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41  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][PIVX] - PRIVATE INSTANT VERIFIED TRANSACTION - POS 2.0 - ZEROCOIN PROTOCOL on: April 13, 2017, 10:48:42 PM
EleanorZ  Thanks again for answering.

First of all it's not DASH but PIVX that has put a DASH vs PIVX comparison on there website.
My arguments are going in against that, and I wanted to figure out how people thought about it. And I already concluded that lots of people fell for it

And what I have researched and concluded for myself(obviously reading PIVX whitepaper and so forth) Was that the marketing was the strongest selling point, and its mostly directly directed at DASH.
So as my final decision was to ask people on this PIVX forum, to perhaps break my conclusions. I could explain how this PIVX marketing works (I do if you want to but I am in no need to be called a troll Tongue)


Do I am certain I can not make you or many others change your minds to the economic fundamentals I know them and seen them unfold in crypto I do want to put my final info on the matter out here and leave it at that(economics is a soft science so it would be only logical that people will disagree to the end of times Tongue ):


Dash yes had an instamine, it was during a time crypto's where much more wild and they are currently silly things such as what accrued with DASH definitely accrued with allot of other coins.
Crypto where allot more buggy than they are now, coins exchanged hands quickly definitely buggy coins like DASH, even with worst case scenario's, the coin distribution coin not have ever been as bad as people thought.  If the instamine would have happend today, than yes dash would have been a failed project from the start. But hey nobody ever called bitcoin a instamine coin even do 1 milion coins are still in one address of the original creator a major red flag we all simply take for granted, LTC creator Charlie sold over 400.000 LTC as well for instance. Also lot and lots of coins got stolen in the past via various ways included the exchange collapses of both Mintpal and Crypty.

Much more reasearch on the matter can be found here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzqGf_ak_2I
https://www.reddit.com/r/dashpay/comments/62jc3b/evan_duffield_has_no_more_than_256000_dash_and/
Dash Instamine Issue Clarification https://dashpay.atlassian.net/wiki/display/OC/Dash+Instamine+Issue+Clarification
Instamine FAQ https://dashpay.atlassian.net/wiki/display/DOC/Legacy+FAQ#LegacyFAQ-WasDashInstamined
Was The Instamine A Positive Thing For Dash? https://dashdot.io/alpha/?page_id=118
My View: Dash’s Instamine Is Not A Problem http://fintekneeks.com/my-view-dashs-pre-mine-is-not-a-problem/
Deep technical analysis of the early mining and distribution https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=421615.msg15619552#msg15619552
Confessions of a Instaminer Hashman https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=421615.msg18041424#msg18041424

Now than I compare that info to PIVX

1) Only a 100 day mining period which is what is a 100% fastmine compared to a 10% instamine
2) Masternodes and minting where the plan from day 1, aka which means creators will definitively not sell out straight way, and will keep running nodes, aka earning via selling masternode rewards.
3) POS is completely different from the POW fase, and you can not simply say that the distribution continued fairly from that point on, as the LOOT (AKA the masternodes where already firmly in the hands of a lucky few)  
4) Looking at market cap and what I could find out about the mining phase, it really does not to be heavily mined (looking at hash-rate)

I agree with you multiple coins should excised to fill up the differences, and i never said anything to contradict you on this either nor will I, but the think is in PIVX current shape and form it has not yet proven to do this, especially in the way the coin is presented in what its unique features are.

When in time PIVX will offer these differences than yes PIVX deserve its market-cap and much much more if these features are desirable to users, but that just it currently PIVX has not yet proven itself but has gained a massive market share, it can only be described that is mostly on the back of DASH, this can be seen looking at the charts, to my knowledge no big development updates have been given out that could explain this.

If in time PIVX and DASH will differ from each other than it all that ends well for the end users (use investors just have to deal with it either way)  

IF I find new info on the matter I''ll be sure to post here again. But fir now I'll  leave it at this for now, and let things cool of as some over zealous users are already taking offence to my questioning. ( I am a bit dyslectic so perhaps the fault somewhat lies with me)


  



42  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][PIVX] - PRIVATE INSTANT VERIFIED TRANSACTION - POS 2.0 - ZEROCOIN PROTOCOL on: April 13, 2017, 05:10:59 PM
Quote
IloveBTCtomuch wasn't even a subtle FUD Dash troll

Please quote one piece that is FUD ? I asking difficult questions yes, and I have a strong opinion About both DASH and PIVX, That does not make me a troll

You on the other hand attacking me personally does make you a troll Wink
43  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][PIVX] - PRIVATE INSTANT VERIFIED TRANSACTION - POS 2.0 - ZEROCOIN PROTOCOL on: April 13, 2017, 04:43:06 PM
First of all thanks for all the answers, the vibe I am getting from you guys is very similar as with DASH community. Which makes me kinda sad why did you guys join up with DASH !?!?


