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Could you update the OP with price details? I'm curious to how this solar panel project will fare price-wise. Doesn't seem like it would do well but I don't know much about solar panel prices so I could be wrong.
It can be anywhere from $.50 to $2.00 depending on if you make your own panels or buy premade ones. |
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Well either the power becomes a major factor or if the growth is slow then the 2016 halving will stop it.
Yup, once the halving happens it will be a whole new game. Do we know when exactly when halving will occur at this rate? |
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http://igg.me/p/822701/xWhat do you guys think? Legit or scam? If this is real it could mean that difficulty would go up even more and our old miners would become obselete even faster. My thoughts: 1) A 14nm ASIC is unlikely to come from a crowd funded source with no ASIC experience. 2) There are many problems with scaling ASICs that have not necessary been solved. The results may in fact be disappointing, maybe in the range of 1.6% faster and not as much power reduction as expected. 3) 14nm is very new and hasn't had time to mature. There will likely be smaller ASICs in coming years, but the huge gains are in. No it is more of a factor of using more ASICs not vastly faster ASICs. So I wonder if difficulty will plateau then? The difficulty rate growth will slow down, but the real question is when. Personally I think there is still more than a year before we start seeing a real plateau. At some point the amount of power used for bitcoin mining will become a limit to growth. Yeah. That's what I was thinking. At some point, the electricity costs will decide the plateau of difficulty. Interesting opinions! |
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http://igg.me/p/822701/xWhat do you guys think? Legit or scam? If this is real it could mean that difficulty would go up even more and our old miners would become obselete even faster. My thoughts: 1) A 14nm ASIC is unlikely to come from a crowd funded source with no ASIC experience. 2) There are many problems with scaling ASICs that have not necessary been solved. The results may in fact be disappointing, maybe in the range of 1.6% faster and not as much power reduction as expected. 3) 14nm is very new and hasn't had time to mature. There will likely be smaller ASICs in coming years, but the huge gains are in. No it is more of a factor of using more ASICs not vastly faster ASICs. So I wonder if difficulty will plateau then? |
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"I am a Graduated Science Engineer major with a 3.84GPA from Atlantic City, NJ, USA. "
Scam...a person with the credentials offered would have not made this egregious grammar mistake
Yeah. That's true. I'm wondering when the improvment in ASICS will stop. Uh, never. Unless bitcoin and all other SHA-256 coins go bust. I'm guessing you don't want that. But what's going to get better? Optimization I guess. Probably not nm. |
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"I am a Graduated Science Engineer major with a 3.84GPA from Atlantic City, NJ, USA. "
Scam...a person with the credentials offered would have not made this egregious grammar mistake
Yeah. That's true. I'm wondering when the improvment in ASICS will stop. |
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http://igg.me/p/822701/xWhat do you guys think? Legit or scam? If this is real it could mean that difficulty would go up even more and our old miners would become obselete even faster.
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I've been getting into trading recently, and I can't find how to download the end of day data for a lot of cryptocurrencies like drk/btc into a spreadsheet. How do you guys do it?  |
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hi. how much amps it need to power on a normal antminer s1 ? and for the s2 ? can someone tell more about current needed to mining...**Two panels with 250W and 8.5A each one will power a S1 and keep it cool with a corsair cx500m or **Five panels to power a S2 with the internal psu?? The amps and watts are right? thanks. For our purposes amps it watts/volts. Example: 350 watts/12 volts = 29 1/6 amps. The panels will depend if its 24v or 12v. If its 24v it has twice the wattage and also means you need half the amps. So 250watts and 8.5 amps means its 29 1/6 volts? An S1 could get away with probably 400 watts of panels $200 if you make it yourself. The quoted specs on solar panels only run for about 4 hours a day, so a little more would be necessary to get through more of the day. A cx500 (what I"m using now) would work as it has about 500 watts on the 12v rail for the miners. Five panels? We need the ratings. The 12v from the panels would probably need to get around the internal PSU, I'm not familiar with how that works. If you're using a grid tie system then I guess it doesn't matter how many panels you have. |
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Using 12 panels of 190W each with a 3KW inverter (originally wanted to have a 3KW system, but on installation we found that it wouldn't fit on the roof). All professionally installed and legally connected to the electricity utility through their meter. The feed-in tariff is fairly small, so using it to offset the electricity provider's cost makes a lot of sense. I'm getting 6 AU c/KWh as a feed-in tariff, while my provider charges about 54 AU c/KWh during peak time (there is a time-of-use formula, which I won't go into right now). This system produces more than 7 KWh/day during winter time (now, down under), and about 13 KWh/day during sunnier seasons. It is a completely conventional installation, so I won't post any photos. The miners are just connected to standard residential electricity outlets, and do not care if the electrons come from the roof or the utility. There used to be a subsidized generous feed-in tariff here, which made PV systems very attractive, but the politicians decided that they can't afford the subsidy, so it was terminated. It doesn't fully supply all the bitcoin mining needs, but helps put a slight dent in the energy bill.
