adding "doubleup" will just bring this "fair" game into another gambling rolling dice ... with the same result You will just lose ALL your money overtime (with more fun, of course ...)
ps. Bitzino , If you add this, please allow users to disable this feature, I will not pass my time on the screen saying "No, thanks" ...
I imagine the 50/50 roll would also be provably fair, since everything else on the site is. Gamblers tend to like the 50/50 double-up bet since it has a 0% house edge, which is better than any other bet on offer, generally. It doesn't cost the house any expectation, but does increase their variance. Instead of "jack high" being a break-even hand for the house, it becomes either a +1 or a -1 result with equal probability if the player takes the 50/50. |
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Is this thread some sort of sick joke?
I don't know. But I did make a little over 2 risk-free bitcents today playing SatoshiDice for Come-from-Beyond with a coin he sent me. That bit was real. |
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I don't know if it needs changing, but maybe it's something to think about. Would it be better if adding and removing chips from my balance both happened at the same 'speed', whether gradual or instant?
Good thought! My suspicion is that this would be a little bit "busy" with too much animation. But, I'll give it a try, and see how it feels! There was some talk long ago about allowing the user to disable animations. Perhaps this is one such animation. Along with the 'rolling' dice, spinning roulette wheel, etc. |
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Another little detail that you may want to consider:
When I win at roulette, the winnings count up gradually on my balance. If, while they're counting up, I place another bet and spin the wheel again, they keep counting up until they're done, and only then is the new bet deducted from the total. The deduction happens in a single step, rather than counting down gradually. It looks odd to see the game work 'so hard' to add to my balance, when it can remove chips in the blink of an eye.
I don't know if it needs changing, but maybe it's something to think about. Would it be better if adding and removing chips from my balance both happened at the same 'speed', whether gradual or instant?
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I doubt it. Nobody loses 25 times in a row on a 91% chance bet. The odds against it happening are massive.
That's exactly what someone trying martingale strategy would say, it might be what actually happened here. I watched black hit 16 times in a row on roulette. I said, "Well just f me in the a!"  Rare? Sure. Chances are something like (ignoring 0 green) 0.001525%. But does it happen? Yep. .001525% is not 0%. There's a difference between 16 50% chance events happening and 25 9% chance events happening. .001525% is not 0%, but 0.0000000000000000000000001472% is pretty much 0% - and that's the percentage chance of losing 25 "lessthan 60000" bets in a row. ie. it didn't happen. >>> "%.28f" % ((1 - 60000/65536.0)**25 * 100)
'0.0000000000000000000000001472'
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Alright, I'll have fun trying anyway.
1% of final net winnings.
I bet you wouldn't have bored the customer to death with tedious mathematics and provided txids before sending the bet even though he didn't want it. That's what you get when you spend the extra 4%. A level of customer service that nobody wants! |
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No need to post txs. I trust u.
OK, thanks. Well, the first (easiest) bet won: Net amount: +1.14669885 BTC Transaction ID: c13b5efc99d5aea1ecf9e0e2388946ad5147917c89448182c719b60b6bb3ab51 So on with the 2nd, slightly harder bet, without further ado or txid proofs... And we won again! win: Net amount: +1.41574223 BTC Transaction ID: 71861fe0ada8cd652d087517aa3e13bebecd3383158c191633f784ffbc8160bc Unfortunately that's not quite the 0.40 BTC you hoped for after my 5%: >>> (1.41574223-1) * 0.95 0.3949551185 So I've just sent 1.39495512 to your address. We'll have to put off getting rich from the lessthan 32 game to another time! Net amount: -1.39495512 BTC Transaction ID: 7ed1eba6ad0ff974c67ca05fea4d02ffad1b392958a13c96d865fba67527e5e2 Pleasure doing business with you.  |
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No need to post txs. I trust u.
OK, thanks. Well, the first (easiest) bet won: Net amount: +1.14669885 BTC Transaction ID: c13b5efc99d5aea1ecf9e0e2388946ad5147917c89448182c719b60b6bb3ab51 So on with the 2nd, slightly harder bet, without further ado or txid proofs... |
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It just occurred to me. When I make the bet, the bet won't use your coins (they only have 2 confirms so far), it'll use one of my old coins probably. So I could make a bet, and if I win, make another one the same. And keep doing that until I lose. And then show you the losing transaction, and say "sorry, you lost".
