You are asking for 0.1 x 10000+0.15 x 40000 = 7000
That is for 50% of the venture. Total valuation 7 million dollars for an exchange with no customers. If this sells out I'm going to be depressed.
Hard to discuss with someone, who can't do elementary math :-) |
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I haven't invested in this or any other PMB because I have done my own research and due diligence. The only reason for this post is to warn others who have not.
Ok, i get it. |
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you should always do your own due diligence and own math... I don´t think that issuer has any inside information about BFL, Avalon or any other company numbers about orders, so it is pretty complicated to sue anybody about underestimated difficulty. Maybe it is also your greed and lack of investment skills, not only he is to blame, hmm? It is very naive to invest in mining shares today and await new asicminer. Mining shares are in greedy bubble and every bubble will burst one day.
PS: I am not shareholder and not personally connected with issuer of that share
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Hi,
Please excuse what is probably a naive question, but how is this different to Localbitcoins?
I don't see how you are performing the role of a secure escrow service, since you are not handling or able to guarantee the transfer of the fiat currency component of any deal - am i missing something? Does the escrow only protect the fiat-receiver in any deal? How do you guarantee the cash component of any deal is delivered in conjunction with BTC release? Does this rely on the honesty of traders admitting to having received cash transfers?
How will you resolve disputes if/when dishonest btc sellers do not acknowledge receipt of buyer funds, and subsequently request return of btc from escrow?
Do you plan any voluntary or enforced policy for vetting/verifying the identities of participants to help prevent fraud?
Re-reading my post it seems overtly negative, it was not initially intended as such, but I guess these are fundamental issues.
surely, we have thought about all those issues and how to prevent fraud... First of all, accounts will be verified. 2nd, we will in the start work on SEPA payments, so it is easily to get it proved with screenshot or notarized bank statesment, that payment was done. All those things are standard in EU banking system. For personal meeting and exchange of money personally, we have thought about prepare contract to be printed from website /2 copies, one for each side of transaction/ with user identification and signed. I think this is the best we can do to prevent and protect from any possible fraud. |
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i will pay today or tomorrow, waiting for my wire to bitstamp...
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50% of system shares are held by investors. We have to pay the costs from the remaining 50% of income. So, the investors get paid always, even the company is in a loss. It is highly probable, that we will be several weeks or months in the red numbers. Our dividend system is not based on a profit, but on revenue. About those topics... Markus is not so good in English, like you are probably not so good in French or German. And he is mostly into technical stuff, not financial. So sometimes it is pretty hard for those technical people to stay the course with investors, especially when it is in foreign language. That mistake will never happen again, I will speak about financial and investments. English is not my native language as well, so probably I will do some mistakes from time to time. It doesn´t mean that non-native English speakers are scammers. Are there any scammed user of bitcoin card? I guess no, but it is a habit to make everybody scammer or liar on this /and other/ forum. On the other side, like an investor I understand it, as I hate to be scammed too. So there is still a place for tought questions and doubts. Never fall in love with any share or business. What happened to "The Bitcoin Company" since its launch? Could you please provide some proof of legitimacy? The bitcoin company will be changed from DEAL DU JOUR next week, anyway, company exists from 2011, VAT number: FR00531563682 http://thebitcoincompany.co.uk/index.php/contact-us same details you can find here. |
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Get rid of the .com domain name. Domain of one of you competitors was stolen by the US agency as part of war against Liberty Reserve. Use .sk, SK-NIC is so incompetent that stealing of that would take years  we have other domains as well, like .sk, .ru etc. just need to use this like a proxy, main domain is bitcoinbourse.eu. And we are not in any money transmitter business either, we don´t plan to make any fiat to btc and back payments... this is an escrow model. I know the story of libery reserve very well wrote a blog about it back in May http://blog.etrend.sk/martin-belobrad/2013/05/29/the-domain-name-has-been-seized/ |
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Under what conditions will a forced buyback be allowed? I think you should specify conditions when it can be done. Not only at what price.
