I haven't got shit to show so I'll just keep writing nonsense.
Fixed that for ya.
Several times I provided proof to what I said such as official statements, reported facts that were filmed, events on which soldiers were officially prosecuted how these aren't facts please enlighten me.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_authoritySince I know you won't bother to click, let me sum it up for ya:
A says P about subject matter S.
A should be trusted about subject matter S.
Therefore, P is correct.
The second premise is not accepted as valid, as it amounts to an unfounded assertion that leads to circular reasoning able to define person or group A into inerrancy on any subject matter.
All your comments on your several last replies can be resumed to this, no counter arguments, not proof, derailling discussion to something else and avoiding the disussion on point that matter when you lack arguments, which is once again proves my point
Man, you just love to copy me, don't you. That's getting really sad.
thank you for proving my point once again, now how about, as I asked several times ago, why don't you answer on your point, your strategy of delluting content in this kind of rubbish post would not hide the fact that I asked clear and on point question a few replies ago and to this point you didn't provide answers. Now, can we get back to the point, would please your please answer the points that were mentioned
What was asked, I answered, but when you pretend to be educated, it's no surprise that it through one ear and out of the other.
Are you in denial status right now? Israel does colonize Palestine
UN Security Council Resolution 242
UN Security council Resolution 478
UN Security council Resolution 497 and many more
International justice court orders
All recognize the occupation of Palestinian land by Israel, do you want me to quote the resolutions for you ?
And if you didn't know Palestine is now recognized an observe state and not an non state entity in the UN, hence it is colonization.
And in reference to what was said above, here is an example of Proof I provide which you on the other hand don't and I'm sure you'll try to derail the discussion once again
Quote as many political entities as you want (And yes, ICC is ruled by political agendas), that doesn't equate proof. Much to your dismay.
Yes and that's why I was against the illegitimate US attack on Iraq, but geopolitical and economical reason won the argument, and it is in the US responsibility and the allies (it wasn't US alone) to solve the issue and strengthens the government in place and institution, but that's not the point, the point is the US didn't KICK people out of their territories and occupied them which is the US doing,
It kicked plenty of people, and while they don't occupy those territories, those people can't never go back there.
not to mention that Saddam wasn't an angel, and was a threat to your beloved country (one among many reason Iraq was attacked).
Saddam was a threat just like hamas is now.
No it wasn't imposed, and if you have a proof of such a thing you can provide them, but obviously there was favoritism and lobbying as the "liberator"
Oh wow, you really think the Iraqis were in a position of power during the making of said agreement, oh boy. Someone lives in la-la land.
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-pTJwfgbUjyo/T5vK5X9gyEI/AAAAAAAAAgA/pfrk3ErJtEQ/s640/free+the+shit+out+of+you.jpgWhere do you see me agreeing to such a thing, but from another perspective what the Palestinian are suffering is much more than any other population suffered in modern times, yes they are not getting mass murdered in the hundred of thousands, but they are suffering for a century long of harassment, fear of death with thousands of deaths every now and then
Sure, thousands of death every now and than after they provoke Israel with shooting rockets to populated areas. It's not that Israel just out of the bloom executes 1,000 palestinians, because the PM had a bad breakfast.
and prosecution without warrants of thousands and torture every now and then
Those prosecution is for terrorists, same goes for the torture. But that is something that is irrelevant to the palestinians, that is something every country does.
with areas like Gaza in total siege and blockade without even the minimum necessities for human beings.
They are still, as you people like to quote so often, are above humanitarian crisis level, so I don't see the issue, so they actually do get the minimum necessities. Why would Israel support them any further? They elected hamas, which is a terror organization, as their leadership, which is also why there's a blockade.
Moreover, there's a border with Egypt, and they too, keep it close.
Do you even know what's happening in Lebanon with the palestinians?
Totally relevant, because Iraq was a sovereign state with a strong army, that inflict thousands of death in US force and hundred of thousand of injured according to some sources (over 32K officially recognized) not a single room of comparison here with Palestin.
Irrelevant still, because they hadn't had a chance vs the US. The fact they managed to kill US soldiers doesn't equate they had a chance.