I won't - but it's something to be aware of when having someone play for you!
I guess to prove I'm being fair I will publish the bet transaction ID here before sending it to SD - so I won't know whether it is a win or a lose when I tell you I made it. I can do that by disconnecting from the net before sending my bet, then grabbing the txid from the client, then closing the client, reconnecting to the net, posting the txid, and finally restarting the client and sending the txid.
Seems like a lot of work for 5% of 40% of 1 BTC, but hey I'm not doing anything else. Except for burning perogies.
Heh. If 5% of 40% of 1 BTC is too low, u could make a bet on "lessthan 32". 5% of 1997 BTC is good enough, isn't it? If the two "easy" bets win, and if there's more than 1.40 BTC left after my cut, I'll put the excess on lessthan 32.  |
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It just occurred to me. When I make the bet, the bet won't use your coins (they only have 2 confirms so far), it'll use one of my old coins probably. So I could make a bet, and if I win, make another one the same. And keep doing that until I lose. And then show you the losing transaction, and say "sorry, you lost".
I won't - but it's something to be aware of when having someone play for you!
I guess to prove I'm being fair I will publish the bet transaction ID here before sending it to SD - so I won't know whether it is a win or a lose when I tell you I made it. I can do that by disconnecting from the net before sending my bet, then grabbing the txid from the client, then closing the client, reconnecting to the net, posting the txid, and finally restarting the client and sending the txid.
Seems like a lot of work for 5% of 40% of 1 BTC, but hey I'm not doing anything else. Except for burning perogies.
My first bet will be 1 BTC on "lessthan 56000". The txid is cfce734f9cab4747c75873d11fba499107a89b8660bc010771d90796a26253b2. I didn't send it yet, as you can see here: http://blockchain.info/search?search=cfce734f9cab4747c75873d11fba499107a89b8660bc010771d90796a26253b2It says the transaction doesn't exist. |
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It just occurred to me. When I make the bet, the bet won't use your coins (they only have 2 confirms so far), it'll use one of my old coins probably. So I could make a bet, and if I win, make another one the same. And keep doing that until I lose. And then show you the losing transaction, and say "sorry, you lost".
I won't - but it's something to be aware of when having someone play for you!
I guess to prove I'm being fair I will publish the bet transaction ID here before sending it to SD - so I won't know whether it is a win or a lose when I tell you I made it. I can do that by disconnecting from the net before sending my bet, then grabbing the txid from the client, then closing the client, reconnecting to the net, posting the txid, and finally restarting the client and sending the txid.
Seems like a lot of work for 5% of 40% of 1 BTC, but hey I'm not doing anything else. Except for burning perogies.
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5% of the net winnings. Try to make a single bet. I'd like to win 0.4 BTC. For a single bet, there's lessthan 48000, which pays 1.338x, or lessthan 32768, which pays 1.957x. I've mentioned to the SD guys before that they should have more bets between these two because that's quite a gap, but it never happened. Ideally we'd put your money on something that pays 1.42x or so, to win you your 0.4 BTC. I propose putting it all on lessthan 48000, which will win you around 0.338 BTC. Alternatively, I could put it all on lessthan 52k and if that wins, put the winnings on lessthan 56k. Those two together (as an accumulator) pay 1.147 * 1.235 = 1.416545x, which is pretty much what you asked for. That's what I'll do if that's OK with you - 52k, then 56k. |
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So do I get 5% of each winning bet? Or 5% of the net winnings? I said net winnings, so I guess we'll go with that. It gives me an incentive not to lose it all. The best strategy I know is not to play. The edge is in the house's favour. So the best strategy I know would be to just send the BTC back to you. But that way I don't any chance to make a profit for myself. Do you have a 2nd choice of strategy? It's probably best to make a single bet for the whole amount. But you could do that for yourself. I could use a martingale strategy, but I'm worried the fees will become significant for such a small amount. I guess I should ask how much you want to win. Would you be happy with a 5% return? 10%? Obviously the higher the return, the higher the risk of losing it all. |
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I'll play for only 1% of your winnings.