- legal issues. if there is any situation, that we have to change the model due to some authority´s threats. Still, system share is not company share, there is not obligations to anything. But as I work for a company which incorporates in various countries, we would prefer to move the company very quickly and keep the system running like is planned if something like that happens. Still, we do not work with fiats at all, our system is bitcoin long, not effected by fiat money so much, only costs are in some parts in fiats for a hosting, advertising, programming. - offer to buy company. If there is any offer to take over our business, probably we will be not able to sell the company with that share system. Still, we didn´t think about it at all, just an option in long term view. 50% of system shares are held by investors. We have to pay the costs from the remaining 50% of income. So, the investors get paid always, even the company is in a loss. It is highly probable, that we will be several weeks or months in the red numbers. Our dividend system is not based on a profit, but on revenue. About those topics... Markus is not so good in English, like you are probably not so good in French or German. And he is mostly into technical stuff, not financial. So sometimes it is pretty hard for those technical people to stay the course with investors, especially when it is in foreign language. That mistake will never happen again, I will speak about financial and investments. English is not my native language as well, so probably I will do some mistakes from time to time. It doesn´t mean that non-native English speakers are scammers. Are there any scammed user of bitcoin card? I guess no, but it is a habit to make everybody scammer or liar on this /and other/ forum. On the other side, like an investor I understand it, as I hate to be scammed too. So there is still a place for tought questions and doubts. Never fall in love with any share or business. |
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Very interesting. But biggest problem of bitcoin exchanges has been security, and the statement "it's programmed in PHP" does not instill confidence in this area. Was the system built or at least reviewed by known expert, with quality penetration tests? For example, in Slovakia http://digmia.com/ offers such services, and it's led by bitcoin enthusiast. EDIT: I see Markus Weiler fits this role, misread it at first. And a question: How it is different or improved from bitcoin.de? Yes, Markus will take care of all testing, we should have all ready this month, so we will spend all September just with testing and language mutations. System is similar to bitcoin.de, but it is not limited for German market, limited amount of funds traded a year, month etc. If you noticed, a lof of changed when bitcoin.de "merged" with Fidor Bank. We would like to create the biggest European system, later expand to Russia and ex-USSR plus Middle East countries. We have a lot of plans for future, but it is not right time to show our cards yet, first step is what we wrote in prospectus. |
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www.bitcoinbourse.eu BITCOIN BOUSE/ is new trading system developed by French Bitcoin SARL Trading system works like a secure escrow service, where Bitcoin Bourse/ holds and freezes bitcoins until successful transaction is finished between seller and buyer. Each user gets temporary bitcoin address to fund his account with bitcoins. User can sell his coins to any user, who accepts his ASK rate, or to any user whom BID rate seller accepts. Transaction could be done by following ways: 1. When buyer accepts the ASK rate, he sends money from his bank account to the seller. When seller confirms the receipt of money, buyer receives bitcoins from our trading system to his account. Or when seller accepts the BID rate of buyer, buyer sends his money to the bank account of the seller. 2. Buyer and seller can do the transaction in person. This means that buyer or seller can search for a person from his area. If they find one and accept the rate, trading system will freeze bitcoins, buyer and seller meet in person and exchange money for bitcoins. After confirmation of transaction bitcoins are sent to the buyer account. Trading system has not any trading fees for buying and selling of bitcoins. Trading system generates income from funding the account and from the payout of the funds. There is a fee of 1% of the bitcoins deposit into the escrow and 1% fee from the payout of bitcoins from escrow. Total there is 2% fee of deposit and payout of bitcoins into trading system. SYSTEM SHARES IPO BITCOINBOURSE/ offers investors exclusive right to participate from the system fees. IPO of the system shares will start on 15.8.2013 at 20:00 CET /Central European time/. There are 100.000 system shares. 50.000 shares are held by Bitcoin SARL , 50.000 shares is available for investors. IPO price of system share is 0.1BTC for the first 10.000 shares. Early birds can buy only 10.000 system shares for this price. When the first 10.000 shares are sold, the price of the remaining 40.000 shares is 0.15BTC. IPO will end when all the shares are sold, at the latest when the trading system officially starts on 1.10.2013. Unsold shares will be kept by issuer and could be sold later for the market price. 