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We have now seen the S5, which is not really what i've been expected, the SP20 can do the same, 500W at aprox 1080 GH/S, and it can be easily undervolted, and it's been on the market for a while already.
What about the S6 ? maybe they will get better with the S6?
I expect it to be around 4 Th/S - 4.5 TH/S, with an 2000W
Price should be somewhere around 1500 $ TOPS

I would say the S5 was not to far from expected.  Double it's former S3 on hashing power and less power.  I expect S6 will follow trend.  We will see around 4T with less or equal to S4 power.

Rack mount would be nice.. And it would have been really cool if the blades would have been able to fit in the s4

The S4 still has quite a bit of life left in it being profitable for most places,  I doubt we see a  upgrade on S4.

this  is the truth.  the s-4 can do .6-.7 watts per gh   and at .6 watts a gh the s-4 pays


for 10 cent it pays for power  until diff  is 94959m
at 12 cent power  it pay for power until diff is 78123m
at 15 cent power it pays for power until  diff is 61211m


so no need to make an s-6 for at least 90 days.

I would put my money on a rack mountable miner with the new chip like:
S1 - S2 BM1380
S3 - S4 BM1382
S5 -     BM1384

You need to remember that the s5 can also be undervolted to achieve .2 w/gh which is less then 1/2 of what it consumes at stock speed.

I do think/hope we will see great improvements in efficiency with the s6, hopefully down to ~.25 w/gh at stock speeds

With this information on the S5 I believe the S6 will have the same chips as the S5, only with more chips and with a "Special DC PSU" to lower the power consumption.

they better do an min 1000 to max 1500watt, not 2000w. too many amps on 1 cable
add more chips, lower the voltage and make it a bit better than knc neptun, say 3.5th!

it wouldbe good if they could do more efficient miner.

I actually prefer to go all the way to 3k watt or higher. If you want to mine you have to go big anyway so cmon, get a new high amp cable.

tell 3kw to the 110volt guys!
3kw means 2 psu's, it means 4u or more... heavier than hell!
don't see a progress in up-ing the wattage. this way we gone have 10kw in 1 miner looking like a fridge! see knc and 400watt thru an 6pin vga...
this is not the way!
the way i see it to be good for miners, is to keep the case format, cooling and wattage and keep on making smaller and less of power hungry chips.
 

chuck a few s5 blades in a box - make sure they're "screwed" nicely

put in a few quieter fans - not that loud but sufficient cooling (by the time it comes out, winter is almost over)

rack mountable ? yeah most likely oh yeah & a fancy LCD screen - but probably with thinner metal sheets for the case ?

try to avoid "magic" smoke from the psu's - stick in a better server type psu or even a VERY good idea & selling point + less headaches where the consumer can find a equivalent server type psu to be fitted/modded.

cost ? - i'm still gonna let ya'll willingly make me rich while u know it may or may not make $

prolly a little "nice" bonus with some miner software linking the miners

cgminer versions ? OS ? yeah there's gonna be sum sort of fukkup but hopefully not especially after releasing a new FW & the miners don't hash or go dead

NO free shipping

my guess - 6 blades minimum, air/fan cooled packed in a box (maybe a light weight one?), lcd display, server type psu = 3th/s (under/over clock-able) between 1500-2000w psu, FW/CGminer +/- abt the same, most likely (my guess) 8 blades underclocked = a lil more hashing power but lower electricity consumption & defo coming in a box (4u)

price - ??? 1 thing for sure BM is NOT going to loose any $

Think from a point and on to enchance and all ready good product is very very difficult.Btc market is not on its best with the low prices
So similar 1.5 miner will be with 500-750w consumption
What I realy enjoy on the S5 is that you need one psu and not two plus one by one item sale

Double the S5 wattage and still able fit in one psu. There are lots of 1300-1600 wattage PSU on the market nowadays.

There is a roumor that S5 can do up to 2 Th... Why do we need next AntMiner in this case?  :)

if this is correct then the i expect BM will rise the price soon.

It would be nice if it was sooner than later....S6 would/could/should be interesting.

With BTC so low I don't see them rushing it.  I think it will be a little while.   

if and when the s6 comes out it will probably be 4-5th at around 1k to 1.5k cost. When will it come out? good question but my guess is a little before summer or early summer

at stock is running at 50+C how the hell will it reach 2th!


they are rushing it for sure! not on the market but in their own farms :D
and it depends a lot on the rest of manufacturers: AM, SPTECH, etc. if one is coming with something new and powerful to the market, bitmain will not want to loose a piece of it's own pie...

