This would not be proper airflow in a rack (and Avalon is designed to be racked). Strange, I have seen Server racks online with those kinds of configurations. (mostly 120mm fans) These fans you guys are looking at are crap. Server, rackmounts fans are substantial and HUGE. 120mm, but 2-3 inches thick with crazy high power motors. I have some 120mm fans that run on 48V, and they're rated to move 200CFM each. About 10 times what most 120mm fans will do. When I powered one up loose on a table, it blew with enough force to push itself across the table, and drew blood when it walked right off the table edge and I tried to catch it. They're loud as hell too, with a real high tone. I like Avalon's design where the air flows in a straight path in the front, across the fins, and out the back. I never liked the BFL and bASIC designs where the air is forced to make a right-angle turn. They make tiny fans of 30 to 40mm that push about 125cfm each if I recall correctly. My server has about 4 on each side. (8 total at 15-16 thousand RPM) So at 120mm a high end delta fan should be doing quite a bit. From what I understood the static pressure is more important as it keeps the components nice and cool. The Avalon seem to be pull only configuration. I also wonder why they didn't buy a modular power supply. The top where the powersupply is located has restricted airflow with all those cables. It would be interesting to measure if that is a spot where heat can build up and cause power supply issues. |
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No, of course this won't color his review! heh.
And this is somehow different from Avalon giving Jeff and the Foundation each a device? Jeff may have paid for his, but he still got the first one...out of 3(?) units so far. The former was a donation. The latter is paid for in full like any other customer. The circumstances turned out to be Yifu importing it by hand and giving it to the Bitcoin Foundation in person. That is why there is a video out there with him and the Bitcoin Foundation members laughing it up with the device humming away in the background. Anyway, if you really think about it, at this point Kano's visit has pretty much lost it's intended purpose. Which was to prove whether BFL was real or not. At this point they are about to ship....so what is the point in that again? It becomes a rather redundant effort and probably a waste of money.
Yeah, unfortunately I agree here. The point before was to see the process in action...not touring the facility as they supposedly pack the final units for shipping. Ditto. I don't see what is going to be achieved now by the visit. jeff did get a 25BTC "donation" from avalon after he ordered. Thats called a partial refund. He offered that information freely as well. |
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Well, Like or hate BFL they are bringing Luke-Jr and Kanoi in, for a entire week.
Kanoi and Con provide support on IRC all the time, they answer any question (except CPU mining) very fast and provide excellent support.
I will use my BFL (if and when I get them) with confidence that it has full software developer support. It will support both major work protocols- you are free to pick either GBT or Stratum.
Without this support and a binary available, If I had a Avalon I would be shit out of luck if something went wrong.
Of course Kanoi should come home with product, he is supporting it.
I guess you can write your own code, since you are so eager to bash Kanoi?
It's not bashing as pointing out the obvious. He admitted it a while back that he thought he was entitled to free hardware. (Under the guise of providing support) When I brought up the idea of a monthly re-payment plan for the hardware...guess what? |
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No, of course this won't color his review! heh.
And this is somehow different from Avalon giving Jeff and the Foundation each a device? Jeff may have paid for his, but he still got the first one...out of 3(?) units so far. The former was a donation. The latter is paid for in full like any other customer. The circumstances turned out to be Yifu importing it by hand and giving it to the Bitcoin Foundation in person. That is why there is a video out there with him and the Bitcoin Foundation members laughing it up with the device humming away in the background. Anyway, if you really think about it, at this point Kano's visit has pretty much lost it's intended purpose. Which was to prove whether BFL was real or not. At this point they are about to ship....so what is the point in that again? It becomes a rather redundant effort and probably a waste of money.
