The only way you Ron Paul supporters will get people to take you *seriously* is if you win the Caucus. If you guys can't even pull off a caucus victory in Iowa please just stop there. I really don't want to hear 9 months of nauseating Ron Paul rhetoric if his supporters can't even win him the Iowa Caucus.
Mike Huckabee won the Republican Iowa caucus in 2008. Enough Said...
So this proves.....? McCain won the nomination in 2008, remember? So winning the Iowa Caucus didn't seem to help Huckabee. I guess I don't understand your point. If Ron Paul can't win a caucus, he sure as hell can't win a general. But I'm saying your standard of success (Iowa Caucus) is a false one, as winning the Caucus doesn't prove you can win the nomination, nor does losing it mean you will lose the nomination. Your example shows exactly this. Whether you like it or not Ron Paul is the dark horse candidate. He barley has a chance now, and loosing a caucus (which primarily has to do with organization and strategy) only sets him deeper into the dark horse corner. His supporters demand media attention like they deserve it! Well, now it's time to show the country that you guys are there to win it for your man. Bachmann and Romney should not be hard to beat, I mean seriously look at them... One said "I think if we give Glenn Beck the numbers, he can solve this [the national debt]", and the other was for universal healthcare before he was against it (HCR being unpopular among Republicans). |
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1) I pay an electric bill 2) I pay a water bill 3) I don't buy cable television, or satellite or broadcast, I do listen to the radio so I'll give you partial credit. 4) USDA gotcha, I'll give you that one. 5) Standard times and measurements... an advent of the railroads that the government took over without really having any urgent need for it. 6) Postal service - An actually constitutionally mandated service congratulations! 7) OSHA.... not necessary to avoid getting killed at work.... seriously are you worried about falling in the fry oil at any moment but thanks to OSHA your safe?....  Roads - Hey! a 2fer another constitutionally mandated service (to support the post office) 9) State and local Fire/Police.... not a part of the fed budget ... it's state and local, covered by local sales taxes and my property taxes. 10) Don't forget Al Gore invented the net .... but Can't knock this it was funded governmentally... you'd be hard pressed to not realize this *required* government funding to come into existence.... but I guess your due partial credit Congratulations! You justified a few % of my taxes! Well done. 3) I don't buy cable television, or satellite or broadcast, I do listen to the radio so I'll give you partial credit. This is your biggest problem here. You have no Cable so your stuck at home listening to Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity all day so you get this serious distaste for anything Liberal/Progressive. You can't point to why your ideology is superior. |
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I agree on the slow-and-steady pattern. What will ultimately get things going is more market depth, and then the final transition where you can actually live on bitcoins. But that is quite a ways off. Can't wait, myself.
Do you think that people can get past the psychological barrier of paying with a deflationary currency? For example if deflationary currency is possible things will cost 0.00000021BTC in the future. We are literally asking people to count backwards, and it's a totally new concept that would seem not work in a practical every day environment. |
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The only way you Ron Paul supporters will get people to take you *seriously* is if you win the Caucus. If you guys can't even pull off a caucus victory in Iowa please just stop there. I really don't want to hear 9 months of nauseating Ron Paul rhetoric if his supporters can't even win him the Iowa Caucus.
Mike Huckabee won the Republican Iowa caucus in 2008. Enough Said...
So this proves.....? McCain won the nomination in 2008, remember? So winning the Iowa Caucus didn't seem to help Huckabee. I guess I don't understand your point. If Ron Paul can't win a caucus, he sure as hell can't win a general. |
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I wouldn't mind a gradual increase of $1/week in the price. Keeps things running smoothly. The difficulty drop may be the harbinger of future price increases - based on the last time that happened.
Watching the charts...
A $1 every 2 weeks would be even better. Slow and steady is the way to go if we ever want this "experiment" to work, and turn into a viable currency. if it did go up slow and steady, after a while It would start to look like a safe investment, and the speculators would be all over it, driving the price up , which would cause panic buying  then eventually the surge runs out of steam... oh no! SELL! SELL! SELL! is that pattern even avoidable? Afraid not, bitcoin follows the swings generated by it's milestones good and bad. We haven't even reached V1 yet of the client, so there's a lot to happen yet. Also a few million is very little of a unit to have in circulation, any relatively small movement on an international scale can have a massive impact on price. It will be a long, long while until the price settles in to an equilibrium if ever, as bitcoin has behaved more like a commodity than a currency due to it's scarceness. Currencies fluctuate mildly(on the macro scale at least) just on the basis of their vast quantities in circulation. Thank you for explaining this as I have been trying to tell my friends for weeks why Bitcoin is going to have a hard time catching on as a "currency". Regardless it's an awesome commodity which does have it's own value. |
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I wouldn't mind a gradual increase of $1/week in the price. Keeps things running smoothly. The difficulty drop may be the harbinger of future price increases - based on the last time that happened.
Watching the charts...