I bet if you run an S5 on about 16V and keep it immersed about a -25C tank you could get 2TH out of it. For a while. Before the chips start breaking down internally.

As for S6, I'd like to see them make blades that slide into S2 chassis. They specifically said they wouldn't make BM1382 boards for the S2 because it was still profitable, but that's getting pretty tight these days and within a few months probably all of them will be turned off. With a string miner it'll take a bit of finagling to get the power draw right for the internal PSU, but I'd really like to see an efficient DC-DC converter over top of the string with software-controlled voltage output so the user can custom under/overvolt. That opens up a lot of options both for the manufactured stock configuration and user-defined operating points.

+1 I still have a bunch of S2s that I had hopes of upgrading.  The upgrade path was the only reason I bought them.

I bet S6 will have better efficiency with the same S5 chip.

And about 25% more efficient I guess 0.38 W/G

JG

when would you expect them to come? q2/q3?

I think slightly before s6 they will come out with s2.5
PCB replacement boards for the s2, each board 250ghs
I just hope they don't charge too much.

Looks like S2 upgrade boards are imminent.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=728068.msg10435170#msg10435170

a bit late as i already sold few of my s2.
curious if it will be 1kw or it will need higher wattage psu

upgrading will most likely cost like 50% of the new type i guess, considering that, id get a new one anyway, so upgrading isnt really an option for me

Remember Bitmain had 100mh/s miners for scrypt?

Did they deliver (it was pre-order?), and how/why did that turn out/no more scrypt miners?

I'd buy a scrypt miner if it was decently priced, there aren't really any options now.

it got cancelled

The scrypt market has changed quite a bit since that couple of weeks when Litecoin was trading at $40.

I need to fetch a couple S2 sometime. All I have is the kit, not the stock version, so it'd be good to have a stock and a second stock to upgrade, for the museum.

Yep, they attempted to do the pre order model to fund their production of the L1, but it backfired and ultimately got cancelled.

Eventually, they did right by their customers as far as refunds or credits:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=768004.0

They refunded but it doesn't mean people didn't suffered a lot.

Oh.  Thanks for the answer guys.

Yeah scrypt/litecoin has gone to the shitters...but i find a lot of fun coins to mine/discover aren't SHA-256 and if a scrypt/other algo asic was DECENTLY priced i would buy it just for fun.  I used to mine obscure coins and hope for the best.  most didnt work out (im looking at you magic internet money...that was fun though), but some did, and that was very profitable.

I'm curious about specs for the S6, too. Power by me is about $0.20 to $0.25 per KWH. Unless the power consumption drops dramatically or the GH/s increases substantially I won't be able to mine any more. Glad I got some while GPU mining was still profitable!

Will these be sold like the S2 kits; or as boards only requiring existing blade heatsinks / S2 backplane & controller?

Thanks for link.  I wonder if they are making a new chip for "power consumpiton at wall will be less than 0.4W/G." or if they somehow found a way to underclock it.

If new chips would be a good time to see a S6 aswell.  With Holiday would be a good time to retool for a new model (But most likely people will want to spend it with family which no one can blame them for).

When is S6 coming out?  Or a new spondoolies coming out?

Seems likely the S2 Upgrade is the same chip in the S5, set at a lower voltage and clock. They won't make a whole new chip in two months. Probably the next ASIC from them will be around July/August based on the times between the last few generations.

I haven't seen any actual word on the S6, but it makes sense the actual mining boards would be a similar configuration as the S2 upgrades - same stock clock and string length, etc. Possibly even the same boards, but who knows.

It's probably better to ask in a Spondoolies speculation thread instead of a Bitmain speculation thread, when the next SPxx is appearing.

you will never be able to mine at home and make a consistent profit.  not with 20 cents a kwatt.

what you can do at home is get a piece of decent used gear and mine it solo on a pool

like this one

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=763510.0

mine with a s-3 from antminer.  put in 3 pools 1 solo and 2 normal  run it balanced  so 150 gh + 150 gh + 150 gh   ⅔ is going to get back some money the other ⅓ may never see a dime or may hit a block.

If you really want to mine you could host a miner here

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=934581.0

 ;D I think they should update the S4 .  Its all in one compact design . just looks more professional

I just got a reply from bitmain the S6 will be released in July !

~0.4gh/w in July=irrelevant. They have boards now, what's up with the multi-month delay?

Hopefully not self-mining to take advantage of limited increased competition.

Also, I'd guess 0.4W/GH is a very conservative estimate given the S2 Upgrade will probably be rated for that. S6 I'd expect to see about 0.3W/GH at the top end.