Yeah, unfortunately I agree here. The point before was to see the process in action...not touring the facility as they supposedly pack the final units for shipping. Ditto. I don't see what is going to be achieved now by the visit. |
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Feb-2 Hey Josh, you got any update on where your guys are at? I'm certainly not someone to promote your guys unsubstantiated claims coz of your crap history (even with the ASIC), and you know full well I've never been a fan of BFL, but the Avalon people are really pissing me off, Tom's gone down the drain, and I would certainly be happy to be able to run a BFL ASIC on an rpi and show it leaving Avalon's shit in the dust. ... ... So ... when is anything happening at BFL? P.S. if anything I've said on the forum lately has pissed your guys off - oh well, damn shame  You are pissed off because we haven't got around to release source code yet or the fact we did not giving you a free unit? Thumb through Kano's posts and anyone can get the picture. |
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FYI I've got my plane tickets to BFL - Kansas City today (email booked digital ticket details from the travel agent) arranged by Josh So my flight to the USA, leaving Sydney on the 17th Feb (my time) - to be back here in Aus again on the 23rd. ... so I going from Oz (Aus) to Kansas (City) ... isn't that back to front?  That's quite the trip! How many days do they have you touring the facilities? Anything specific on the agenda? Agenda: To get their stories straight so when he reports back on the forums it is exactly how BFL wants him to report things lol. There's a reason why your ignore is so dark ... You are so far off the mark and you've made a comment based on zero knowledge of the situation ... or is your statement simply to mean that you can easily be bought and just assume others are like you? Here's most of the opening and closing of the recent PM I sent Josh to find out where they were at and then got the visit finally organised. Feb-2 Hey Josh, you got any update on where your guys are at? I'm certainly not someone to promote your guys unsubstantiated claims coz of your crap history (even with the ASIC), and you know full well I've never been a fan of BFL, but the Avalon people are really pissing me off, Tom's gone down the drain, and I would certainly be happy to be able to run a BFL ASIC on an rpi
and show it leaving Avalon's shit in the dust.... ... So ... when is anything happening at BFL? P.S. if anything I've said on the forum lately has pissed your guys off - oh well, damn shame Uh, You do realize you have been critical of Avalon for a while now. (Beyond simply the source code not being provided.) You complained (quite openly) that you weren't getting free [development] hardware from them. The PM you posted on the top just goes to confirm what is kinda plainly obvious. You may not like BFL <cough> but you didn't quite bash them nearly as hard as Avalon. For the matter of record, yes, Kano is getting free devices from BFL when he leaves the trip. ---------------- No, of course this won't color his review! heh. Anyway, if you really think about it, at this point Kano's visit has pretty much lost it's intended purpose. Which was to prove whether BFL was real or not. At this point they are about to ship....so what is the point in that again? It becomes a rather redundant effort and probably a waste of money. Doesn't matter anyway, Kano's going to Kansas. He going to get a few BFL devices to Vaseline/lube the review in a positive direction and a few good shots of people working on benches to put together the machines. Perhaps some shots of the staff in a photo OP and finally when he gets back he will write a positive review of whatever it is he saw there. I believe his review would have been useful in October 2012. Perhaps even November or December 2012. That would have been interesting to see the state of things way back then. Not now that the party balloons have been put up and a "proper" implementation of the working business had come to life. Anyway, that is my take on it. Expect the article soon. |
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FYI I've got my plane tickets to BFL - Kansas City today (email booked digital ticket details from the travel agent) arranged by Josh So my flight to the USA, leaving Sydney on the 17th Feb (my time) - to be back here in Aus again on the 23rd. ... so I going from Oz (Aus) to Kansas (City) ... isn't that back to front? Whoo-hoo! Kano is coming to America! Everyone get your daughters locked up safe!  Play it! |
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Remember, I think awhile ago it was confirmed that the ASIC orders start at about Order #1500-ish. True that 6K chips does not mean 6K Jalapenos.
I too was just trying to figure out this math last night and wondering how many of each unit would potentially have been orderd, along with all the false order #s (just due to how their ordering system would increment).
Well...I made a quick excel sheet with data gathered from the preorder thread, specifically from June through the end of August. Totals come out to: Jalapeno - 157 Little Single - 18 SC Single - 228 Mini Rig - 21 Multiple in the chip counts per device (speculated, and noted above in the thread) and you get around 6253 chips. There are tons that go unreported, but given Josh's statement that they're break into the August orders, my guess is about 50% more orders than we've seen so far...bringing us to 9380 chips to cover June through August. Obviously just a rough guesstimate, but I figure it'll work for now until we get more data. I guess many BFL Minirig customers may have to wait until there are more chips. |
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This would not be proper airflow in a rack (and Avalon is designed to be racked). Strange, I have seen Server racks online with those kinds of configurations. (mostly 120mm fans) |
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You guys should investigate more on how server heat dissipation works. There is a reason if they are done that way. Avalon design is correct.
