 Show Posts
|
|
Pages: « 1 [2]
|
We'll all be sending our miners to data centres in Russia at this rate - Russia 2.4 to 9.58 c/kw according to Wikipedia
I was able to find space mainland USA with 2c offpeak & 3.5 cent peak rates, which is where the miners are going... and where exactly are your miners? plugged in at a power plant near you?!? No... my apartment/soon to be warehouse [/quote] In the US don't forget there is a 'transmission charge' also. Here in the wonderful state of NJ, it is $0.12 Kwh. Now add the $0.067 transmission charge for a marvelous total of $0.187 Kwh. Most of the 'alternative' electric companies fail to mention that you are still going to get charged for transmission. So the guys that are offering $0.10 Kwh, your final cost is $0.167. Lets see: 750 Watt 400Gh/s miner - from .187 to .167 yields a savings of $131 per year; and from .187 to .08 yields a savings of $600 per year, down to $579 per year. I did a search for Russian electric costs, found a .pdf at academia.edu... $.08 Kwh this year, $.10 Kwh next year and rising $.01-.02 cents each year until 2020. This is because they are going the deregulation route. Really, if you are going to use COMED RRTP program, watch that 4pm spike to $.078 Kwh. Oh to be in Illinois again. [/quote] The rates everywhere are high, going to impact ROI in the long term. In MA i'm paying .14 through a local muncipality, nearby towns are paying .17-.18. My partner and I found a site where we can get .04 at commercial rates. He's a network specialist so we're working on leasing the space and setting up hosting with it's own pool. Costs should be significantly less this way. |
|
|
|
How about a traffic light system for vendors with;
Purple Pre-orders
Green Shipped on time
Amber Late/Unreliable (+ 1 month)
Red Severe Delay/Dishonest/Incompetent (+ 2 months)
Black Scam (taken money and run, or blatant lie)
+1 this idea. With a vendor specific forum, combined with a rating system on each vendor it would solve alot of these issues. Inaba and BFL should have been tagged and banned by this forum. They've been able to keep the spotlight off them by shipping measley quantities to certain people. Not to mention they are clearly spending money for advertising here. If you want to cut back on the bad chatter, then the forum should have a set of standards it adheres too. |
|
|
|
|
Dude you need a disclosure at the bottom of this -
*Past performance is not indicative of future results. Nothing is guaranteed. The opinion of the author is his own and does not directly reflect the opinions of the bitcoin economy.
|
|
|
|
Then, for shits and giggles, I went across the street to check out business at the McDonald's. I counted 5 employees, 18 patrons, and one car in the drive-thru. The one guy at the register was twiddling his thumbs because he had no one to serve.
Their building was over half the size of In-n-Out's.
Maybe it was because people can get their food within seconds after ordering, and no one has to stick around waiting for their order? McDonald's around my area are packed (despite us having Checkers, Hardees, Burger King, Wendy's, etc), and serve about 300 customers an hour during lunch rush, and about 100 a hour the rest of the day. Average a day for the good ones is about 3,000 customers. So not THAT much worse. Imagine how empty McDonald's in your area would be if an In-n-Out was next to it. The two McDonald's that are next to a Burger King and a Checkers (which makes burgers way better than any other fast food place) are doing just fine, usually being quite full. The other places are a bit empty. Reason is because people prefer uniformity to quality. They go to a McDonalds knowing exactly what they will get, as opposed to wanting to experiment with new things. And that, by the way, is the McDonald's version of WalMart's supply chain. McDonalds is beating everyone around the world because they were the first to set up a uniform burger standard around the country. Regardless of which Mcdonalds you go to in the country, you know exactly what you are going to get. Purely by volume, history, and size today McDonalds is "beating" competitors. Recently though the Double Arches missed estimates and had lower than expected performance. Maybe they really aren't the best. Perhaps the real reason they are "successful" is because they can craft cheap food through poor wages and questionable sourcing practices of their food products. Now back to entitlement, should a company like McDonalds really be an icon in our modern day economy? Or should we perhaps treat them like casinos, admit that wages should be higher and food should be sourced appropriately, and then focus our attention on the things that make us a better society. I really could care less that McDonalds makes cheap food, we all know we shouldn't eat it and do it anyways. Lets just keep it that way. |
|
|
|
This is hilarious... I actually have some BFL hardware and even I think this means they are finished.. They are obviously trying to move payments to a medium that cant be refunded (bitcoin or wire xfer). They are using a design which alot of us *know* cannot dissipate that much heat, and they are moving at a snail's pace with current orders.
