Except for one thing. The definition of "science."

Within the definition of science as it is defined among scientists, is science theory. Science theory might seem to be fact, it might have lots of evidence, but it is not fact necessarily. When science theory is heralded and believed to be fact, when it is known that it might not be fact, it becomes religion. And in that way science is religion.

Mwahahahahaha!   Talk about smoking weed.

Hostile environment!? Hehehe. How many species of life are there on earth? Thousands, maybe millions. Even if we set off all our nukes at strategic locations, at least many forms of microbes and plant life, and probably some animal life, would survive.

Shoot, the weed you are smoking really IS gooood.

It was a U.S. government remote controlled miracle - two humongous drones.   

So that's why you don't reply much. You are tired.

What do you mean by "god of the gaps?" Do you think that it is ignorance of what you mean by "god of the gaps" that this user appeals to?



Of course lack of knowing very much of anything doesn't prove that the God of the universe exists. It is the knowing part that proves God exists.

Science shows us that cause and effect, complex universe, and universal entropy exist together in this universe. Since they exist together in the same universe as they do, God must exist. If God didn't exist, one or more of these 3 facts would have to not exist, as well.

As it is, cause and effect almost prove that God exists all by itself. The fact that we don't know much about God through scientific observation, doesn't suggest that He doesn't exist.

I just did a search through the whole Bible. I didn't find the word "cherry" even once.   

Atheism is a religion for this simple reason, if nothing else. Science and nature have proven that God exists. Atheism has not proven God does not exist. When atheism sets itself up against the facts in the light of having no facts to sustain itself, it is calling itself "God" in one way or another. Perhaps this would not be so if the point were not regarding God. This makes atheism a religion of non-religion, a self-contradictory religion.



Okay. The only thing that I was trying to prove is, that I am not trying to prove anything. Sounds like I might have proven it to you.

Check #6 of the definition of "religion" at http://www.dictionary.com/browse/religion?s=t. Everyone is religious. Perhaps people in a coma are most religious, being adamantly stuck in the way they think.

Let me use the example of our legal laws in the United States. When you read the laws, they mean what they say. Over and over courts and judges have taken little pieces of previous court cases, and interpreted what the actual words say, to be applied to their particular new court case.

Regarding the Bible, while it might be difficult to understand what is being said regarding literal and metaphorical, usually the explanation is right in front of us. For example, if the Bible says something like, "I saw what looked like a ...," the wording itself is stating that the following parts are figurative. They state it in the words "look like." Then, when you watch the punctuation for a new thought, and it says something like, "Then I saw an angel coming down...," there is a change from the figurative to the literal.

Unfortunately, God is so much greater than we are, that His operations can barely be made simple enough for us to understand. For example, playing chess is relatively easy. Knowing how to win or at least draw from every "play" is not so easy. We are finding that computers can be built to beat even the greatest chess masters, in every game. So, why would we think that we can understand everything that God says in a universe that is many times more complex than a chess game?

The point about the Bible is, there is that which is literal, and can be understood by almost anyone. There is part that is figurative and can be understood by almost anyone. But there are going to be parts that will not be understood easily, and maybe a few that will not be understood at all, but are there just to show the greatness of God.

Is there anything that people do NOT know? Does everyone know everything? Silly questions, right?

Our knowledge, knowledge that is absolute fact, is a fraction of that which is available to know. As we gather knowledge little by little, we ofter formulate many opinions about that which we have found out.

Why should we wait around for science to tell us the details about God? Most of these details will forever be something that science will not be able to discern, anyway. Rather, now that science and nature have shown us that God exists, let's look for things that God has been telling us. Let's understand the logic of them, rather than waiting around for the next hundred thousand years until science can tell us a little.

This is what Christianity is all about. It is about God talking to us, showing us things that we could never find out through science, so that we have the opportunity to gain eternal life in peace and joy, a thing that science might never be able to prove in a million years, even though it is the absolute truth.

Consider Revelation 9:6:
Revelation is a little bit difficult to understand. Some of it is literal, and some figurative. Some of it talks about the future, some about the past, some about all times.

Some scholars consider that the above passage refers to the next age... the New Heavens and the New earth "time," which is also the Lake of Fire "time," which is the time of the eternal hereafter.

Personally, while I am not entirely decided, I think the above passage talks about a present universe time that is coming up shortly. I think that God will allow modern research to discover a method whereby people can medicate themselves in some marvelous way, so that they live indefinitely.

What might this indefinite life include? It might include the ability to grow new limbs where old ones are lost. It might include the capability to increase the abilities of certain organs to do their job and function, such as night-sight in those who opt for it. It might include something as complex as short-distance telepathy.

Modern science and medical research is already a ways into developing some of these things. Consider, for example, the M1 and M2 "genes." Deactivate the M1, and you automatically live 50% longer, provided you can deactivate it simultaneously throughout your whole system. Control the switching on and off of the M2 gene, and your cells will continue to divide indefinitely in a good way.

The M1 and M2 gene controls are coming. They need to be absolute controls, or there will be side effects. But the knowledge of these genes and some of their operations have been around for more than two decades. And the controls are coming. These genes are only two little research areas that might free people from death when they are finally controlled.

The point is, Moloch would be one of those who would opt for this kind of life-without-end. It might be available to him within his lifetime. This means that nobody would be able to tell for sure when Moloch's self-destruction would actually finalize. Of course, it would be set in place - and maybe is already - because he might have already locked himself irreversibly into his resistance against God.

Moloch's actual destruction would, then, come at the Judgment Day. Jesus tells us that nobody knows exactly when that time will be... the time of His return.

A thought regarding the Revelation passage above: Will there ever come a time that people will want to die, but won't be able to? Almost nobody really wants to die. But a few people have been in such great pain or trauma that they have thought that they wanted to die, and have wished for it.

Imagine that you are medicated to live indefinitely, and that you actually cannot die because of it. Imagine that you remain alive through the pain and trauma of a Mexican drug cartel, or an ISIS dismembering. Imagine that you are burned in a literal fire, and wherever your molecules go, you remain alive with them, feeling the pain of complete "dissolution" without any way to stop it. Imagine riding yourself out like that, within a nuclear blast.

As things stand right now, nobody comes back from true death, even though doctors may seem to bring people back from death now and again. Now, think about the pain that you have when you get a cut on your finger. Or, remember the pain of a broken bone that you had in the past. We don't know for a scientific fact that dead people are not experiencing total-body pain through all time to come after they die. What would it be like if the doctor could fix you to live forever, bodily, even if you were totally obliterated?

Of course you love it... destruction.


Fits you so well. If I am sinning slightly, I will be forgiven. You, however, have a long way to go to be removed from destruction.



Both sets of commandments are listed in the Torah. The emphasis lies not in the legalistic use of the law, but in loving obedience... love for God first, and then love for your fellow people.

Your self-destruction is closing in on you.

Thank you... I think.

This stuff is written in the Bible. The Bible scholars have said and showed the parts of it for hundreds of years, even if they haven't put them together quite the way that I have.

However, even if I am wrong in some of what I think, the basics of Jesus salvation, the New Heavens and the New Earth, the lake of fire, the enemies of God including Satan and the people who side with him against God going into the lake of fire, are among many simple truths that are expressed in the Bible.

Be among those who are saved.

Isaiah 14: On the day the LORD gives you relief from suffering and turmoil and cruel bondage, you will take up this taunt against the king of Babylon Moloch:

Of course it is the case. Look at it this way and understand.

God created Satan to be one of the good angels at or before the Beginning. He was third highest in Heaven at that time. Figuratively speaking, Satan walked in the same places where God walked, right with God. He learned the things of God. God gave him power and majesty and beauty unrivaled by any.

Because of his beauty and majesty that God gave him, Satan corrupted himself. He became conceited. He wanted to be better than God. He thought he could be better than God. But to start to be better than God, he needed to create something to be at least as good as God. What could he create that God hadn't created already, just so that he could create something, just so that he could start to show that he was as good as God?

There was only one thing that God had not created. And it is a relatively easy thing to create. It was just the thing that Satan needed so he could say that he created something. What was it? It was destruction. Satan created destruction.

Make a car from scratch. A car is something very difficult to make from scratch. You have to mine the ore for the metal, and then smelt it down. You have to melt the various sands for the glass. But before you can do any of this, you have to have the knowledge and the design.

Once you have gone through painstaking detail and made a car - say a Mercedes Benz - it doesn't take long to destroy it. All it takes is a couple of muscle guys with a couple of sledge hammers and a couple of hours of work, and you have destroyed the car quite well.

With the knowledge that he had learned while walking in the presence of God in the "old days," Satan wrought destruction. His destruction destroyed a third of the laws of the universe - the dragon's tail swept a third of the stars from the sky and flung them to the earth. He thought this would be sufficient to easily bring down the whole universe. But it didn't work.

God upheld the universe through Jesus and the work Jesus would do (and finally did) on the cross. The universe is being upheld long enough for God to find His people in it, and bring them out of it to Himself. God's purpose is to take His own people from this universe, and to place them in the New Universe He is creating, and then finally to let this old universe go to destruction forever.

The devil created destruction, but God is a far better master of it. Since Satan wanted destruction, God will GIVE it to him, at the time when He finishes Satan's work of destruction that Satan started in this universe. It will be called the lake of fire, and will be an eternal smelting down of this whole universe (including Satan) into its component parts for reuse by God beyond eternity.

Creation is like Moloch's computer. Moloch sits down at his keyboard and creates posts for the forum. He designs them with reasonable care. He artistically places all the words in their correct places. Then he posts them. They are his works of art, his creations.

What if Moloch's words had a life of their own? What if the things he was attempting to say with his creative words, was corrupted because the words took on their own life and changed themselves into things that they wanted rather than what Moloch wanted? What if this happened with almost all of his words? What would Moloch do?

Would Moloch, out of love for the good things the words could say, give the words a second chance to turn back to be as he created them? How many chances would he give them? How long would it take before Moloch erased the batch of his rebellious words, and wrote new words in their place? And how long would he put up with the new words when they rebelled like the old?

Would Moloch ever fall in love with the words so that he would be designing them for their own good? Or would he always be simply doing it for his own pleasure?

How long would it take Moloch before he got a new keyboard? And if he found that getting a new keyboard didn't help, how long would it take before he reloaded the OS on his computer? Or maybe he would get a new computer, and completely trash his old one.



God created the universe for His own purpose and pleasure. Part of His pleasure was the good of the people He made in it. The people rebelled and corrupted the artistic and perfect universe God created. God loved the idea of what His creation could be so much that He gave the people a second chance, and many second chances.

The second chances that God gave and gives the people came and come through Jesus, the Christ, who was called the Messiah by the Jews of the Old Testament. The second chances started in the Garden of Eden after the first two people rebelled against God. God promised the Messiah at that time, the Christ, Who found His fulfillment in Jesus, the Savior.

What does science know? Science even tries to hide the fact that it has proven the existence of God! And atheism attempts to keep the knowledge of God hidden.

How long would it take science to find out about Jesus salvation through methodical seeking of all science? Most of the greatest minds of scientific people are not focused on finding the truth of God. Rather, they are continually attempting to prove that God doesn't exist, in the face of the scientific proof that He does exist.

If science ever expanded enough that they had an actual time viewer, and they took a look into the past to see what had happened in history, would they ever admit to the existence of God when they saw Him? Or would they continue to corrupt themselves just like the created words in Moloch's computer corrupted themselves?

God gives the best laws to mankind, but man seeks to ignore God. Failing that entirely, man seeks to express that God's laws aren't just, and aren't the best. And mankind gets old and dies in the process, but just can't seem to grab hold of the eternal life that God offers, even when it is paraded right in front of him.

There is no hope for man without the hope of God working in and through mankind. But if mankind continues to reject, there will come a time that God will get a new keyboard, reload the OS, and even - finally - throw out the old computer for a new one.

Turn to God while you have a chance. Turn to the Son, Jesus, the Christ, for salvation at the time that God throws out the old, useless, rebellious computer. Turn from your rebellion so that you can be loaded into the new computer rather than being thrown out with the old, "... where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth," and, "where their worm does not die, and the fire is not quenched."

Even if science unlocks the secret to life with potentially no death, the end of the old computer is still near.

You've lost track of the thread. It seems you like it that way, because you won't stop lying about me.   

Trumpy Drumpfy sat on a wall.
Trumpy Drumpfy had a great fall.
All the king's horses and all the king's men,
Couldn't put Trumpy back together again.

Why not? Because the people don't have or need a king. Especially not Trumpy.

Google Drumpfy.

Well, you know better.

The point is, God is proven to exists, in very easy manner. Why won't you accept the truth? If it bothers you to call complex universe a scientific law, don't, since it is a fact no matter what you call it.

Is it your honor? Have you decided to ignore the truth just because I say it? How silly of you if you do this.

However, it is completely okay if you don't state that you understand that God exists to me or the people in this forum. But DO accept Him in your heart, and find out about Him, for your own good.

Since you haven't explained what your "it" is, there is no way I can answer your questions.

The scientific laws of cause and effect, complex universe, and universal complexity, when combined, prove that God exists. Cause and effect almost does it alone.

Why is it that you would rather remain in ignorance? After all, since the proof is there, God exists. Work with God rather than trying to stick your head in the sand, hoping that He won't see you. You are much better off acknowledging Him and His greatness than trying to hide it from yourself.

After all, He essentially came and told you face to face through the science that proves He exists. Why should He do more for you, since you won't accept facts?