Yikes. I guess that really speaks to what type of investors are behind BTC

This is basically like:

What came first the chicken or the egg?



If demand was growing but not causing computations to get harder, fees would stay lower, and prices of bitcoin would stay lower since miners wouldn't need to recoup as much electricity losses

If demand was growing and causing the computations to get harder, fees will be higher, and prices of bitcoin will rise because miners will need more money to cover their electricity losses.



Clearly the increase of fees (aka wasting of resources) is impacting Bitcoin's price.

You can't win here. The only people who type in proper English tend to be smug and rude.




Redundancy much? You don't need to repeat the word post




Sure, I'll go respond. But if you still don't think Bitcoins price is correlated to the cost of mining you are delusional. If mining was does in an efficient manner that didn't waste resources, Bitcoin would certainly be priced less than it is (in terms of fiat).

What? You are comparing oranges to apples.

Microsoft has revenues, Microsoft profits, Microsoft creates value, Microsoft has added many new technologies and expanded business. When you look at the history, you actually see the growth of a company. Those are the things that actually GENERATE the returns. When you look at bitcoin you see none of this. Its growth is derived not from profits, not from revenues, not from new technologies, not from much of anything. Its price is entirely based around hype



It is very possible bitcoin will indeed double or triple in price before crashing. That would provide a mere 2x-3x return

My entire point is that bitcoin has already gone up 6,000,000x.

Is it worth the risk of losing a 6,000,000x profit for a chance at 2x-3x more?

Lets compare bitcoins price rise to a bottle of water. Since water is something EVERYONE needs



Water:

2008 - 50 cents
2017 - 1 dollar

2x increase



Bitcoin:

2008 - $0.003
2017 - $18,000 dollars

6,000,000x increase



Clearly water (and the demand for it) is more important than bitcoin. Yet water appreciated 2x in value while an imaginary, invisible, untangible thing called bitcoin has increased 6 million times. If water increased by the same amount it woud cost 3 million dollars for a bottle today.

Would you pay 3 million for 24 fluid ounces of water? No.

Then why would you buy bitcoin for the same inflated price?

WTF did I just try to read? Are you dreaming right now...

Are there active forums that have more knowledgeable users than this one?

I would love to continue to learn about the Crypto space but looking around here all I see are bots, referral spammers, and broken English. Its feels like this forum is stuck in a third world country and all the campaign signatures are like the homeless begging for money. Where can I find solid content and discussions on Crypto? Another big problem with this forum is due to all the bots and referral spammers, everyone here is basically 100% bullish on Crypto. Which makes for a very one sided conversation. Every time I bring up solid questions related to Crypto I get attacked by broken English and referral spammers who just want to shout how amazing Bitcoin is saying "FUD FUD FUD". I feel like I waste too much time sifting through all the garbage on here.

Any suggestions please?

Yeah. Its not like fiat is backed by assets. That's not what this thread is really about though

How can a market cap increase 6 million times without any significant advancements in technology etc. Without anything tangible being created and without any real value added. It doesn't make sense. I don't think bitcoin can retain a price point that is 6 million times higher than it was 7 years ago. People are going to start cashing in eventually, and the price is going to plummet

What should bitcoin be worth? Maybe $100 would be more reasonable after 7 years of growth

There really has been little innovation overall. Lightning network isn't even rolled out and SegWit hasn't been integrated everywhere. Basically the market cap of Bitcoin has ballooned without any real growth to justify it. The price is just being hyped

Bitcoins exploding price might be the biggest deterrent to its success. A gradual rise in price would be much more reasonable.

This exponential, nonstop increase is looking more and more like a bubble.

"But when you take a hard look at the last few years, it’s hard to deny that the run-up is starting to look shaky. And compared with past events, the rise of cryptocurrencies has all the hallmarks of a disaster waiting to happen."

"Unsurprisingly, this one-dimensional view encourages a herd mentality. While early adopters tend to have at least peripheral knowledge of the investment in question, eventually those without any understanding of finance or investing are sucked in simply by the promise of returns. Case in point: Nearly 1 in 3 millennials would rather own bitcoin than stocks, according to a November report"

"If you’ve made a ton of money in bitcoin then good for you. But new money needs to know the state of play and heed these warning signs before simply jumping in. Because at best it’s a mature rally that has already achieved much of its gains, and at worst it’s a recipe for disaster as you buy at or near the top."

