the uncertainty of whether things like data feeds will remain as part of the core XCP protocol, and or whether integration of ETH VM will occur and the former will get deprecated is stopping me from mentioning this technology to some cool projects.
just an FYI
Things like data feeds will remain part of the core XCP protocol. I have never heard anything contrary to that. |
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I don't particularly think one is better than the other. Sorry, but that is incorrect. Maybe if you are using monopoly money, they can be functionally equivalent. - The security of Ethereum - a potato inside a cardboard box without a finished consensus mechanism, a brand new untested blockchain, and a small network
- The security of Bitcoin - hashing power of more than the top 1000 supercomputers combined, distributed worldwide, with 5 extra years of development, superior liquidity by a factor of 3000x+
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Can anyone tell me why someone would want their smart contracts running on Counterparty instead of Ethereum? Is there any advantage besides the security of the Bitcoin blockchain vs the security of the Ethereum blockchain?
Your blockchain will not undergo an unprecedented change from POW to POS in 12 - 18 months. Who knows what that will mean for businesses on Ethereum, of which there probably won't be many. Yes, exactly. The dimensionality of factors that can screw up accounts and liquidity entirely either through malice or accident is exponentially higher than with BTC. |
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Can anyone tell me why someone would want their smart contracts running on Counterparty instead of Ethereum? Is there any advantage besides the security of the Bitcoin blockchain vs the security of the Ethereum blockchain?
No, apart from the fact that your money or assets are encoded on the only chain with real consensus and a workable solution to the Byzantine General's problem, there is no benefit. I guess if you don't care about network stability or who overwrites your coins and assets, you are free to use Ethereum. (And Counterparty smart contracts will let you read BTC blocks, BTC transactions, BTC balances, and engage in nlocktime and other BTC scripting) As to whether Counterparty will become used for a specific project, I can't say, simply because I don't know.  It really just depends on what engagements materialize, and the requirements of each one. The way I see it: Once you establish rapport, giving tangible metrics of certain inefficiencies (in applicable fields) resolved by using Counterparty instead may be a stepping stone once a private solution is implemented. However, only calculated graphs, simulations and a 3rd party assessment will be convincing. I do hope these solutions are by definition modular and interconnectable as stated before. |
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With the advent of new and new platforms which promise the world such as Fluid and Treeleg, the definition of what a sidechain is has become completely ambiguous and subjective.
This is why I propose that Counterparty is now an embedded consensus sidechain. Please refer to is as such. This makes Counterparty the only functional sidechain in the world.
I expect a price bump of at least 10%+ as a result.
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Most of this is the unsexy behind-the-scenes work, but they are major strides in helping Counterparty to be a stable and solid option for building a service on, or using in general. For example, Counterwallet stability is much improved over what it was (still not 100% of the way there, but moving in that direction), and the "undolog" updates are very useful for several industry players, like Tokenly.
I'm going to be an enthusiastic optimist and realize that this is 'unsexy' work is exactly what needs to be done if you want XCP in production for business clients. |
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It would be nice to have some announcements or information on any of this though. Panic selling perpetuates too quickly in silence. |
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I am not criticizing the devs. They have their rights to do more profitable things and they are also under the pressure of their angel investors now. I am just expressing my own frustration and warn others that Symboint investors spend money not for counterparty but only for private ledgers for banks.
So what? They said their software can be connected to Counterparty and is all part of the tech stack. Private ledgers are great for making money, and many vastly successful Linux distributions use exactly the same business model. You are warning others that Symbiont isn't spending money on Counterparty... but all their activity and statements suggest that they are. Where's your evidence? Also, smart contracts are waiting on Ethereum to have a stable release, then they will be ported. Stability and performance updates are happening regularly (see last week for example). This 'delay' has nothing to do with XCP devs. It's a strategic decision. And you realize that all of the core devs of Counterparty are still working on it? And XCP is open source, so anyone is free to contribute code. You don't need to wait for investors or devs. Do you mean we can enable smart contract in mainnet by ourselves without permission of core dev? Yes. You can make a fork, and if people prefer to use that one, then it will be the main fork regardless of the devs. But if you manage to implement that, it makes sense that the devs will simply add your code to the official repo. But keep in mind that the limitation on smart contracts is waiting for Ethereum to finish them, so that there aren't any consensus issues later. This is all extremely security critical code, which makes it even more challenging. Counterparty regularly has formal security audits, bug bounties, and a high standard for security. If you can ensure that you retain consensus with Ethereum, and create production ready code which stands up to the security parameters, then I'm sure the dev team will consider it. You can have smart contracts in the next 24 hours, if you happen to be some form of rainman savant. |
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I am not criticizing the devs. They have their rights to do more profitable things and they are also under the pressure of their angel investors now. I am just expressing my own frustration and warn others that Symboint investors spend money not for counterparty but only for private ledgers for banks.
