Moneypak doesn't know how to verify information so it's seeming quite useless for me.
Can you explain in a little more detail? I am not quite sure how MP transaction work if you are selling BTC for them? |
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Am I the only one who after reading the transcript, does not understand what is wrong other than the allegation that a deposit has not been paid back in a timely manner. Could the OP please summarize what is actually the issue so we can weigh the evidence. Just posting some logs out of context and having someone passionately arguing with the OP using Pirate references is not enough.
I want your argument so I can weigh it.
Appreciated,
Dalkore
Deposit was made, as per an agreement. Deposit was not returned, as per the agreement. That doesn't mean that a "scammer" tag is what is needed. It sounds like we have another label and needs to be invented for things of these nature ("In Default" tag, etc...). There was risk involved when you put deposited your money. He is making a solid effort to pay people back and keep is creditors apprised of the current situation. Scamming in my book is a very specific thing that has facts surrounding it that show the person's true intent. Intent is the most important aspect of giving this tag out. We need to make the distinction on someone one intends to do something and someone who doesn't. If you think otherwise, I would like to see reasoning what else is more important. Don't mentioned, be broke his word, that isn't scamming per say, externalities do happen and when it did happen in this case, he didn't disappear like a scammer, he is putting real effort forward to make good. The important point here is that intent can only be established by examining deeds. Nobody is in a position to posit what intent "is" or "really is" other or outside of what is supported by facts. You claim (with no basis) that "he is making a solid effort". I show, clearly and so far indisputably that he is not: ~20 BTC coming out in three months on a 500 principal + 100-200 interest deal is neither solid nor effort. You claim (with dubious basis) that he is keeping the creditors appraised. This is false: he has not been in contact to negotiate beg for a new agreement, as his position behooves him to do. In fact, he has not been in contact at all. Finally, let me quote myself, maybe on 2nd read it sinks in: Here's his scam in simple terms:
I. Do the Peter Lambert thing: pretend like you know what you're doing, give out ratings, all that jazz.
II. Take deposits, recallable on demand, at a reasonable rate (1% was, back in August, pretty much tiny).
III. Refuse to repay deposits.
IV. Make a "best effort" repayment of about .9% a week.
This is an out and out scam. Better designed than pirate's, sure, but just as much a scam.
The only other way you could look at it would be "How to sell miner bonds without any miner gear, and without the risk of difficulty dropping". Also a scam.
There's no grounds for you to posit innocence or anything else about some vague "intent" when the construction the facts bear is scammer. Sorry. Approximately 75% of the assets in Kraken are bad Pirate debt via Payb.tc, PPT.A, PPT.B, and PPT.E (as later disclosed in his Kraken newsletter on October 14, 2012).
This is something we have no knowledge of whatsoever, not being involved in that. However, if indeed the quote is correct I would like to include this by reference to further illuminate why Darlkore's claims above hold no water. If it quacks like a scammer, it can have a scammer tag at the very least until he stops. It's not like these scammer tags come with a beheading, he can earn his way back out of it just fine. At any rate, the notion of a "default" tag, while maybe appropriate in general, is not appropriate here. It would seem to imply no blame and no wrongdoing, whereas blame and wrongdoing is exactly what we're showing. The man made false representations, which is a polite way of saying he lied, in order to steal money. That's all there is, we're not arguing against the general unfairness of the world and why oh why did our cherry tree not make any cherries this year. We're arguing against the very specific fraudulent behavior of one person who lied and misrepresented themselves for profit. When was the last time you contacted Patrick? |
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looks like Hartnett took the loan, and thus the obligation to repay. further, he misrepresented his exposure to his creditors.
mistake is his. scammer/default.
Another use of the word "default". I propose a "Default Tag" be used for this type of situation until the principle is paid. The defaulter could apply for removal and we could have a 1 week comment period where if people who are actually owed principle and dispute the request with hard evidence only. If all disputes are settled or none of the known creditors come forward, then the tag is lifted. |
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Am I the only one who after reading the transcript, does not understand what is wrong other than the allegation that a deposit has not been paid back in a timely manner. Could the OP please summarize what is actually the issue so we can weigh the evidence. Just posting some logs out of context and having someone passionately arguing with the OP using Pirate references is not enough.
I want your argument so I can weigh it.
Appreciated,
Dalkore
Deposit was made, as per an agreement. Deposit was not returned, as per the agreement. That doesn't mean that a "scammer" tag is what is needed. It sounds like we have another label and needs to be invented for things of these nature ("In Default" tag, etc...). There was risk involved when you put deposited your money. He is making a solid effort to pay people back and keep is creditors apprised of the current situation. Scamming in my book is a very specific thing that has facts surrounding it that show the person's true intent. Intent is the most important aspect of giving this tag out. We need to make the distinction on someone one intends to do something and someone who doesn't. If you think otherwise, I would like to see reasoning what else is more important. Don't mentioned, be broke his word, that isn't scamming per say, externalities do happen and when it did happen in this case, he didn't disappear like a scammer, he is putting real effort forward to make good. |
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UPDATE 11/06/2012:
Out of coins again. No further PO requests will be approved today. PO requests can be sent starting 8PM EST for deposits made tomorrow. Due to demand for this service exceeding our available volume we are changing from a 0.5% discount to a 0.5% fee/markup. As an example if the MtGox rate at the time of deposit is $10.00 the exchange rate will be $10.05. This does not affect existing orders (funded or unfunded). It will apply to all new orders going forward.