If we take your logic, than hamas is comparable, it did cause hundreds of dead thus far (soldiers).
So because Hamas has in it banner the destruction of Israel, it makes legitimate to kill thousands of civilians and oppress hundred of thousands on a daily basis? so tomorrow if I take a banner written on it Death to Israel or any other state tomorrow(which is extrem and hatefull) on the street I deserve to be killed, my familly to be killed, my friends, neighbours, and city to be destroyed, what a broken logic is this.
If you were in a position of power and were trying to realize your ideology of destroying Israel (launching rockets, sending suicide bombers), than yes, you would be deserved to be killed. If you were to hide behind your family while Israel tried to retaliate, than it's on your when they got hurt. That's actually very logical.
Israel shouldn't (nor any other country) not retaliate in order to protect its citizens just because the enemy is hiding behind civilians, and that's not to say that killing civilians is right, but to say that sometimes there's no way to avoid casualties.
As for the peace negotiation you are the one clueless here, and presenting partial facts, maybe you've forgot the Operation Cast Lead that was orchestrated to stop such peace negotiation as the current offensive is to destroy the new unity government. As for the 1967 borders is beyond you maybe you need to check the UN resolutions on the matter as a reference, now lets check Mr Nattanyaho peace agreement which want full control on west bank and the territories that are not under control will be consider buffer zones or defense zones by Israel (IDF can do what ever they want there) Yup sounds fair.
lol, I am the one clueless? Olmert was the one who proposed the agreement and he was also the one who approved Operation Cast Lead. He offered, the palestinians refused, and moreover, they continued launching rockets into Israeli territory.
So it was orchestrated to stop anything, considering Olmert was in power back then.
But it's a nice fairy tale you got there.
Regarding Netanyahu, I believe he wants peace, but I also know he isn't as bendable as previous PM were. He has in his mind the ideal peace treaty and he isn't compromise. That might mean there won't be a peace treaty between Israel and the palestinians while he's in power, but that's not to say he doesn't want peace.
Not to mention the refusal of the palestinians to even recognize the state of Israel, so even if they were given the 67 borders, that wouldn't be enough.
Hundreds? UN Security council resolutions are 226 in total about this issue, with over half of them condemning attacks on Palestinians in several occasions, so again one more of your lies proven to light.
My lies? You just proved I was right, in more than 1 area. 226 from UN SC and hundreds more from the UN itself:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_the_UN_resolutions_concerning_Israel_and_PalestineMoreover, you wrote youself:
Israel is not respecting any single UN resolution on the matter or the La Haye supreme court orders ..... and for half a century now!.I can go on and on I can write a thousands things proving that the two cannot be compared
Which to I wrote:
Irrelevant if they respect it or not, what matter is if they follow it or not, which they mostly do.
Israel broke 65 resolution thus far out of hundreds of resolutions.
And I was correct.
So actually, it's more lies from you.
Unlike you I do read what I'm linking
No you're not.
No the Palestinians death are not listed there as it is not yet officially recognized
No, it's not listed there because anyone with half a brain knows it's not a genocide.
and what you are basically saying here, is that Jew Holocaust during WW2 wasn't recognized -During- especially by Germans so it was fine, no it doesn't work that way!
Again, a logical fallacy.
Your premise that it's a genocide is wrong, even according to your own sources.
So no, that's not what I was saying. What a sick and twisted mind you got. No wonder you're so full of shit.
While this wasn't the point of my comment as it seems you like,as usual, to derail and not answer on point, I clearly said, that in that list there are event that similar to what happening in Gaza right now and are genocides and there is no reason for this to not be one. Not to mention that most if not all Genocides are officially recognized after events are over.
It's not similar and there's absolutely no logical reason to call it a genocide.
It's your assumption that IDF is targeting palestinians just because of their nationality or ethnicity, when in reality that's not happening.
IDF targets terrorists, those terrorists shot from within populated areas, so of course there will be dead civilians, but from there to genocide is a long way.
As for the Israeli Goverment not initiated anything? are joking ? this point was proven before, but lets discuss once and for all.
