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3321  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: Public STATEMENT Regarding Bitcoinica account hack at MtGox on: July 26, 2012, 06:57:29 AM

There's no reason that I'd forgo my integrity and all the reputation for just $200,000 at such a young age. I was working very hard for my new project (and a new homepage design will be deployed today) and it's simply outside my attention to commit such a thing.

I'll commit any reasonable effort to get justice back.

Now, if you really are innocent, you seem to have exercised very poor judgement about pretty much everything.(your friend, not taking advice of security professionals, etc) And if you're cleared, you still have the reputation of high integrity, but nobody would ever trust you because you lack wisdom. (At least, I wouldn't)

Meh. Wisdom comes with age.  If Zhou has made mistakes which have made it possible for someone else to perpetrate this crime (a suggestion I make only because my own children share way too much information with others without thinking about how it might be used), I doubt he'll still be making them by the time he's 30.  Throughout all of this, Zhou has acted with great maturity at some times and like a petulant teenager at others - which is to be expected.  If he's found innocent of any wrong-doing, this isn't going to haunt him in the long term.
3322  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: Public STATEMENT Regarding Bitcoinica account hack at MtGox on: July 26, 2012, 06:30:21 AM
Zhou, whether you're innocent or guilty you need to get a lawyer and shut the fuck up.  There is no way in which continuing to post here regarding this incident can possibly benefit you at this time.

You posted the other day that what you feared most from the Bitcoinica clusterfuck was criminal charges which would affect your future.  That's now a distinct possibility, so stop worrying about arguing with people on the internet and spend your time and energy on engaging a lawyer who can help you defend yourself against these accusations.  This isn't a game.
3323  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: Public STATEMENT Regarding Bitcoinica account hack at MtGox on: July 26, 2012, 06:07:46 AM
Its hard to say which jurisdiction will handle this . Interpol?

Interpol is just a clearing house which co-ordinates co-operation between the law enforcement agencies of different nations.  Jurisdiction would belong to the nation from which the crime is deemed to have been committed or to have taken place (where there are multiple jurisdictions involved, one place can cede jurisdiction to another).

Jurisdiction doesn't become an issue until a criminal investigation has been conducted.  Mt Gox is the only party so far which acknowledges having filed a police report.  I suspect that the release of this information will prompt people to file reports with the appropriate computer crime units in their own countries (I know one person had already reported the Bitcoinica hacks to the DoJ in the US).  It's those law enforcement agencies who'll determine if any charges are laid and where.

It would certainly be wise for Zhou to retain a lawyer at this point.
3324  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: Public STATEMENT Regarding Bitcoinica account hack at MtGox on: July 26, 2012, 05:44:06 AM
I'm gathering some information and a statement will be posted soon.

stevejobs807@gmail.com was indeed my email account used for anonymous testing purpose, however I haven't been using it for a long time. I'm logging in the account to check the suspicious activity and I'll post relevant details as well.

The $40,000 I exchanged at AurumXchange was indeed from a friend. Later I can also post proof that I exchanged another $30,000 at other exchanges during the same period. The total amount far exceeds the stolen amount claimed in the OP. My own Liberty Reserve account number is U7097615.

So are you saying that you used a different email when you sold the LR for your friend?

How would a hacker benefit from using the SJ email to have a wire sent to your bank account?

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This ids a good time to use http://judge.me

Judge me is intended to operate as a mediation service in civil matters.  It's not intended to handle criminal matters such as embezzlement.
3325  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: Public STATEMENT Regarding Bitcoinica account hack at MtGox on: July 26, 2012, 05:35:43 AM
Zhou admitted on here the other day that he sold a large amount of Liberty Reserve following the hack - people had already noticed the transactions and asked him about them.  He said he did it "for a friend".

Can you extract the log saying why he did it?

Quote

Roberto has linked the relevant posts.

I'll quote in case of edits.

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Since my name has been mentioned I would just reply in this thread anyway. I'll explain this, for once and for all.

As I explained in the QQ Group where the trades happened, I was cashing out for a Singaporean friend who has $100K in total in several LR accounts. I was able to get much better USD/SGD exchange rates than any bank customers. (I was able to get "interbank" rates: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=76156.0)

I was not "in a hurry". Even on today I have done a deal with someone. (7 days is not "hurry".)

