Another question while I'm still trying to grasp the concept. The initial creation of the coloured coins is stored in the blockchain of the wallet that created them. Is it very important the record of this genesis creation/transaction of the coloured coin is kept? If so how does this individual colour marked blockchain be distributed? Or does each wallet just keep its own new colour marked blockchain from receipt of the coloured coins to prove ownership?
There is only one blockchain, the public blockchain. Let me try to draw an analogy: Every US dollar has a serial number on it. The US dollar version of colored coins would be analogous to: "the holder of $20 bill with serial number ABCD1234 owns Chevrolet Corvette VIN 137YA9031WE239523" Colored coins says "bitcoin ABCD1234", whatever its value, is somehow more special than regular bitcoins. This requires special software for the bond issuer and the bond holder, both, that recognizes bitcoin ABCD1234 as special. This is simply an agreement enforced (or not) by running special software. The bond issuer runs software that searches for the current public key holding ABCD1234, and pays dividends to that public key. The bond issuer does not know or care who is the owner. The bond holder runs software that stores ABCD1234 in a special wallet, separate from other bitcoin wallets. This guarantees that the bond holder does not accidentally spend their "special" coin accidentally -- analogous to accidentally giving a rare coin to a vending machine for soda. As I'm looking at issuing coloured coins based on the ownership of over $4,000 of ASIC's how do I prove ownership of the issued coloured coins permanently taking into account of hardware failures. |
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Is there anyway this idea could be used to hold motions/voting weighted off coloured coins ownership?
Yes. The issuer may determine what public key currently controls a colored coin. That is the only information present in the public blockchain data. It is obvious that voting is possible: a colored coin holder may use the 'signmessage' feature to sign any arbitrary text using their bitcoin ECDSA keys. Let us assume that a colored coin has been sent to bitcoin address 1ABCD1234ABCD1234. 1. A public notice of voting is posted <somewhere>, of a vote. This notice includes a sample ballot, a simple text message format. 2. The owner of 1ABCD1234ABCD1234 downloads the sample ballot, edits it to reflect their vote, and then uses the 'signmessage' RPC to add a cryptographic signature. 3. The owner of 1ABCD1234ABCD1234 emails the signed ballot to voting@mycompany.com, or maybe, voting@thirdpartyballotservice.com. 4. The bond issuer, or 3rd party vote tabulation service, looks at the blockchain to verify that the email just received is signed by the holder of public key 1ABCD1234ABCD1234, and that 1ABCD1234ABCD1234 does indeed still control the colored coin. Cool, sounds complex but I'm sure it could be built into the new altered wallet and made simple enough. Another question while I'm still trying to grasp the concept. The initial creation of the coloured coins is stored in the blockchain of the wallet that created them. Is it very important the record of this genesis creation/transaction of the coloured coin is kept? If so how does this individual colour marked blockchain be distributed? Or does each wallet just keep its own new colour marked blockchain from receipt of the coloured coins to prove ownership? |
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Is there anyway this idea could be used to hold motions/voting weighted off coloured coins ownership?
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The company currently ownes $4,022 of hardware assets. That's $1.71587030716724 per share we also have ~BTC24.00 on the GLBSE and £90 of cash left that I'm converting into bitcoin tonight while the price is low.
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what do others think ? (other shareholders )
The only other shareholder I've spoken to (who is in the Retroshare pgp web of trust) is keen on the idea. This is not a benevolent thing were doing. We offering the pay as an incentive to devs to build us a usable product for managing, proving ownership, paying dividends and trading shares in our asset. |
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For any shareholders who want to contact me anonymously and securely with trust you can do so using Retroshare - ( http://retroshare.sourceforge.net/) - if we can get enough of us on there we can have a private forum for asset holders only. Where we can all communicate privatly, securely, anonymously and direct to each other without using any central servers or such infustructure. Here is my key, if you add me don't forget to post your key here or inbox me and please sign my key so we can start a PGP web of trust - -----BEGIN PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK-----
Version: OpenPGP:SDK v0.9
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=Ag9h
-----END PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK-----
--SSLID--2de9aeb356090d24251d2f07c7fb81d8;--LOCATION--Home;
--LOCAL--192.168.1.69:59825;--EXT--86.164.7.74:59825;
As I'm new to pgp encyption and Retroshare does it all for you it what I'm going to use for RSM votes. So if you want to vote I recommend you install it, add my key plus sign it and send me yours. Although I haven't got our shareholders list yet to work out each shareholders weighting |
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there is no way to vote on this , I still think crypto is best then vote on there via motions on what to do next
instead of giving away shares of RSM to projects that may not work out