Quote
iloveBTCtomuch on April 12, 2017, 10:48:57 PM
I wanted know if there are some real counter arguments to these following questions.

1) Distribution, is a so called plus by PIVX, yet when you take a close look at DASH compared to PIVX POW fase it was only 100day's long and the masternode idea was already planned in, so not much selling going on.

Quote
There was plenty of selling going on. Believe me, I was there. PIVX has been around for more than a year and a half and had plenty of ups and downs in the early days. It deliberately adopted a slow, steady block reduction scheme to ensure that latecomers still had a chance to get in.

Pivx has a 100d ay POW mining period how on earth can you say it had a slow block reduction !!! I am sorry I can't get my head around that please explain why you think that is ?


Quote
If you keep good look at the block-chain you can also see still still see that the TOP 250 address still hold close to 50%, that was even worst just after the 100day POW fase.
Also the 2 anonymous creators of this coin claim to have burned up all the pre-mined coins but there where only 60.000 coins burned in that process. Which to me sounds more like a gesture to create come good will if you compare it the almost 53 million coins that exist right now.

Quote
I would very much like a similiar info on PIVX compaired to this DASH info(which completely clearly's up the instamine for me in satisfactory way other than the trolls keep bashing on it)
https://www.reddit.com/r/dashpay/comments/62jc3b/evan_duffield_has_no_more_than_256000_dash_and/


Quote
The material fact is that DASH was instamined. Those resources you cite only exist to defend DASH because there is something there that needs to be defended and justified. I am not saying that they don't justify the premine--that is something that each person has to judge for themselves. What I am saying is that I would love to show you similar information for PIVX, but it doesn't exist because there is nothing equivalent that needs to be justified. The premine, which was used to set up the first MNs for the network, was publicly burnt. That is also a demonstrable fact. If I'm understanding you correctly, you're suggesting that 60K seems too low (maybe because the number was so much higher for DASH?) so therefore there must be more to the story. If there is more to the story, no one has managed to find evidence of it in the past year and a half, and the Dev team has given us no reasons to doubt their integrity. Again, though, each person should make their own decisions, and place their trust as they see fit.

No, DASH was not a premine, that the whole point !!!! It has a much fairer distribution than most coins and definitively compared to PIVX, I urge you to better research into DASH, seeing that why most you did not join DASH


Quote
2) What features that are currently in the system that truly make a distention, other than seesaw (I find it a bit to aggressive do in favor of minters 40% or less, maybe in time minters can do some services in return as well do )


Quote
The fact that it's DASH with improvements is, of course, a selling point on its own. Every coin is a clone of previous coins; the question is how the features are improved, and how capable the Dev team is of realizing their vision. But if you want truly unique features, then yes, the see-saw mechanism is one. The decentralized governance system is another. The upcoming use of zerocoin protocol is another. The flat supply increase, following the long, slow reduction of block rewards, and the integration of MNs (IPv6 and TOR) with PoS are still others. Then you have the highly engaged community (have you gone on Slack?), and the large, active Dev team.

Quote
Dash is developing non-stop, it never stopped, at is not going to stop any-time soon, DASH just hired 8 full time members
Seesaw sounds allot more advanced than it it actually is, Dash could add it as well, but is still research what would be most fair and balance to the network as whole.
Connection types such as IPv6 and TOR, if needed will be added to Dash no worry's, for development reasons it was allot quicker to take this root.
The Goverance system ? What different form your it seems to be 1 on 1 clone off dash
Your Community yes, you are a very good community, your very similar to DASH, I wonder why you did not join DASH (Think you fell for the Instamine meme, which is sad, but I hope some will read my questions and realize their mistake)


Quote
3) I just looked at the road map again, and even down to the name change is looks like a straight up clone of dash, will it continue to do so ? I mean will it also copy past DASH evolution ? or will it go a different direction

Quote
See above. See-saw, PoS, ZP, decentralized governance, etc. No one is saying that DASH sucks. Clearly, DASH has been highly successful. But that doesn't mean that it's perfect, and PIVX is trying to take the best parts of DASH, combine them with other features in new ways, and come up with something even better.