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/yes-the-rise-of-bitcoin-has-all-the-hallmarks-of-a-disaster-waiting-to-happen-2017-12-12

It does feel like people are delusional when it comes to this. Rich is a relative term. You can't be rich without someone being poor.

That same concept applies to bitcoin profits. Everyone can't make 1000x their money or more. There has to be losers. There's going to be a giant wakeup call whenever Bitcoin starts to trend down. I think the drop will be even faster than the rise was.

We've mined 17m of the 21m bitcoin already.

In that time bitcoin has gone up 6 million times its original value! That makes no sense at all. Even 1000x - 10000x increase would be rather absurd


Bitcoins price is WAYYYYY TOOO HIGH!!! Only 1% of the world has adopted the coin so far. It makes no sense that the first 1% to adopt (aka miners and HODLers) should get up to a 6 million times return on their money. While someone adopting today would get a one times return. That's simply not feasible. The remaining 99% of the population will not agree to deflate their own purchasing power by 6 million - they will just continue to use Fiat.

That's the biggest problem that will prevent bitcoin from scaling.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F7luAHdv61k

Heres a great video from Crypto Daily discussing the problems of bitcoins price

No it doesn't make any sense to buy bitcoin at absurdly high prices

Get a time machine and pick up some bitcoin from 2010.

Its already gone up 6,000,000 x its original price. Yes 6 million! Normally 2x-10x is a great return. Even if bitcoin somehow climbed all the way to $100,000 that would still only be a 6x increase from where it is.

When you think about how it has gone up 6 million times its original price and realize how little room there is for it to keep going, it starts to make more sense to SELL bitcoin than to buy it. Why would you want to buy at the very highest price?

Now is the time to SELL!

Everyone is hoping that bitcoin will continue to rise in price indefinitely.

They look at the growth from $0.003 to $18000 and think that bitcoin is unstoppable


Is everyone buying into a dream that is too good to be true? How can bitcoin go up over 6 million times its original value without approaching a bubble? A $100 investment in 2010 would be worth $600,000 dollars! Where the heck does that "value" even come from. Bitcoin produces no revenues and provides no tangible assets. How can a $100 investment be worth $600,000 after 7 years? You can't just make $600k from scratch without there being losers involved. So who are the losers going to be when this wild ride is all done?

I think once the bubble bursts, people will get stuck with their worthless digital currency and the dream will finally come to an end.


People are investing with their heart, not their brains.


This feels exactly like the dot-com bubble. Yes crypto and specifically the block chain are incredible innovations, and that is what is fueling such massive excitement. When the smoke clears, reality is going to smack a lot of people in the face. Investors need to start thinking about exit strategies. A ton of money is going to be made on crypto - IN BOTH DIRECTIONS. Go ahead and keep riding the wave up, but start getting prepared to also ride the wave down. Billions will be made in 2018 or later off of SHORTING crypto. The current prices, especially bitcoin and the major alts, are just unrealistic.

#CryptoCrash2018

Yup. Small and medium size investors are about to get squeezed out of the picture

Smart money tends to be contrarian and patiently waits to exploit markets inefficiencies. They buy undervalued assets when everyone is panicking and short when bubbles are at their peak hype.

With everyone and their aunt's hairdresser investing in Bitcoin perhaps the bubble is getting closer than we think!!

When do you believe the smart money will take over Bitcoin? Will prices fall all the way to $1000? $100?

Lots of money is going to be made off the crash

I think its definitely too late.



Think about it this way:

It has risen in price from $0.003 to $17000

That is over 5million times increase in value.

If Bitcoin goes up to 100,000 that is ONLY a 6 times increase in value  (6 compared to 5 million is very small - especially factoring in risk!)




The upside is just too small compared to what it was before. You basically need a time machine to invest.

I actually think now is the BEST time to sell before the inevitable crash

I think now is a good time to cash in on bitcoin profits

I predict a price correction will happen in 2018

I see bitcoin being around $1000-2000 or so. But before that happens it might go up in price. Could even get to 100k before the crash