Nobody has a crystal ball.  But like ass holes, everyone has an opinion.  And it is of *MY* opinion (and probably less popular because we're on a bitcoin promoted forum) that bitcoin exhibits all classic characteristics of a bubble market...AND COMBINED with the long string of negative press/fraud...will continue in its downward price trend until a) future investors shy away, b) current holders jump ship, and c) interest naturally dies down.

The euphoria phase of bitcoin is over, imo.  Same thing with Dogecoin.  But damn, those few months were crazy.  But that's what happens with bubbles.  Everyone starts talking about them like the 'next best thing in the history of mankind' and a frenzy ensues.

And unlike for certain recoverable bubble markets like the stock market and housing...bitcoin is not a necessity, but rather an alternative and luxury. 

The underlying basic tech of bitcoin may flourish under another new improved infrustructure/name down the road, but I think Bitcoin in itself has seen its best days, and lost grasp of its reigns in a downward spiral once the Mt. Gox debacle first hit.  It's in an unrecoverable phase, ironically akin to the excuses the scamming exchange operators give.  

With technology, there is often a very small window of opportunity to turn boom or bust.  And unfortunately with Bitcoin, the bad news just kept piling up and public perception went to the wayside with it.  About the only ones still raving over it are holders hoping to save face or in denial.

Again...since reading comprehension seems to be a difficult chore for some: the underlying premise/technology of bitcoin may have a future, but Bitcoin itself is (in my opinion) headed towards a fate of obscurity and an afterthought.  

Much like plasma tv's succumbed to LED's...so will Bitcoin.  

In my opinion, there will probably be some sort of government issued digital currency that will take its reigns and gain true widespread adoption.  I know people shudder at the mere mention of crypto currencies and government...but in the end, they are the real ones that have both the financial and advertising means to take the technology to the next level of adoption.


Disagree if you will. But those are my thoughts.

.io domain registration? check

15 dollar wordpress template? check


Yeah.  I think I'll pass.

That was a generalized statement to the pattern of the majority of all cryptos until now.

Artificial/unhealthy exponential growth spurt over a very short period of time followed by a swift crash.  It's the exact pattern of a bubble chart.

Are you not capable of looking at the bitcoin charts and the bubble chart I noted earlier?  And are you able to refute how its 2 month 1000% rise and subsequent halving in value 3 weeks later was anything but 'organic?'

I'd honestly love to hear this.  I'll go and grab my popcorn now.

Bingo.  Completely agree with this.


Jbreher: I agree with some of your points, though to me (may not be the same for all) it seems like you're trying to downplay the greater issue by staking blame of risk vs. reward at the end user when most have been essentially robbed blind without recourse.  Or are we all to just 'expect the worst' in the crypto community when entrusting our bitcoins in transactions?

p2p? I've combed over that multiple times in other posts.  It's no different.  You're still putting your trust in another faceless entity over the internet with no verifiable name/address/location.  Go through an escrow? Lol.  What if the escrow packs of shop once they've hit personal economic hardship?

This is the biggest problem facing bitcoin, in my personal opinion.  You keep saying I'm blaming the technology.  No, I'm not.  I'm blaming the people who are using it, because the motives thus far have been anything but charitable.

What good is fiat without banks?  Or are we all to just hoard coins in our personal computers and let them collect dust while maintaining a 'wait and see/trust no one' approach?  I'm sure that's the entire point of bitcoin, right? To just hoard and remain stagnant. 

You're multiple post rebuttal was basically agreeing with me.  Exchanges have no verifiable identities.

Now.  The greater question: how do YOU suppose bitcoin should be transacted/traded? I mean, if none of these exchanges are trustworthy, what other alternatives are there?  Or is that not an option whatsoever?

No.  Organic growth over a 4 year period /= a 1000% skyrocket in price in under 2 months, then a subsequent drop of over 50% in less than 3 weeks.  I suggest you present both market charts to a professor of economics at a local university for verification on how asinine your comparison is.

It's obvious this is going nowhere, as you don't understand the basic fundamentals of market conditions...and are just reaching for straws.

The shiller will always shun away constructive criticism/reality.  This is no real surprise.