Thank You,
Staff
Tangible Cryptography
So because you're making more money and have more orders, you're going to charge your buyers a fee instead of keep the discount that had them coming to you in the first place? Damn. No, I know why this is being done and it is just fine. With ACH limitations and delays, they need to make sure they are staying on top of their exchange risk. They are actually providing a very helpful service. |
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Any benifit to stratum for small miners? Btw, my payouts are delayed as well...
-Wave
everyone using it showing less stales, no disadvantage to it for small miners. A large payout run just went, are they caught up? ** Update**: Talked with Graet. I got an email showing payment. I will post back if it doesn't hit my wallet but at this point this issue is closed. Very helpful and a good pool. I am still not caught up? |
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When are payments going to be sent out? It has not sent my latest payment? Please advise Graet. Thanks
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Aug 10 08:07:58 <mircea_popescu> you deem yourself able to repay your depositors in the event bs&t goes bankrupt, and nothing is recovered ? Aug 10 08:08:00 <patrickharnett> back in a couple of minutes - grabbing a glass of wine - friday evening here Aug 10 08:09:57 <patrickharnett> back Aug 10 08:10:17 <patrickharnett> in the event BS&T goes bust, I have more than enough assets to cover thatThat turns out to have been a lie, and hardly an innocent one. I believe after reading what he has said after the Pirate default, is that he under-estimated the exposure people who were his borrowers, to Pirate, but that he did not have prior knowledge. A bank counts debt is holds as assets & liabilities. Unless you have more evidence, I am not sure this alone should meet the bar. I have been visiting his thread in another section and so far, he has been slowly paying people back in regular intervals. |
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Am I the only one who after reading the transcript, does not understand what is wrong other than the allegation that a deposit has not been paid back in a timely manner. Could the OP please summarize what is actually the issue so we can weigh the evidence. Just posting some logs out of context and having someone passionately arguing with the OP using Pirate references is not enough.
I want your argument so I can weigh it.
Appreciated,
Dalkore
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I missed the posts on my thread completely ... just reading now....
The thing is ... this is a *market*. If BTC is trading at £6.60 and someone genuinely does need £600 in hard cash within 10 minutes, then sometimes deals like this can work positively for the seller.
It depends on what 100BTC is worth to the seller... if he/she bought at £2.00 many moons ago then sometimes its less 'hassle' to sell at a discount to a trusted buyer with the knowledge that 110% you will not get 'stung' by a scammer or a PP reversal. I don't always demand a 10% discount.. but sometimes I get asked to supply 100/200 even 500 BTC at short notice and if can flip them for a little trouble and sell on at -5% - everyone wins.
So if anyone *today* is looking to sell 100BTC at £600 for hard cash - please PM me. :-)
Just my 2 bitcoins worth.
Xch4ng3 - if you have any coins to sell - I am interested - always ready to buy cheap coins fast. Thanks
Good Luck. With the situation in the UK, I would actually think there would be a premium right now because of the limited options for funding purchases. |
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Doing updates and upgrades
Payouts will be unavailable for a few hours
Apologies for any inconvenience
Graet - It is Nov 5th and I have a Confirmed Credit Balance well over my threshold. Why are the automatic payments not being sent out as usual? An update would be most appreciated.Dalkore |
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Do you buy cards from older editions? Revised, 4th, foreign language, signed cards by Garfield?
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It was a common mistaken belief that the loans were not correlated and that there did not exist a common event that would or could cause a significant fraction of loans to default at the same time. The question is whether the contract allocated this specific risk.
I believe they call that "fat tail" risk or a Black Swan event. |
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SCAM etc
Did you mean for you post to read SCAM
Coming Soon..... (Launch Imminent) because that's how your post reads in conjunction with your signature. Now that is funny lol, good catch. Didn't even think about those combining. |
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Bump for update. Thank You.
Dalkore
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Bump!
P.S. Yes, bare knuckle is bad, usually draws blood.
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I am interested. How would you go about making my unique seal? I see a some Katakana or Romanji on them? How does it work? I would like to get one. Can you do ones for stamps and others for wax?
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Rename the thread title to "Escrow + Goods Inspection Service". What you describe is more than just escrow.
How is security at your office? Are you there during normal delivery hours every day? What happens when a delivery happens when you are not there? I am just thinking, if everyone knows the address of your office, and knows that expensive hardware is being delivered there, perhaps daily, then it could make for a fairly easy crime of opportunity the first moment you aren't at your office and packages are dropped at/near your door.
I think it would be an interesting service, but it would definitely increase expenses. Instead of paying for one shipment, two shipments now have to be paid for, plus whatever percentage you plan to take. That said, I do believe it is a service people would be willing to pay for in some cases.
Great questions: How is security at your office? - It has controlled access with 24 hour video surveillance on all floors and exits. I am not on the ground floor (higher than 20 feet). I know my neighbors and we have extremely limited foot traffic. Are you there during normal delivery hours every day? - I would be making daily trips to the Receivers. I would actually have them come to a private mailbox address that has daily hours and signs for them. I have been using one for over 6 years and they are great. Tracking would be required with no exceptions. I am just thinking, if everyone knows the address of your office, and knows that expensive hardware is being delivered there, perhaps daily, then it could make for a fairly easy crime of opportunity the first moment you aren't at your office and packages are dropped at/near your door. - That is why I am using a reputable PO to eliminate that risk for the most part. I would not post the verification & storage location publicly, just the shipping address.After contemplating it, I do have all the infrastructure needed to do it. I care about my reputation way more than a quick buck. I would get the shipping address when I do the estimate so I can getting shipping cost handled, right then. Plus, I like doing the things that would revolve around running it. I know equipment, know how to research, if needed. |
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