-First excuse : Hamas Killed 3 Israelis teen, Hamas denied such a thing, there is no proof of Hamas doing such a thing, heck even Israeli media and intelligence reporting that Hamas has nothing to do with it and I linked and can link elements of this but I'm pretty sure you know about this. (this without mentioning the 2 teens that were killed by IDF and were filmed doing so by surveillance cameras a couple of weeks before but this event was barelly mentioned anywhere as apparently Palestinians lives are not equal)
Yes. hamas was accused, as it is in most cases, the direct responsible for such action, directly or in directly. It was later reported that a different group was responsible for the murder of the 3 Israeli teens. But even that wasn't the action that instigated the current war in gaza.
-Second excuse : Hamas fired thousands of rockets against Israel and Israel population hence Israel response and didn't initiate anything, well this is yet another total lie, IDF, penetrated Palestinian terretories and took hundred of Hamas members that it released in a peace deal among other Civilians, breaking peace deal) and killed 6 Hamas members around 10 civilians, raided thousands of houses, and stole over 3 millions $ among other valuables, not to mention the Palestinian that was filmed (factual proof) being abducted by Israeli extremist and was burned alive and inside out and started air strikes, and all this is between the 12 and the 19 of June right after Reuven Rivlin was elected as president of Israel ( another peace lover of yours that does want a two stats solutions /s),
And this was the response to the 3 teens that were murdered (while they were still looking for them).
What actually lead to Operation Protective Edge was the increase of rocket launching into Israeli territory.
Heck there are even reports that Israel knew that the 3 teen were killed and hours after their abduction on the 12 of June and engaged in cover up operation and banning press for reporting the news.
Can you actually back up this claim with factual proofs? Or is it more of your uneducated assumptions because it just fits your pov.
So please stop with the lies and propagandas.
Lots of assumptions and argumentum ab auctoritate from you and you talk about lies and propaganda? Oh the irony.
No they don't attend to kill Palestinians, they just point deadly weapons on them and shoot them, sounds logical, do you even read what you say?
Wrong premise again. They don't shot at them, they shot at terrorists they hide among them.
No Nazi German soldiers doesn't didn't built the chambers they used to Gaz Jews in for the purpose of killing Jews, they just killed Jews in there after receiving orders to do so makes 100% legit, no seriously stop with this it's makes want to puke especially after seeing all the images and reading many books and documents of jew people suffering and which is the same things for Palestinians right now and I invent you to just look at the picture of civilians in Gaza and their suffering and I'm sure if you have remotely a human heart your want such atrocities and this genocide to stop.
Using an extreme example that doesn't even apply to what's happening right now doesn't make your point valid. Actually, it makes you look like a desperate moron.
When the Israelis will put palestinians in gas chambers or will execute them in masses, than you can compare, until than, don't make a fool out of yourself by comparing nazi Germany to Israel.
Not to mention that the palestinians there are getting hundreds of millions of dollars annually, but hamas is actually the one that steals all that money, the money that could of make the lives of the people there so much more better.
So lets first of all check your list, where you are talking about top 10 : there are 3 Arab countries in that top list namely Saudi Arabia, Iraq (broken country with Zero influence), and United Arab Emirates, and all tree of them are close US Allies and follow US directives and hate Hamas as they has ties with Iran. So you are WRONG!
UAE, Iraq and SA never vote with the US on matters related to Israel, so I am not wrong. You actually made a fool of yourself, once again.
You claim 18 arab countries export Oils, yet you fail to gasp that over half of those aren't even self sufficient, and have less than a decade of proven reserves like Yemen, Mauritania, Tunisia, Egypt, and co they are poor countries,
Looking at the people is no indication if the country is poor or not, in fact, from the 4 you mentions, all of their leadership got hundreds of millions of dollars overseas in assets.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/egypt/8320912/Egypt-Hosni-Mubarak-used-last-18-days-in-power-to-secure-his-fortune.htmlWhile Mubarak isn't in power, this is just to prove that the general state of a country is no indication on how rich/powerful/influential the country is, more so, general sisi is a close ally of mubarak, he has a fortune too.