A $1 every 2 weeks would be even better. Slow and steady is the way to go if we ever want this "experiment" to work, and turn into a viable currency. |
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I think everyone would do this if scammers didn't catch on. But oh they WILL lol  . He is making a heavy premium on them though. |
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The only way you Ron Paul supporters will get people to take you *seriously* is if you win the Caucus. If you guys can't even pull off a caucus victory in Iowa please just stop there. I really don't want to hear 9 months of nauseating Ron Paul rhetoric if his supporters can't even win him the Iowa Caucus.
Mike Huckabee won the Republican Iowa caucus in 2008. Enough Said...
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So it's theft to help your own country now huh?
God Obama is going to win so bad in 2012... You guys are just giving this election away lol.
No it's theft when my money is used to pay the bills of my friends sister who has 2 children by 2 different fathers, has no job, owns the latest and greatest cell phones and laptops and is quoted as literally saying (wouldn't have believed it if I didn't hear it myself) in dead seriousness "I need to have another kid so I can get some more money" both in child support and federal and state assistance..... That is theft! Your gross generalization of anyone who is receiving help is disturbing. Is this how you really look at other people who are taking help from the government right now to survive? The person who you know has her own problems to deal with and her free ride will be over with time. However, how can you relate Warren Buffet only paying 17% in taxes to your (I assume poor) free loading friend who probably barley has enough to feed her kids she has now. How is it that you can justify in your mind giving Billionaires like Buffet huge tax cuts while normal people (like your friend) have to justify having another kid just to make rent with the welfare check... It's an amazing time we are living in people... |
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I think we would be better off lowering individual tax rates to the same amount corporations currently pay. It will level the playing field and encourage a more diverse set of small businesses.
...but it won't happen. It's all rigged, gentlemen. There will never be change from within. We need a revolution.
Well said! And as long as there are parasites who strongly feel that they somehow have a right to the fruits of others labors this will be unfortunately one of the hardest points to argue. It's theft and nothing more, but theft made legal by the government sadly we need to rotate the whole lot of them out starting with the parasite-and-chief himself in 2012. So it's theft to help your own country now huh? God Obama is going to win so bad in 2012... You guys are just giving this election away lol. |
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If Democrats and Republicans weren't the same, then why do they have the same supporters?  It is customary for the biggest company's to donate to all the candidates. Mostly they do it for publicity to show that they care about the American system. The difference is that Democrats get the majority of their money from individuals and non profit organizations, and Republicans get most of their money from wealthy beneficiaries like the Koch Brothers and other corporatist. |
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You quoted tax to GDP.... not tax rates....
This shows that they are heavily under-taxed... You are spinning the graph, when the issues are so obviously in front of us. |
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I said corporate tax rate. Then you change it to corporate tax rate income to GDP and call me a lier. You corporatists are just incredible.
Ayeyo, I gave you a full critique of keynesian economics and you completely chicken out and disaperared.
You imply sir that our corporations are heavily taxed which is far from the truth. Regardless of the specifics, the fact of the matter is they are getting away without paying trillions while the middle class suffers with deeper and deeper spending cuts. You advocate for their tax cuts/loopholes. |
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A modern democracy is what we already have NOW...
Oh how the education system has failed you dear child... The United States IS NOT nor EVER WAS a democracy... our government is a REPUBLIC.... I bet you don't really know what that means.... Can we please stay on topic ? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Representative_Democracy |
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The truth hurts More rethoric. Are you capable of using a rational argument? Warren Buffet pays 17% and he's the third riches person in the world. I am pretty sure Bill Gates isn't to far away from that number either. If you really believe this you are even more naive than you seem. How can you guys possible think this is ok? What is wrong with you? Who says we are ok with it? You progressives are guilty of this situation. And in the USA corporations pay higher tax rate than in Germany. If you like Germany I guess you support lowering taxes for corporations in the USA right? Or this Germany things is just another of your stupid talking points? We are the lowest taxed industrialized country on Earth and you guys are still fighting for less even though 46% of the population in America already pays 0 income tax. The USA has the highest corporate rate in the industrialized world. Germany and all the northen european countries have lower corporate rates. Is that the model you are defending? I don't know what the hell you're rambling about, but you are a LIAR. THE UNITED STATES CORPORATE RATE IS 2'ND TO LOWEST IN THE ENTIRE WORLD, THAT'S NOT INCLUDING THE MANY LOOPHOLES.http://www.bnet.com/blog/financial-business/freeloaders-us-corporate-tax-rates-are-among-the-lowest-in-the-world/14623 Learn your facts please, everything else you said was completely useless and irrelevant if you just begin your tirade with LIES. |
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And btw, congratullations on completely derailing the thread with stupid rethoric. You seem incapable of being rational.