So what? They said their software can be connected to Counterparty and is all part of the tech stack. Private ledgers are great for making money, and many vastly successful Linux distributions use exactly the same business model. You are warning others that Symbiont isn't spending money on Counterparty... but all their activity and statements suggest that they are. Where's your evidence? Also, smart contracts are waiting on Ethereum to have a stable release, then they will be ported. Stability and performance updates are happening regularly (see last week for example). This 'delay' has nothing to do with XCP devs. It's a strategic decision. And you realize that all of the core devs of Counterparty are still working on it? And XCP is open source, so anyone is free to contribute code. You don't need to wait for investors or devs. |
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If Counterparty team keeps the current pace, I think it will be overtaken sooner or later.
Since the current pace is nearly a standstill, I would have to agree. The devs work on a private repo, and there are regular updates on the public repo as well. The illusion of a slow pace is because the devs don't promise anything in advance, they deliver code regularly and that's what gets real, tangible results. If they wanted to pump they could advance flashy buzzwords 12 months before any code exists, and write 4 page blog posts about theory. Remember, Counterparty simply showed up. There was no 12 month announcement and e-mail list building. The code showed up, posted by anonymous devs. XCP seems strange among other Bitcoin projects for this reason, because it's about results much like the work of Satoshi. Having some experience with dev teams, I much prefer those that code and network with known Wall Street players and finance giants instead of create theatrics to appease a small user-base. But maybe that's just me. Since Symbiont is funding Counterparty and says it's a 'core aspect' of their toolkit, I doubt it's 'nearing a standstill'. |
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rootstock.io (Port ETH VM to a BTC pegged sidechain)
If Counterparty team keeps the current pace, I think it will be overtaken sooner or later.
So they have a landing page... and are proclaiming to port an unfinished engine onto a theoretical concept. Is anyone supposed to be impressed by this? They said a white paper will be published in couple of weeks. I am waiting to see how they plan to solve the side chain support and security problem. In case the plan is reasonable, a token with fixed exchange rate with BTC and can be instantly converted to Bitcoin could be much more attractive than introducing a new coin, such as ETH and XCP. "We will publish a short story about how it could theoretically work, maybe. In a few weeks..." Sigh. Enthusiasm is no substitute for code. |
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rootstock.io (Port ETH VM to a BTC pegged sidechain)
If Counterparty team keeps the current pace, I think it will be overtaken sooner or later.
So they have a landing page... and are proclaiming to port an unfinished engine onto a theoretical concept. Is anyone supposed to be impressed by this? |
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For some reason it's not loading for me, so I'll mirror it here: Symbiont and Counterparty
August 20, 2015
At our recent press-event, we issued a number of smart contract-based financial instruments onto the Bitcoin blockchain. This is the culmination of over half a year of hard work by our development team, and a major milestone towards our overarching goal of rapidly developing a platform for the issuance, management and trading of blockchain-based securities.
We had a precise business goal in mind when we started Symbiont, and it was clear that our vision for our securities platform required the full expressiveness of a smart contract implementation. As several realities became abundantly clear to us on both the regulatory and technical fronts, we developed technology based on Counterparty, but which differs from Counterparty itself in a number of key ways, being optimized for a private network with known participants. This technology (layered on the Bitcoin blockchain) was at the root of the demonstration we provided.
Symbiont as a business is, as it has always been, a separate entity from Counterparty. We build products to match our clients’ needs, and Counterparty (as an open, public platform) cannot service all use-cases. However, Counterparty is a core part of the Symbiont “tech stack”, with entirely complementary technology to the other systems we are developing. In cases where public network on public blockchain (Bitcoin) solutions are most appropriate, Counterparty is the prime tool in our toolbelt.
Effectively, nothing has changed with respect to our enthusiasm for the potential of Counterparty, and permissioned ledgers will augment Symbiont’s platform offerings, not compete with the many market uses for Counterparty. We will continue to support the Counterparty ecosystem by providing development resources, funding Ivana Zuber in her position as Executive Director of the Counterparty Foundation and handling incoming business development inquiries. However, as we onboard more clients and partners, and develop more products, we will not be able to discuss if, why or how that client product uses or does not use Counterparty. (Determining use of Counterparty should be clear to anyone via a Counterparty block explorer.)
These are exciting times for blockchain-based technologies, as we stand at the beginning of replacing the core archaic, error-prone banking and securities technology in use today. We thank you all for your interest, and will continue to issue announcements on the relevant blogs (Symbiont or Counterparty) as things develop further. |
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This update should address the availability issues we and others running counterparty-based services were occasionally seeing with counterparty-server when Bitcoin "stress tests" were ongoing. We have an additional in testing right now that will make network reorgs not require a full reparse, instead being "rolled back" almost instantly. (Currently, counterparty-server currently needs to reparse the blockchain data on a reorg, which can cause availability problems as well.) The tl;dr of this is that with these two updates, services built on counterparty-server should experience a resolution of any previous availability and stability issues. This will help the entire Counterparty ecosystem to be more robust as a whole. It's really encouraging to see development progressing like this. I think this (and the performance enhancements) will definitely draw more developers to consider Counterparty for production. Hopefully the naysayers trying to convince us that the party is over will quiet down a little now. Great work, guys! Meanwhile, I'm sitting here racking my brain about what the next update might be... |
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Is XCP still relevant in the crypto scene?
Is anything except XCP and its Bitcoin meta-protocol relevant at all currently? I'm having trouble with my search... Everything else seems to be an out of consensus Bitcoin fork. +1 However as i said back in the beginning of post-burn, and again now, Counterparty needs greater marketing effort. Symbiont is a small fish in the sea of potential adopters yet whenever i check this thread symbiont is all everyone talks about. Counterparty revolutionises finance, it hitches on the back of bitcoin protocol fame, security and robustness. It makes new coins like ethereum irrelevent. Question is, How can we maximise efforts to tell the world about Counterparty? thats all that is needed! Symbiont is the best marketing you could ever ask for. i know its great marketing, but its not the only marketing Counterparty should be relying on, There needs to be more exposure in the developer community I think. With the Ethereum smart contracts VM, there will also be more focus on XCP. At the moment the secret is in the code... |
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Is XCP still relevant in the crypto scene?
Is anything except XCP and its Bitcoin meta-protocol relevant at all currently? I'm having trouble with my search... Everything else seems to be an out of consensus Bitcoin fork. |
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https://niceplum.bandcamp.com/Check it out guys! Paying with Bitcoin will be available soon. Also anyone who has the Niceplum asset can send me a PM, and 1 can be traded for a full version of the album! I hope you enjoy it.
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All the haters ruined a beautiful coin
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Was ist Overstock bzw. wie ist das mit den Anteilen gemeint? Hat Overstock Anteile an Counterparty die es verkaufen möchte oder möchte die Firma Assets über Counterparty ausgeben? Danke! edit: sehe das es schon ein Weilchen her ist. Hat sich da überhaupt was ergeben? Counterparty ist ein Gegenstück zum Mastercoin bzw zu anderen btc 2.0 coins.
Ursprünglich hat der Entwickler von CP für den Mastercoin gearbeitet, die haben sich dann durch Missverständnisse zerstritten und er hat CP gemacht.
Wie bei allen 2.0 Coins ist großes Potential da, aber bis heute noch nichts Bewegendes geschehen.
Overstock hat vor kurzem bekannt gegeben, dass sie evtl Firmenanteile (oder stocks) über einen der Beiden oben genannten verkaufen wolle.
Counterparty devs haben sich mit Overstock nicht vertragen und haben eine eigene Firma gegruendet, Symbiont, welche investoren von Goldman Sachs und den ex-CEO der NYSE angelockt hat. |
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