Firstbits 18tkn.
Sold! I expect there won't be any winnings, and you'll end up spending a lot of time for no reward. Unless you mean 1% of each winning bet, rather than 1% off the final net winnings. In which case I'll go 0.5% if that's how it works... |
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To incrment the trigger the you must hit 10 on the payout table.
To trigger the donattion a max bex must hit 10 4 typos in 2 lines? This is your brain on drugs. Actually this our your brains trying to do to many things in to few hours. Thank you for pointing that out Dooglus, we have updated the site again Yeah, I was just trying to be funny. I'm not very good at it. |
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Would anybody be interested?
Yes. Post here ur address. I'll send money with instructions. I'll play for you for only 5% of your net winnings, if any. Send funds to 1ENhPicE9pA79aXVacrZBzLjWRv4e7MTNr and tell me your instructions. |
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But, thanks for bringing this up, because it is an angle that we should consider when developing future games.
That was my intention - just to bring it to your attention and see if you had any magic fix for it, and if not, at least have you be aware of the issue. |
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Results: 2012-Oct-16 12:55pm (up to block 203589)
Address Target Should Win | #Bets | Win | Lose | Refunds | BTC In | BTC Out | Refund | Profit | RTP
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1dice1e6p 1 0.00002 | 26108 | 0 (0.00000) | 25725 | 383 | 211.29 | 0.01 | 33.79 | 211.27 | 0.009
1dice1Qf4 2 0.00003 | 1928 | 0 (0.00000) | 1851 | 77 | 28.07 | 0.00 | 8.28 | 28.06 | 0.006
1dice2pxm 4 0.00006 | 2750 | 0 (0.00000) | 2712 | 38 | 34.99 | 0.03 | 4.42 | 34.96 | 0.089
1dice2vQo 8 0.00012 | 3491 | 2 (0.00058) | 3445 | 44 | 64.40 | 16.06 | 5.65 | 48.33 | 24.948
1dice2WmR 16 0.00024 | 4999 | 1 (0.00020) | 4960 | 38 | 149.36 | 4.28 | 8.40 | 145.08 | 2.865
1dice2xkj 32 0.00049 | 6527 | 3 (0.00046) | 6512 | 12 | 442.77 | 303.33 | 1.29 | 139.43 | 68.508
1dice2zdo 64 0.00098 | 8463 | 8 (0.00095) | 8433 | 22 | 694.41 | 124.47 | 55.64 | 569.93 | 17.925
1dice37Ee 128 0.00195 | 10637 | 19 (0.00180) | 10562 | 56 | 1631.83 | 1274.69 | 44.25 | 357.14 | 78.114
1dice3jkp 256 0.00391 | 11694 | 53 (0.00454) | 11627 | 14 | 1654.91 | 1996.47 | 13.11 | -341.56 | 120.639
1dice4J1m 512 0.00781 | 17590 | 135 (0.00768) | 17444 | 11 | 3254.78 | 2864.45 | 9.35 | 390.32 | 88.008
1dice5wwE 1000 0.01526 | 35610 | 542 (0.01523) | 35056 | 12 | 9396.03 | 8827.10 | 1.80 | 568.92 | 93.945
1dice61SN 1500 0.02289 | 16880 | 395 (0.02341) | 16477 | 8 | 5255.17 | 5347.60 | 15.00 | -92.42 | 101.759
1dice6DPt 2000 0.03052 | 24618 | 772 (0.03136) | 23842 | 4 | 6124.83 | 5547.75 | 9.24 | 577.07 | 90.578
1dice6gJg 3000 0.04578 | 17234 | 801 (0.04650) | 16425 | 8 | 7456.74 | 8874.09 | 24.99 | -1417.34 | 119.008
1dice6GV5 4000 0.06104 | 17231 | 1073 (0.06229) | 16154 | 4 | 5004.82 | 4571.18 | 31.20 | 433.64 | 91.335
1dice6wBx 6000 0.09155 | 22997 | 2160 (0.09400) | 20818 | 19 | 10678.27 | 10683.53 | 7.01 | -5.25 | 100.049
1dice6YgE 8000 0.12207 | 92177 | 11325 (0.12289) | 80829 | 23 | 12384.29 | 10682.17 | 0.00 | 1702.11 | 86.256