Cheers
Yeah that's pretty cool. If I make my own solar panels I can save money and not vet it nicely installed and hook them up toy minersx but this is probably the better long term strategy. T |
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This is an interesting thread, however you may consider a more 'conventional' approach: Instead of having a system dedicated to mining, why not simply use a standard grid-tie PV system. This offsets or covers your mining electricity cost during sunny hours and allows you to mine using the grid during dark hours. Standard grid-tie systems are common place, relatively low cost and accepted by neighbors/planning authorities/electricity providers. These may be eligible for some 'green' subsidies in many countries. Another factor is the WAF (or SAF=Spouse Approval Factor), where it is easier to convince of the merits of such an investment on wider financial/ethical grounds.
I have a PV system of about 2 KW peak capacity that provides partial offset of my mining electricity costs. The electricity provider pays very little for energy that I feed into the grid, but charges 'like a raging bull' for the KW/h that they provide, so it makes a lot of sense to use internally all that the sun provides. This of course doesn't help at night, but I don't need to buy and maintain large battery banks. If some day I stop Crypto-coin mining, the PV system will still provide a useful function in reducing household electricity costs.
Cheers
That's a more conventional and easy approach to the problem. As you said, building a battery bank is expensive. How many panels you are using to get the said 2KW? Also let's know the watt ratings of panels. If possible you are invited to post some images or drawings of the connections if its not conventional. In my state, NJ, the power company said that small grid tie inverters are illegal. You'd have to check in your state. I would have to get the grid ties professionally installed. Grid tie inverters are not very efficient and power companies pay pennies on the dollar for that electricity. Also, this would mean you need an input outlet of electricity into the miners and an output outlet to the power company, and there might not be enough power outlets in your house. I still think running the solar panels with a small battery to even out the voltage and then switching to wall power the rest of the night would work cheaper. |
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I think you are confused a bit. Those batteries are not monster huge.
They are normal Tubular 100AH 12V battery connected in series. 2x means 2 no of batteries.
So in total the battery bank will give 24V 100AH. That battery is connected to a 24V/1500VA Inverter to get backup.
To reduce the power cost I'm looking to implement solar or other possible solutions like genset or so.
In my opinion if Solar is used its better to just plug the psu in inverter and connect the solar panels to battery rather
than directly connecting 12V to ASIC devices. Then we can avoid the replay and converter. What yo think? Do you
know how efficient the generator thing is?
Okay. I see. You're taking the batteries and making ac power with the inverter and then converting it back to dc power with the PC power supply and I assume the batteries are plugged into some ac, to DC chargers? So is it ac wall ->charger -> batteries -> inverter -> computer PSU -> miners or Ac wall -> PSU -> miners. When power is up Charger -> batteries -> inverter -> PSU -> miners only when power is out 100amps is pretty large...the largest ones on amazon are like 40amps and $50-60. I can think of many options that aren't very efficient. When I get home tomorrow night I'll make a good diagram of this. I feel like this'll require either a 24v to 12v step down or a whole overhauled battery charging scheme. For a backup inverter like this 100AmpereHour is pretty common and normally used everywhere here in homes. In youtube, I found a tons of guides and a few good ones. Thanks for wttbs to putting it here. My current setup is like below, see the image. Also I'm looking where Generators diesel/petrol/LPG is economic to run for this.  I'm going to ask some professional electrical engineers today and see what's the best for this system. I feel like diesel generators are costly and inneficient. I did some research in using fossil fuel ac generator sets. They are no where near to afford as a system for running 24hrs. Their cost to output ratio is very high and dropped that fossil fuel plan. Will look more into Solar + Grid Setup. As per my calculations when we combine the solar+grid ROI is 15 months and its very great. Solar alone is expensive for this purpose due to the need for a large battery bank to get power when Sun is down. If we are setting up a full solar setup minimum 35 12V 100AH batteries for continues 24hr 1KW/H delivery. At robotics in my high school I'll talk to them about it, is having a battery bank for backup when there is no power still a viable option? Overhead cost for 35 12V 100AH batteries is huge. So its not a viable option in my opinion. One 100Ah 12V battery will cost around 100 to 130 USD. So USD 3500 for the battery bank alone. And the no of solar panels need to be almost doubled to charge this big battery bank. So need atleast 15 no of 12V 250W PV Panels. $190 to $200 per PV panel cost another $2850 for 15 panels. Adding all minimum 8000 to 1000 USD and which is very high for running such a small 1KW miner. Alright. So I learned a few things. 1. The efficiency of DC to AC on an inverter is around 70% and if you have a computer psu that's around 80% then your efficiency is really really bad, especially since the whole point of this is to save electricity. 2. The batteries you have cannot be used for backup and solar regulation for the miners. That would need complex voltage sensing and still wouldn't be perfect. 3. The diagram above that I edited would work fine. The best way would be to buy an 24v-12v step down because that would be the steadiest 12v power available. 4. If you get 12v solar panels and run that through the solar charge controller with the batteries in parrelel you would be ok. 5. Apparently solar panels only get max output around 4 hours a day. |
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I think you are confused a bit. Those batteries are not monster huge.