When I'll care enough I'll give links to others leadership from "poor" countries with billions in assets overseas.
Oh, and, Egypt has the 4th highest GDP out of the arab countries. (Iran isn't there but it has about 500b~)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Arab_League_countries_by_GDP_(nominal)
the only rich Arab countries are Saudi Arabia, UAE, Qatar and maybe Kuwait, the rest are all third world countries in development with Zero influence or broken like Iraq or Libya, and the 4 countries I mentioned, are all US close allies. The GDPs of most Arab countries are in the 200Billions $ Or less and do not have money to bride anyone, and if you want to see the sphere of influence of the US for example you can check the current US-Africa summet, and who's spending billions to increase it influence in poor countries.
It's funny how you mention US-Africa, when the reality is that the US lost Africa already to the Chinese.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Africa%E2%80%93China_economic_relationsChina is the biggest trader there, and China is also allied with the arab countries. It's also communist.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Arab_League_countries_by_GDP_(nominal)
There are actually more than the maybe 4 you listed (with 100+). 8 at least, not counting Iran
So yeah sphere it out yourself, and get your facts straigthts, and if you want we can go on the case of country by country to prove the point I mentioned before.
Just did, you didn't.
Are you serious? Several UN condemnations and sanctions were vetoed but were upheld by other instances such EU and US and many other organization in several key domains as you've mentioned
You said, and I quote:
he security council is institution of the UN that enforces sanctions among many other functions and Yes China and Russia vetoed and tried to veto some resolution, BUT a lot of sanctions passed and applied Syria
So I see you haven't got a clue what you're talking about. First saying that a lot of sanctions passed, but now saying they were actually veto'd.
Your claim was regarding the UN, not the EU, the US or w/e that isn't the UN.
and comparing these to some Arab countries boycott of Israeli products from occupied lands is a joke,
Wrong again. It's not Israeli products from "occupied lands" - unless you mean all of Israel, in that case, you're even a greater retard than I thought. They boycott Israel fully.
and once again proves your biased way on this matter, if Israel was sanctioned like Syria is being right now, the Israeli economy would have crumbled by now or have been forced to sign the peace treaty, but again Israels allies are the one in control of UN and other relevant institutions hence no sanctions and any sanctions related discussions gets shut down either by veto or lobbying. (and this on it self is a prove that it's not the Arab countries that has influence in the UN as you are claiming but the other way around)
I never said it was sanctioned like Syria, just that you can compare.
The western world sanctions Syria, same as the arab world sanctions Israel. Personally, I'd prefer to be on the western side.
Breaks UN resolutions and doesn't get punished for it! Syria is getting punished pretty hard as you linked your self not to mention that most of the world condemns Syria actions me included and there is no debates in this, So no, the whole problem here is that there are people like you who claims that Israel does no evil which is totally false.
I never said Israel does no evil. I did say however, that it doesn't perform genocide nor is it as bad of a country as you and other brainwashed mobs are trying to portrait it as.
Another pseudo claim without any basis, simply because if Palestinians has their right uphold with their country and the right to exist as a People there ..ect they would not attack their neighbour and hence there would not be any response. it's a causality relation, the groups are fighting in Palestine because their country is colonized and not the other way around!
Can't believe I actually bothered to provide you with a proof to how they actually did attack Israel in the past. And how to, according to their current action, there's actually no reason to believe otherwise.
and your AIPAC presentation is totally on point and made the most neutral organization of course !
How about you actually disprove the validity of the presentation, because to the best of my affords, the presentation is correct.
So are you gonna post counter point to his presentation or are you, yet again, just say he's wrong/biased/whatever other bullshit and not actually prove anything.
How about explaining to me and other people reading how is this is relevant to the point? that the Palestinians will attack the Israelis once they get their rights and land according to UN resolutions, And I remind that in 1948 Israel was created unilaterly on the whole
The proof was in the link. The palestinians had a bigger territory back in 48 and that didn't stop them from attacking (granted, they weren't called "palestinians" back then, but rather arabs), hell, they kept attacking nonstop since, I can't see how giving them the 67' territory will stop them from attacking if the 48' one wasn't enough.