The rate was not bad. Most e-currency exchanges charge 1.5%-2% plus wire fees (about $50 per transaction including routing fees). USD/CNY exchange rate is highly stable and I can access to discounted exchange rate through my Chinese bank as well. I actually got a better deal.

And it's definitely not $40K (which is the stolen USD amount that Bitcoinica claims). I have also placed a single $40K AurumXchange order during the same period.

I still have an operating business in Singapore (http://www.sgitcoin.com/) and this service is actually quite popular (top Google result for "buy bitcoin in singapore"). Therefore I regularly deal with foreign exchange, money transfers and e-currencies.

This kind of transactions are very common to me. It happens all the time before the hack. (For example, trading over $20K with UserXXX: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=93109.msg1039996#msg1039996)

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The only question I have is: Why wasn't that information made public sooner?

Be thankful it's been released at all.  This is a criminal matter and the exchanges are under no obligation whatsoever to pass on any information they have to anyone other than law enforcement.
3326  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: Public STATEMENT Regarding Bitcoinica account hack at MtGox on: July 26, 2012, 05:18:58 AM
It seems proven that Zhou Tong owns stevejobs807@gmail.com, but how did you verify that the hacker controls this email address?

* To my surprise, upon further examination of our order system, I found an order from Zhou Tong to sell Liberty Reserve to us for the amount of USD 40,000, requesting a wire to his bank account in Singapore.

How do you know that Zhou Tong owns this account?

Zhou admitted on here the other day that he sold a large amount of Liberty Reserve following the hack - people had already noticed the transactions and asked him about them.  He said he did it "for a friend".
3327  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: Public STATEMENT Regarding Bitcoinica account hack at MtGox on: July 26, 2012, 05:01:54 AM
It's good to see the exchanges co-operating with each other for the benefit of the community.

While it's obvious that users won't get their funds back any time soon, if at all, at least people now have a clearer idea of what really went down.  



3328  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: Bounty to dox BitcoinEXpress on: July 26, 2012, 04:46:34 AM
has committed the crime of impersonating people, DDoS'ing, and probably having a botnet.  

Make sure you let us know the incident number when you file that police report.
3329  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: Bounty to dox BitcoinEXpress on: July 26, 2012, 04:40:50 AM
You're so ignorant. Keep your shit up before I bring the law into this.

"The law" being an internet petition?

http://www.change.org/petitions/bitcoinexpress-have-him-arrested

LULZ.

If you think she's done something criminal, sack up and file a police report.  You're embarrassing yourself if you believe anyone's going to take someone who starts internet petitions seriously.
3330  Economy / Service Announcements / Re: {ANNOUNCEMENT} WBX Exchange Frozen on: July 26, 2012, 02:36:03 AM
Does someone with a reddit account want to let this guy know what's going on.

http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/x4h2o/has_anyone_had_any_dealings_with/
3331  Economy / Marketplace / Re: Intersango Exchange on: July 26, 2012, 02:22:00 AM

You dont need any ID to pay into an intersango account ,they dont even ask ........

But thats the british norm ,you dont need ID to pay into ANY UK bank account (only ID required to withdraw)

by the way ,this might take way longer than  a week ,metro bank my be legally forced to close them down because you can not process the transactions from drug deals (cocaine was it ?) and expect the regulators to ignore that


Same here.  You only need to identify yourself for threshold deposits (ie, those over $10k) and that's a recent requirement.

I was thinking more along the lines of the guy who wanted the scanned ID using it to open accounts with other exchanges and/or bank accounts.

At this point we don't know what has led to the bank reviewing activity on Intersango's account.  Could be related to this.  Could be something totally separate.  It's inevitable that sooner or later one of the exchanges is going to get caught up in a serious money laundering investigation.  The question is which one and when.  Anyone who has an axe to grind against Bitcoin or a particular exchange can make an an anonymous report accusing exchanges of money laundering and it's going to get followed up just like anonymous tip-offs about tax evasion get followed up.
3332  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: Alternitive to Intersango on: July 25, 2012, 10:03:16 PM
I backed these at first... How wrong was i. It takes a week + to get moneyu in in most cases and im still waiting for a withdrawel for a week now. I've wrote, E-mailed etc but they just dont get back. I told a friend he was been OTT with them a while back buty i can confirm these are a bag of spunk juice now. Spunk juice as more life in it though so i suppose thats cruel to spunk juice.

bankmybitcoin.co.uk as popped up but down for maintance and it seems a little sketchy. ANy other alternitives, AND NOT MTGOX!!!

thanks in advance

Intersango's bank is reviewing activity on their account.  Current estimate for completion of that process is one week but I guess that will depend a lot on what the bank finds.