I personally would be hesitant to buy it in July or August.  I remember the release of the S4 in October 2014.  Only a couple of months later, the S5 was released with much better efficiency.  It depends on the efficiency of the S6 before I would consider buying.  There could very well be an S7 to come out only 2 months later like the S5 came out 2 months after the S4 release.

Anyone who purchases the S6 [with the same chips as the S5] is making a serious mistake.  As they will see a more power efficient S7 come out only a couple of months afterwards.  My opinion...

Hy guys,

did you check out hashcoins.com (http://hashcoins.com) with their Uranus Miner?
Take a look here https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=417623.0 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=417623.0)
I do not know how this rivals Bitmain, but we already, if you believe buyers, have these chips with the efficiency running.

This Uranus miner has been talked about many times.  Most likely a scam.  They still have not shown a zeus miner which  is no where near as efficient.

Okidoki, so you think this guy https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=417623.msg10996618#msg10996618 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=417623.msg10996618#msg10996618) is a scammer "purchased" by hashcoins.com (http://hashcoins.com)  ??? :o

Notlist3d you want to play with the juniors? ;D

elrippo this is a thread about S6! piss off with your preorder and scamy links!

Just asking?
I think you have been a freschman too, so try to be polite as most people here are.
By the way, your trustrating looks impressive  ;D

u can suck on my trusting! and i've been a frenchman before too!

go spam yourself!

I would say Maverick has a good point this is a S6 speculation thread.   The Uraus miner has nothing to do with thread and goes off topic.  Is that guy  telling the truth? I have no idea.  He didnt provide a transaction ID, he went with bank transfer he say's.  I think there is a good chance he is tied in with company yes.  And if not I feel sorry as he most likely got scammed.

Either way back to S6 speculation :).

Thought about it,.....mmmmm.... nope  ;)


Agreed, it was just an idea of comparing an "existing" product with a speculated pentand. I don´t know, that´s why i initially asked. I believe we are thinking the same, sorry for the "customer" if so.

Back to S6 -> http://www.antminerdistribution.com/ (http://www.antminerdistribution.com/), any info or news about spec, price and availability  ???
They have listed the S6 in their products, though without a sheet. Have you guys news from http://www.antminerdistribution.com/ (http://www.antminerdistribution.com/) regarding the S6 ::)

soon, will show you the speculated new hardware preview...  Please wait for a bit longer for the official announcement.

Thanks for info! Love that you said something :)

But stand by with something to plug your ears, tho....   :'(

http://s11.postimg.org/fr4miuf77/earmuff.jpg

  really ? you guys are going to put out the s-6?

I would have bet 5 btc you would not release it until July or August.

I'm getting a few extra breakers put in.  I'm sure there will be room for one ... or two of these :)

it will come out before june. s5 is out for too much time, so s6 must be around the corner, imo

bitmain going spondoolies, noise wise ::) ??? ::) ??? ::) ??? ::) ???
 :o :o :o :o
 ;D

Antpool showed it temporary went up to 66.7 PH.  Are there any S6's in this jump? :) I'm guessing not but I hope so.

Picture: http://s100.photobucket.com/user/notlist3d/media/antpool/antpool_zpssmf9atth.png.html?sort=3&o=0
(Did link not post as size is quite big)

Hey bitmaintech waiting on an s-6.
I put in 2 not 1 240 volt breakers.
Would love to get my hands on one.

Nothing new here:

https://www.bitmaintech.com/product.htm

I don't know.  The smart thing to do in my opinion would be as soon as possible if it is more power efficient than the S5.  The sooner the better.  Waiting longer only shortens the sell life span of the S6 similar to the S4.  If the S6 has a built in PSU like the S4, with similar efficiency to the S5, it would behove them to release the S6 ASAP.  If the S6 has "much" better efficiency than the S5 [Like .40 watts or lower], it would be best for them to wait for more S5's to be sold before releasing the S6.

I know you are not complaining about the noise at all.  I'm just chiming in that I wish others would not complain about the noise.  This is part of the life of a bit coin miner.  If one does not like the noise, they need to drop out of this business. 

DAMN...  That was a hell of a jump.  From approximately 56 PH/s to 66 PH/s.  That was definitely a hell of a jump!

I thought so as well.  I have no idea what caused it or what was going on.  But I took a screenshot so people would believe me it happened.

I could throw out all kinds of speculation, but at the end of the day that's all it would be is speculation.

It has got to be S4+ rigs that were tested for a short time span in my opinion.