It a bit of non-statement in case of DASH, DASH is developing non-stop. If you say DASH is take the road the mainstream and you wish to take a different road than yes.
I do think POS (do think its a bad idea to go POS, at least for the foreseeable future) And adding Zero-cash tech is also a very different step, I will vote against zero-cash it's trusted setup implementation for sure when it comes to DASH do the fact the you now need trust both  the coin and the developers, instead of having a trust-less block-chain.


Quote
4) Also is there any way to find more info on the creators of this coin ?

Quote
https://pivx.org/pivx-team/
Or go on slack and talk with them yourself--they're very, very accessible.

WOW what a large team, how did this came to be ? all these people working full time ? This to me sounds very unlikely, as your coin marketcap just recently exploding (on the back of DASH I may add)
But if they are why ? Why did they not join DASH than ?

I think the whole point is a bit sad at no point did seem like PIVX team and community tried to join forces with DASH, but just straight up cloned it for the most part. At the same time Evan Duffield definatily tried to join with bitcoin but was not let into it.

I'll keep a close eye on this project but up until you deliver something ground breaking, I do not think your marketing cap and your very rich announcements 2 owners deserved such a very big payday. But most sad of all is that PIVX created a unneeded fork from DASH, that makes crypto most less strong than it could be, and giving enough time Goverments will completely put us in a small box and it over and done with satoshi nakamoto Dream.

If you guys can provide me with the same level of info as is available on DASH it's instamine, I would look more favorable on your coin but it clearly does not, anyways thanks for your time, my decision is made, DASH remains the crypto-currency for the mainstream, ready end of 2017 (and please don't clone evolution just go your own way).
44  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][PIVX] - PRIVATE INSTANT VERIFIED TRANSACTION - POS 2.0 - ZEROCOIN PROTOCOL on: April 12, 2017, 10:48:57 PM
Hi,

I wanted know if there are some real counter arguments to these following questions.

1) Distribution, is a so called plus by PIVX, yet when you take a close look at DASH compared to PIVX POW fase it was only 100day's long and the masternode idea was already planned in, so not much selling going on.
If you keep good look at the block-chain you can also see still still see that the TOP 250 address still hold close to 50%, that was even worst just after the 100day POW fase.
Also the 2 anonymous creators of this coin claim to have burned up all the pre-mined coins but there where only 60.000 coins burned in that process. Which to me sounds more like a gesture to create come good will if you compare it the almost 53 million coins that exist right now.

I would very much like a similiar info on PIVX compaired to this DASH info(which completely clearly's up the instamine for me in satisfactory way other than the trolls keep bashing on it)

https://www.reddit.com/r/dashpay/comments/62jc3b/evan_duffield_has_no_more_than_256000_dash_and/
Dash Instamine Issue Clarification https://dashpay.atlassian.net/wiki/display/OC/Dash+Instamine+Issue+Clarification
Instamine FAQ https://dashpay.atlassian.net/wiki/display/DOC/Legacy+FAQ#LegacyFAQ-WasDashInstamined
Was The Instamine A Positive Thing For Dash? https://dashdot.io/alpha/?page_id=118
My View: Dash’s Instamine Is Not A Problem http://fintekneeks.com/my-view-dashs-pre-mine-is-not-a-problem/
Deep technical analysis of the early mining and distribution https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=421615.msg15619552#msg15619552
Confessions of a Instaminer Hashman https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=421615.msg18041424#msg18041424

2) What features that are currently in the system that truly make a distention, other than seesaw (I find it a bit to aggressive do in favor of minters 40% or less, maybe in time minters can do some services in return as well do )

3) I just looked at the road map again, and even down to the name change is looks like a straight up clone of dash, will it continue to do so ? I mean will it also copy past DASH evolution ? or will it go a different direction

4) Also is there any way to find more info on the creators of this coin ?

Thanks in advance ( a potential investor)
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