Keep living in your perfect world, though.  Seems like it's doing you a lot of good up 'til now.  After all, we all know technology thrives/grows when it's never amended or improved.  Just let it rot stagnant and it all will be gravy!

Reading is fundamental, and apparently you suck at it.

Please re-read my OP.  I said bitcoin as a technology has so much advantages in its premise.  It's just fallen into the wrong hands.


And please enlighten me: how exactly is bitcoin supposed to flourish and grow when every single one of its exchanges goes belly up?  Is everyone just supposed to do peer to peer transactions doing FS/Wanted trade threads on forums?

Agreed.  This is a vital requirement or these scams will continue happening.  Guaranteed.

Why do you think actual fiat banks around the world are able to work?  Because they are physical entities with verifiable employees/assets.  Additionally, most are FDIC insured.  Meaning, should the absolute worst case happen, they are backed by the federal government and all your funds would be replenished should they go bottom up or robbed.

This is a fundamental flaw in the bitcoin banking system.  The anarchists will claim 'BUT HAVING REAL NAMES AND REAL PEOPLE GOES AGAINST THE TRANSPARENCY OF CRYPTOS!'  No.  You can't have it both ways.  Either you have accountability or you get taken to the cleaners.  The 'blind trust' system never works on the internet.  Never has.  Never will.

Is that we are dealing with faceless entities over the internet and entrusting them with hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of our hard earned money.

Has anyone ever stopped to think how ridiculous it is that we actually put our faith and send money blindly to a most likely foreign operation ran by members known merely by an internet screenname?  I mean how damn professional is it knowing that a good majority of these exchanges are owned by teens and mid to late 20's Russians simply known as 'XxShadowRoguexX' or 'SysOp69_4u.'  With no physical company building or readily verifiable business location.  Well.  Let me rephrase that.  Even having a physical location such as Mt. Gox didn't stop Mr. Karpeles from cleaning out shop.

Step back for a second and think about this.  Do you think a company such as Apple or Samsung could just get away with being ran by anonymous CEO's that simply go by an internet screenname?

Bottom line is there's zero sense of accountability.  Which is precisely the reason why they're able to scam...and keep scamming.  Because they can make up any bullshit excuse they want and follow the crowd by saying they were 'hacked'...and there's nothing we can do about it.

And this is precisely the reason why I believe bitcoin will ultimate fade into the sunset of obscurity along with failed techs like tablet pc's and palm pilots.   Could another, better tech supplant it in the future? Possibly.  But as of now, it is nothing more than a haven for scammers, and has fell into the wrong hands.  Assuredly the same exact hands Mr. Nakamoto feared.

For every arbitrary youtube vid/article you quote in your one-sided shill argument, I could quote another 10 negative articles outlining why this is no more than a speculative bubble that will soon collapse.

Look.  I'm not doubting that the bitcoin fundamentals were quite impressive.  In an 'idealistic' society, it would have flourished 10-100 fold by now, and perhaps been the next 'tablet computer' of payment processing.

However, majority of the technology fell into the wrong hands, casting a negative cloud over it that could not and cannot be remedied.

Every single one of the biggest and supposedly most trusted exchanges all go down due to hacks/scams...new coin ipo scams galore, and basically every other perspective new start up involving some form of scamming in one way or another.

Then there's Silkroad 1 and 2. 

I'm not even going to include the amount of p2p scamming that goes on on an individual basis on forums either. 

With all this negative press, do you think any new large scale corporations are going to actually spend time and money to implement it? Come on dude, this is common sense.  Take off your rose colored blinders.  Without new adoption...it's going nowhere...unless you're happy with just trading worthless coins to joe bloe in India like hoarding Farmville money...maybe that's your thing.

You're in denial man.  It's a burning/sinking ship..and it will take you down with it.  So be it though.  So long as you're 'happy' with the fundamentals, it shouldn't matter if you lose every penny you spent, amirite? That's a great way of looking at things though  

The overtly optimistc/blind will defend these guys til they burn down to the ground.


IMO, all these supposed 'hacks' of exchanges were nothing more than inside jobs.  Gox, Cryptorush, Coinex, Mintpal, Bitstamp...the list goes on forever.  This is stolen money..and the owners/scammers all just follow the same wordpress template during the situation:

*insert 'down for maintenance page'
*insert 'we have been attacked, please allow us time to address the issue' splash page message
*insert 'we assure your old funds are safe, please bear with us' update message
*insert 'we are terribly sorry but due to the losses we have to close up shop as we are insolvent' finality message, as you strung along users for over a month with enough time to flee your native country, change your legal name, and enjoy your millions you scammed from your own users 



At least with Mintpal, they admitted it.  But at the same time, after reading that whole fiasco, even that seems a bit shady because it's 2 owners deferring blame to a rogue member.  And I have heard zero updated on the court proceedings that supposedly started 3 months ago (and nobody has even verified or attended it)...to which they even raised a good 5 digits worth of bitcoin charity for their supposed prosecution money.

Ridiculous lol.

Did you really just compare the organic 4 year price increase of the largest corporation in terms of consumer electronics sales worldwide to a 24 month bubble spike chart of a speculative new tech named bitcoin?  

Like, I'm honestly not sure if you're being serious or not.

Lol.  This is hopeless.

You are the primary reason why most bitcoin and altcoin 'investors' get hosed.  Because they have no idea how markets really work.  They just see dollar signs and jump on the first hypes of 'TO DA MOOOON!!!!!!'

Nope.  The Bitstamp price drop hasn't even happened yet. This looks bad.

I'm simply stating every digital currency created up til this point has suffered the same exact pattern of an artificial pump and dump bubble.  Not one of them hasn't.  Whether from the actual coin creators or investors, all have been whored to death and then promptly dropped like a 5 dollar hooker.

I'm not claiming to know the future.  But I also base my opinions on facts, and trends.  And as of right now, the price trends/charts/and all the recent fraud news does NOT bode well for any crypto, bitcoin included.

As an owner of over 4btc (far from a fortune, but it's still money) and having lost over 8 btc on various exchange thefts, I wish this was not the case.  But it's really disgusting how dark the bitcoin community has gotten.  It's a sesspool of fraud and manipulation...which are the exact things that will run it to the ground and prevent it from gaining true mainstream adoption.

I was out the loop for about a month and a half.

Wow, did not realize Mintpal had gone the scam route as well.  Amazing.  I thought they were the one and only true trustable exchange since they had info and not an anonymous server domain registration.

But I guess that doesn't matter?

Not sure I'm catching your analogy.

Are you refuting what I'm saying that every single digital currency has been pumped and dumped and never fully recovered...all exhibiting the same market bubble long term trend? If so, I'd LOVE to hear your analysis to the contrary.

I don't think the problem is security..it's the admins/ceo's stealing the money.

Although your username is pretty hilarious and troll-esque, it's hard to argue against any of your points.


Pump and dump? Check.

Same exact trend has happened to every other alt coin in the history of mankind.  

Doge, Aurora, Lite, Black, Dark, NXT, Vert...you name it, it's suffered the same fate.  Started dirt cheap, rose astronomically 100-100,000% within a matter of hours/days...then crashed hard to the floor as the pumpers realized profits and moved on.

Bitcoin so far has been no different.  Check and compare the long term charts of all these digital currencies.  And none of them have ever come back to realize their initial pump and dump prices.  None.  Matter of fact, most have gone on to become worth basically a milli fraction of what they used to be...or completely vanished altogether.

The entire bitcoin/altcoin game just seems like a virtual game of monopoly by young techies and scammers.  It's been ridiculous for months now.  Sexcoin? Unobtanium? Pandacoin? Koinye?   I mean really...when you step back with a level head and really assess the situation, you'll see how ridiculous the entire thing has become.  It's a joke.    And the funny thing is, a good majority of these exchanges that have popped up are no different.  Young techie scammers with absolutely zero knowledge of how a business or corporation is run...yet it's so easy to feed off the others to buy in because they're even more desperate to turn a profit.   Create a decent looking homepage with a 25 dollar wordpress template, create some shill accounts, and write up an ANN thread and basically you'll have investors flocking like flies. 

All in all, bitcoin is a fun social and technological experiment, but so far it's mainly brought out the worst in people.  Greed. Which is the very exact thing it sought to combat with the corruption of fiat.  It's as bad and probably even worse especially when there is such low accountability when you're dealing with faceless people behind a laptop.

Is this how bitcoin execs pitch the technology to future adopters?