S4+ available for shipping within a week.  2,570 GH/s (2.57 TH/s) @ 1,480 watts.  Stated .58 watts per GH/s.  PSU's are not the same.  They were designed by Bitmaintech.

946 USD ( 4.218 BTC )

https://www.bitmaintech.com/productDetail.htm?pid=00020150420021310934XOpI8PEw0689

what's the point of this miner? i mean s5 is 0.51 per giga and you can find it for 1/3 of the price(used) of this new miner

I suppose it's for those who are looking for a form factor suitable for a server room.  It depends on your situation I suppose.  I still have fourteen (14) 3,000 watt server grade PSU's with breakout boards sitting around waiting to be used on rigs without PSU.  I have to upgrade power first though.  I'm actually seriously thinking about keeping the money I would spend to upgrade my power at the house to fund my transportation to another location with cheaper power and upgrade the power there if needed.  I will have another $20,000 to invest in rigs the middle of June.  I think I will hold onto it and wait for approximately $10K or $20K more before my move to another location.  I need at least 140 TH/s to start in another location I have in mind.  It's just a matter of time.

Back to subject...  It really depends on your situation.  Those who are just starting up a mining operation may want them.  I'm in wait and see mode at the moment while waiting on a bit more funds to start right.  I only have 45 Th/s at the moment.

Not really a groundbraking revolution this new S4+
Old chips, loud, more W/GH than the existing S5 but a rack mount...
Well, i´ll go with the S5 either the S6 is going to be "groundbraking" in terms of chips and power use  ;D

Looks like this thread need to do a 90 day vacation  maybe a 150 day vacation since s-6's will not show up sooner then summertime. Or early fall.

U might be right!  >50%  :P

maybe it will come out almost on the same time with s7...

I would agree with it could be a while.  I still think btc being so low has something to do with it, companies have to do R+D smarter not faster.

I think for a little bit our options are S4+ or S5.  Which is a interesting mix.   I was surprised with the 220, I see this as good for future releases showing Bitmain is not scared to go up to 220.

I'm also happy to see Bitmain not being too concerned about telling those who are serious with mining to move to 205 to 240 range.  I do like the capability to still use rigs at 120 during the winter.  This means I can move a rig to a bedroom or living room that needs heat without concern of having a 205 to 240 volt receptacle.

yeah home miners will need to up their game by having 1 or more 240 volt  receptacles.

 I now have a 30 amp and a 20 amp circuit .  These were 120 volt dedicated receptacles for subwoofer amps that I installed in my home 17 years ago.  I now  did a very simple switchover and made them 240 volts.

Of course they are not in the best spots of my home but I will get around that in due time.  For now with the hot weather approaching I will keep mining low.

Sounds like a plan.

I did have six 20 amp/120 volt circuits at one time.  I switched everything over to five 30 amp/240 volt circuits with PDU's.  I doubled my available watts by doing this.  Everyone else should do it as well if possible.

I think I was the one who pointed you in the 240v/PDU direction. :) Looks like you took it and RAN LOL. Love your setup.

And I appreciate you doing so, Sir!!!  THUMBS UP!!!

Your assistance and knowledge played a large role in helping me get my setup to where it is at the moment.  Thank you for taking the time to provide mining knowledge!

Kind regards,

David

Glad I could help, especially seeing what your project has evolved into!  :D

Thank you, Sir.

Although, it's kind of a shame it will all be torn down in a few months when I move to Washington State.  It has been quite a learning experience.  This also gave me an opportunity to learn about dealing with the heat, ventilation, networking, etc...  It has been a lot of fun thus far.  I still have a lot to learn.  Especially, when I take this to a much larger scale in Washington State.

I was thinking about moving out to Washington State in June.  I was approximately 80% sure I was moving out there in June due to this Jade Helm 15 thing.  Now, it has reduced to 20% chance of going in June and 80% chance of going between August and October.  I'm about 95% sure I'm moving to Washington State regardless.  It's just a matter of "when."

If you have not heard about "Jade Helm 15," this is the video I recommend you listen to in its entirety:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j4kaNjvRxIw&feature=share (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j4kaNjvRxIw&feature=share)

When are they releasing S6 and S7? we need bigger hash rate and compact to reduce the shipment charges per Gh/s

Not that sure it is happening until the late summer Sept 10th at the least.

Good, my gear should ROI around late summer  ;D

Is there something significant about September 10th? It all looks very uncertain, and yet September 10th is a fairly specific date. Care to share your reasoning?

Good question I personally cannot think of anything special about the date.  I was surprised they released a S4+.