50.000 shares hold by Bitcoin SARL and World Assets s.r.o., will be not sold during the first year of the existence of BITCOINBOURSE/BITCOINBURZA. System share has the right for a weekly dividend of 0.001% of the system fees. Every Sunday at midnight trading system counts all the fees obtained in the last week and pays a dividend of 0,001% for every system share. System shares can be freely trade within BITCOINBOURSE/ trading system for bitcoins or €. Pass-through system shares issued on other exchanges are not possible without written consent of BITCOINBOURSE/. SYSTEM SHARE BUYBACK BITCOINBOURSE/ has right to buy back system shares. To eliminate any doubts and speculations, shares are bought on the open market for the market price. Forced buyback of shares can be done for average daily closing price of system shares during the last month before forced buyback. PRELIMINARY ESTIMATES OF DIVIDENDS Trading system of BITCOINBOURSE/ has ambitions to become a major player in the market of buying and selling of bitcoins. Although it is difficult to estimate future income and financial projections, we prepared variants of the distribution of dividends based on the estimated turnover: Weekly turnover 2% fee Dividend per share Annual return (52 weeks) Annual return (%) 10 BTC 0.2 BTC 0.000002 BTC 0.000104 BTC 0.104% 100 BTC 2 BTC 0.00002 BTC 0.00104 BTC 1.04% 1000 BTC 20 BTC 0.0002 BTC 0.0104 BTC 10.4% 10000 BTC 200 BTC 0.002 BTC 0.104 BTC 104% 100000 BTC 2000 BTC 0.02 BTC 1.04 BTC 1040% PROMOTION Trading system will have very strong and intense promotion and advertising. BITCOINBOURSE/ will be promoted by following channels: - BitcoinAffiliate Network «TheBitcoinAffiliate.com », over 1.500.000 banner views in July 2013 and over 500 active Bitcoin related affiliates. - New´s website TheBitcoinNews «TheBitcoinNews.co.uk », over 700.000 visits in July 2013 - PPC and PPV advertising on google, facebook, bing, twitter etc. - Related websites, printed magazines and forums for bitcoins and crypto currencies - An event presentation throughout Europe focused on alternative investment, bitcoin and economy TECHNICAL DETAILS Trading system is programmed in PHP and will be hosted by Incloudibly – professional DDoS protected web hosting solutions from Switzerland. We will later launch application for smartphones. There will be multiple languages on the website to help everybody to select preferred language version. We prepare from the start following language versions: English, German, French, Czech, Slovak, Hungarian and Polish. Later we will add Spanish and Italian version and other languages will follow. VISION We would like to present competitive, secure and highly professional solution for buying and selling of bitcoins, especially in Europe. There is a plenty of potential for future growth and we would like to be helpful with the general adoption of virtual currencies. Although it is premature to estimate income for the several months after the launch of the system, we would like to get weekly turnover over 1.000 BTC till the end of 2013 and 10.000 BTC per week till the summer 2014. During the second year of existence we would like to get on 100.000 BTC and more in the next years. MANAGEMENT Markus Weiler has more than 15 year of experiences in various internet businesses. Currently living on French Côte d'Azur, Markus was involved many years in credit card and payment processing. He is skilled and experienced in website development (PHP, AJAX, MYSQL, LINUX) and search engine optimization (SEO). He has several years of experience in trademark and copyright issues and is active bitcoin investor, trader and consultant. He is leading a growing company offering bitcoin payment cards – www.thebitcoincard.co.uk. CONTACT: info@bitcoinbourse.eu
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XPM are flowing! I wish the XPMs mined could be 'bought' with the reinvestment fund @ current market and held by Ciphermine for a couple months. I expect significant XPM value appreciation. Dumping them now feels like an overall loss for everyone. Agree, but it's Kate's call and I like investing in a panoply of approaches representing the investment strategies of several unique, outstanding individuals. If you want to be long XPM, buy&hold them yourself, like me!  where is the best place to trade XPM? I use vircurex, but liquidity is not very shiny |
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This is a daytrader's dream though.
I made quite a bit of money already, as a simple amateur.
there is a difference between luck and skill anyway, congratulations, I am satisfied as well |
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one of the reason is also the price on btc in fiat money... it increased in last weeks from some 70 USD to over 100 USD, so it could be a reason to take profits in securities and change some funds into fiats. Even I do not do it personally, I understand it. There is also too much mining attempt and most of them sux. I guess maybe 1/3 of current mining securities could be successful, but we will see...