Guys... Ive never said this before, but i believe they are on the virge of folding and taking anyone who preorders money with them..
Regarding power consumption, Radeon 5970 and 5870 both consume more power than our card does, the very reason we took this design approach. Also this pretends away the challenges of the form factor and ignores it was AMD with three decades of experience, and the HD 5000 series was their 12th generation of graphics cards. AMD/ATI's first graphics card looked like this and consumed 10W.  Even AMD isn't immune to the challenges of working in a compact unforgiving form factor, the 7990 (375W TDP) was delayed by six months due to power/thermal issues that they found challenging to resolve. While 350W is possible in that form factor one would have to be willing to bet that unlike every other time the simulations aren't lower than reality AND that the company doesn't run into any cooling/power problems due to the extremely high energy density. As for 350W being conservative? I don't see it. 350W is 0.6 w/GH. BFL current chips are 3.1 w/GH correct? A die shrink conservatively means at best a 40% reduction in power (miners tend to be always on so we are really only interested in active load). 28nm is two die shrinks from current chip. So 3.1 w/GH * 0.6 * 0.6 = 1.1 w/GH. If the current generation was just a die shrink (Intel's tick/tock strategy) we would be looking at 1.1w/GH (660W for this card). You stated you will both shrink and optimize (something Intel split up to reduce risk) but that is a rather significant optimization wouldn't you say? Nearly an 86% (1.1/0.6) improvement in performance per watt outside what is gained from the die shrink. Intel (that small rookie ASIC designer) is happy for a 10% improvement in performance per watt from architectural changes. Given the aggressive improvement in performance per watt necessary, combined with the lack of any headroom (if it misses by even 20% then it can't be cooled in that form factor at that speed), it would need to be a nearly flawless design and execution from start to finish. It certainly "can" be done (it isn't beyond the theoretical limits of silicon on forced air cooling) but given BFL past promises on power and cooling well one would be betting that "this one will be different". Give Nasser a break, for he's not quite up to speed. Remember, he was on vacation in Rome at the end of November, early December, on those who pre-ordered's dime. He just came outta the woodwork to address a couple concerns about BFL's new product line to coincide with the recent video and Josh coming back to play with us naysayers after being away for a week. After today, Nasser will go back to his French cave for several months. This new revelation is sick on so many levels. Madness!+1 Madness! |
|
|
|
Haha if I knew the answer I wouldn't be telling  Not till early - mid 2014 I would say. ASIC flood will cause a drop in the short term for sure! I have a feeling ASIC flooding the market will actually lead to an increase. Every ASIC investment is a direct investment into the bitcoin network and economy. At this rate we might even break 115 and run to 125 in the next few weeks! |
|
|
|
|
Ok, I do want to see pictures of the PCB. That would relieve further doubts.
I DO have a KnC preorder and will take any additional information that puts me closer to a solid delivery in September.
Of course I have my doubts. Let's be honest though, would you bet on some of these other companies over KnC? CoinTerra? Hashfast? Seems like KnC has been the most forthright in this process and they have followed through on things they say publicly thus far.
|
|
|
|
|
Seriously, how can they ever deliver a new product when they are still behind on 10 months worth of orders?
That should prove to everyone out there they are trying to siphon off as much cash from this community as possible. Talk about over-promise and under-deliver.
|
|
|
|
|
I'm interested in these guys. Site is undergoing "maintenance" right now. I seriously doubt the legitimacy of most ASIC manufacturers these days after having dealt with BFL.
Right now I am betting on KnC. I'd like to see XCrowd succeed because we do need more manufacturers and stiffer competition on pricing.
|
|
|
|
|
It's a great sign whatever the reason! Increased demand is going to improve our Bitcoin Economy!
|
|
|
|
|
I for one, got a refund on my BFL order back from May 1st and couldn't be happier. A 25 gh/s little single is a joke with his type of difficulty. Go invest in BTC or build a business.
Just a heads up, might near impossible to get your money back out of BFL. Best of letting paypal know you ordered a preorder and need it refunded for failed delivery.
|
|
|
|
And the difference between the rich and the poor is the amount of money held by each.
They're [the rich] people, just like the poor. Given money, luck & intellect, the poor would be just like them.