I think it's good for miners we get a little extra time to ROI before next gen.  That is a win in my book.

Nothing special about that, he just likes that date. I too think it might happen somewhere late summer.

S6 will be released when Bitmain sells second hand S5 stock totally or a big proportion of it.

Its not a bad assumption but i wouldn't be surprised if that was held off for a while and we started just buying their used units. We're supposed to be getting an announcement from Bitmain soon but i get they are in no rush to do so.

With the S4+ there's possibly quite a bit of time before the S6 and mentions of S7 are unsure as well.

Didn't Dogie or someone direct from BitMain already announce they were skipping the S6?

 No point in releasing anything new with the BM1384 any more unless (1) they have a BUNCH onhand, AND (2) they come out with a "S5 Lite" type design with 18-20 chips in the chain for better efficiency OR they come out with a design with the ability to set the voltage like the SP20E.

 Given they are no longer selling "new" S5s, I'd bet that Bitmain doesn't have a significant number IF ANY of the BM1384 chips left in stock.

They would need to design a better board, but if they had the chip on hands, maybe a version of the S5 that *actually* let you run it at 9v?

If i recall correctly, there was a mention of the S5 being able to run at 0.2j/w with a 9v PSU, that was later crossed out.

Chip spec doesn't go quite that low - they did mention "run an S5 on 9v" early on but I think the figure was more like .3w/GH or .4w/GH range.

 Problem with that is FINDING 9v power supplies with enough current to run an S5 - I did some digging early on and never did find anything suitable - REALLY poor efficiency way $$$ pricey industrial stuff was the only option I could dig up and even THAT stuff was going to be WAY iffy on providing enough current. The one supply I DID find that looked like it could handle one side of a S5 at 9volts was going to lose almost as much in the PS as would be gained from the undervolting.

The S5 runs fine in chain mode at 12V, and even down to 11V. Something goes wrong somewhere between 11V & 10V. Sidehack has speculated that this is nothing to do with the voltage per say, but probably the level shifters for the signals between the chips?

The bottom line, for me, is that the previous Bitmain data sheets on the BM1380 & BM1382 have been pretty accurate on the under & over clocking & volting potential of the chips so I feel that the BM1384 sheet is also likely to be correct?

So I see no reason with the correct design why the BM1384 should not be capable of a 2.49J/GH at 0.6V. Whether this is best achieved by sticking with the more efficient chain supply mode moving from 15 to 20 chip pairs / chain (to enable 12V running) or returning to conventional DC-DC converters (please make them programmable) I do not know?

I plan as soon as I can pick up an S5 in the UK for a sensible price to sort out the best / easiest way to undervolt / underclock it and get as close as I can to the specified J/GH. Bitmain on the other hand have very little incentive to do this as their prime customers have very low price KW/H and are only interested in GH/$

Rich

.249 is the CHIP spec, the actual usage in the S5 is a little higher due to the other stuff in the machine that uses power, like the fan controller support chips etc.
 I HAD forgotten the chip spec went quite that low, but I'd still say .3 is probably about the best an S5 unit could manage even if you can get it fixed to run at 9v

 It's closer to chip spec than machines that DO have programable voltage due to lack of losses in a voltage converter/regulator, but there's still SOME non-hash-chip power draw out of the other stuff.

 I'd still like to see that .3 though, if I could ever find an EFFICIENT 9v power supply that can support the current draw.

Do any of you know when will they officially announce S6 specifications? When will this speculation end?

S6 has been mentioned (I believe by Dogie, but might have been by BitMain directly) that it's not going to happen, will be "skipped".

 It's the S7 we're all waiting on now....

I still insist they are not going to skip S6.I believe there is a problem with cooling, they will overcome with water cooling.

There is NO POINT to them releasing an S6 at this time. If they were GOING to release one, it would have been several months ago when the BM1384 was still a performance leader, not when they appear to have emptied all of their stocks of it building the last new S5 units and are moving on to the NEXT generation.

 Water cooled would be a C series machine, NOT an S6.


 I'll take the word out of a Bitmain representative over your "I insist they are not going to skip" wasting time and money on a machine that they know would generate almost ZERO sales.

Is it only name change or do they produce S6 and don't like it? What's this skipping generation?

Bitmain just never got around to building a "rack mount" datacenter-style machine based on the BM1384.
 
I would guess their sales on the S5 made them decide there wouldn't be enough sales of a S6 model to justify the design/test/build costs.

Get an Uranus miner . its 6th and is more energy eff.

Never heard of it, is it something that actually exists or is it vaporware/scamware?