I'm not using Cryptostocks to trade or issue shares. With coloured coins you could create your own asset on Cryptostocks valued against your coloured coins (shares) if you want to, or on a Open-Transaction server or you could just trade your shares (colored coins) however you want, but I'm not creating, issuing or trading any shares ever again. Also we are not giving away shares I will hold them. The devs will just receive the profit from those allocated shares as long as there developing for us. What are you using these projects for? Basically to prove ownership of our asset and pay dividends. I recomend you read up on coloured coins. Try these two links - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=106373.0https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=117630.0You should be able to hold your coloured coins (shares) in blockchain.info online wallet. Blockchain.info online wallet is very secure, they don't hold your coins and your wallet can be automatically backed up to your email or dropbox. What I will be recommending tho is for as many people as possible on as many different PC's as possible is to run a new altered version of the default bitcoin wallet. To keep a copy of our new coloured blockchain that proves everyone's ownership. |
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there is no way to vote on this , I still think crypto is best then vote on there via motions on what to do next
instead of giving away shares of RSM to projects that may not work out
I'm not using Cryptostocks to trade or issue shares. With coloured coins you could create your own asset on Cryptostocks valued against your coloured coins (shares) if you want to, or on a Open-Transaction server or you could just trade your shares (colored coins) however you want, but I'm not creating, issuing or trading any shares ever again. Also we are not giving away shares I will hold them. The devs will just receive the profit from those allocated shares as long as there developing for us. I took the executive decision and unless there is a major shit-storm about it I'm doing it for the health and benefit of our asset. You should look into 'coloured coins' and how useful they will be to us. They should also probably enable us to hold secure motions eventually. The only downside is we will need as many shareholders as possible to hold and run the new copy of our coloured blockchain. As long as we have enough coloured blockchains running for redundancy (because if we don't keep at least one copy everyone's proof of ownership is lost) then you could keep your coloured coins (shares) on the secure online wallet by blockchain.info. Which is what I'll recommend everyone does: to keep a copy of our new coloured blockchain running on as many PC's as possible if you don't want eveyone including yourself to loose ownership. Then keep your coloured coins in a separate online blockchain.info wallet that is backed up to your email or dropbox. Then you can't loose your coloured coins to hardware failure and blockchain.info's wallet is very secure and they don't hold your coins. As many new coloured blockchains will need to be held as possible try to have mulitple copies of the new coloured blockchain on as many different machines as possible but they don't need to be running 24/7 just kept updated once a day(s). Otherwise everyone could loose ownership. I'll keep a copy of all shareholders (weighting) online privately but that doesn't help if the new coloured coins (shares) are traded. |
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there is no way to vote on this , I still think crypto is best then vote on there via motions on what to do next
instead of giving away shares of RSM to projects that may not work out
I'm not using Cryptostocks to trade or issue shares. With coloured coins you could create your own asset on Cryptostocks valued against your coloured coins (shares) if you want to, or on a Open-Transaction server or you could just trade your shares (colored coins) however you want, but I'm not creating, issuing or trading any shares ever again. Also we are not giving away shares I will hold them. The devs will just receive the profit from those allocated shares as long as there developing for us. |
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I've put this bounty up As long as the shareholders don't massively disagree I'm going to offer out a 0.5% ownership of the former GLBSE mining stock/asset RSM - (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=63257.0) - That works out currently as ownership of 0.9(GH/s) of BFL-SC-Singles although we will be saving 50% of profits towards buying more ASIC's to increase the (MH/s) per share ratio. For you to implement this idea and maintain it. You wont receive the coloured coins relating to that 0.5% that will be held in a separate account managed by me but you will receive all profits made from 0.5% ownership as long as you maintain the code. I've also offered this bounty to this coloured coins project too - (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=117630.0) - so the first/best implementation will win the bounty. We don't need to use the coloured coins for about another month yet when we receive our first BFL-SC-Single.https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=106373.0So we have a way to manage our shares and pay dividends. You will also be able to issue your own assets on Open-Transaction servers valued against your coloured coins(shares). I hope everyone is with me on this as its very important for us to be able to operate and move forward. |
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As long as the shareholders don't massively disagree I'm going to offer out a 0.5% ownership of the former GLBSE mining stock/asset RSM - ( https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=63257.0) - That works out currently as ownership of 0.9(GH/s) of BFL-SC-Singles although we will be saving 50% of profits towards buying more ASIC's to increase the (MH/s) per share ratio. For you to implement this idea and maintain it. You wont receive the coloured coins relating to that 0.5% that will be held in a separate account managed by me but you will receive all profits made from 0.5% ownership as long as you maintain the code. I've also offered this bounty to this coloured coins project too - ( https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=117630.0) - so the first/best implementation will win the bounty. We don't need to use the coloured coins for about another month yet when we receive our first BFL-SC-Single. |
