That's just the textbook definition of sunk cost fallacy.  If anything you are just proving my point.  We spend a bunch of time, resources, and energy to create a virtual commodity (bitcoin) that has no real value, especially if bitcoin died.  If you spent all that same time, effort, and resources to dig up silver instead, worst case scenario you could convert them to 29% efficiency solar panels in the end.  It's crazy to waste time and resources on a black hole called mining for an imaginary resource when you can mine for a real resource instead.

Claiming that you NEED bitcoin to send money to China is also another fallacy because as I've stated a million times, bitcoin is only a currency and not money or the base of Exter's pyramid.  Just like the Chinese wouldn't want an infinite stream of digital US T-bills, they would also not want a continuous stream of bitcoins.  They are going to want some type of REAL WORLD good or service for their trade so you will be shipping them something in a large ship anyway.  You do not eliminate the movement of real world goods by using bitcoin.

This is false.  Bitcoin has zero value as a settlement layer because far better alternatives for settlement existed before it's creation (noble metals).  For bitcoin to have value as a settlement layer it would need to be able to compete as the base of Exter's pyramid, but it can't for numerous reasons I've stated before:

1)  Bitcoin has built in middlemen (transaction validators) and counter party risk, negative traits that are typically found among "currencies" and never found among "money".  The entire purpose of the base of Exter's pyramid is to remove counter party risk so that even if everyone else on the planet dies, you are not left holding a worthless coupon.  This is why something is required to be an actual commodity, not a fake psuedo commodity (bitcoin) to be real money.  Bitcoin will always be just a currency alone and not money, and currencies derive value from transaction flow (scalability) not stock.

2)  Money is an abstract concept that represents goods or the ability to do work (services).  This means the ideal form of money would be energy based since it represents both a commodity and service at the same time.  The problem there is that humans don't have the technology to do so and remove counter party risk, and the free market time after time has signaled removing counter party risk is even more important, so it utilized metals.  The fact that anything you do in bitcoin is going to make you a 1 of N participant means there is no removing counter party risk in bitcoin and it's dead on arrival for competing as a settlement system, aka money, aka the base of Exter's pyramid.

3)  All forms of money and currency have elements of a pyramid or ponzi scheme to them, meaning it's all about me finding some resource and hoarding a bunch of it to try and create a master/slave relationship where I now rule over you because I got what you need.  Such a paradigm doesn't actually work with a "virtual" commodity.  If Elwar or Jimbo corners the entire 21 millioin coin market, it really doesn't mean shit to me.  Under no circumstance do I need their coins when they have no intrinsic real world use, so I can completely ignore them and thus no master/slave relationship is formed.  This is also a good reason why gold may lose a lot of it's market cap to silver in the long run due to gold having far less use.

Or China can go full retard, perform the "anyone can spend" attack by going from legacy bitcoin to segwit, fork back to legacy bitcoin, spend all segwit transactions, and since their BCC chain wouldn't be affected, legacy BTC is now crippled while they pump their BCC coin.

Ver is demonized as the bad guy on the forum, but the lightning network doesn't actually function in a decentralized manner, so he might end up being on the right side of history in the end assuming there is no small block miracle scaling solution (it's not gonna be payment channels...that will just benefit interbank transactions)

Most people buying bitcoins nowadays know absolutely nothing about whether it does or doesn't have some type of fundamentals (doesn't for decentralization or scaling).  

This is the bitcoin market:

I wouldn't touch fractional reserve paper metals.  I could type all kinds of stuff about it, but one of the more problematic examples is that they will be forced to revalue metals in the near future and when said event happens, they will settle everyone's GLD account into fiat USD spot price first and immediately revalue right after, so basically a confiscation in practice.  Paper metals are 100% useless.


The word "blockchain" is just a hype marketing word to describe a linked list with a get rich quick scheme built on top of it.  It is not a new invention at all or a "new industrial revolution".  The get rich quick scheme was supposed to create incentive for a large mass of participants to enter, which would create some pseudo form of Nash equilibrium amongst thousands of miners, but it failed miserably in decentralization since PoW is designed to centralize and now you have just a handful of mining corporations.  Bitcoin wasn't "created by god", it was just an experiment which did not actually accomplish what it claimed to set out to do.