 And define "6'th generation", as far as I know there is NO ASIC COMPANY that has built 6 generations of Bitcoin chip yet.

Looks good on paper. 20nm ASIC's, 6THS, $3299, 0.26J/W and can be underclocked for greater efficiency.

Whether it exists or not I do not know? and this is the S6 speculation thread.....


Rich

Given that their "Ares Scrypt miner" is obviously an Alcheminer at a ridiculously high price, I have some doubts about this Uranus thing - though to be fair, they do specify somewhere on their page



 The BIG sticking point is that "20 nm" part of their spec - I've not seen ANYONE from an ASIC company claiming to be working with a 20nm process.

 They also say the CHIP efficiency is .24w/GH, the MACHINE efficiency is .26w/GH, yet the machine is "designed to be underclocked" - voltage converters for typical low-voltage applications like SHA256 ASIC do NOT achieve a well over 90% efficiency, and there seems to be ZERO allowance in those specs for the power consumed by the controler board and other parts needed for the ASIC to talk to the outside world.


 Definitely a "I want to at least see a review from a few REPUTABLE sources" item before I will believe it's real.

Is it true or are you trolling us? Can you show me source of this? I can't believe they skip a generation for whatever reason.

what is true is dogie wrote:

" the s-4 +  was kind of the s-6  and the s-7 comes next." 

I quote this from memory so it is not necessarily a perfect quote.

They're not skipping a generation, the even number generation is a Rack mount unit, the uneven number is a small form factor. The next unit coming will be s7 as reported by several users of reply from Bitmain.

They're skipping a RACK MOUNT generation, to be picky.

 9-)

Dunno, they didn't say they would not release a rack mount, they just said they were releasing the smaller factor next. It was supposed to be last month but now they said they would announce at some point within a month or two.

I don't see them making a rack-mount miner from the chips to be used in the S7 and calling it an S6.

You're not seeing a S7 either. They did not announce either yet. Only that the next thing to be released will be the S7.

 Nope, not yet. "soon". I'm guessing a month or so, however long it takes them to move out most-to-all of their existing S5 units in their farm.

This turned up in the S5 thread:


Looks interesting.

I would like to see some source. The member who brought it up did not mention any, he just threw some insane specs in and left.

Saw it over there, but just now got to thinking about heat dissipation.

 No bloody WAY those tiny heat sinks are going to keep a BM1384 running at .75 volts (3 chains of 16 per board is the ONLY viable option that fits the board setup, 2 chains of 24 is below the BM1384 minimum voltage spec, 4 chains of 12 is WAY over) cool, expecially with that many clustered that close together.

 The "3 PCI-E connectors per board" part of the picture fits in with that scenario, which comes down to LESS heat sink area total than on the S5, trying to dissipate about 40% more power.



 Not quite a Nuclear Meltdown scenario, or an Intel Pentium original generation that couldn't run 75 Mhz due to heat issues, but.....

I doubt those are all the headsinks - with the S5, they actually experimented with those very same heatsinks.  They go on the opposite side of the main one, so I imagine that's the same with this, just a bit of extra heat dissipation on the opposite side of the board.  More than likely inside there you have a big headsink similar to the one on the S5 bank to back to back with each board.  In terms of the S5, the density is basically 2x, since each one of these blades are the same hashing power of one S5...

Ah its using, allegedly, mini aluminium headsink and a high air pressure is blown through. Dissipating the heat is quite possible since it would obviously use something like 6 of those fans S5 uses. The chips would run hot but thats probably okay.

Anyways on the bright side, the diff won't go up TOO much.

Bingo you got it. If the power improvement is .51 down  to .44 diff will not move much

So just thinking a bit more about the S5+, as others have said the name under calls things a bit S5+3 or S5+++ might have been more appropriate?

Got me thinking that perhaps the development started as the item that philipma1957 wants? A single bay S5+ with controller. Original brief might have been to push the hash rate to the max in the form factor and slightly improve the J/GH?

Then someone realised that there might be some economies to be made, common frame & hash board, by tacking 3 bays together rather than designing a completely new BM1384 based S6?

Rich

Price for s5 + will be maintained probably. But the price for the s5 has fallen already . Only 352 USD ( 1.323 BTC) .
It seems that the weight of the parcel jumped to 4.2kg . They can now sell a version with small heatsinks or I missed something ?
Hashnest also got a new s5 delivery . Replacing the equipment continues.
Now we have a very interesting situation , because it looks like the S5 will get a good deal on the market.