No matter which exchange you choose, you need to understand the risk that your funds could be frozen by third parties at any time.

3333  Economy / Marketplace / Re: Intersango Exchange on: July 25, 2012, 09:03:49 PM
I wonder if this recent event had anything to do with what assumingly is currently going on with their Metro Bank account: http://www.topix.com/forum/drug/valium/TDB3N8TVV6R8HJ3KH/p2 (only need to scroll down a tad)

~Bruno~

Good find Phin.  It may or may not have anything to do with the current review of Intersango's account, but it proves beyond doubt that people are stupid enough to publicly post stuff which links exchanges to money laundering.  Looks like the guy might have been using the ID of his "customers" to open bank/exchange accounts. (who in the hell would be stupid enough to send a scan of their ID to someone purporting to be an online drug dealer?).

Quote
True - but if the scammed folks then complain to the bank - makes sense why suddenly they'd want to take a look at what Intersango is doing and cause this review.

Hi Metro Bank.  I ordered drugs from some guy on the internet and he hasn't sent them.  I paid the money into one of your accounts.  Please help me get my money  back.  kthnxbye.
3334  Economy / Scam Accusations / Re: Scam Report Against CryptoXchange $100k USD on: July 25, 2012, 10:01:58 AM
I would suggest you get better lawyers.  People that can't differentiate between a business registration and someone with multiple businesses across the web/Australia and are easy to find need sacking.

It took a few seconds for me to pull up Ken's home address, phone number and work history.

Indeed, these have never been secret.  For that matter, Colin's contact details are not secret either. 

I'd seriously suggest that you find a new lawyer.  Yours seems unable to put together a business letter to you, the client - I wouldn't entrust them with writing an important letter to someone else.  Their paralegals are apparently totally inept when it comes to research, too.

3335  Economy / Marketplace / Re: Intersango Exchange on: July 25, 2012, 06:10:23 AM
If they are telling the truth then it looks like their metro bank is frozen ..........

Which is something that's happened to other exchanges multiple times in the past and been sorted out.  Whatever the bank's going to do, it's going to do in it's own time-frame and there's not much that Intersango or its users can do about that.
3336  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Bitcoinica MtGox account compromised on: July 25, 2012, 05:39:22 AM

WOW! Simply, wow! It looks to me that if some regulatory body choose to do so, they can walk into any banking institute and demand to see the records of (I will use this example) Intersango. They can simply claim that a certain client of theirs with such-and-such Bitcoin address conducted some illegal transaction and that an investigation is warranted. This account is now closed until we finish our investigation. This could take a week. After a week goes by, they return with another concern of another address and the whole process starts anew, thus freezing the account indefinitely. Furthermore, during the interim, Intersango will not be allowed to open up another bank account in that country, and if incorporated there and choosing to open a bank account in some other country, their incorporation privileges will be revoked. I sure the hell would hate to be such a company in their shoes if such an event did occur.

~Bruno~


Sort of.  When the DoJ went after the online gambling providers, they went after the payment processors.  People's money was tied up for ages because the gambling providers didn't have enough reserves on hand to directly pay out people's balances (at least one of them had been co-mingling funds, but that's another story) - the money was in the bank accounts of the payment processors and those were frozen.  While many users did receive their deposits back, it demonstrated the extent to which payment processors are a weak link in the chain.

While it's possible that a regulator might choose to go after one particular exchange, it's just as likely that they'd do what they did with the online gambling drama and go after everyone at once.  There's no question that a sub-set of customers on every exchange are going to be using the exchange to launder money, evade taxes or commit other financial offences.  The offshore poker providers weren't actually breaking any laws in the jurisdictions in which they were licensed.  It pretty much came down to the DoJ having the power to disrupt their business indefinitely if they didn't play ball.  The Bitcoin exchanges are tiny compared to the online poker providers and its unlikely they'd win in a showdown with the US DoJ.