That's how they lost the land that was given to them by the LoN, btw (and no, it wasn't theirs prior, they actually signed it off during the Ottoman Empire era to avoid land taxes).
See ? not only that I've answered and provided facts as proven above each time, you are right now not answer the point and claiming with an excuses that I need to back my claim yet you cannot answer the point, and you've been avoiding doing so for the 4 or 5 times in a row, which is a prove of someone out of argument.
You haven't proven a thing, actually. You just keep typing the nonsense that you have over and over again.
The best is not childish it's a warranty that I will not compromise my identity and personal informations to an escrow without a collateral, as for posting Diplomas images it's not a proof in it self especially when they aren't verifiable as with yours, so stop pretending you don't what I'm talking about here (and this not the point of discussion here, so please stop making excuses and back to the point, you had an argument to answer here I proved you wrong with real facts and you keep refering to the education point as it is your only excuse so far)
Like I already said, I posted, you haven't. Spin your foolishness all you want if that makes you feel better.
Back peddling? no it is not, it would have back peddling if I wrote all those AFTER your point, which is not the case, from the first I replied to to the last one my position on the matter was clear! my OP post is under the supposition if it was real, and I brought facts why it is most likely to be real than it isn't such as previous verified post by IDF soldiers on social media and the fact that IDF soldiers killed palestinian in several occasions and targeting them directly, and I mentioned several times factual examples of this that you've been dodging all along
Again, back peddling. It's not after I post, it's after you post.
And for what it's worth, you haven't actually brought any facts, just faulty assumptions. Can't say I'm surprised though.
No it is not. I stated my opinion on OP under the assumption if it was real, and I explained clearly in my next reply my take on matter, and this is not again back peddling
Yes it is.
Now it's clear what's your strategy is, after failing to answer on point and pushing toward this kind discussion you'll claim that I'm doing repeating the same rhetoric, but yet again you are the one that's not answering on point in the first place and derailing the discussion as you are out of proofs and argument, but I'll remind you of the point you are avoiding right now, you claimed that the Twitter account of that soldiers is the proof that Israeli soldier has a good behaviors on social media and thus he cannot have posted such a thing on Instagram, yet you failed and been avoiding to explain why his same twitter account has almost zero posts before the incident sounds logical huh.
Seeing how a person tends to post and from that deducting that he/she can or cannot post something in a different nature is better than just taking a random post from a private account to a private account and come to the conclusion that this is real.
The fact that it was from private acc to a private acc should of raised superstition all by itself, but for the likes of you it was more than enough to serve as a proof to its validity.
As for me being Muslim or not how is this relevant to discussion? I don't mind answering this even if it is a personal question but can you please enlighten me and the people reading how is this relevant to the conversation ? think carefully, because unlike you I might not be involved or a side in this conflict, hence my judgment is less to be subject to be biased unlike yours, as you are most likely an Israeli according to the certification you've posted above and if it is real that is.
Never said it's relevant. And even if you aren't, that doesn't mean you are any less subjected to be biased. You are, after all, get most of your info from the media and various political entities and than trying to argument from authority to claim anything.
Except that many times it was proven that IDF soldiers targeted and killed civilians lets alone Hamas members and this is not the point, from this quote you are sayng that IDF is as moral of an army as you can get and that they do not kill civilians intentionally and there is no commander that would order attacks on civilians (it's just it happens that almost 2K Palestinians mostly civilians died so far with UN refuges and hospitals being targeted which is in it self a crime war, so which is it? IDF does or doesn't do crimes.
Many times can be 10, 20 or even 100, and yes those numbers still can't point on IDF as a whole.
it's just it happens that almost 2K Palestinians mostly civilians died so far with UN refuges and hospitals being targeted which is in it self a crime war, so which is it? IDF does or doesn't do crimes.
And this is exactly how biased you are. Hamas is the one firing from within populated area, from the vicinity of UN facilities and so it is who is responsible to consequences that follows.
Sure IDF fired at UN facilities, but not with intention to hit civilians, but to hit terrorists which shot from said facilities.