Servers use fans with high static pressure. (I don't recall the correct term) The current way seems to be more in line with a normal ventilation technique. ------------------------ I'll deposit a question: Why did it matter what Jeffs Garziks environmental conditions were like if these units are (supposedly) rated up to 105F operation? (Has this changed?) I assume Jeff wasn't roasting himself in his home. I myself am a fan of Avalon but keep in mind that does not mean I will overlook some glitches. Was Jeffs errors about software and not temperature? I think Ngzhang seems to think it was just a bug. I would love some confirmation that this is indeed the case. Edit: I live in an environment where temperatures reach 105F to 110F pretty regularly. I plan to move the device even further south where it will probably be just as equally hot. BFL devices were last rated only for 95F operation. |
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What I would at least like to see in the next batches are better use of forcing air in the fins of the heatsinks especially when adding more modules.I bet it would decrease temps by 5 to 10 degrees which would allow better overclocking.It should also be a more push pull fan design since the module heatsink is so long.
I actually agree, They should have probably have gone with a large 280mm+ fan assembly. (IMO only) Edit: Push/pull would have been better than what they did. I have to agree. I wonder how it will fare in summer to be honest. Jeffs machine is having issues. Some say it is heat related and other say it isn't. I wish the guy with the thermal imager (Aseras I think it was) would get his machine soon. |
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Disadvantages
The small size of the exposed contacts, and the large area of exposed thermal pad makes it easy for small parts, such as 3x3 mm DFN packages, to float on the pool of molten solder under the thermal pad during assembly. This causes the parts to make no contact to the printed circuit board pads in some instances. Due to the excellent thermal characteristics of this mounting package, it is very hard to rework the device, as hot air reflow typically does not offer enough heat to the thermal pad without damage to surrounding board material or parts. Oxidation of the exposed chip contact pads after being exposed to a reflow oven during initial assembly makes solder wetting to them during rework quite difficult. Additionally there is no clearance for a soldering pencil to reflow pads under the chip if touch up is desired. Sometimes contact can be made up the sides of the DFN package contact pads, but this does not work well in practice.
Despite these limitation both BFL and bASIC had been utilizing QFN designs in their ASIC engineering attempts. Only one has switched to FCBGA due to high heat and the need to overclock their ASICs chips. |
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No over heating issues observed. Fans always running @ 1600~2200rpm. Chip temperature is about 50~60 C.
Fans will increase speed when temp goes up, 3600rpm max.
We design and produced some heatsink installed at front , but we found its unnecessary during the test.
Are the Avalon designed to overclock or are they fixed to a certain preset GH/s? |
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I just called and they said there were no inbound packages to my zipcode.
Wait there are no DHL packages to your entire zipcode for the rest of the week? Where do you live Rural East Bumfuckistan? They checked by Destination Zipcode, Name and Point of Origin. From the 20th of January till today. |
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I posted this in the Avalon batch #1 ships thread on February 4th. I just called DHL and asked about my shipment status even though I don't have a tracking number. I was surprised when she said she would help me. She asked for my address details and name. Nothing came up. I was one of the earlier orders in the first 50. So I doubt if anyone is going to get their miner this week, but I could be wrong. Give it a try 1-800-CALL-DHL and let us know. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=137534.msg1503904#msg1503904I just called and they said there were no inbound packages to my zipcode. <Raises the alert level to DEFCON 3.>  1-800-225-5345 |
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PuertoLibre,
Did you get your tracking number for the package?
I just checked in email, at site account etc. Nothing as of yet. I think it is time to start a thread and get on the horn as to why Yifu hasn't even answered any tickets up to 40 yet. He is in New York and has the ample opportunity to do this. |
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March 2013, here we come. Be of good cheer. We Avalon customers are still waiting on ours.  (see how I inserted that jab for equalizations sake?) Both are better than where bAsic left off at? Right? You got me! I cannot argue against that point. By the way, some Chinese customer said they received their Avalon unit. So the landscape of situations is changing it appears. |
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Today is Feb 6th. The worst case ship date (to date) has been pushed back some. From Late October. To Early November. Then Late November. Then Early December. Then December 10th 2012. Then add 30 days till January 10th 2013. At January 10th Add another 30 days to February 10th 2013. Now add push back the date 8 more days, to February 18th 2013. Latest push is to add 3 or 4 days on top of that to the 22nd. ------------------------- Coins the term "Inflationary DelaysŪ" ------------------------- Don't worry, BFL customer took _75 Days_ extra like a champ when BFL customers were tired of waiting on December the 10th. Whats a few more days? Imagine if you had been told on December 10th that the chips wouldn't be ready until 75 days later? What would you have done? It's a good way to retain the status quo. March 2013, here we come. Be of good cheer. We Avalon customers are still waiting on ours. (see how I inserted that jab for equalizations sake?) |
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Then, I will resolve the matter in a different manner. You have made it clear to me that you do not intend to comply with the request.
Let it be noted that I am not the originator of your personal information on BitCoinTalk.org.
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