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New disclaimer when buying 3k and 1.9k units from bitmain.
3. One major cryptocurrency which is using CryptoNight hash function is about to change their PoW algothrim, and according to their public statement, it is purposely to brick ASIC mining rigs including X3. When you buying it, you are betting that they are wrong.
I dont think ETN will fork, they would want wide spread adoption of their coin, asics are perfect for this. XMR can only change their algo so much, their ram requirements still have to be cpu friendly.
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New disclaimer when buying these 3k and 1.9k models from bitmain...
3. One major cryptocurrency which is using CryptoNight hash function is about to change their PoW algothrim, and according to their public statement, it is purposely to brick ASIC mining rigs including X3. When you buying it, you are betting that they are wrong.
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Have not kept up. How many coins do people think will actually FORK vs just making noise....is this unit really gonna be in trouble, due to all the forks
or is it just noise.....(again, no one knows, just your impressions from the various coin threads you frequent this applies to and what you think the odds are from the noise maybe?)
I might start a group buy (transparent...we would tell you any $$$ per unit we would tack on for price for our efforts not including the usual shipping to folk)
because I MAY want to get just ONE...figure we could dump the other 7 on a group buy (each of us 1 unit) ...but being lazy....unsure if it is even worth that little effort to get ONE.
SEARING There is no point of group buy when asicminermarket.com has the miner $3800 ,, so $200 more than BAIKAL and free shipping .... group buy for what... It's baikal behind him .... Eastshore.xyz has them for 4399$ and 90$ declared value so basically no import taxes. |
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Who on earth is buying up these miners? They're sold out! After reading XMR's reddit's discussions on the matter, it's a complete waste of time to get these miners because XMR is going to fork before these miners are released.  Sold out apparently. Whether they are paid for on time is another matter. |
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95% of CN coins will change algo for sure. There's no way on earth that this could be profitable in the long term, unless you got free electricity
Some cn coins will embrace asic. Sia is a good example with blake 2b. They wanted the benefits of asics. With pinidea, halong mining, baikal and bitmain that gives a better variety of asic sources, this is better for decentralization then just bitmain cornering the market. The question is who will want this hash power on their side. |
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Pinidea have got a cn miner now too, 27kh at 350w ~4.5k. Who's next? Ibelink? This is x11 all over again, but possibly worse.
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Stealing electricity is what gets your miners confiscated
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Everybody just buy 12k worth of btc @ 5-6k instead of this gamble. By late may/june youd be better off then buying 1 of these. Saves power too. All you have to do is hold. Yes its not as exciting as mining or waiting for a kickass miner but gambling is exciting too, until you lose.
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I'm thinking about the sudden hashrate increase in XMR, trying to explain it. It's 5 fold increase in a couple of months.
Is it that every GPU migrated from ETH to XMR? I think this is not likely, seeing ETH hashrate. And GPU supply is limited at the moment. There are not enough GPU in production to justify a 5-fold increase in such a small timeframe. Everybody and their parents started mining on the home rig ? Might be, but still, I don't buy it.
What is somebody is using asics. Perhaps preliminary or private development. Think about the D3 and what it is going to do to X11.
And if this is true, who could this be ? My coins would go with Bitmain.
I know, Cryptonote is supposed to be memory intensive and thus not asic friendly. But, 2MB is not that much and asics with such memory exist. The only risk for such an asic would be the hard forks of monero. They could increase the memory size, or maybe not. Many CPU had 2MB of cache and exceeding that would make CPUs unfit for mining.
So, my guess is that we're going to see an ASIC for Cryptonote really soon. What do you think?
Your prediction was spot on!  So, this answers some of the questions in a different thread: Q: How long do the ASIC creators use them in secret before making them available to the public? A: It seems they were using the Giant N and the Antminer X3 from July 2017. So, about 9 months! Q: What kind of profits do they make before they make them available to the public? A: Taking into account that Monero would be their best target coin, that means they could pull about $200-300/day or $80k until now with the X3 and about $20-30/day or $8k until now with the Giant N. These numbers are for just 1 device! Imagine what kind of money do they make with dozens of them. They will also max out these profits by selling these ASICs to naive miners that will probably just pay them off until the hard forks happen and then have nothing to do with them. The creators win all the time. The x3 specs arent finalised yet or are they just being hush hush on their design specs. Sounds like they need time to rebuild / build them. Maybe the new ones will be v7 compatible. |
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I really wish people would stop calling FPGA's ASICs. Baikal (so far) has only made FPGA mining rigs. There is a huge difference between an FPGA and an ASIC. An FPGA is not that much different from a GPU. Anyone can get one. Anyone can buy a Zynq FPGA board from digikey for $89-$199, or a higher end one for more money, and if you take a little while to learn how to program it, you can hash any algorithm except equihash & ethash. Furthermore, your ROI will be better than a GPU in almost every case, in some cases dramatically better (as Baikal showed with the X10 and Giant-B).