The S5+ price also dropped, quoted at 17200 yuan now instead of the original 19000 - still almost $2750.
http://shop.bitmain.cn/goods.php?id=47
(though I don't understand the chinese on most of that page the price is obvious).

 Seems Bitmain is finally responding to the recent bitcoin small price dump.


 I also finally just noticed the apparent "intended for rack mount" tabs - dunno why they didn't call this the S6, abet the tabs don't seem to be spaced right for a standard rack mount.

Typically i would stack rackmount units, not put them in a rack. This doesn't particularly look like something i'd be able to stack unto one another, so hmm...

Who knows? They are close to the target $2500 . Perhaps we will see the price soon.

If we got a good price drop on BTC it would help a bit.

http://shop.bitmain.cn/goods.php?id=47

I can't tell from the picture, but would this come with a PSU or we'd need to find one to handle 3,500W? From what I can tell, they are suggesting 3 of these?

https://bitmaintech.com/productDetail.htm?pid=000201505040743496917U7kGsCm0694

I guess it could also technically run on 3x EVGA 1300W G2. However, at 120v, it would be pulling over 30amps. Is 120v even possible for this thing?

Also of note:

It looks like you could use 3 separate 120V power supplies, though they would need to be on 3 separate circuits (i.e. a breakers) to operate safely. Obviously a 240V setup would be much cleaner, although you will likely need more than 1 PSU since even a 2880W server PSU won't do it alone.

I don't see any sign of an included power supply.

 Given previous antminers, I don't see any reason you can't use multiple power supplies to power one of these - just don't use different power supplies on one specific board.

 3x15A 120v circuits should work fine with 3 PS at 1100+ watts (that 34xx watt rating is "at the wall", actual DC usage should be around 3100 watts - though I'd go with at least 1200+ per power supply to leave SOME headroom).

 2 of the Bitmain 1600 Watt PS in theory would handle this monster but you'd have to dig up more PCI-E cabling to add to what they include and it would be very marginal and NO room for overclock.
 2 "someone else" standard 1600 Watt PS would probably also work, though the PCI-E connections might be a limiting factor, and not many folks MAKE that big of unit (and they're pri$ey).

Will there be coupons for S5+ ?

$3,299 for the S5+ from iTop  http://www.itopshop.net/world-biggest-miner-antminer-s5-bitcoin-miner-77-t-3436w-p-271.html (http://www.itopshop.net/world-biggest-miner-antminer-s5-bitcoin-miner-77-t-3436w-p-271.html)  I'm not sure if that includes shipping.

Even if the ITop price includes shipping, that's $hundreds higher than ordering it direct from Bitmain - and IMO the BITMAIN price is too high for this unit.

Totally agree...  The price at iTop is hundreds higher than what it will be at BITMAIN.  I have no idea what BITMAIN will sell it for and when they will sell it.  I need to see if they have started a thread on it.  It's possible I may purchase 25 units if they are not too pricey.

Sound levels seem a lot higher on the S5+ than any of the previous machines, right?

They have to be twice as loud as its predecessor but I don't mind.  My little mining closet keeps the noise down anyway.  However, I'm not buying many more rigs anyway unless I move to Washington State.  I still have not made up my mind as to the move yet.

https://i.imgur.com/HfwPkni.jpg (https://i.imgur.com/HfwPkni.jpg)

I'm guessing Bitmain will sell it at very close to the $US equivilent to what their chinese site quites it for in yuan - and then translate that to bitcoin.

 Given that this S5+ has *6* fans vs. the single on a S5, and guessing they're probably the same fan (the pics aren't clear on that point), it should run about 7-8db louder than a single S5. Possibly a little more as the air path is a lot more crowded than on the S5, but possibly a bit less as it's fully enclosed.

The sound is 90 Decibell minumum.

If it's that loud, you have lots more options for power supplies (e.g. noisy and efficient used server supplies).

Thanks!!!

That's funny, because they sold out of the S4+ and there was no good reason to buy one of those. I wonder how long these S5+ have been run before they were pulled for sale as "new" units? If they're willing to go 48 chips to a blade, it's possible an S7 would still have BM1384 and something like an 18-string would get you right around 0.3W/GH chip-level. Say 3x18 per board runs you about the same hashrate as an S5 and around 385W machine-level.