Loup is right that there are a number of US agencies which could really fuck up an exchange's shit pretty much regardless of where that exchange is located.  I just believe that once that particular can of worms is opened they are more likely to go after everyone than after just one exchange.

I'm not sure what the fines are for failure to comply with AML/KYC requirements in the US.  Here in Australia, the fine for either not reporting a transaction as required or reporting it late is up to $1.1 million for an individual and up to $22 million for a company.  A single transaction could have multiple reporting requirements attached to it, so you can get hit with more than one fine for a single transaction.  Big banks might be able to absorb those kinds of fines, but I doubt there's a Bitcoin exchange on the planet which can afford them at this time.

3337  Economy / Marketplace / Re: Intersango Exchange on: July 25, 2012, 04:22:06 AM
Problem is a bank can halt all account activity if a few tx are flagged as fraudulent. Not defending Intersango, just saying.

Since btc transactions are irreversible, it's tempting for some scammers to try to get some free btc. by comitting fraud with the bank transfers..

Just like conventional financial institutions are constantly bombarded with fraud and hacking attempts, the same is going to be true in the Bitcoin world. I suspect that many people grossly underestimate how frequent those attempts are. It's always going to be a matter of trying to stay one step ahead of the game. 
3338  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Bitcoinica MtGox account compromised on: July 25, 2012, 03:08:49 AM
One can only speculate that one of the victims of their gross negligence (at the very least) might have threatened Metro Bank with action and forced them to hold funds until an investigation is undertaken. Certainly I would take that action, backed up with a proper legal notice that the funds they are holding in trust are being held criminally, and are currently the subject of a massive world-wide investigation of their enormous breach of their fiduciary responsibility to those they are holding the funds in trust for.


More likely someone contacted the bank and told them that people were using it to launder funds, which immediately obligates the bank to investigate activity on the account. 

There's no "massive world-wide investigation" going on.  While it's possible that various international agencies will investigate some of the issues related to the Bitcoinica clusterfuck, it still won't be a "massive" investigation.  As businesses go, Bitcoinica is a piddly little one and it's total debts appear to be just over USD 1 million.  They may well end up being the first Bitcoin related business investigated for financial offences such as facilitating money laundering, facilitating tax evasion, etc but I can't think of any exchange which isn't at risk for that - let's face it, the Bitcoins which pass through Silk Road are being cashed out somewhere.  In fact, if the authorities choose to go down that route, they may do exactly what they did in regard to online gambling and hit everyone at once, shutting down the flow of funds.
3339  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Bitcoinica MtGox account compromised on: July 25, 2012, 02:38:27 AM
Quote
We understand that many people have called Metro bank and Metro has told them that there is no issue. This is entirely incorrect. We believe it in not intentional it is simply that their support staff assumes that if there is not an issue affecting all accounts or a huge number of accounts at the bank that there is not an issue with our account.

Does anybody here work closely with a bona fide banking representative that can call Metro Bank and directly inquire, semi-privately, the validity of the above?

~Bruno~

There's not a legitimate bank on the planet which would confirm to outsiders that they're investigating activity on one of their customer's accounts.  Depending on the reason for the investigation, it could be seriously illegal to reveal that even to the customer concerned.

Intersango had previously posted that certain forms of withdrawal would be unavailable between 26 and 30 July.

It's not really clear whether their Metro bank account is now in a state of total limbo until the investigation into their account activity is completed.

Quote
Seems to me somebody is planning a vanishing act.

Or someone who's really pissed off over the Bitcoinica clusterfuck has decided to cause them as much grief as possible.

3340  Economy / Marketplace / Re: Intersango Exchange on: July 25, 2012, 01:22:34 AM


I believe bank staff would know if there was technical errors causing deposits to not show up ,another day passes and no money credited by interango EVEN THOUGH ITS BEEN IN THEIR ACCOUNT SINCE LAST FRIDAY

INTERSANGO SCAMMERS or LIARS or both ??

Are you going to pay interest on the deposits youre withholding ?

It's not a technical issue.

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While we were previously under the impression that the problems we were having with Metro bank were due to a technical issue on their end (as this has happened before), we have been told that our account activity is being reviewed and that we must be patient during this process. We have faith that our contact at Metro bank will properly investigate the matter. They have indicated that they do not require information from us at this time. The resolution time we were given was around 1 week, however this is just an approximation.

https://support.intersango.com/
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