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3821  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: Spend Bitcoins Actually Asked Questions on: December 13, 2012, 10:52:17 AM
I don't see how all bitcoin addresses forwarding to our own address is unsafe whatsoever. All it means is that the bitcoins have come to us, and we are a perfectly legal company registered and following all laws and regulations to the best of our and our legal team's knowledge. Selling bitcoins to us is perfectly legal and there is no reason I can think of that it would be unsafe for anyone to know that a particular address sold bitcoins to us.
Think harder. Suppose someone obtains bitcoins through some illegal activity (which the police find out about), they sell them to you, then the police will know that you received bitcoins from an illegal activity, and they will get a subpoena for the seller's name and bank account details. As a perfectly legal company, you will hand over this information, and the seller gets arrested. But that's not your problem, the problem is with criminals being complete morons and thinking that using bitcoins magically makes them anonymous. Hint to would-be criminals: If you obtained bitcoins illegally (or have any other reason to remain anonymous) and need to sell them in a way that can be linked to your name and bank account, use a damn mixing service ffs. Roll Eyes
3822  Other / Off-topic / Re: Problem with Probability on: December 13, 2012, 08:02:02 AM
a. 70%
b. less than 49%; how much less depends on how many houses are in the suburb, eg if there are 100 houses, the probability is 48.788%

What do I win?
3823  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: Bitcoin and quantum computers on: December 13, 2012, 02:19:00 AM
Your colleague clearly has no clue. Only certain types of public-key cryptography (including ECDSA, which is which is what Bitcoin uses) are especially vulnerable to quantum computers. Symmetric cryptography and hashing algorithms are slightly weakened, but not to the point of being "broken". Note that there are public-key algorithms which are not broken by quantum computers, and Bitcoin can switch to one of them if the need arises (the reason Bitcoin isn't using them now is because these quantum computer resistant algorithms are relatively new and untested and may have as-yet unknown flaws).
3824  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: The future of Bitcoins on: December 12, 2012, 04:49:31 PM
Quote
What are you suggesting? That a political organisation might turn down a massive bribe? Maybe you're forgetting just how massive it is. We're talking about 51% of all transaction fees, plus 51% of all newly-created money, of a worldwide currency. That's a central banker's dream (well, they dream of complete control, but I think they're all aware that's never going to happen with a world currency). You really think anyone would rather try to destroy us (with no guarantee of success, I might add) than take a 51% cut? I don't.
"massive"? Some millions $ is "massive" for you? Oh LOL. In case you don't know the guys i'm speaking about (banks, governments, etc) daily spend billions of $. Dozens of thousands of millions. The 51% cut is peanuts for them.
Also remember, if bitcoin become successfull they will lose billions.
If Bitcoin becomes successful, they stand to gain billions by working with it rather than against it (sure, it's not worth billions now, but it will be if it ever reaches the stage where it becomes a serious "threat"). And if it doesn't become successful, why go to the trouble?