And hell, that's just the decentralization aspect it failed in.  It also needed to scale to have any value and that aspect went totally fubar as well since lightning network only works in a centralized manner.

Decentralization is determined by the ability of the general public to be able to MINE BITCOIN, NOT run a fucking node!  Therefore it's COMPLETELY centralized.

Bitcoin has ZERO, I repeat, ZERO value as a settlement layer because there already exists far better settlement alternatives - noble metals (gold and silver).  This is why currencies were always derivatives of them in the past.  Bitcoin has built-in middle men (transaction validators) and counter party risk while metals DO NOT.  Bitcoin is a rent seeking usury system where miners expect to get a cut out of every transaction like the mafia while metals ARE NOT.  

You need to be a complete lunatic to believe bitcoin somehow has better fundamentals as a settlement system than metals.  Can you imagine issuing currencies as a derivative of bitcoin when bitcoin is already only a currency and not money in the first place? LOL.  For the the 500th time, bitcoin is a currency, not money, which is why it's called "cryptocurrency".  The value of currencies are derived from transaction flow, NOT stock.  

LOL, no.  Silver is the most undervalued asset in the world right now.  If silver was only good for a 2x I wouldn't even bother.  US debt vs gold chart has a 92% correlation, which means gold will head to $2200 in the near future which will see the GSR collapse from 80:1 to 30:1 or lower ($73 silver).  That's a 4.4x even within their rigged system where the price is suppressed, let alone factoring in something like massive money printing or the economic system imploding.  This is what I consider easy money because it's very likely, almost inevitable to occur.  

You would need someone to pump bitcoin to $12,000 to match that trade.  Bitcoin, even though it has crap for fundamentals since it's not decentralized and doesn't scale, might get another pump looking for greater fools to buy next halving, but bitcoin is no longer a cheap penny stock to buy.  The market cap of bitcoin and silver are around the same now.  It's no longer the biggest upside item around because other assets were suppressed by central bankers while they allowed this imaginary, digital asset to rise in order to try and promote a "cashless society" and eventually release their own governmentcoin.

The bitcoin market is in deep shit once the general public finds out Lightning Network isn't a valid scaling solution.  Sure, it works as a CENTRALIZED scaling solution, but not a decentralized one.  Not that the base bitcoin network itself is even decentralized in the first place.  

The market can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent, but on a long enough timeline, dumping bitcoin for silver (while silver is at the floor) is the best move you can make in the long run right now.  Sure, some idiot could pump BTC higher, but there is no valid scaling solution, and it's useless without scaling.  It's value prospect is also supposed to be based on decentralization, and it's not even decentralized either!  There's no god damn fundamentals for it anywhere!  It's all just a pump and dump scheme at this point.

Negative.

Both parties are wrong.  It's not possible for any cryptocurrency to be fungible:

Yes, yes, right after we are all culturally enriched by forced rapefugee bombardment taking the average IQ down from 100 to 75, this will grant us the power of interstellar travel and space mining:

http://whitegenocideproject.com/governor-tells-minnesotans-to-find-another-state-if-they-dont-like-african-immigration/

Lol, this is complete bullshit and those companies are basically Buttalik Butterin IPO scams.  It's such bullshit they can't even create a valid infographic of what said mining would look like.  Does this look like something you're going to see anytime soon or even a valid way to mine in the first place? LOL.  Let me guess, the structure on the left is a Dyson sphere they're trying to maneuver around the sun to start up the miner (which probably also mines bitcoin at the same time):

There is truly no hope for people involved in bitcoin.

from:
http://steemit.com/money/@r0achtheunsavory/the-r0ach-report-20-everything-you-ever-wanted-to-know-about-precious-metals-vs-bitcoin-fundamentals-and-the-future-of-the

