what do you do with everyones info you collect name and addresses and such? and I bought a ticket.. no red X on my number.. and the receipt I got in email was blank..  Did you get a blank receipt from bit-pay.com ? |
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Either they are orphaned or not. What does the eventually mean?
Ophan isn't instantaneous. The chain with the most hashing power will ALWAYS eventually the longest and orphan out any other competing chains. Eventually is a given but how low is subject to variance. Say one entity (A) has 51% hashing power. Everyone else is (B) and has a combined 49%. block #1000 is current block B builds a block #1001 (we will call it 1001B) If A builds the next block (1002A) it never risks being orphaned as long as it builds on the longest chain. If B builds the next block (1002B) and A decides to abandon the block it is working on and build on top of 1002B then the chain continues If B builds the next block (1002B) but A decides to continue its chain and publish 1002A then eventually 1002B will be abandoned. Maybe team "B" even gets lucky and builds 1003B, 1004B, 1005B. Sweet got 5 blocks despite A having 51%. The victory is short lived because the math is unavoidable. A has 51% of hashing power. The 1% is like house edge in a casino. Over a long enough chain of blocks A will build the longer chain and when that happens 1001B, 1002B, 1003B, 1004B & 10005B will all be orphaned. It is inevitable and unavoidable. It is the same dynamic in play with a 51% attack. 51% hashing power = 51% to 100% hashing power. The miner with 51% can choose how many blocks to oprhan and how much profit they want to make. So if B builds following blocks on chain A, it will create a valid block, meaning if B plays by the rules of A, it can still successfully mine blocks. Or not? Only if A changes the rules without including B, like in a 51% attack, then B would start producing orphans. But that comes back to the statement, that A could monopolize Bitcoin with 51% but doesn't need to. So D&T, are you assuming in your explanation, that A will eventually change the rules in his favor? |
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Yes the economy of BTC is currently growing by about the BTC creation rate.
While I do appreciate someone thinking about the growth of the BTC economy, I am curious as to how you got to this conclusion? Because if we just measure it by looking at transactions I would doubt that we get meaningful results, it's hard to tell from blockexplorer or blockchain. Likewise if we look at trading volumes at exchanges, they don't really reflect the size of the underlying bitcoin economy either. How did you measure or estimate BTC economic growth? |
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That was exactly the point of my question and again, afaik (and please educate me if that's wrong) orphans are not included into the block rate calculations, so the remaining 49% of valid and verified blocks produced will not all orphans. Of course I agree there will be a lot of orphans and mining efficiency of regular miners will suffer in the process.
If they all were orphans, a 51% miner had effectively 100%.
A 51% miner could have 100% of the generated blocks and 100% of block rewards. So yes a 51% miner effectively has 100%. Every block produced by the 49% would be orphaned out ( eventually). Either they are orphaned or not. What does the eventually mean? |
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Just out of curiosity, why do you have all these FPGA dev board makers (like Ztex and Trenz) in Germany and who are their customers outside of the Bitcoin world? I just can't imagine that they actually sold enough of these boards to make a living and pay taxes, company, etc... ? But then again, I know nothing about this market.
I get the feeling that a lot of people don't quite understand what FPGAs are exactly. That aside, I'm thinking that the Ztex guy(s) don't do this as their primary source of income. I'd hazard a guess to say that these guys are engineers who are doing this on the side (with the obvious exceptions). Yes, and I also think a lot of people that frequent message boards don't use search engines anymore  GIYF "fpga applications" Just from my own job: I'm in MRI Physics. Our MRI machines have numerous FPGAs in them each. Both for signal synthesis and processing. And I think GE is doing well enough with medical equipment? Our institution actually developed our own RF signal receiver and we used an FPGA that was originally designed for applications like radar. And the list goes on... Because FPGAs were there before Bitcoin and because they are produced in sufficiently high numbers for industry applications, they are economically feasible for Bitcoin mining at this point at all. Not the other way round. Edit: FPGA development boards by themselves would not be economically self-sustainable IMHO, they are there to develop a mass produced FPGA application. Bitcoin certainly gave the sales for those boards a boost. |
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And if the 51% miner chooses to monopolize bitcoin, many people that came here for the freedom of currency will not accept the monopolist as their new fed printing money and look for something else.
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If they are telling the truth, well... is it time to start an orphanage? Blocks from the 49% are going to need a home.
Why? Isn't the difficulty (and hence the network share) calculated from the valid block rate only? As long as you play by their fricking rules then, your 49% of blocks are still valid, like is receiving money from the mob or the fed. I'm just making a joke. Vlad will only build off his own blocks. Everyone else will not be able to mine a single valid block. They will just make worthless orphans... Thus the need for an orphanage. That was exactly the point of my question and again, afaik (and please educate me if that's wrong) orphans are not included into the block rate calculations, so the remaining 49% of valid and verified blocks produced will not all orphans. Of course I agree there will be a lot of orphans and mining efficiency of regular miners will suffer in the process. If they all were orphans, a 51% miner had effectively 100%. Sorry Vladimir, this was slightly off-topic, considering your latest reply. |
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I never said it was a currency.  As you can see I was simply providing some calcs on the raw numbers. In that case, just carry on  You seem a bit put out because I didn't want to divide by the estimated growth rate. We'd simply arrive back at the start with a net inflation rate equalling the US rate at somewhere around 3 to 10%. AFAICT, more accurate data about the growth can't be gained without somehow separating real growth from various kinds of speculation. Even if we conservatively take CPI inflation to be 10%, and let's say two thirds of the supposed growth is speculative, that's still over 8% real, non-speculative growth for the Bitcoin economy... Don't know about you but I'm impressed. Not put at all. I'm simply asking if you are comparing your rate to the "US rate" to state the conditions of your comparison properly. If someone is talking about inflation nowadays, currency inflation comes to mind first. And that comparison is still flawed without taking economy into account for calculations. Normalizing by economic value is not cheating for a currency as it is really relative to its purchasing power. Now you are taking the CPI at 10% (that's 2.6 times a value decrease over 10 years)? Cheese, where do you get that shit? I guess SGS. Their numbers as I pointed out somewhere before are just as skewed as the CPI, just the other way round; the truth is probably somewhere in between. |
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U.S dollar inflation rate is more like 8%, the government statistics are fucked up.
And I remember my $$$ purchasing power (in relation to my income and living situation) was surely not 2.5 times higher 12 years ago, so that number is just as skewed as the CPI. |
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If they are telling the truth, well... is it time to start an orphanage? Blocks from the 49% are going to need a home.
Why? Isn't the difficulty (and hence the network share) calculated from the valid block rate only? As long as you play by their fricking rules then, your 49% of blocks are still valid, like is receiving money from the mob or the fed. |
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I never said it was a currency. As you can see I was simply providing some calcs on the raw numbers. In that case, just carry on Compensating for a "change in value of Economy" is essentially cheating ...
In case of a currency I would argue that statement is outright false, as a currency can only be seen in the context of its economy. But since you never said you are talking about a currency the debate about that is open... |
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This is not at all how currency inflation is calculated. You forgot to include the economy in this calculation.
There's generally two ways people calculate inflation/deflation:
(Change of Money Supply) / (Change of Value of Economy)
or
Change of CPI
Both take the economy into account.
The economy is hard to estimate at this point. And since (this has been discussed up and down now) Bitcoin is generally treated a commodity (or incorporeal hereditament), the inflation term how you calculated it is even more meaningless.
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you can always try your luck gambling That's one thing I would discourage you from. Granted, once you have digital currency it's easy to spend it at a blink, the sites usually don't ask a lot of questions either where it came from. But if you are paying gambling debts with gold, then you must be pretty desperate. Bitcoin might not be real gold, but look at the interest rates being paid in the lending forums, and look at the low prices in the market place (people basically sell stuff at manufacturers/wholesale prices, even if they paid more for it, and often throw in free shipping on top), you must be quite a fool to gamble it away. If you think you have plenty, then invest somewhere, or buy some FPGA miners if it pleases you, but think about what you could be gaining in the bitcoin economy before gambling with it. And if you like risk, speculate on it (there's a forum for that); once you get into it this is more fun than gambling but you can go as risky as you want, if you seek the thrill. |
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When exactly can we expect to see our purchases in our mailboxes?
Already got my copy. It's a great read. Seriously? When did you get it and where are you located (I mean are you in the US)? |
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^^This + use the purchased bitcoins to invest in some finds on GLBSE.
Right, the next step would be to put your coins to work. Either buy stuff or invest in some way. |
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...or go to exchanges and buy BTC.
I mean, when I used to travel to foreign countries in the old days (now I just take my credit card) I used to exchange some funds to the local currency.
So go to MtGox or Intersango, get a Dwolla account for currency transfer (or if you hold an account in an European country use SEPA to Intersango) and buy some BTC with fiat currency.
I'm by no means endorsing these exchanges, there are many more you can use.
Easy as that.
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When exactly can we expect to see our purchases in our mailboxes?
While I don't expect to get an exact date, I'm curious too: When do you expect to ship the Bitcoin magazine (specifically in the US)? |
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Is MM still mining, and if so, is he still extending his mining /or botnet operation?
Doesnt look like it: Network hashrate is still at ~11-11.5GH excluding the badluck, I dont think that Mystery miner is gone unless some other mysterious 1-1.5TH user replaced him. You are looking at the 1 TX blocks, its pretty obvious that is gone but the hashrate isnt. Oh I forgot to post that I fixed my software patch: I'm working on a patch that solves block hashes analytically without requiring to brute-force SHA. Then, you simply set the blocktime variable to the desired value and off you go.
I'm in the testing phase right now, set it to 1 block per hour, just to make sure I won't destabilize the bitcoin enterprise, but I still need to add tx to the equation; people seem to get uncomfortable with all these zero tx blocks right now.
Well, once I fixed that I will offer the patch for just $9.95 to everybody!
Just not sure if I'm ready to make it available to the public yet |
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So, ask for a small loan at interest free then be a good modelled citizen and repay and earn street cred.
Next time ask for much higher loan and dissappear ?
Good one, that's why I see more merit in making some kind of donation instead of taking a 2 BTC loan to hold for a few days. Well, let's see what those 2 BTC will do the next few days: http://blockchain.info/address/1BftWpsY7UMWaUUwXJrKq8rwKQZcadNz1U |
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Matthew: USSR was socialism/communism. USA before creation of the Federal Reserve system was capitalism. Today under Obama it is more socialism. Nazism was socialism. (Hitler's party was the National Worker's Union). You have many concepts confused. Socialism is evil as well, but Sharia is militant and Socialism is philosophically evil. Left or right, democrats or republicans -- their title doesn't matter. What matters is what they say, and what they stand for in their actions.
To others -- I have stated my postiion and will not debate further in this forum -- the information is out there in the links I posted, and you can debate there on each of those points. My point of posting it here was pertaining to bitcoin and the hypocrisy of such a use: defending freedom and financing murder is a contradiction.
First socialism is not equal communism. Second, I was just waiting when you would call upon Godwin's law, and here it is! Wow on the second page, that was fast! |
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