Are you really sure that Baikals X10/B are FPGA? (Which FPGA, by the way?) While it is enterely possible, technical characteristics of these products are not typical for FPGA. Especially the low power consumption. As for ROI I wouldn't expect good ROI from entry and mid-range FPGA boards because of their weak power supplys. We need propertly designed professional grade DC/DC for core voltage, that is rarely seen in practice. There is nothing suspicious about the Giant-N. I was already working on an FPGA cryptonight miner before the Giant-N was announced (and obviously I am now focusing on other algorithms). The power of 60W is realistic for one FPGA accessing many external SRAM's. Unlike DRAM, SRAM consumes very little power. The fundamental nature of Cryptonight is that it uses almost no number crunching (by design). A single FPGA just accesses many parallel SRAM's and these memory accesses do not consume a great deal of power. FPGA's consume way less power than other mining devices already. Consider the X10 burns 250-500W and makes the same amount per day as a 2000W GPU rig. Some algorithms burn more, some burn less, and algorithms that have no number crunching (like Cryptonight) burn the least. The reason a Vega 56/64 burns so much power on cryptonight is because it is using high bandwidth external memory, a totally different approach than using many SRAM's in parallel. FPGA's can be reconfigured very quickly. It is true that certain PCB designs and part selections are better at some algorithms than others. But it doesn't matter if Monero does a hard fork, you can still just use an FPGA to mine the new algorithm, ad infinitum. As I mentioned before, only Ethash is truly resistant to FPGA's. As Baikal has more and more FPGA miners on the market with different types of FPGA's and RAM (Giant-B, X10, Giant-N), a coin which 'forks' would have to know the exact internal configuration of every FPGA mining rig on the market to 'avoid' a new algorithm which could be efficiently mined by them. To give an example, there is a decent chance that Monero's new algorithm could be (accidentally) mineable by the Giant-B or Giant-X10 or Giant-N, and all Baikal has to do is release new bitstreams (firmware for the SD card) that would update those rigs to mine the new algorithm. As the number of different FPGA rigs on the market continues to increase, it would be very difficult to fork to an algorithm that would be immune to those rigs, unless you pick an Ethash style algorithm. Furthermore if you add in all the cheap FPGA boards available from companies like Digikey, Avnet, Xilinx and Intel, then there is ALREADY a mass produced FPGA board that can do any algorithm efficiently except Ethash. FYI the Monero ASIC statement is specific to ASIC's. They specifically say they want to avoid ASICs mining their coin (they speak of FPGA's more favorably, and separately from ASICs). Since the Giant-N is an FPGA rig, it doesn't actually fall into the category of something they would fork away from. Furthermore, the Giant-N hash rate is not devastating to GPU's. It has a slightly better ROI than Vega's, but in no way do Vega's become obsolete. Baikal would have to ship out 100,000 Giant-N's to truly disrupt the Cryptonight networks, which is unlikely. (BTW I bought 2 Giant-N from a local reseller in Vancouver. The units are supposed to arrive on Monday.) If the Baikal Giant N is an FPGA that could resynthesize from a hardware update and be effective after the V7 Fork, then why are Baikal only selling them for $3600 per unit? And why are they no longer marketing them as being compatible with Monero? Is the public sale of these units weeks before the V7 fork just a coincidence? For DIY setups like you're talking about then FPGA is the only viable option, however, if you have millions to invest into mass production then the cost per unit to produce an ASIC is going to be much less than an FPGA. Baikal have their own propriety development, they don't just make FPGAs, they make multi algo ASICS. Also, from the 2018-03-04 Dev meeting: 12:22 PM <knifeofpi> somebody made an FPGA 12:22 PM <knifeofpi> but ASICs...? 12:22 PM <@fluffypony> somebody taped out an ASIC 12:22 PM <knifeofpi> when did this happen? 12:22 PM <medusa_> the reddit post you mean ? 12:22 PM <rehrar> link? 12:22 PM <@fluffypony> sidechannelled to me, not public 12:22 PM <@fluffypony> a handful of others have had similar confirmation via via 12:22 PM <psychocrypt> @fluffypony: are this ASICS or FPGAs? 12:23 PM <@fluffypony> were it just me I would find it suspicious 12:23 PM <@fluffypony> psychocrypt: ASICs, not FPGAsMonths ago i read about baikal buying a lot of asic chips i guess it was right. Not many believed the story cause it said baikal was a russian company when its chinese. Maybe they just got that bit wrong. http://www.idownloadblog.com/2017/12/22/samsung-baikal-bitcoin/ |
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These sound like their being built / rebuilt after the monero fork this month ( cause specs arent final yet) but before another fork possibly in 6 months. So they should be built to support the monero fork ( if possible) but once you get them in may/ june u might only be able to mine monero on them till ~September. Because they are asic they wont be able to update the firmware for the new fork. However the baikal n if FPGA may be upgradeable to the new monero fork. Depends if monero devs see fpga as much of a threat as asics and treats them the same as asics and dis allows baikal to mine their new algo. If monero changes its algo to need more ram etc then the baikal n might still be useless if it doesnt support the new hardware requirements. I feel sorry for the giant n buyers after todays announcement.