1dice7EYz 12000 0.18311 | 23343 | 4347 (0.18633) | 18982 | 14 | 8762.46 | 8961.41 | 14.50 | -198.95 | 102.271
1dice7fUk 16000 0.24414 | 98995 | 24150 (0.24401) | 74822 | 23 | 57710.24 | 56014.41 | 347.79 | 1695.83 | 97.061
1dice7W2A 24000 0.36621 | 69567 | 25560 (0.36767) | 43959 | 48 | 37804.38 | 37613.20 | 212.64 | 191.17 | 99.494
1dice8EMZ 32000 0.48828 | 601272 | 293587 (0.48864) | 307237 | 448 | 353871.40 | 350770.69 | 2173.41 | 3100.70 | 99.124
1dice97EC 32768 0.50000 | 217371 | 108469 (0.49943) | 108716 | 186 | 204268.83 | 201788.65 | 1295.22 | 2480.17 | 98.786
1dice9wcM 48000 0.73242 | 162246 | 119339 (0.73590) | 42828 | 79 | 160698.48 | 158753.23 | 467.98 | 1945.25 | 98.790
1dicec9k7 52000 0.79346 | 14756 | 11733 (0.79557) | 3015 | 8 | 23698.29 | 23479.37 | 400.00 | 218.92 | 99.076
1dicegEAr 56000 0.85449 | 14458 | 12384 (0.85780) | 2053 | 21 | 21386.45 | 21100.91 | 400.00 | 285.53 | 98.665
1diceDCd2 60000 0.91553 | 7172 | 6569 (0.91682) | 596 | 7 | 16157.98 | 16214.67 | 0.00 | -56.69 | 100.351
1dice9wVt 64000 0.97656 | 7983 | 7681 (0.98009) | 156 | 146 | 16525.57 | 16245.21 | 239.21 | 280.35 | 98.303
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
small (bets < 4 BTC) | 1488955 | 606265 | 881146 | 1544 | 370288.25 | 361660.01 | 150.94 | 8628.24 | 97.670
big (bets >= 4 BTC) | 49142 | 24843 | 24090 | 209 | 595062.90 | 590399.09 | 5673.35 | 4663.80 | 99.216
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
| 1538097 | 631108 | 905236 | 1753 | 965351.16 | 952059.11 | 5824.30 | 13292.05 | 98.623
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SD Profit before fees: 13292.05384721 BTC (1.377%)
Cumulative Fees Paid: 774.87630000 BTC
SD Profit after fees: 12517.17754721 BTC (1.297%)
----
Since Satoshi Dice started, there have been:
Blockchain Tx: 5164775 : SatoshiDice Tx: 2857479 (55.3%)
Blockchain MB: 2160.1 : SatoshiDice Tx: 1166.1 (54.0%)  |
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While attempting to lose the 1 BTC you recently added to my account, I noticed that the roulette wheel shows a "Win: 400" when I win 400, but doesn't show a corresponding "Lose:" message when I lose. Also, the "Win:" message disappears as soon as I start placing bets for the next spin.
These are both things you recently addressed for the craps game. Perhaps making roulette behave the same as craps would be good.
I also noticed another inconsistency between the games. In craps and roulette, my balance goes down before I start the game, but in blackjack it only goes down when I start the game. It may be that there's no good way of getting the games to 'feel' similar in that respect, since in blackjack we don't place bets on the table before dealing, unlike in craps and roulette, but I thought maybe it's something you hadn't considered, and might have a solution for.
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I guess im that unlucky guy that loses 25 times in a row on a 91% chance to win game the day after winning large sums in the same game.
I doubt it. Nobody loses 25 times in a row on a 91% chance bet. The odds against it happening are massive. |
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