There is truly no hope for people involved in bitcoin.

from:
http://steemit.com/money/@r0achtheunsavory/the-r0ach-report-20-everything-you-ever-wanted-to-know-about-precious-metals-vs-bitcoin-fundamentals-and-the-future-of-the

Gold and tungsten are EXTREMELY similar in things like the specific gravity test, which is one reason it seems a lot harder to fake silver than gold to me.  Things like the ping test seem to be more effective for silver as well, along with stuff like the magnet slide test and others.  Having said that, fake gold would still not pass the trained eye in the specific gravity test, nor the machines the bullion dealers run them through.  For the average man on the street though, it's really not hard to spot fake silver if you know what to look for, so fake metals are really not a problem at least in the silver market because it has a lot of unique traits to identify it.

http://silvergoldbull.com currently has the best deals if buying less than $10k at a time while http://www.jmbullion.com/ is same price with faster shipping if buyign $10k or more.  Both take bitcoin.


In terms of premiums and buy vs resale price, Canadian silver maple leafs are currently the best deal right now at this point in time because silver eagle premiums are up (demand spiked I guess).  Sunshine mint 10 oz bars and American silver eagles are currently the next best thing in terms of price vs resale liquidity.

If you're going to try and argue with me about metals, please have at least some primitive understanding of how the market works.

For people clueless about metals vs bitcoin:

The ESF naked shorts metals down capping them to like 5-10% above cost of production in order to try and contain them.  The vast majority of their cost of production is based on the oil price, so metals in this rigged market are almost like oil futures in practice.  Over the last 100 years we were arbing excess and cheap (basically free) energy into the extraction of these metals pulling out enormous amounts of them, far more than were mined in the Roman days.

The time has now come where we've used up most the low hanging fruit in energy and EROI is collapsing (energy return on investment) so this arb game is ending.  At the same time where EROI is collapsing, we are also reaching peak gold and peak silver at the same time.  For instance, you need to move something like twice as much earth on average in the year 2017 as in the year 2000 in order to get 1 oz of silver (not to mention they printed an enormous amount of money at the same time).

The holy trinity that will catapult metals to the moon is the combination of collapsing EROI, crashing metals content per ton of earth mined, and probable revaluation of metals by the CBs in the near future (gold to $10k+ and silver even higher percentage gains).  Cost of production to mine anything in space will be astronomical so you're wasting my time even mentioning it.  You might as well claim we will mine gold inside a black hole or alternate dimension. We would probably attempt to mine metals 2 miles under the ocean long before space but that is of course no threat to anyone buying at current prices.

The fourth piece of the puzzle is that debt based usury currencies require infinite growth to not collapse since the interest due is always higher than the principal.  Demographics have peaked in every nation that matters (the horn of Africa does not matter), and net energy production is flatlined with the cost of  that production rapidly rising due to collapsing EROI.  Since every action in an economy requires someone either doing something by hand or a machine doing it for them and burning fuel in the process, this means growth is over and all debt based currencies are 100% doomed to collapse.

Since the debt based currencies are doomed to collapse, they will be forced to either issue a non-debt based paper currency issued by the treasury like the greenback, or go back to a metals standard.  Either route will see the USD and all other fiats collapse in the process with metals skyrocketing, so metals win regardless.  There has likely never in all of human history been a more bullish time for metals (silver in particular) than this point right now.  

Bitcoin doesn't have good fundamentals to compete with gold and silver as a settlement layer (aka money or the base of Exter's pyramid) because it has built in rent seeking middlemen (transaction validators) and doesn't remove counter party risk.  It also doesn't have good fundamentals as a currency due to horrible scalability from a high redundancy, triple entry accounting design, so it's currently designed to fail at both tasks.  Someone would need to bring it back to the drawing board and completely redesign it as a high throughput currency and forget it ever competing with metals as a settlement layer to have some type of relevency.

Cryptocurrency is not fungible no matter what you do to it, and thus not possible to be money, only currency like dollars or airline miles: