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35581  Bitcoin / Mining speculation / Re: Butterfly mining cards, is't worth ? on: September 05, 2015, 11:26:15 PM
I am in the USA shipping would be very high.


Which country are you in? I may not be able to ship it to you.

For me to ship to Abu Dhabi (United Arab Emirates)  it is 64 an s-3.

So lets say I charge you 100  for one add on 64 to ship.

  164 x 4 = 656  and I clear 400. That is too much for you to pay.

is I charge you 75 each + 64 each to ship = 139 x 4 = 556

  That is too high a price.

You should pay about 400 to 450 if you can get that price.

My problem is If I charge you 450 with shipping included   I clear 200. 

If I keep the machines and mine I would earn 200 in about 83 days. So If I ever sell my 4 S-3's it will be local.
35582  Bitcoin / Mining support / Re: Surge protection on: September 05, 2015, 11:12:32 PM
BTW double conversion UPS often have less protection than power strips.  Anyone can read its specification numbers.  Most do not.  How many joules does that double conversion UPS claim to absorb?  Notice a tiny number.
you assert that any surge seen on input of such UPS coming through AC->DC->AC transformation survives and comes out in original form??

no he is telling you read what your ups is rated for in terms of joules.  A direct hit from lightning can be higher then 100000 joules.

here is a decent ups


http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16842301289&ignorebbr=1

it is rated for 1800 joules  so if you suffer from a lightning strike  1800 joules is not going to cut it


here is a whole house at the panel protector>
http://www.amazon.com/Square-Schneider-Electric-HEPD80-Electronics/dp/B00CONA1OQ/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1441495077&sr=8-1&keywords=Whole-House+Surge+Protector
35583  Bitcoin / Mining speculation / Re: Butterfly mining cards, is't worth ? on: September 05, 2015, 11:07:51 PM
i've a kind of FREE power ( Not stealing it ) so i'm thinking of buying some hashboards for a cheap price and group it together in order to have a Good hashrate which ROI in short time..

so no one think that it's a Good idea while i have FREE power, i'm confused what to choose ..
if i'd like to have about 10 TH/S using BFL boards how many boards do i need and how much do you think that i have to spend on this ??

share your thoughts about it.

get s-3's instead.   s-3's are more durable.  I have 4 that have been mining since july 2014

I have then in a 2.4 cent spot so they still earn a profit for me.  about 80 usd a month. after I pay for the power.
35584  Bitcoin / Mining speculation / Re: Diff thread sept 4th. to sept 17th Picks are closed. on: September 05, 2015, 10:15:11 PM
AntPool Hashrate  is still 69.62 PH/s

They have more hashrate then what is on that pool.


Explain why it is beneficial for them?

Too much profit, and they want to share it with the another pool owner?

They owned really  another pool,  but this is for solo mining.  
Total over 14.00 PH/s
https://www.antpool.com/poolStatsRankings.htm

 Any Antpool user can join it.


  I was referring to the  solo pool and I was also referring to

hashnest pacmic v3  which is 24ph.

so the is 68 ph + 14 ph + 24 ph = 106ph

most of the current rise is due to pacmic v3.

  I also believe they use s-7's and charge buyers like it is an s-5  so 23826 th in contracts  Is just about the diff jump and they are fucking whaling on it.

Since they charge you based on s-5 power rates while they run s-7's (this is my guess)

 but if I were them  I would be doing it.
35585  Bitcoin / Mining support / Re: Surge protection on: September 05, 2015, 10:10:47 PM
some good shots.

I am repairing my neighbors cable connection.  many years ago they had a roof top 'free' antenna.

Cablevision was installed. No drop box and they drilled a new hole ½ inch above the ground and 2 feet from the gutter drain pipe.  
Which means rotted sill. To make matters worse he switched to direct tv and I think they did not ground his dish.  So I will need to do a few of these

http://www.summitsource.com/images/products/GRS274.jpg
35586  Bitcoin / Mining support / Re: Antminer S5 - Underclock - Undervolt - Best J/GH on: September 05, 2015, 09:39:53 PM

I found another mean well  this one is decent price and should be able to run the s-5 at freq 175

88% efficient  can go to 10 volts

 http://www.trcelectronics.com/View/Mean-Well/RSP-320-12.shtml


 I'm not sure but I think that's the same RSP-320-12 I mentioned as one of my original 2 links, just from Jameco instead of from TRC.
 (if it's not, then I have changed my mind since then on the "optimal" one as it's the one in my booklinks.)
 Mouser also carries them, I have noticed, but for a couple bucks more, and at least 1 seller on Amazon in the same price range.


 I dunno if they have enough isolation to use them in series, DO let us know how that works out.

all my testing will be on the s-7.

I have done a fan mod on the one I have at my house.  huge improvement in sound.

links to two of these psu's

https://i.imgur.com/5JvfR8m.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/kh94dIs.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/2vniinV.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/mMM3ydE.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/jjrUOa4.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/v058Wvk.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/Qc6o4pK.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/lLgxB28.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/vPGNi5W.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/sHBG6GR.jpg


I will post a few photos of the  fan mod I did


a 90 mm noctua fan


please cover the ac in or you can kill yourself

 








35587  Bitcoin / Mining speculation / Re: Diff thread sept 4th. to sept 17th Picks are closed. on: September 05, 2015, 05:07:24 PM
I may guess that a few thousands of Sfards machines are online.

well say 2000 of them  so 2000 x 1.7 = 3.4ph or just under 1%

my guess is bitmaintech swapped a shit ton of s-7's for s-5's

 2000 s-7's in = 9.5 ph  take 4000 s-5's out = 4.6ph  net gain is 4.9 ph

2x that

4000 s-7's in = 19ph take 8000 s-5's out = 9.2 ph  net gain is 9.8 ph

So say 3.4 ph in sfards

say 9.8 ph in s-7s'

some bit fury

some knc

and 20ph is added on for +5%

I think we get this 3 times in a row and then go flat.

AntPool Hashrate  is still 69.62 PH/s

They have more hashrate then what is on that pool.

35588  Bitcoin / Mining support / Re: Antminer S5 - Underclock - Undervolt - Best J/GH on: September 05, 2015, 04:51:07 PM
Voltage control is achieved by reducing the 12V supply voltage. As the chips are powered in a string, like Christmas Tree lights, this reduces the core voltage to each chip.

Rich


I found another mean well  this one is decent price and should be able to run the s-5 at freq 175

88% efficient  can go to 10 volts



 http://www.trcelectronics.com/View/Mean-Well/RSP-320-12.shtml


https://www.trcelectronics.com/ecomm/pdf/rsp320.pdf


35589  Bitcoin / Mining support / Re: Surge protection on: September 05, 2015, 03:45:08 PM
westom posts all over the internet on many forums about surge protection.

a whole house protector and proper ground of the mains usually works.

I have had lightenting hit my home and everything survived due to my whole house protector and my 3x grounded main box.
35590  Bitcoin / Mining speculation / Re: Diff thread sept 4th. to sept 17th Picks are closed. on: September 05, 2015, 03:28:19 PM
I may guess that a few thousands of Sfards machines are online.

well say 2000 of them  so 2000 x 1.7 = 3.4ph or just under 1%

my guess is bitmaintech swapped a shit ton of s-7's for s-5's

 2000 s-7's in = 9.5 ph  take 4000 s-5's out = 4.6ph  net gain is 4.9 ph

2x that

4000 s-7's in = 19ph take 8000 s-5's out = 9.2 ph  net gain is 9.8 ph

So say 3.4 ph in sfards

say 9.8 ph in s-7s'

some bit fury

some knc

and 20ph is added on for +5%

I think we get this 3 times in a row and then go flat.
35591  Bitcoin / Group buys / Re: [lee group]419$ the sales promotion of hosted antminer S5(golden psu included) on: September 05, 2015, 02:22:17 PM
https://bitcoinwisdom.com/bitcoin/calculator

7-22 – 8-4 (334 days)       -0.3571
8-5 – 8-18 (348 days)        0.04827

crap roi with 0% diff
damn! cause i wanted few units

The 17% tax is quite painful.  I am still debating if I want to get it or not.
it is possible to get better price if i donot order from bitmain's website, i will go to beijing to meet bitmain on 15th around to see what is the best price i can get

good please let us know if you can do better.
35592  Bitcoin / Group buys / Re: [lee group]419$ the sales promotion of hosted antminer S5(golden psu included) on: September 05, 2015, 01:42:09 PM
https://bitcoinwisdom.com/bitcoin/calculator

7-22 – 8-4 (334 days)       -0.3571
8-5 – 8-18 (348 days)        0.04827

crap roi with 0% diff
damn! cause i wanted few units

The 17% tax is quite painful.  I am still debating if I want to get it or not.
35593  Bitcoin / Group buys / Re: [SIDEHACK STICK] Official sales thread for everywhere not already covered on: September 05, 2015, 05:29:06 AM
I had one of those 49-port hubs I got damaged off CrazyGuy sometime last year but I fixed and sold it 'cause bills were due. I'm kinda wishing I'd hung onto it instead. I mean my little 10-port is nice but it's not that nice. Maybe I should build more. Or get a forty-niner. I still have some 30A power supplies, and if that's not good enough it's not like I can't build one better. I mean a slight change to the TypeZero power systems as designed would get me upward of 50A of 5VDC. That'd run a lot of sticks. I could fill the hub with 250MHz sticks and get about 670GH off that 50A. I wonder when was the last time someone had 670GH worth of stick miners running together? That would have taken 2000 Block Erupters. Dang. Actually, let me do some checkin' and see if I can't scrounge one of those up.

Speaking of, I should probably post pictures of the thing full-up with proper green-heatsink Compacs running on Novak's cgminer. I think we had about 8 plugged in when I left the shop this afternoon. They'll be swapped out with more in the next couple days.

Apparently Monday is some sort of labor holiday ("Labor Day is observed in the United States on the first Monday of September to celebrate the achievements of workers and the labor movement") which means the post office is closed and, I dunno, people are supposed to take a day off work? Yeah like that'll happen, dangit I got sticks to make. So it looks like shipping will resume Tuesday.

I had 122 sticks  block erupters on one pc my all time best for a pc.  

I have  had 75 U1 + U2 on one pc

A pc maxes at about 120-127 sticks.

You need a second usb controller  to go over.
35594  Bitcoin / Mining speculation / Re: Larger Miners For Cheap on: September 05, 2015, 05:26:51 AM
try market place link


https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?board=75.0


or hardware link not software sub forum


https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?board=76.0


or group buys

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?board=137.0
35595  Bitcoin / Mining speculation / Re: Diff thread sept 4th. to sept 17th Picks are closed. on: September 05, 2015, 04:28:49 AM

http://btc.blockr.io/charts


157 Sept 4 2015 ---- This was partial  but it is +13  on a norm of 144  that is over 9%    that is really high number we  need to see the next few days.
35596  Bitcoin / Mining speculation / Re: Diff thread sept 4th. to sept 17th Picks are closed. on: September 05, 2015, 02:05:06 AM
you don't understand why a builder with 10% of the hash loses money by expanding to 15% of the hash you think he makes more  money if he does that.

the problem is 4-6 guys all have 10 to 15% of the hash each.  they all can build bp and then the other 4-6 guys match them.

So what hey have been doing is swapping  gear with out really expand hash by a ton.

they have s-3's at .75watts  they have s-5s at .50watts  now they have s-7s at .25watts

so they ⅓ their power   so many think they  will 3x their hash .  if the top 6 builders all do this they all gain nothing and they spent money to make the gear.

so they try to ⅓ their power  and 1.5x or 1.2x their hash.

if the top 6 builders do this.  they keep the same share of the network and they spend less on power.

This is what has stopped the crazy growth the last year.

unless your gear is god like say .01 watts a gh and really cheap to build expansion of hash matching your efficiency gain is a loser economically.

so s-5 at .5 and s-7 at .25  for example does not pay to 2x the hash power
 if the other builders can match you.  but if antminer ½ the power and 1.25x the hash   and are matched by the other builders  antminer makes more money.

this is very simple math.

I believe there are several errors in your analysis.  You have assumed everyone pays a similar amount for their miners, has similar costs and does not try to drive others out of business.

1) Not all miners pay the same for their miners.  The mining hardware with the highest efficiency is not likely to be sold to the public.  It is more economic for the manufacturer to keep it to themselves and mine themselves. This is what KNC and Bitfury do.  They manufacture their own cheap hardware and do not sell to to the public.  It is in their interest to increase their hash rate as it increases their profits.

2) For similar reasons miners in areas with the cheapest electricity will try to maximize their hash rates.  Anyone who pays more than about $0.05 per kWh is likely to be ultimately driven out of the mining business.

3) Finally you have assumed people would co-operate if they all had the same costs.  But people are not always that rational in an unregulated market.  See the Tragedy of the Commons.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragedy_of_the_commons

The entire mining game is a zero sum game.  There is only a fixed amount of money available from Bitcoin mining.  

The best way to maximize your profits is to not share your competitive advantage and to keep your costs below your competitors.  Ideally you would like most of your competitors to give up and leave the market.

So I expect the battle between the miners to continue and the hash rate to continue to increase for some time yet.



 





I don't assume that every new miner is equal in cost.--- See my first bold.

There has not been a battle between the building miners for the last year.--- Hash rate has been flat for quite a while.--- This is about builders mining not builders seller as spondoolies and bitmaintech did have a selling war Last DEC/JAN.  That war crashed price of BTC down to 180 for a while

Now Lets be frank I am basing this on Sept/Oct 2014 to July/Aug 2015.

This means Anything after that can be new.  But no builder will attempt to crush another builder at self mining unless they have a god-like chip. With a monster edge. And it needs to be cheap to build and run. And to try to kill your competitors off now if you have the chip of doom is moron just wait for the ½ ing and the summer heat of 2016 then hit them with the chip of death.



So to say mining is an end game is not applicable at all as the reason to ramp your gear up like mad.
35597  Bitcoin / Mining speculation / Re: Bitmain just implemented nuclear fusion in their s9 miner? on: September 04, 2015, 09:07:32 PM
This thread is a trap designed  to make people angry.

the op has done many others.

A new poster puts in a post on nuking Japan and I feel this is an attempt to get us to fight on this thread.
35598  Bitcoin / Mining speculation / Re: Diff thread sept 4th. to sept 17th Picks are closed. on: September 04, 2015, 08:39:05 PM

We are not going to get to 100 diff and  1000 ph .  before the ½ .

 unless price jacks upwards   quite a bit.

We are already close to a 60 diff and likely to go over 60 at the next adjustment.  I don't see any reason why there cannot be growth to 100 by the middle of next year even at the current Bitcoin price.  There are 23 adjustments until then.

Mining, and the push for faster miners,  will continue before and after the halving.

you don't understand why a builder with 10% of the hash loses money by expanding to 15% of the hash you think he makes more  money if he does that.

the problem is 4-6 guys all have 10 to 15% of the hash each.  they all can build bp and then the other 4-6 guys match them.

So what hey have been doing is swapping  gear with out really expand hash by a ton.

they have s-3's at .75watts  they have s-5s at .50watts  now they have s-7s at .25watts

so they ⅓ their power   so many think they  will 3x their hash .  if the top 6 builders all do this they all gain nothing and they spent money to make the gear.

so they try to ⅓ their power  and 1.5x or 1.2x their hash.

if the top 6 builders do this.  they keep the same share of the network and they spend less on power.

This is what has stopped the crazy growth the last year.

unless your gear is god like say .01 watts a gh and really cheap to build expansion of hash matching your efficiency gain is a loser economically.

so s-5 at .5 and s-7 at .25  for example does not pay to 2x the hash power
 if the other builders can match you.  but if antminer ½ the power and 1.25x the hash   and are matched by the other builders  antminer makes more money.

this is very simple math.
35599  Bitcoin / Mining speculation / Re: Diff thread sept 4th. to sept 17th Picks are closed. on: September 04, 2015, 06:53:55 PM
next two jumps are important.  two 5% jumps plus the one we had would be a trend that the bigger builders all have better chips and are all retooling. If this occurs we will be at 450ph by  oct 1st and we will then see if the big builders decide to slow growth down again like they did last year.

Or and here is the or do they all say f it and try to out build each other.   I believe they will get us at 60-65 diff and 450-500 ph and then go flat.

I suspect it is much more likely we will get to 100 diff and possibly 1,000 ph before growth goes flat next year.

Both KNC and Bitfury are expecting 16 nm chips to be at 0.07 Joules/Gigahash.  This means miners with at least 3 times better electrical efficiency than current 28nm miners.  

I know there is considerable daily statistical variation but over the last few days the KNCMiners pool seems to have grown considerable.  It will be interesting to see how KNCminers and Bitfury change over the next few months.  See
https://data.bitcoinity.org/bitcoin/hashrate/30d?c=m&t=a

Another period of change is coming whether we like it or not.




  

We are not going to get to 100 diff and  1000 ph .  before the ½ .

 unless price jacks upwards   quite a bit.
35600  Bitcoin / Group buys / Re: [SIDEHACK STICK] Official sales thread for everywhere not already covered on: September 04, 2015, 06:50:35 PM
I think Luke-Jr is planning to release support soon but as far as I know right now you need to build the "compac" branch on his github if you want compac support on bfgminer.
Yep, I'll try to get 5.3.0 released before any deliveries take place.
Note I merged and deleted the "compac" branch, so just the main "bfgminer" branch is fine now.
Windows users can get git-built bleeding-edge binaries from: http://luke.dashjr.org/tmp/code/webisect/webisect.php?dobuild=bfgminer

thanks I will give that a try on the weekend.
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