They are normal Tubular 100AH 12V battery connected in series. 2x means 2 no of batteries.
So in total the battery bank will give 24V 100AH. That battery is connected to a 24V/1500VA Inverter to get backup.
To reduce the power cost I'm looking to implement solar or other possible solutions like genset or so.
In my opinion if Solar is used its better to just plug the psu in inverter and connect the solar panels to battery rather
than directly connecting 12V to ASIC devices. Then we can avoid the replay and converter. What yo think? Do you
know how efficient the generator thing is?
Okay. I see. You're taking the batteries and making ac power with the inverter and then converting it back to dc power with the PC power supply and I assume the batteries are plugged into some ac, to DC chargers? So is it ac wall ->charger -> batteries -> inverter -> computer PSU -> miners or Ac wall -> PSU -> miners. When power is up Charger -> batteries -> inverter -> PSU -> miners only when power is out 100amps is pretty large...the largest ones on amazon are like 40amps and $50-60. I can think of many options that aren't very efficient. When I get home tomorrow night I'll make a good diagram of this. I feel like this'll require either a 24v to 12v step down or a whole overhauled battery charging scheme. For a backup inverter like this 100AmpereHour is pretty common and normally used everywhere here in homes. In youtube, I found a tons of guides and a few good ones. Thanks for wttbs to putting it here. My current setup is like below, see the image. Also I'm looking where Generators diesel/petrol/LPG is economic to run for this. I'm going to ask some professional electrical engineers today and see what's the best for this system. I feel like diesel generators are costly and inneficient. I did some research in using fossil fuel ac generator sets. They are no where near to afford as a system for running 24hrs. Their cost to output ratio is very high and dropped that fossil fuel plan. Will look more into Solar + Grid Setup. As per my calculations when we combine the solar+grid ROI is 15 months and its very great. Solar alone is expensive for this purpose due to the need for a large battery bank to get power when Sun is down. If we are setting up a full solar setup minimum 35 12V 100AH batteries for continues 24hr 1KW/H delivery. At robotics in my high school I'll talk to them about it, is having a battery bank for backup when there is no power still a viable option? |
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I think you are confused a bit. Those batteries are not monster huge.
They are normal Tubular 100AH 12V battery connected in series. 2x means 2 no of batteries.
So in total the battery bank will give 24V 100AH. That battery is connected to a 24V/1500VA Inverter to get backup.
To reduce the power cost I'm looking to implement solar or other possible solutions like genset or so.
In my opinion if Solar is used its better to just plug the psu in inverter and connect the solar panels to battery rather
than directly connecting 12V to ASIC devices. Then we can avoid the replay and converter. What yo think? Do you
know how efficient the generator thing is?
Okay. I see. You're taking the batteries and making ac power with the inverter and then converting it back to dc power with the PC power supply and I assume the batteries are plugged into some ac, to DC chargers? So is it ac wall ->charger -> batteries -> inverter -> computer PSU -> miners or Ac wall -> PSU -> miners. When power is up Charger -> batteries -> inverter -> PSU -> miners only when power is out 100amps is pretty large...the largest ones on amazon are like 40amps and $50-60. I can think of many options that aren't very efficient. When I get home tomorrow night I'll make a good diagram of this. I feel like this'll require either a 24v to 12v step down or a whole overhauled battery charging scheme. For a backup inverter like this 100AmpereHour is pretty common and normally used everywhere here in homes. In youtube, I found a tons of guides and a few good ones. Thanks for wttbs to putting it here. My current setup is like below, see the image. Also I'm looking where Generators diesel/petrol/LPG is economic to run for this. I'm going to ask some professional electrical engineers today and see what's the best for this system. I feel like diesel generators are costly and inneficient. |
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Sector7G that will not work that way much. Conservation or energy is still valid.
