I certainly hope so, else I would still be shitting in my diapers.

Well, you can go see real world examples currently underway in both India and Venezuela where the government will arrest you for not using their currencies. I don't know what more to say on that point. Is there a hypothetical dreamland where coercion is not the main tool? I suppose. The government could create all of the money, in the US it was designed to, but the banks did not like that. See Andrew Jacksn, Abe Lincoln, and Jekyll Island for further. And really I don't like it either, as again it is time to move forward and not backwards...and hope we are.

Clearly you are not a property owner or there would be no discussion of whether tax payments are coercive.

Yes, government pays out currency they borrow from the bank, at interest. Simultaneously the bank makes loans to the public at interest. No, you are not forced to borrow money. You can alternatively perform labor  or services for somebody who chooses to borrow it from the bank, and get paid in their borrowed money, and pay your landlord, who will use it to pay taxes, which will return to the bank as government debt payments. Or you can live in a shopping cart/jail. All money returns to the bank.

Probably the crux of a lot of delusions. College is great but... real life is a different game.

А профит у них в чём? Баннеров что-то не заметил. Капча тривиальная, вряд ли она из другого сайта.

When I am saying people will hold on to their money now and spend it later, that can be interpreted as lowering the velocity now, and increasing it later. Then you will understand that that is consistent with a stable price level and an increasing quantity of goods.

They get it from the system that will be full steam. The banks simply issue loans at interest, and do so with money they print from nothing. That is fractional lending. They start with nothing, you borrow money at interest, they give you money they invented. That is why a bank ledger shows outstanding loans as an asset, and money in the vault as a liability. Exactly opposite the way a borrower sees it. A bank wants no money in the bank, all money in your hands paying them interest 24/7. Compounding effect assures that they will always make more, the public will always grow poorer. Or why I hate this system.

If they are any smart, yet. If they are the average ignorant Joe, maybe not, then again some of us have to be zombies.

deisik:  I feel your pain, debating these Troglodytes.

That said I think the Quantity Theory of Money could be of assistance.  It is a simple and ancient formula that every economic school aknowleges.

The Formula is M * V = P * Q

M is Money Supply
V is Velocity, the number of times each money unit is transacted in the defined time period
P is the Price level of Goods and Services
Q is the Quantity of Goods and Services exchanged during the defined time period

Now once we have this formula we can clearly see that when any one factor is going up or down it must be balanced by a movement of one or more of the other factors (which factor tends to move more or less is a whole other area of debate).

If we assume that Q quantity is going to rise then their are 3 possible response, P decreases (deflation as prices are dropping), or an increase in V or M.  Now in BTC M is completely fixed (and in reality it will decline slowly from lost coins).  So this leaves only higher V and lower P as options.  Velocity in BTC could indeed rise a lot as most coins are hoarded but the overwhelming attitude is one of holding onto coins with a death-grip, and even if people did hoard their are probably practical limits to have high V can go.  This leaves a falling P as the only real option and hence the prediction of deflation (which has been spectacularly correct).  Really their can be no argument here both the pro and anti BTC sides of the debate expect deflation.

биткойн, согласно нормам русского ИМХО

Presently governments borrow the legal tender from the central bank to operate. And I am guessing you have never tried to go off the grid. If you own land, you have to pay taxes on it, in legal tender. If all of your money is in btc form, you have to sell enough each year to at least pay your taxes in fiat. If you rent, your landlord pays the taxes. If nobody pays the taxes the gov seizes the land and sells it to someone who will.

That will probably be next year.

Each Bitcoin is 100 million Satoshi so you have a long way to go before we run out.

Imagine a weekly market with a pile of clothes on one side of the square, and a pile of coins on the other. Every week the pile of clothes is a little bigger, and the number of coins stays the same. You are saying that the price of clothes next week MUST be lower because there are more clothes then. But what is going to happen now then? People will wait with their purchase to next week, not buying clothes now. So this weeks demand for clothes drops and prices will fall NOW. Hey presto, there is your increase in the purchasing power of your coin already. (rise in the exchange rate clothes/coins)

hmm its usd price has gone up from 8 usd to 1,000 usd in under a year, i don't know why everyone is saying its deflationary

No. If gold backed dollar turned out to be deflationary, it was because of an unforseen increase in the demand for it. Anyone who could have predicted it, would have held on to those dollars before, causing a rise in the purchasing power of the dollar immediately (deflation), and a constant price level for decades after. Prices went down over time because demand for the dollar was bigger than expected. The pain was caused by the inability to adjust to the unexpected deflation in contracts like wages.

You keep talking as if in every round of production, you are forced to spend every dollar in existence. You are free to keep it in your pocket. Currency is not just for transactions now, it is also a store of value over time. That is what un-links the currency supply from the production it can buy. What currency buys is for the market to decide, and people thinking about that can take account of the increasing demand for transaction, the wear and tear of bills, etc.

so what kind of currency or asset is deflationary by your definition? i can think of nothing.

if the dollar were printed by a fix number, it would be deflationary due to wear and tear or people would lose their paper notes. people will lose their BTC as well. also, BTC is deflationary because people hoard their BTC, which raises the value over time.

When you divide production by the fixed number of bitcoin, you are talking about 'production per bitcoin'. Yes, that will keep going up, but it is a completely irrelevant measure. There is NO 1:1 link between production and the supply of currency.

You can not mistake 'production per bitcoin' with 'what a bitcoin buys you'. That is for supply and demand on the market to decide. You can choose to hold on to your bitcoin and spend it later if you think it will buy more then.

Yes, but then we are talking a movement around some level. Not a constant deflation or inflation.

I suspect the economic cycle in a bitcoin economy will be much less than we are seeing now. A lot of it is caused by the time delay between a central banks guiding indicators (gdp growth/inflation) and the effect of its instruments (money supply change). In aviation it would be called Pilot Induced Oscillation, plenty a crash is caused by that.

The price will incorporate the expected future growth of the underlying economy. Why do you think there is $15 billion worth of bitcoin now with only little trade. We are taking the future into account.

Bitcoin is not deflationary. Bitcoin is not inflationary. There is no free lunch.