Bitcoin Forum

http://i58.tinypic.com/35d68aq.png
Over 2,000 users scammed
Over seventy BTC robbed

It's difficult right now to say what more could be done at this early on to prevent all this other than doing thorough research before dealing with anyone or any site to ensure who you are dealing with you will not have any problems with. It's sad to see so many get scammed and those who scam get away with it and it will take time to find a way to make it less easier for those who do scam to be able to do so.

OP what you're talking about?

http://cryptoconspiracy.com/overnight-major-ponzi-scheme-cryptcominer-finally-absconds-with-over-70-btc/ (http://cryptoconspiracy.com/overnight-major-ponzi-scheme-cryptcominer-finally-absconds-with-over-70-btc/)

wow fantastic, only 2 weeks and they have 70 btc.

this is crazy, i think they must be jailed.

Want to know how to stop these scammers? Don't give your money to ponzis? Problem solved. They'd go away if nobody "invested" in them.

"Returns of up to 130% in just 24 hours." Of course it was a Ponzi scheme. What did you think was going to happen?

The real problem is : Most users see a lot of free  and easy oppurtunity  ( specially in this forum ) for make easy money ( btc , or whatever you want- € , $ etc .. ) .

But free money doesn't exist   ::) .

LOL i recall there are tons of members on here with their sig ad. These assholes even trying to suck ppl in for bonus (30% of payout)

I wish death on all these parasites.

Nothing can be done, people were warned and they chose to "invest", it's their money and they can do whatever they want with it.

No matter how many warnings people post about these scams, there will always be newbies getting scammed. The bright side is, they will only be scammed once in their lives and they will learn.

If only that were true.

Unfortunately history is filled with examples of people that fail to learn from past experiences.

very true, many people invested in bitcoinia, then in pirates BS&T and then in MTGOX.. what do all these 3 things have in common, they all involve putting funds into addresses NOT OWNED by the person..

"History repeats itself, first as tragedy, second as farce." - Karl Marx

pretty agree with Karl Marx ;)

This is the biggest trend I see with people losing Bitcoin, people should never feel comfortable when they keep Bitcoin on Addresses generated by someone other than them-self.

Its not much different than using unloaded paper wallets that someone else gave you, then hoping they did-int make a copy of the key pairs and won't take it back at any point.

Generate your own key pairs, and you generate some peace of mind.

So the finally problem is the : Human  ;D , who own and control these : Mt.gox ,  bitcoinia  etc.... ?

I don't get, why people fall for that. I mean, seriously, where is that extra money supposed to come from?

In wallstreet place, it's nothing ... dude.  ;D

Totally agree... it was their choose  we cant do more for them...

I don't get why scum were advertising for them too, knowing it had to have been a scam.

The same reason that people advertise gambling websites that acquire money from those who don't understand the mathematics of negative expectation:

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https://i.imgur.com/nr9h6Yt.png

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Greed.

For many people, putting money into an obvious ponzi is a form of gambling.  They are "betting" that they will be one of the lucky ones that can get their profits out before the ponzi collapses.  Meanwhile there are others that fail to understand the mathematics and take risks beyond their personal risk threshold without realizing it.

Sounds a bit like "dice" sites, doesn't it?  Many people "bet" that they will be one of the lucky ones that wins at the dice site.  Meanwhile there are others that fail to understand the mathematics and take risks beyond their personal threshold without realizing it.

The thing is: some people are so greedy that they just cannot think clearly... The scammers explore this awful reality, and the victims are exactly those uncontrolled greedy ones.

Those on the signature campaign were not in the wrong: no one could ever imagine that there are still such stupid people to invest in ponzi...

Honestly... your advertising a gambling website Primedice, albeit this is reputable currently, who knows maybe one day it will be come a "scam" because the operator loses all the Bitcoin or something else happens to shut down the site. (Lets hope not we need sites like Primedice)

Then someone else will criticize you for advertising the Scam site in your signature.