God damn you're an idiot... Did you know that Bill Gates, Peter Thiel, and Sergey Brin started out with approximately the same amount of money as you? Why are they rich and you are poor? And do you honestly think that if you were to take away all their money so that they are as poor as you, that you all will have the same equal chance of becoming rich? Man you're deluded... I am not poor by any standards, furfag. In my entire adult life, i haven't lived on $500 a month you claim your poor parents live on ($1000 jointly)  My parentsv aren't poor, either. They earn a combined ~$25,000 a month. It's just that all but $1,000 of it goes to support their various properties and investments (just as all but ~$450 of mine goes to investments) - things that give people a place to live and a place to work. You have one again missed my point entirely, which is that rich people that make a lot of money, such as my parents, aren't just sitting on bags of money, and can't just give up half their wealth without doing some serious harm to other people (one of their tenants is on government assisted housing, so hurting them directly hurts the poor, too). As I said, you're too much of an idiot to recognize these things, even when I spell them out for you: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=247874.msg2802864#msg2802864Rassah, it might be that you're own experiences have disillusioned you about the state of the rest of the 1%. Most of the wealth that is acquired by the upper level of society does not trickle back down to others. There are various documentaries out there that attempt to elaborate on this position. There are also statistics that 1% of the population controls some 85% of the wealth. The middle class the comprises approximately 70% of the population, controls just 5% of the wealth. When there are CEO's making millions upon millions in their respective companies and their are lower level employees going to work every day and making a fraction of what the CEO makes it spins the whole concept of work and reward on it's head. I would suggest you look up the story of HP's failed CEO Lee Apotheker http://money.cnn.com/2011/09/22/technology/hp_ceo_fired/index.htm. This little gem took over HP for 11 months and performed dismally. When he was fired, he walked away with a $25million severance package. |
|
|
|
It is still possible to break even. Take KNC Miner for instance, they offer high hashing power ASICs at good prices. Assuming they deliver by October/November, you can definitely still make a ROI. You can find more information about their ASICs and prices at https://www.kncminer.com/. Good Luck. Cute. Spamming reseller links. Also, "Assuming they deliver by October/November" is a big assumption. So far, all the ASIC vendors have been delayed, some substantially. If they're delayed a few months, those calculations shift significantly. What I love about this post is "all the ASIC vendors have been delayed, some substantially". Throughout the forums and on this thread, the concensus seems to be that difficulty will skyrocket to 500m come Dec because of the huge influx of ASICs to the network hashrate. Guess what, if all the ASIC companies so far have been delayed is it really logical to assume we will see an order of 10x magnitude in 3-4 months? I seriously doubt Cointerra, Avalon, Butterfly, KnC, Hashfast, Bitfury, ASICMiner and every other little guy will deliver ALL their ASICs on time. At best I think you see 2-4 vendors deliver solid goods in the next 3-4 months. Take into account that a 10x magnitude would be roughly a 10x increase in hash rate, putting the network something like 4,000 TH/s in the next 3-4 months. So 3,600 TH/s get delivered in 3-4 months, sounds like ALOT more happy customers than the ASIC community has been seeing lately.... The fact of the matter is, the assumptions about ROI and difficulty leveling off are also correct. Once the industry realizes adding machines isn't adding to productivity/returns then orders will start to fall off and the craze will definitely fade back. Until then, it leaves alot of room for companies to deliver on their ASIC promises. |
|
|
|
|
This is a great article. Very interesting stuff. I'm a compliance officer at a broker/dealer and deal with all sorts of AML issues on the B/D and Advisory side. The first thing I thought of when I discovered this were the compliance issues that businesses and individuals would encounter. At the end of the day we need strong policies and procedures to make sure FINCEN and the govt will adopt the industry.
|
|
|
|
I would venture to say no company in the BitCoin space will get $200m from Venture Capital. Hopefully everyone realizes VC works on mostly hard numbers, i.e. potential growth, market cap, market penetration etc. So $200m into an economy with a $1b market cap? Not likely. VC would laugh if companies in this space walked through their door looking for $200m. At least today  BFL is a scam. Where is Josh today? |
|
|
|
|
End of 2013, we should see a pop above $200. When it breaks 200 you'll find a ceiling around 260. I wouldn't be surprised if it broke 260 and ran to 350 but that is highly speculative barring the trade activity at the time.
Time wise, anywhere between late Nov and mid Feb 2014.
|
|
|
|
|