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Do you think that the X10 is still profitable if bought now?
Now it is profitable. If you get it as a gift. But if you buy it, you should think yourself. It is a risk not to get your money back! Nobody know it!!! Nothing is worth buying at the moment. |
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I really wish people would stop calling FPGA's ASICs. Baikal (so far) has only made FPGA mining rigs. There is a huge difference between an FPGA and an ASIC. An FPGA is not that much different from a GPU. Anyone can get one. Anyone can buy a Zynq FPGA board from digikey for $89-$199, or a higher end one for more money, and if you take a little while to learn how to program it, you can hash any algorithm except equihash & ethash. Furthermore, your ROI will be better than a GPU in almost every case, in some cases dramatically better (as Baikal showed with the X10 and Giant-B).
Are you really sure that Baikals X10/B are FPGA? (Which FPGA, by the way?) While it is enterely possible, technical characteristics of these products are not typical for FPGA. Especially the low power consumption. As for ROI I wouldn't expect good ROI from entry and mid-range FPGA boards because of their weak power supplys. We need propertly designed professional grade DC/DC for core voltage, that is rarely seen in practice. There is nothing suspicious about the Giant-N. I was already working on an FPGA cryptonight miner before the Giant-N was announced (and obviously I am now focusing on other algorithms). The power of 60W is realistic for one FPGA accessing many external SRAM's. Unlike DRAM, SRAM consumes very little power. The fundamental nature of Cryptonight is that it uses almost no number crunching (by design). A single FPGA just accesses many parallel SRAM's and these memory accesses do not consume a great deal of power. FPGA's consume way less power than other mining devices already. Consider the X10 burns 250-500W and makes the same amount per day as a 2000W GPU rig. Some algorithms burn more, some burn less, and algorithms that have no number crunching (like Cryptonight) burn the least. The reason a Vega 56/64 burns so much power on cryptonight is because it is using high bandwidth external memory, a totally different approach than using many SRAM's in parallel. FPGA's can be reconfigured very quickly. It is true that certain PCB designs and part selections are better at some algorithms than others. But it doesn't matter if Monero does a hard fork, you can still just use an FPGA to mine the new algorithm, ad infinitum. As I mentioned before, only Ethash is truly resistant to FPGA's. As Baikal has more and more FPGA miners on the market with different types of FPGA's and RAM (Giant-B, X10, Giant-N), a coin which 'forks' would have to know the exact internal configuration of every FPGA mining rig on the market to 'avoid' a new algorithm which could be efficiently mined by them. To give an example, there is a decent chance that Monero's new algorithm could be (accidentally) mineable by the Giant-B or Giant-X10 or Giant-N, and all Baikal has to do is release new bitstreams (firmware for the SD card) that would update those rigs to mine the new algorithm. As the number of different FPGA rigs on the market continues to increase, it would be very difficult to fork to an algorithm that would be immune to those rigs, unless you pick an Ethash style algorithm. Furthermore if you add in all the cheap FPGA boards available from companies like Digikey, Avnet, Xilinx and Intel, then there is ALREADY a mass produced FPGA board that can do any algorithm efficiently except Ethash. FYI the Monero ASIC statement is specific to ASIC's. They specifically say they want to avoid ASICs mining their coin (they speak of FPGA's more favorably, and separately from ASICs). Since the Giant-N is an FPGA rig, it doesn't actually fall into the category of something they would fork away from. Furthermore, the Giant-N hash rate is not devastating to GPU's. It has a slightly better ROI than Vega's, but in no way do Vega's become obsolete. Baikal would have to ship out 100,000 Giant-N's to truly disrupt the Cryptonight networks, which is unlikely. (BTW I bought 2 Giant-N from a local reseller in Vancouver. The units are supposed to arrive on Monday.) The question is how long will it take for baikal to release the new firmware for the giant n that works with the new monero algo. Or will they have to make a new miner every 6 months. Maybe someone can ask baikal about this. If baikal offers a solution to this then they will definitely sell out. |
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I really wish people would stop calling FPGA's ASICs. Baikal (so far) has only made FPGA mining rigs. There is a huge difference between an FPGA and an ASIC. An FPGA is not that much different from a GPU. Anyone can get one. Anyone can buy a Zynq FPGA board from digikey for $89-$199, or a higher end one for more money, and if you take a little while to learn how to program it, you can hash any algorithm except equihash & ethash. Furthermore, your ROI will be better than a GPU in almost every case, in some cases dramatically better (as Baikal showed with the X10 and Giant-B).