Did they even pay the advertisers?

As far as I know, the signature campaign payments were daily, BUT on the ponzi's website.

Those advertisers who were smart enought to make daily withdrawals to their personal wallet were paid until the scammers runned away. Now, those who (for no matter what reason) left their payments accumulating at the ponzi's site surely have lost it.

I confirm this ... i got 15$ and 10.5$ left there because i was afk for a few days ... so that 10.5 went bye bye

This is not a tragedy, but a sour "comedy" which has run on for too many seasons with different actors in the lead roles.

This is comedy. Suckers trying to make a quick easy buck got hustled, cant say I have an ounce of sympathy.

Haha. Called out. No shit, right?

This sig campaign thing is a noxious epidemic. I've been rockin' my current sig for several weeks now. Chew it, shills.

i love people investing in ponzis heh

I understand your point of view, and I even agree with your disposition to automatically deduct credibility points from users with rented sigs. The quality of the posts tend (in some cases) to drop significantly, because the person is only interested in QUANTITY posting, but sometimes lack QUALITY.

So, the idea in deducting credibility points can be a way to stimulate more quality from this situation (or at least to be a filter to protect you from wasting your time).

But, anyway, there are exceptons: I mean, users who rent their signature and work (hard) to keep quality... (Although I know I am not the best contributor to this forum, I try to keep some quality).



I also agree with you: a sad comedy.

No matter how much we try, it seems like new and new lacking opens up everyday :-[ :-[

Since they're still on line, accepting money, something needs to be done.

Start filling out this Securities and Exchange Commission complaint form  (https://denebleo.sec.gov/TCRExternal/questionaire.xhtml) now.

Doesn't matter if they're not in the US, if you are and they sold to you.

Select the "Ponzi scheme" option (the first option; the SEC gets these a lot).

If you lost money, check the Yes box for "Are you having or have you had difficulty in getting access to your funds or securities?".

Check the "Yes" box for "Is the alleged conduct ongoing?".

Keep going; there are options to attach documents.

The SEC brings the hammer down on Ponzi schemes all the time. Their most recent enforcement action for a Ponzi was on September 17th. (http://www.sec.gov/litigation/complaints/2014/comp-pr2014-198.pdf) Doesn't matter if it's in Bitcoins; the SEC won on that issue in court last year on another Bitcoin Ponzi. Doesn't matter that they have "private domain registration" and are being hosted by a "cloud service"; the SEC can find them.

It's worth reporting this even if the parties are not in the US. Someday, they just might pass through US Customs, and they'll be in the database.

People argued with me in a thread in the gambling forum about the concept of trusting anything that is clearly a Ponzi scheme, even games that admit to being Ponzis. By definition, a Ponzi or a HYIP is a scam, and thinking otherwise is just ridiculous, greedy and short-sighted.

I don't get what happened here. Users report "yay i got my first transaction" but the transaction was being sent to the big 73btc wallet that got cleaned out. If was posting about my first withdrawl it would be a withdrawl into my own wallet and not sitting in a website.

williamj2543 - 294 posts
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=762929.msg8614904#msg8614904 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=762929.msg8614904#msg8614904)

nakazznicek - 56 posts
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=762929.msg8621649#msg8621649 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=762929.msg8621649#msg8621649)

Haslett5236 - 112 posts
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=762929.msg8641769#msg8641769 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=762929.msg8641769#msg8641769)

david186 - 70 posts
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=762929.msg8644873#msg8644873 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=762929.msg8644873#msg8644873)

RoxanaMallet - 126 posts
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=762929.msg8645668#msg8645668 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=762929.msg8645668#msg8645668)

LorettaAndres - 112 posts
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=762929.msg8648004#msg8648004 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=762929.msg8648004#msg8648004)

NadineWilliams - 112 posts
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=762929.msg8649238#msg8649238 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=762929.msg8649238#msg8649238)

Jackson86 - 112 posts
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=762929.msg8650897#msg8650897 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=762929.msg8650897#msg8650897)

soccosocco - 140 posts
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=762929.msg8659063#msg8659063 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=762929.msg8659063#msg8659063)

nawaytes - 98 posts
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=762929.msg8662945#msg8662945 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=762929.msg8662945#msg8662945)


etc.