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As long as the shareholders don't massively disagree I'm going to offer out a 0.5% ownership of the former GLBSE mining stock/asset RSM - ( https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=63257.0) - That works out currently as ownership of 0.9(GH/s) of BFL-SC-Singles although we will be saving 50% of profits towards buying more ASIC's to increase the (MH/s) per share ratio. For you to implement this idea and maintain it. You wont receive the coloured coins relating to that 0.5% that will be held in a separate account managed by me but you will receive all profits made from 0.5% ownership as long as you maintain the code. I've also offered this bounty to this coloured coins project too - ( https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=106373.0) - so the first/best implementation will win the bounty. We don't need to use the coloured coins for about another month yet when we receive our first BFL-SC-Single. |
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For any shareholders who want to contact me anonymously and securely with trust you can do so using Retroshare - ( http://retroshare.sourceforge.net/) - if we can get enough of us on there we can have a private forum for asset holders only. Where we can all communicate privatly, securely, anonymously and direct to each other without using any central servers or such infustructure. Here is my key, if you add me don't forget to post your key here or inbox me and please sign my key so we can start a PGP web of trust - -----BEGIN PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK-----
Version: OpenPGP:SDK v0.9
xsBNBFBH2DcBCAC2yWeG62BW1cSB+6Oye0vj0NyaL3V0hbAeEshqaUjCKab/QuxJ
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XYWXd63j75jmGwoA4TReRme+Z2779IvG5UDI2ZOKmVS4jK2FlrG0VzrbAtM=
=Ag9h
-----END PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK-----
--SSLID--2de9aeb356090d24251d2f07c7fb81d8;--LOCATION--Home;
--LOCAL--192.168.1.69:59825;--EXT--86.164.7.74:59825;
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When colored coins come up I always hear the example of shares / stock. But when it comes to securities, determining ownership and decentralizing the exchange is simply not an interesting problem, compared to the bigger problem of ensuring that the issuing company is trustworthy (which is more of a social problem rather than a technological one). I believe there is a demand for a secure trading platform which doesn't try to be an investment bank. You probably know that Goat was delisted from GLBSE. Maybe he shouldn't have been there in the first place, but now this delisting creates problem for Goat and for people who bought something from him. Or imagine a situation where GLBSE will suffer from catastrophic data failure, it it will be hacked. Do people have a backup plan? Suppose they even have a list of owners (this features is offered by MPex), can they continue trading after being delisted or after some problem with exchange? With a trading platform based on colored coins ownership data is encoded in a blockchain, it cannot be lost, it cannot be hacked in realistic scenarios. You cannot be delisted. You will be able to trade no matter what. Maybe this problem is not interesting to you because you haven't considered catastrophic failure scenarios yet. But things like that happened to currency exchanges and wallet services, why do you think stock exchange would be immune? Anyway, I'm a programmer, not a lawyer. I cannot help you with non-trustworthy exchanges, but I can help to develop a secure trading platform. By the way, it might help with trustworthiness checks indirectly: since smartcoin based trading platform won't do any checks at all, this would create a market for trustworthiness checks. GLBSE wants to be everything at once, they offer some verification, sort of, but it is really half-assed, and its bundled with their trading platform. So people have no choice but to use it, and they don't think that 3rd party rating agency is needed. But when trading platform is open to anybody, amount of bullshit assets will be so high that companies will have no option but to go to 3rd party rating agency. As many such agencies can co-exist, there will be a market, and so they'll compete to provide best services. I.e. you'll be able to check rating agency's track record. The best way to solve social problem is to provide economic incentive, I think. How close is this to being used for an actual security and have you seen this guys work - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=117630.0 |
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I think I read of a HSBC analyser saying they expect a boom in virtual currency(s) in the next ~5 years.
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Cant you setup an investment club then pool your money in hardware ?
As long as you appoint officers and hold meetings etc I dont see an issue.
In the United States Investment club partnerships must file Form 1065 and Schedule K-1s with the IRS each year, and with states that require partnership filings. In the United Kingdom investment clubs and their members are required to submit form 185(new) to HMRC each year. Investment club accounting software can facilitate the management of a club's books and the preparation of tax filings. |
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We may have a new way to manage and issue shares as well as paying dividends using Coloured Coins - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=117630.0 - You'll then be free to trade them yourself either Over The Counter or on Open-Transaction servers. I think this idea is very important for our asset holders and I put froward the idea we promise the developer a 0.1% stake in RSM once he has made a stable client. That donation would be (1/1000) stake in us or 180(MH/s) on delivery of our three ASIC's. What do investors say? Would a BTC10.00 donation be better if they prefer? |
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Well we will probably wait until it is a bit more mature but I will put forward the idea that you get a donation from our shareholders.
Another question is does the whole blockchain need to be saved and how can I distribute more than one copy of this new coloured blockchain.
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We may have a new way to manage and issue shares as well as paying dividends using Coloured Coins - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=117630.0 - You'll then be free to trade them yourself either Over The Counter or on Open-Transaction servers. |
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