I haven't tested undervolting S5 boards directly myself. I don't have an adjustable PSU with that kind of current output, and designing one was stalled when we started working on a miner instead. I have run BM1384 chips successfully from 0.58 to 0.80V and the posted efficiencies are about right from what I've seen. Really the only other parts to an S5 board are the inter-node level shifters and per-node LDOs for 0.9V (PLL) and 1.8V (IO) power. The level shifters use a diode drop to translate logic-level signals about 0.8V uphill, which when your node voltages drop to under 0.8 that can affect the received logic levels referenced to local ground, possibly enough that the ASIC might not detect a logic "0" properly. The LDOs also have a min and max input voltage range, and lower-node LDOs are typically powered from core voltage a few nodes uphill. I don't recall the numbers exactly, but possibly if node voltages drop far enough the input voltage for, say, the 1.8V LDO could drop to below the minimum to maintain regulation (probably at least 2.1V) and start starving the chips. The upper few nodes require >12V for their LDOs, so there's a small ~14V boost on the board for them which might also be failing at decreased input voltages for some reason.

I haven't tested either of these things directly to see what's coming into play, but the miner boards we're designing have taken both into account. Our level shifting will use a different method to guarantee signal integrity, and all LDO input voltages will be in-range across the full operating range of the boards.

Think a stacked pair of DPS2K would run an S5+ pretty well?

Probably not the right thread but a quick comment on Undervolting an S5.

Have just taken delivery of a 2nd hand S5 and after some quick initial checks that everything was ok had a quick go at dropping the volts.

First, very early impression, is that things work as expected...

Tested at 125MHz with 9.0V at the connectors.

(Not wanting to tell people how to suck eggs, but perhaps those that are bragging about how much current they can push through a Molex connector, you need to measure the voltage that is actually getting to the board)

Only measured over a 30 Minute period the Hash was 440GH/s (a bit lower than expected, should be 470GH/s . Over the short time the rate was fluctuating quite a lot and needs further investigation)

Current from the supply (not the wall) was 12.1 Amps so 109 Watts

So that gives 109/440 = J/GH 0.248  :)

No xxx, HW error a bit higher than I would like to see @ 0.05%

Boots up and starts hashing at 9V, although to be fair it's 10V with no load because of the rubbish leads I am using on the adjustable PSU.

So a lot more tests to run but a better than expected start. Is it my S5, am I lucky, am I doing something wrong? Time and more measurements will tell.

Rich

Interesting, folks have previously said that the S5 couldn't be reliably unvervolted past about 11 volts....

 They'd have to go 20-string to even get close to the numbers Lketc has already posted for it's upcomming miner at the miner level. I don't think they have enough space on the board to put 3x20 strings on it, though with the power reduction per chip cooling would be NO issue with either an 18-string or a 20-string.

 
 I don't see any chance the S7 will be BM1384 based, given previous comments out of Bitmain. I can see a VERY FAINT possibility of them putting out a "S5++" with more chips per string, but it would have to show up Real Soon Now and would have to be priced lower per TH than the current S5+ to have a prayer of ROI.

I think MrTeal reported the 11V reliability floor, and I trust him to know what he's doing. What board version is that? I only have access to some partly-working V1.3 PCBs with six level-shifter diodes, but I've seen some others (not sure what PCB rev) with only five. I haven't checked what the difference is.

Also, I'm really surprised you got 0.25W/GH out of it with the extra fan and controller current.


I would also be surprised to see a BM1384 S7, but given the S4+ and S5+ they don't seem to mind doing things I think are kinda stupid and still turn a profit on it. I figured 3x17 to be a practical max for BM1384 on a S[odd] chassis but that doesn't give you much benefit over the 2x15 string currently in use - about 10% more hashrate at about 20% less power for 70% more chip cost - not like a new-gen chip would. If they're prepping for someone else to put out a new gen in the next month or so it makes sense to get a leg up by moving better gear, but Bitmain has already proven they have no interest in competing with themselves as long as their machines are the most efficient already. Unless someone else steps up with a gamechanger efficiency (rumors for LK's machine are December shipping), they'll continue to push approximately-status-quo miners like the S4+ and S5+ even though they could have been selling better equipment than that six months ago if they wanted to. I'd be surprised to see the S5 and S5+ as the only BM1384 miners released, since they're not even touching the low range of a really good chip like the S2 did for BM1380 and the S4 and S4+ did for BM1382.

I wonder if perhaps the chip cost of the BM1384 has declined enough that maybe it's more practical to use more "downclocked" parts to get an overall improvement. Give how long the BM1384 has been out, you would think the yields at TSMC (or wherever) would be pretty good by now.

The arrival of the S5+ makes me wonder about how likely a "soon to be released" S7 is, presumably with a BM1386.

I will start a new thread on S5 Undervolting, will put a link here when I've done it.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1151460.msg12124622#msg12124622

Rich