Thank you very much for your valuable contribution

Pople has to be responsable of their own wallets.. thats all.

You sound more irritated with the victims of the scam than the scammer who made $28,000. Myself, I can't be pissed off moreso at the scammer. Yes, it's idiotic to invest without due diligence. But I know smart people can get  caught up in this too.

BCT has a good reputation - people assume the content herein is more legit much moreso than the other crypto forums.

Non-reversible transactions are a new frontier; the blasé attitude will come back to bite us all (as NY knows).

Another person OK with scammers making $30k in a dozen days, huh?
Maybe a little compassion would defuse the SEC knee-jerk reactions? Because were it me, I'd be shattered. And the last thing I'd want is condescending retorts.

To those who lost out, I feel for you. I hope a lesson was learned and if you feel you need to contact the SEC after cooling off, then do so.
No one else gives a shit about these scammers raping new investor blood.

Karma's a bitch. These scammers will learn how karma works in time.

Finally, some empathy.
I'm angry and upset these things keep happening.
People get caught up in emotion - maybe they owe loans,bills, debts - and they find a reasonable 4% return and think, well, it's safer than altcoin ICOs.

If there is a lesson to be learned here it's escrow wherever possible and proof of developer.

My condolences to the victims.

idiots lost money. i dont see a problem here. (and yes, it will never end in human history  :D )


butterfly labs and others are a different case.

shocker.  not

It is not just about quality vs quantity. By involvement in a sig ad campaign, you are announcing to the world that you view your very own reputation as worth nothing more than a few shekels.

A person's reputation is not what is in their signature line, it is how they act and what they say. Having a paid signature is nothing more then receiving money for advertising a good or a service. If you are against advertisements then you should be against this forum (that sells ads) and any source of media/news as they make almost all their money from advertisers.

Yes, a person's reputation is based upon what they say. When you *sign* your posts with an ad for some product or service, you are *saying* that you endorse said product or service.

The only thing that these people are saying, by accepting to rent their signature space, is that they need the money. Nothing else.

I would disagree that people are "signing" their posts with their signature. They are simply "wearing" their signature in exchange for payment. This is the exact same arrangement that theymos (via the forum) has with a number of advertisers (see  this post (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=782437.0). Unless you have ads disabled you will be able to see these ads after the first post in each page, you will also see a disclaimer that advertisements are not endorsed by the forum.

This is also a very similar arrangement as to how newspapers and TV stations make their money....via advertisements, I would say that common sense would dictate that advertisements are not endorsed by these channels of information

EDIT: unless you personally endorse something you are not "signing" your messages with a specific advertiser

Would any of you have a problem with someone advertising a pedophile website in their signature space?  Would you be willing to accept a payment from a pedophile website in exchange for advertising their website in your signature space?

How about a "murder for hire" business?  Would you be willing to accept a payment from a "murder for hire" business in exchange for advertising the business in your signature?

Most moral and ethical people would refuse to use their own activity to assist businesses that they feel are immoral or unethical.  Your decision to accept a payment in exchange for assisting a business says something about yourself and your opinion of the business.

You are essentially agreeing to become a paid employee of the business (you are getting paid, and you are doing work for them).  As such, you are intertwining your reputation with that of the business.  If you act in immoral and unethical ways, people will hold the business accountable for choosing to pay you and choosing to allow you to represent them.  If the business acts in immoral and unethical ways, people will hold you accountable for choosing to provide services for the business and for accepting their "dirty money".

You cannot treat a Ponzi scheme to pedophilia or murder for hire, that's an abusive analogy

Why?