These solar panel are very less in efficiency for convert photons to electrical energy.
Normally a solar panels efficiency is at 20%, means it will convert 20% of what you give.
Now, with 15 Watts LED you will get less than 3Watts from Solar panel. (15*.2=0.30Watts).
Even if we consider getting 3 watts you need 284 such LED lights in practical case you need more.
Do you think its viable to run such a system?
The possible two options and the best among it is to running on grid power during non solar time.
The second option is to have a lot of batteries to backup for 12 to 15 hours to run 850Watts load during the night.
That will be a mess and need a big investment and not worth the money for mining.
Actually, the 15 watts is the amount of power the LED flood light uses. But the output is equivalent to a 100 watt incandescent flood light. It's over 1,000 lumens. So I was just wondering if that might be enough to power the system. I'm not sure if the wattage of the bulb is the best way to measure. The amount of light reaching the panel is what matters. This is sort of irrelevant to mining but no way. You can't get more energy out than what you put in. The panels efficiency is 20% so there is no way this could happen. Look on YouTube. |
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Yes we both realize this. We want to use wall power when it is available and solar and batteries as backup |
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I think you are confused a bit. Those batteries are not monster huge.
They are normal Tubular 100AH 12V battery connected in series. 2x means 2 no of batteries.
So in total the battery bank will give 24V 100AH. That battery is connected to a 24V/1500VA Inverter to get backup.
To reduce the power cost I'm looking to implement solar or other possible solutions like genset or so.
In my opinion if Solar is used its better to just plug the psu in inverter and connect the solar panels to battery rather
than directly connecting 12V to ASIC devices. Then we can avoid the replay and converter. What yo think? Do you
know how efficient the generator thing is?
Okay. I see. You're taking the batteries and making ac power with the inverter and then converting it back to dc power with the PC power supply and I assume the batteries are plugged into some ac, to DC chargers? So is it ac wall ->charger -> batteries -> inverter -> computer PSU -> miners or Ac wall -> PSU -> miners. When power is up Charger -> batteries -> inverter -> PSU -> miners only when power is out 100amps is pretty large...the largest ones on amazon are like 40amps and $50-60. I can think of many options that aren't very efficient. When I get home tomorrow night I'll make a good diagram of this. I feel like this'll require either a 24v to 12v step down or a whole overhauled battery charging scheme. |
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https://www.dropbox.com/s/qdvrwk1x7x5phse/140627_185044.pngUnfortunately I'm on a road trip, but I edited the photo. I was thinking of using one battery on a charge controller like this in 12v mode http://m.ebay.com/itm/351004581852?nav=SEARCH another possibility is you could use the charge controller in 24v mode and then force it into 12v with yet another converter. That converter will however make the 12v output more steady than the direct 12v through the charge controller and battery which might be better for the miner. Adding a converter is not an option for me. Also battery backup for the psu is necessary due to the possibility of power cut during night time. I already have an 24V/1500VA Inverter and 2x 100AH battery. Which willl give a backup of atleast 2 hours for me during power cuts. I'm trying to add solar to this setup without adding any more battery. Hope keeping that in consideration you can advice further. Okay. I didn't realize the battery was going to be used as a backup when the power goes out. My power goes out very rarely so I never thought about that. So your inverter goes from ac power to 24v DC? And what charger are you using for the 2x 100a monster batteries? The best option for this might be to charge up the battery by solar when the sun is up and then by inverter for when the sun is down. Since you have a 24v inverter, I can't think of an easy way to make the batteries 12v without a complex switch which would disconnect and reconnect the batteries from each other to create 12v. How are you making 12v from the batteries for backup right now? |
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Liking this thread. It never ceases to amaze me just how many different types of peoples from so many diverse backgrounds and strengths can be brought together via this thing we call bitcoin! Would love to one day have access to some serious natural energy to run a huge farm and support the network  Definitely cool. I like green energy and am the electronics/programming leader for my New Jerswy award winnng high school robotics team. I'm interested in the tech part of bitcoins  . I know some others like the finances, anonimity, and the trading of bitcoins too! |
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