Sorry but that's a line of crap.... (See the original post....)Conservatives / Libertarians jumping in to repudiate the words of someone 10000 times richer than them in 3...2...1  The truth hurts Warren Buffet pays 17% and he's the third riches person in the world. I am pretty sure Bill Gates isn't to far away from that number either. How can you guys possible think this is ok? What is wrong with you? In Germany for example the top income bracket pays 56% with the average paying 29%. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_rates_around_the_worldWe are the lowest taxed industrialized country on Earth and you guys are still fighting for less even though 46% of the population in America already pays 0 income tax. How can you think it is okay that you pay 20% in taxes and fictional persons called corporations (that have the most income) pay less than 2%? Why are we not concerned about a government that only engineers a regime that creates bigger and more coercive companies? We're worried about the wrong thing. It's all a distraction. We need to close all tax loopholes, we need to raise corporate tax rates, we need to reform the entire tax code, and we need to implement a progressive tax system that is structured to peoples current economic status, we need to get rid of all Bush era tax cuts. Of course there are huge problems right now with the current tax law, but what you have to understand is that we don't need to go back to the gold standard to fix these problems! You have President Obama who wants all these reforms, but there is another faction in this country who wants to see him fail no matter what the price is. And guess what Atlas? People like you who facilitate this weird fantasy world where economic collapse is imminent only make that vision more true by your dismissal to see the true reality today. While you are right that corporations rig this game, you are wrong in thinking that Democrats and Republicans are the same thing... |
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And btw, congratullations on completely derailing the thread with stupid rethoric. You seem incapable of being rational.
Sorry but that's a line of crap.... (See the original post....)Conservatives / Libertarians jumping in to repudiate the words of someone 10000 times richer than them in 3...2...1 The truth hurts Warren Buffet pays 17% and he's the third richest person in the world. I am pretty sure Bill Gates isn't to far away from that number either. How can you guys possibly think this is ok? What is wrong with you? In Germany for example the top income bracket pays 56% with the average paying 29%. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_rates_around_the_worldWe are the lowest taxed industrialized country on Earth and you guys are still fighting for less even though 46% of the population in America already pays 0 income tax. |
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I doubt 99% of the conservative posters here won't be invited to these exclusive "islands". Unless Bitcoin goes up .
Through those rose-tinted glasses of yours, you must envision the culture of libertarianism as being headed by an elite and if they get their way -- and in this case, through these islands -- there would be no chance that a man of average means will have their way into this said innovation.
What you fail to realize is that we are not corporatist, elitist nor do we want to dominate or rule people. All we are advocates of is self-reliance and to gain pleasure from dominating our fellow man is only contrary to this founding virtue.
These islands will be open to anybody who can provide sufficient value and that will most likely be anybody who is willing to move to it. A civilization based on only rich elites won't be that fruitful. Somebody has to clean the toilets. Look at the details: They want looser building codes, less barriers to entry. If anything, this is only beneficial to the less fortunate. If they wanted it only for wealthy, high-end structures and such there would be more restriction. If they wanted only big companies and monopolies, there would be a manipulative tax structure. So far, none of that is apparent.
In summary, you're wrong about our philosophy. You're wrong about our motives.
The people who want to rule you and make you poorer are the current statists in the Democratic and Republican parties and they are continuing to succeed in doing just that.
No one rules me Atlas, I just know that this is a huge waist of money when this country is 14 trillion in debt, teachers are getting cut out of class rooms, roads are crumbling, and we are at the brink of collapse because of our inability to pay our own bills, even though we have MORE THAN ENOUGH money it seems to build fake islands in the middle of the ocean. Seriously do you listen to yourself? |
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That just supports my statement. Your claim that it "destroys" society is clearly wrong, because the most well regulated countries are also the richest. Too many rules can create unnecessary obstacles, but the uncertainty a lack of laws creates is just as bad.
Anyway, I realize your ideology is your religion, so I'll stop wasting our time discussing this now. I dont understand why you come to this community to just repeat talking points and insult people. We can't have a society with no rules... Nobody has ever advocated this. If anything, it only demonstrates your lack of understanding in what we wish to achieve. In the end, what we want is effective order established by the many. Not mob rule, not a few but all through having a system that can effectively addresses all individual desires. A modern democracy is what we already have NOW... " In the end, what we want is effective order established by the many. Not mob rule, not a few but all through having a system that can effectively addresses all individual desires." Is the problem that YOUR candidate won't win? I assume you are a Ron Paul guy or for some other non main-stream candidate. If your picks never win it's not because there is some conspiracy against your ideology, or everyone is just too stupid to care. It's simply because not enough people think that your Ideology is best for the entire country, becuase Atlas you have to step back for a second and understand that not everyone thinks like you do. You are advocating "effective order established by many" yet you continue to rally for restrictions imposed by few through literal economic terrorism. Ron Paul is WRONG when he thinks he can take the entire country back to the gold standard without having any negative effects on the entire economy. Ron Paul is WRONG when he says he can cut all social programs and people will be able to find their own way, Ron Paul is not only wrong but is irresponsible when he says that we don't need to enforce revenues on rich people and that we should let the free market manage itself. I cannot believe that some people think these are good ideas. I honestly feel like I am wasting my time even debating these ideas which is why the Mainstream Media ignores him and all his supporters. Don't get me wrong I like some of Dr. Pauls ideas alot, but some are just so off base, and so wrong I don't even know where to start. You fight for rich people every single day Atlas by fighting for policy's that have no chance of ever making it to law, so you turn the debate so far to the right, that all of a sudden "Right" is the new middle. Being blind to ideology is just as bad as fighting for the rich. |
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