Are you really sure that Baikals X10/B are FPGA? (Which FPGA, by the way?) While it is enterely possible, technical characteristics of these products are not typical for FPGA. Especially the low power consumption. As for ROI I wouldn't expect good ROI from entry and mid-range FPGA boards because of their weak power supplys. We need propertly designed professional grade DC/DC for core voltage, that is rarely seen in practice. I know right? This has been bugging me for the past two days... is it a FPGA is it an ASIC are the specs correct is it an exit scam... We'll just have to wait and see if/when someone gets one of these and opens it up. Asics dont do 2 different algos, Cryptonight and Cryptonight-lite. They are very similar but are they exactly the same, no. Baikal do FGGA , why would they change now. |
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i wonder what's the current ROI for an A3. Thinking about getting my hands on some
As of right this second, a couple months - but I'm pretty sure Bitmain has some being shipped, and another batch due by the end of the month. Wasn't there someone else (Obelisk perhaps?) that announced a SIA miner a few months back but has yet to deliver? The price of sia has fallen over 50% in the last month. I don’t see an end in sight either. Do ASICS usually increase the price of the coin? I would think it would drive prices even farther down The price of pretty much ALL Cryptocoins has dropped 50% or more from the peak around mid-January. ASIC have ZERO effect on price - it's PRICE that affects profitability and the profitability that affects the potential for an ASIC to be sold at a profit for it's maker. Not exactly. Siacoin dumped 10 times from january prices because of ASICs The 2 are unrelated. If you go and think the miners dump the coins from asic mining....what do you think people do with gpu mining. Machines out or not out dont effect price as much as market conditions do. Sia has little demand, but the a3 produces a large supply of coins. People are just selling sia into btc as they mine. Not many seem to be holding. Asics on unpopular coins kill their price. There needs to be more buying volume on exchanges for sia. |
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Baikal N is at present much profitabler than X10, why is the price only a half??? Because they want sell something to get FIAT and want mine with GOOD Algos.
2 Rabbits with one piston!
IMHO
You forgot to mention some important facts. First the Baikal N has not been shipped yet and it earns maximum $24 a day. After they are delivered you should be happy if you can earn $12 a day. On the other hand you can still earn $20 a day with X10 after half a year. Moreover the X10 doesn't cost $7200 at all if you order from Baikal. What should be a reason to go to 12 USD? Current price for altcoin? Maybe it grows in this delivery time. Difficulty can not be a reason. Or did you heard that Antminer sell similar Asic with this algoritm in staple? Baikal N is a low hashrate Asic. It will stay profitable for a long time, like x10. I would also buy some, but so long I do not gets 2 new promissed algos from baikal, I do not buy it! Profit will go to 5-12$ a day mining etn etc. This is after monero fork and the giant n 's mining monero will jump to etn, bytecoin etc. There wont be much to mine after monero fork. Power cost is almost nothing which helps. But then what if etn forks... wont be pretty in a few months time. |
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My Baikal X10 fan broke. Where can I find or buy it?
you can order it from official website or ebay Baikal just tells you to buy a fan off ebay, im using a s9 fan on my giant. A bit overkill but does the job. |
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If people just wait till after monero fork then the Giant n should become much cheaper <1500$.
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So if Baikal mined monero to death in 2 weeks that the monero fork is happening we should see the Vega cards jump back to big profits
Lets see......
Senario 1 :
BAIKAL was mining monero to death and after the fork GPU miners will see big profits and Baikal N will be mine the leftovers
Senario 2 :
BAIKAL just made this miner and GPU miners will not see their profit to increase after monero fork... and that means that GPU miners drove monero there by building rigs non stop. and Baikal N will be mine the leftovers
So monero is trying to save the GPU farms ? or they don't like Baikal ?
BAIKAL N is a home miner , everyone can have it ... so what is wrong ?
Farmers what is wrong ?
I am not supporting BAIKAL ,,,but the farmers should calm down ,,,, lets do fork to bitcoin also to bring it back to GPUs
scenario 1 , gpu s will reclaim some monero profits, although still wont be as profitable as months ago, price has suffered a bit, but what hasnt. Coinhive has prob been ramped up too which wouldnt help.The monero devs prob knew about the baikal n months ago. Good timing. |
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cryptonight is the worst algo to mine if you think about it, its mined by hackers in hijacks who use other peoples resources which makes it basically free. No mining equipment to buy, no power bills. All you need to do is pay the hackers or they pay themeslves. Once they mine it they are unlikely to hold it, they just dump it cause its all profit.
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