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The reason you need 3 million dollars, I'm guessing, is because that is the minimum capital required for a bank in Panama applying for an International License. What are your plans if your application is denied by the Superitendency of Banks of Panama? Are you familiar with the requirements for this type of license and have you started the process? Unless you have experience in banking, I think the odds are that you will be denied. http://www.superbancos.gob.pa/documentos_ing/laws_regulations/laws_regulations/licenses/acuerdo_3-2001.pdfAlso, are you aware that the issuance of bearer shares of any licensed bank in Panama is prohibited? I can't fault you for ambition, but have you actually retained counsel? There are many dodgy websites promising that you can easily "own your own bank in Panama" but that really doesn't seem to be the case anymore. Thank you for your reply and for doing your homework. We are based in Panama and several of our board members are directly involved in the Bank industry in Panama. We will not operate as a "Bank" and will not be regulated by the Superitendency of Banks of Panama as we will not lend out any of our customers funds or pay interest on account. Instead we will operate as a licensed Financial Service provider very much like a Stock Broker in the U.S that has the ability to handle third party funds and licensed as a in partnership with our local bank here in Panama. Our Banking platform will work on top of an existing Bank. We will just do all the leg work for AML/KYC/SAR separately so they don't have to. At least it is not any fancy "New Zealand financial company" |
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Rawted, I trade stocks in the FIAT / "real world" also. Which company has daily PR announcements? Apple often has radio blackouts before they announce something. Sure, some companies manipulate with rumors and leaks, but which companies have daily or even weekly announcements? An official press release from eASIC - what's the timeframe most people are allowing here? I'm aware Ken said a couple weeks, and from what I've heard from him and those close to him, he seems to really have his nose to the grindstone.
At what point do you begin losing confidence?
May I refer you to the first paragraph? Ken said a couple of weeks less than a week ago. I'd suggest that if you're even considering or questioning losing confidence at any point whatsoever before 2 weeks is up then you've over invested, not understood investment, or not quantified your risks? Investors need to be realistic. If you invest in a public company you don't get daily or weekly updates (unless they have some major PR machine/newsletter), and you certainly don't get the CEO responding personally to lots of forum messages. If you need constant reassurance or to constantly question what he's doing then you should sell some shares until your comfortable with Ken's plans and that he'll follow them through, or you shouldn't be investing at all. This is risk money, it isn't safe money. Ken needs to be left to get on with his job now. Should there be regular updates? Sure, but let's not have to find out what sandwich he is eating! It's mainly important to know when delays happen (there will be some) or when a schedule target is hit. The next target is at the end of next week tho is the sort of thing that could easily go on longer, so let's wait until then. I disagree completely. I get at least weekly updates on my fiat stock, and weekly updates here for all my crypto stock, yet Ken's responses are buried in a nondescript forum thread that really no one outside of those that have already stumbled upon it will know about. What's going on with the other 2 'slaughter' higher-ups? One is the coo/cfo (lol @ being both), the other is the VP of Market Operations. Since there is absolutely no forward progress going on, and since those two other people share the same last name, it would be easy to deduce that they are perfectly capable of providing updates, or at least be more communicative than Ken. I'm not trying to pry into anyone's life, but there is real world money invested here, and AMC/Activemining launch has been one mistake after another. How is it so hard to get a simple "we're doing great!" status message up on btct to pull in some of the many investment coins? Why are most of you fighting tooth and nail against any kind of accountability or efficiency? Where is the board? GAZPROM has daily news... and it is great, so much progress, cheap shares, almost monopol player in Europe in gas sector |
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I posted this in the other thread but people seem more concerned about whining about share tendering than actually discussing ActM:
Has anyone thought about how the recent rise in price to over $100/btc will affect paying the NRE? I think we will see positive news sooner than expected because Ken raised funds assuming ~$90/btc. Now it should be significantly easier to sell for that price or higher on Tradehill. He might even have $100-200k extra to speed up the expansion process further. The price is going to go through the roof!
That is a very good point! The extra money should easily cover the remaining expenses (if any still exist) for the Klondike boards and Avalon clones. some part of those funds could be return as a dividend to the shareholders... it could support the price |
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