The other thing is that as bitcoins increase in value, mining becomes more profitable, which means more people will mine, which makes it harder and more expensive to pull of a 51% attack. When Bitcoin is worth enough to pose even a slight threat to the banks and governments, it will have much, much, more security.
3825  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: The future of Bitcoins on: December 12, 2012, 04:26:28 PM
Quote
but really, what are the chances of that ever happening?
Well, not so low...
. . . We're talking about 51% of all transaction fees, plus 51% of all newly-created money, of a worldwide currency . . .
You are mistaken.  If you can maintain 51% of the total hashing power on the network, you will acquire 100% of all transaction fees, plus 100% of all newly-created money.  For as long as you maintain 51% of the total network hashing power, you get to create ALL blocks.  Even if others happen to create a few blocks and get ahead of you for a bit, you will eventually overtake them orphaning their blocks and replacing them with your own.
You're confusing nominal value with real value. A 51% attack can't be kept secret, it will be discovered pretty much instantly, and then who's going to buy your bitcoins or accept them as payment? Nobody, that's who. If there's ever a 51% attack, the attacker's coins (along with everyone else's) will be worthless, and if the attack continues for any length of time, they'll never recover their value as all faith in the security of the network vanishes. Alternatively, you could decide to not orphan everyone else's blocks, and then nobody will be the wiser, there'll be no drop in value, and you get to keep 51% of everything. I'd much rather have 51% of something valuable than 100% of something worthless, but maybe that's just me.
3826  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: The future of Bitcoins on: December 12, 2012, 03:55:09 PM
Quote
but really, what are the chances of that ever happening?
Well, not so low...
What are you suggesting? That a political organisation might turn down a massive bribe? Maybe you're forgetting just how massive it is. We're talking about 51% of all transaction fees, plus 51% of all newly-created money, of a worldwide currency. That's a central banker's dream (well, they dream of complete control, but I think they're all aware that's never going to happen with a world currency). You really think anyone would rather try to destroy us (with no guarantee of success, I might add) than take a 51% cut? I don't.
3827  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: The future of Bitcoins on: December 12, 2012, 02:33:04 PM
If you have 51% of the network hashing power, there are two things you can do with it:
  • Secretly (but entirely legitimately) mine more bitcoins than the rest of the network combined, making you insanely wealthy; OR
  • Do a 51% attack, which cannot be done without the rest of the network knowing about, causing a mass panic and a loss of faith in the system, greatly reducing the value of any coins you mine.

These options are mutually exclusive. You can either get rich or attack the network, but not both. There is a very strong economic incentive to not perform a 51% attack. A built-in bribe for potential attackers, if you will. Of course, a politically-motivated attacker might care more about disrupting the network than their own wealth, but really, what are the chances of that ever happening? Grin
3828  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: Trying to wrap my head around offline/paper wallets. on: December 12, 2012, 01:29:45 PM

No, since Bitcoin addresses include a checksum for exactly this reason. The chance of a mistyped address being accepted as valid is 4,294,967,296 to 1.

How does it work? I mean, if I change a letter of your address my client doesn't send the btcs?
Correct. Also (in the standard client at least), when you try (and fail) to send, the address in question will be highlighted in red to indicate that is invalid.
3829  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: Trying to wrap my head around offline/paper wallets. on: December 12, 2012, 01:04:01 PM
Isn't risky sending money to an address that I can easily mistype because I have to write it on the client manually from the paper?  Huh
No, since Bitcoin addresses include a checksum for exactly this reason. The chance of a mistyped address being accepted as valid is 4,294,967,296 to 1.
3830  Other / Off-topic / Re: PayPal balance: $1,382.12 AUD on: December 12, 2012, 12:29:08 PM
Not trying openly to endorse gambling but...

SatoshiDICE >>> PayPal Grin
That's true. SatoshiDICE gives you better odds of getting your money back. Cheesy
3831  Other / Meta / Re: Have polls been disabled or am I blind? on: December 12, 2012, 08:00:41 AM
you just gotta look closer Grin
That's a horrible thing to say. You really need to be more considerate to blind people. Sad
3832  Bitcoin / Press / Re: 2012-12-11 nbc4i.com Dublin PD: All Leads Exhausted In Bomb Threat Investigation on: December 12, 2012, 01:37:33 AM
References to Tormail and Bitcoin removed.
Quote
Dublin City Schools Representative Tracy Miller alerted police that he had received a similar email the morning of November 26. The email was traced by investigators and found to have been sent through an Oregon-based company specifically provides private, untraceable email access, according to police. Another email received regarding the threat was through another account, which is also not traceable, or accessible.
3833  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: btc and forex on: December 11, 2012, 07:08:01 AM
You seem to be a little confused about what Bitcoin is. Bitcoin is two things: it is a currency and it is a payment network for that currency. Nothing more. There are various exchanges which allow you to trade bitcoins for other currencies in the same way as regular forex markets (though I don't think many (if any) currently offer options, though it is likely they will once the market is more mature), but Bitcoin itself is not a forex market.

The Bitcoin market is currently not very liquid at all, with a market cap of only $140M, and only a tiny fraction of the bitcoins in circulation are actually available for sale on the various exchanges. You will have much trouble buying or selling bitcoins in large amounts (depending on your definition of "large").
3834  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: Turnaround time on: December 10, 2012, 04:36:39 PM
The standard client requires 1 confirmation, except for change, which can be spent with 0 confirmations (since change is sent from yourself, to yourself, and thus guaranteed to be legitimate). There is a (moderately expensive) attack against 1-confirmation transactions, though you needn't worry about it unless you're dealing with a relatively large amount of money (and then you just wait for 2 or 3 confirmations). Waiting for 6 confirmations as suggested by others is almost certainly overkill, and there's nothing special about that particular number that makes it "safe" (Why 6? Why is 5 not enough? Why not be extra safe and wait for 7?).

1 or 6. Eligius used to take 24 hours, it was ridiculous.
Eligius (and p2pool) don't actually "send" you coins, instead you get your coins direct from the block reward, which takes 120 confirmations (about 20 hours) to "mature", in case of a blockchain split (which would render the block reward invalid along with all transaction spending it).
3835  Other / Off-topic / Re: Who else gets weird transactions? on: December 10, 2012, 01:57:29 PM
I used to hold a high opinion of blockchain.info. Now I don't. What's with this blatant censorship? And why only this particular transaction, and not all the similar "offensive" ones? And more importantly, why weren't we notified of this? I demand an explanation. Dammit, we're never going to get to the bottom of this if you just silently unexist these notes wherever they appear. Besides, you're a blockchain explorer, and this information is supposedly in the blockchain. Suppose I went to the police about this (pick up your jaws, I'm speaking hypothetically here), and pointed to that page as evidence, but - oh, no, it's gone, with no record that it ever existed in the first place. Now I look like the crazy person. Seriously, what the fuck? Angry
3836  Economy / Economics / Re: What would happen if everyone got 1000 USD every month? on: December 09, 2012, 12:59:35 PM
People don't have like food stamps or a different kind of money. (in some systems, like Cuba)
Makes no difference, since the market will give food stamps value (even if it's illegal to trade food stamps for cash, people will do it anyway).

Neither the government nor the workers govern companies.
Nor would they be if you weren't printing and giving away money, so how is that even relevant?

Money doesn't come from taxes that only rich people have to pay and so the system doesn't rest on their shoulders.
Instead, everyone has to pay, although the rich still pay more, for reasons I will explain below.

People will get a fixed amount of money, so a free market and value of stuff can adapt to it (there are no free markets in socialism)
The free market will adapt by making the money worthless. Supply and demand. The demand for money is fixed (since people can only produce so much stuff to sell), so if you have an ever-increasing supply, the value will inevitably plummet.

The money will in the end go to working people
No it won't. There is no end. No matter how much money the working people make, the non-working people still keep getting their free money.

You won't be able to afford any kind of luxury, if 1000 USD are worth even less
True. And that is a bad thing. Why would anyone think that's a good thing?

Pays would therefor (I guess) be higher, so you won't have this "I'd earn as much, if I didn't work" thing
Guess again.

It isn't like a tax, because it's not bound to some specific thing (doesn't matter how rich you are)
It is bound to specific thing (your money), and therefore it does matter how rich you are. If your money is being devalued by (say) 10% every year, and you have (say) $100,000, then that's exactly the same as paying $10,000 tax per year. If you have $1,000,000, you're paying the equivalent of $100,000 tax per year.

It is no traditional minimal income, because it is added and doesn't depend on anything and isn't just for poor people/people who don't work
It is not being added, for there is nothing to add. As I said, the demand for money is fixed, so every dollar that you print is a dollar deducted from the collective purchasing power of everyone who owns dollars. By distributed those dollars to everyone whether they're working or not, you are stealing from everyone who has money (and presumably worked for it), and giving to everyone who doesn't (ie, those who aren't working).

I know, it has an effect and if you really read what I wrote you think that it will act like a tax, because the devaluation is bigger for working people, right? Do you really think the effect would be the same even though the gap between working and none working people is probably even higher than now?
The gap between the working and non-working people will decrease, not increase, and that's bad. It punishes people who work and rewards people who don't.

Also do you think it would maybe still be a better solution to have it like that rather to have this complex welfare system every country has now?
Better than what we have now isn't really saying much.

If you still think it's exactly the same would you mind telling me why you think it is?
It's not exactly the same. I neglected to mention that inflation, unlike taxation, is an invisible sack of shit. But it stills stinks, and everyone knows it stinks, though the uneducated can't tell where the stink is coming from.
3837  Economy / Economics / Re: What would happen if everyone got 1000 USD every month? on: December 09, 2012, 12:05:30 PM
Also it wouldn't have to come from other people's taxes, but from kinda devaluing the money making stuff more expensive
Same shit, different sack. If you don't understand why these are exactly the same shit, you've got more reading (or thinking) to do.
3838  Bitcoin / Press / Re: 2012-12-09 Engadget.com-Bitcoin-Central becomes first Bitcoin exchange on: December 09, 2012, 11:36:31 AM
Article is 404 in Australia. Full text:

Quote
Bitcoin-Central becomes first Bitcoin exchange licensed to operate like a bank
By Alexis Santos posted Dec 9th, 2012 at 3:09 AM

BitInstant may be aiming for a Bitcoin debit card, but it looks like a European Bitcoin exchange will beat it to the punch. After working with French financial regulators, Bitcoin-Central has hammered out a deal with French payment processor Acoba and France's Credit Mutuel bank to become a payment service provider, which allows it to function much like a bank. According to Bitcoin-Central, it's the first exchange of the digital currency to be licensed to operate as a bank and function within the framework of European regulations. Customers will now have funds held under their name -- rather than that of the exchange -- at Credit Mutuel and insured by the Garantie des dépôts, the French analog of the FDIC (Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation). Soon, users of the service will be able to order debit cards that can use Bitcoins and Euros for purchases and cash withdrawals. Yearning for some direct deposit action? In a few months, the organization will be able to accept direct deposits and even automatically convert hard-earned cash into Bitcoins. The virtual bullion has taken its lumps, but this is a development that fans of the currency can be proud of. For more details, tap the bordering source link.

[Image credit: Zach Copley, Flickr]

Via: Ars Technica

Source: Bitcoin Forum
3839  Other / Off-topic / Re: Who else gets weird transactions? on: December 09, 2012, 03:10:03 AM
I didn't send the coins but in blockchain.info's wallet you can attach public notes. It isn't a bitcoin thing.
Isn't it? I thought blockchain.info's public notes were encoded somehow in a zero-value output, making them permanently part of the blockchain. Enjoy your permanent label. (I'm in that transaction, too, BTW, and I'm just as confused as you are.)

It looks like Raided for Tor has been getting several such messages over the past couple of days, from such addresses as 1KiDSxM3tZ3VAkRFYu4CnTv51xdEbMmEJP, 1CHiLDqtigm7sMkZpGF9KahVJgkQiWGUAo, 1CPxxxSHcKupLcqUf76FxBTe2DuXtVeqwn, 1pedo9hWm94NriUuDPnZqeWddPGna81Dv. Looks like someone's trying to make a statement, although why it's addressed to us I'm not sure.
3840  Bitcoin / Press / Re: 2012-12-07 the verge - Bitcoin exchange gains clearance to operate as real bank on: December 08, 2012, 01:57:59 PM
Private key.

But it is not like what I quoted is already here. That part should be obvious to anyone. Part that seems to not be obvious to anyone is
that the stage is set for it to happen at any moment, starting right now.
Roll Eyes Apart from the fact that very few people actually use brainwallets (I'm being very liberal with my interpretation - one's brain and forehead are really two completely different body parts), you can transact with bitcoins right now without ever seeing a private key. And you always will be able to. In fact, it is likely that in the future, most people will never see a private key, instead trusting their bank to handle all the "technical" stuff for them (which, considering most of the general public has yet to figure out how to download porn without infecting their computers with half a dozen viruses simultaneously, is probably a good idea).
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