And yes they do target civilians, and this proven several times, I don't understand why you keep insisting on this and if you think this is truly how can you justify the shelling of kids that were playing on the beach or the children in the UN hospital garden, or UN Refugees (7 of them) and I can mention thousands of examples like this now please.
I justify shelling on whatever facility that was used to shell on Israeli civilians. If it was with kids, than that is sad. But Israel can't have its own citizens being killed just because hamas decided to use its own people as human shields.
I'm pretty sure if that number was of Israelis and that if it was your city been blown to pieces you won't have the same opinion, we are talking about human lifes here not just some random number and claiming otherwise proves how terrible of a human being you are, when you don't care about death people as long as it the others and not one of yours and your close people.
My hometown was shelled long before Protective Edge started. So that's that.
And I never said I don't care. I do care, and I don't want to see anyone dead, on either side, but I also am not living in some fantasy world. I have lived most of my live under almost monthly shelling from gaza strip.
Was I there ? No, does the fact that I'm not In Gaza right now doesn't give the right now doesn't give the right to speak about it, No I have every right to speak about it, Are you in Gaza yourself right now? are you whiting the Palestinians population in Gaza so you can denie and approve the facts coming in videos and photos from there? if you aren't then you have no more right to comments on this on me.
Speak as much as you want, the problem is you think that various sources are factual proofs when they aren't. It also means that you haven't got the slightest clue of what's really going on there.
So who gives the orders to attack Gaza, and blow up whole residential neighborhoods and kill nearly two thousands of Palestinians in the last couple of weeks? is it the IDF Solders doing it on their own? or they are getting orders to do so ? which is it?
You said IDF was giving orders to kill civilians, which is false.
And yet again you failed to provide anything to substantiate your claims.
Your logic again never cease to amaze me
I know, that's just who i am.
ever hear of resistance?
So you justify them? Explains a lot.
and saying just plainly don't care about Palestinians is plainly stupid, as they don't have families or they aren't part of that population, and so far the ones who don't care about the Palestinians, are the one killing them and blocking them and blocking even the minimum necessities that a human being needs to live in such an area and not the other way around, you are making the Victim because the Culprit and the Culprit becomes the Victime, funny.
Oh sure, it's not hamas that's putting the palestinians at risk by launching rockets from their populated areas knowingly that Israel will retaliate there. It's the Israelis fault that they shot from there. I see.
Talk about hypocrisy. How fucking stupid do you need to be to think that way?
Don't answer that.
blocking even the minimum necessities that a human being needs to live in such an area and not the other way around, you are making the Victim because the Culprit and the Culprit becomes the Victime, funny.
They get the minimum.
earlier? you mean in the same comment? in all previous posts you did not which another proof of what I ve been saying so far
Not much I can do if you don't read w/e proof I am linking.
Is there anything to back this here? please show me the previous posts to this event on his Twitter account, the so called moderated posted he had go ahead, His twitter is there and there is no such a thing, so Yes the post are inexistent or deleted, and Invited and I re-invite you to prove me wrong on this if I didn't search properly which seems that you aren't able to do so.
Can't prove or disprove something that didn't exist. Logic isn't your strong suit I see.
If you know what I meant to say then why don't you answer me on context, and no apart from the part where you meant hundreds above something that wasn't clear, because 67 out of hundred or hundreds the sentence still make sense especially considering that there are around 200 UN SC resplutions
226-67 = 159.
159 out of 226 resolution Israel didn't break, so it mostly did follow (70%~).
Oh so UN is biased towards Israel yet the countries in control of the UN are Israel allies?what about the international court or many other OGNs condemning Israel and it's acts, where the international trade commission EU or US sanctions towards Israel as the other countries that had similar resolutions in UN faced. of course.
UN is biased, regardless of what countries actually do outside of it, because that's how politics work.
Same as how China and Russia do vote against Israel in the UN but outside the UN, they haven't applied any sanctions, which is to show that the UN is a biased political group that is actually meaningless in real life application and that any sanctions or resolution that it releases is nothing more than a political spin.
So if you wanna use the UN as proof (which you can't anyway), than don't.
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