If the advertisement says nothing about the person that chooses to put it in their signature space, then why does it matter what they put there?

If it does say something about the person that chooses to put it in their signature space, then clearly the following aren't true:


You can't have it both ways.  Either your signature has an effect on your reputation, or it doesn't.  Which is it?

I think you should use some "editorial" discretion (to use a newspaper analogy) when deciding what paid signature to "wear". To answer your question, no I would not display either a pedophile website nor  a "murder for hire" website in exchange for payment (or otherwise). Both of these examples are 100% clearly illegal in the US (where I reside).

To make the conclusion that either of these kinds of sites would be illegal, I could look at what services the website is offering, and look at the relevant laws and see that without question both of these examples would be 100% illegal.

Cryptominer on the other hand was not as clear cut. Yes, the chances of them being a ponzi were well above 99% (it turned out they were one), and yes the chances of them scamming eventually were well above 99% as well. However in the event that the less then 1% chance of them being honest and were going to actually pay investors what was promised then they would simply be making a very bad business decision, and it is not right to try to sensor that.

I also think that a reasonable person would be able to conclude that the returns being offered were that of a ponzi. I would consider investing in a ponzi to be similar to gambling. I would argue that the investors put their money into the ponzi with the hope of being able to make money off of the "interest" for some time and withdrawing prior to the operator running away with investor funds. I would consider this behavior to be similar to gambling at Prime Dice, however the "house edge" is likely much greater, but it is known that the house has an edge prior to people putting their money in.

No, what they are saying is that they are willing to be paid to post.

The rest of us then have to try to determine if they are posting because they have a genuine passion for what they are saying or because they are trying to earn their money. Of course they will all say that it doesn't affect how often they post or the quality of their posts. But how are we to know?

I would have a big problem advertising for Harry Reid in my signature.

Or Fred Phelps, while we're still on the topic

I'm not advocating censoring anything. You can whore your reputation out for whatever the hell you want. Just be aware that discriminating people will form their opinion of your value by what cause you are shilling.

So, should I assume that the reputations of this whole forum, as well as of it's posters, are questionable reputations, just because there are advertisements in each and every page?

Absolutely.

And as a user of the forum, you should pressure the owner to remove those advertisements that you feel are for questionable services.

If the owner of the forum refuses to remove advertisements that you find to be of questionable nature, you should refuse to participate, and should either find another forum or start your own.

So. Let's see how many of us will do as you have said...

If no one does, I will also start deducting credibility points from everyone participating here....

... well, on deducting everyone's points, won't it be a draw anyway?

 :)

http://oi59.tinypic.com/20hr7nc.jpg

I would disagree. Advertising is something necessary to pay for expenses of content creators.

If the forum itself is not able to advertise then it would need to resort to charging users for accessing and contributing to the forum which I am sure would not go over well.

Also the term "questionable" is a subjective term. Any person could consider anything to be "questionable" if enough money was involved. I do see that you are advertising your escrow thread on your signature. While you do have green trust and would trust you with several thousand dollars to be held in escrow, I would likely not trust you with 5 or 6 figure (measured in dollars) amounts in escrow (I would likely instead opt to do any deal with you as escrow in smaller amounts). Since I do not see any dollar (or bitcoin) limits as to how much you are willing to hold in escrow, I would say that, in certain circumstances your advertisement may be considered to be "questionable" (there is at least one auction for 200+ THs worth of miners being sold for $100k+ worth of bitcoin (I couldn't find it in either the auctions or computer hardware forums, but I know it is somewhere - there are a lot of domains junking up the forums).

I hope you understand I am not putting your integrity into question, and do not think that you would likely steak $10k+ of bitcoin if you had the chance

Looks like you've worked it out all by yourself.

So glad we finally have a coherent solution.

Who cares? You just trying to brag yourself about this?

And why did you say that?

Still that doesnt answer anything you are asking..