Looks like the pool is down again; website is unreachable and all my worker are on the backup pool.
yep  pool is down about 2 hours already... urstroyer, please, investigate stability issues. Server is up and running again, sorry for the outage. I identified the possible source of the problem and will report back soon. |
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Hi,
Just a simple question about when a Bitcoin block and Namecoin block are found simultaneously.
My original intuition was that a hash for a merged mining header which Generated a Bitcoin block would also be able to generate a Namecoin block due because the difficulty of Namecoin was lower than that of Bitcoin.
I was later told that this was in fact false. While merged mining it is quite possible to find a Bitcoin block without a Namecoin block and that dual Bitcoin-Namecoin blocks, while possible, were relatively rare.
However, since urstroyer set up PoolServerJ for yourbtc.net all of the Bitcoin blocks (4 now) have come at the same time as Namecoin blocks.
Can anyone explain this? Does PoolServerJ somehow do something clever with the header to guarantee that Bitcoin blocks always come with Namecoin blocks? Is this just coincidence?
I think if you take a look at the yourbtc.net site, you'll see that the shares were not the same as the bitcoin share for this round are about 600 ahead of the namecoin round. I do find it quite interesting that we seem to find these blocks so close together though. In fact the total (valid + invalid) shares of btc and nmc rounds are the same if a "double block" has been found before and we are still hashing for new blocks. BTC share count on the website is 600 ahead because these are the valid shares. I will clarify on the pool website that these numbers are total shares - invalid shares. The reason why nmc invalid shares are currently higher is, that cgminer don't care about longpoll on new nmc network blocks as far as i understood. |
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After a few days, it is safe to say, that merged mining implementation works really well. Already over 20 nmc blocks where found, distributed on double geometric method and converted to btc for payout. This should be a nice boost for your mining rewards. We recently added luck graphs for each blockchain, if you are interested: https://yourbtc.net/content/luck-bitcoinhttps://yourbtc.net/content/luck-namecoin |
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I really like chapter 6.2.*. Haven't found that much information about this topic anywhere yet. Even countermeasures are described.
Awesome work Meni like always, you are a gift!
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Oooooo, I didn't know we were sharing box stack pics. I'll have to go take one today to post.  As promised, box P0rn in all of it's glory.  Enjoy. Awesome! |
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I've noticed you are parsing the website of yourbtc.net for data. It would be great, if you could use our json api: http://www.yourbtc.net/api.phpCheers, Chris |
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I would just like you to test out the software before coming to conclusions as to what is going on.
I would not donate to a project, nor spend my time giving you the suggestion to use the psj software, unless I thought that the results it produced were valid.
After you first mentioned it, I reviewed the PoolServerJ source code and was impressed by its high quality. Its pluggable design is also admirable; seems like a top notch backend all-in-all, certainly worthy of a donation! So thanks for bringing it to our attention  Agreed! Already merged mining ready out of the box, really easy to set it up and of course compatible to pushpool database tables. Next version will even be huge: psj will generate work and blocks internally. bitcoind won't be a bottleneck for pools anymore. |
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Those are some impressive graphs, at first glance! However.. I notice they're from november 1, and you were mining on yourbtc.net. A quote from their main page: Higher Stale Rates fixed
Submitted by urstroyer on Wed, 10/26/2011 - 16:50
The problem is hotfixed for now.
We are now accepting stale shares from NMC chain as a valid share until we have a more advanced solution.
So you won't have any disadvantage using cgminer now.
So it seems you've been a victim of faked stats. This is an excellent example of masking invalid shares. From your screenshot it seems the pool has good rates. While in fact there's no net improvement at all: nothing has changed in the income of the pool and nothing has changed in the payouts of the pool. The rewards are just redistributed, now favoring those who would otherwise have more stales. Of course, this takes earnings away from people who are actually mining efficiently. But they conveniently forget to mention that fact.. There's an additional problem with masking stale shares: It becomes harder to tweak your rigs/setup because you don't get any useful feedback on stale shares anymore. Sorry, you are just wrong. These stats are far from faked. The invalid share detection works perfectly fine for BOTH blockchains (BTC/NMC) since 2011-10-31. The mining client gets feedback of invalid shares from the main blockchain (BTC) only, so thats the stale rate that can be compared to both merged mining and non-merged mining pools like abc. You can take a look at my comment here: https://yourbtc.net/comment/145#comment-145But even if NMC blockchain stale shares where accepted as valid shares, there is exactly zero difference to invalid share handling on btc blockchain, because valid/invalid shares are handled seperated for each btc and nmc. |
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What? It's a PPS pool. It has to have a buffer. Each time the pool finds a block it puts the money in the buffer. Then money from the buffer is paid out to the people little by little as they do work.
Proportional doesn't have a buffer. I just pays the reward out to everyone when it gets it and splits it up based on how many shares each person put in to the round (even if they are no longer mining.) PPLNS is the same but it pays out based on how much work you are doing at that moment (which prevents pool hopping.)
There is a difference between PPS and SMPPS: PPS - Pay Per Share. Each submitted share is worth certain amount of BTC. Since finding a block requires <current difficulty> shares on average, a PPS method with 0% fee would be 50 BTC divided by <current difficulty>. It is risky for pool operators, hence the fee is highest. SMPPS - Shared Maximum Pay Per Share. Like Pay Per Share, but never pays more than the pool earns. |
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Registration still open until the pool reaches 100 Ghash/s.
Thats the point were i have to figure out if current donations are enough to compensate the risk i'am taking to keep paying rewards if pool runs unlucky.
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This very long round could be a result of a bug at recent psj release which only affected nmc blockchain. See this post here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=33142.msg599834#msg599834If there was a technical issue, it's clearly fixed now. Payed out 20 BTC on my own and several nmc blocks found before frontend was finished (transaction loyality bonus). I think it should cover it really well. |
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Backround script for share calculation messed up.
Its running smooth again. Every submitted share was credited, no worries. Got some blocks!
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@DavinciJ15: Are you running 0.09 right now? I run into a 1 million share nmc round and just wondering if you already succeeded in finding a block with this version?
Thanks for help, bro!
No I am not running it right now but just about to set a server with it installed. Msg shadders with your properties file and see if he can see anything wrong. I hope it's just a settings issue cuz I'm going to turn off push to upstream. We already talked about it, couldn't find any unusual. I seems to be just bad luck or variance. PSJ is running smooth like always! |
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@DavinciJ15: Are you running 0.09 right now? I run into a 1 million share nmc round and just wondering if you already succeeded in finding a block with this version?
Thanks for help, bro!
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Not sure yet, if you have any suggestions let me know.
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In order to support Merged Mining and get a fair reward of namecoin blocks we did major updates on the pool:
- Loyality Payout has been done and the feature is now removed
- Therefore all upcomming NMC earnings are distributed on Double Geometric Method just like BTC
- NMC earnings are automatically converted into BTC on current exchange rates and put into the payout queue
- All stats are independent for each chain (BTC & NMC) in the frontend
- According charts will be updated soon
Awesome! What's the current plan for the transaction fee rewards? Yes of course: The method handles transaction fees as is as long as you determine B correctly. It needs to be the total block reward corresponding to a share's getwork.
Did some homework after Meni's feedback, in order to determine B (block reward + transaction fees) correctly when a share was submitted: bitcoind version 0.5 will get a "getmemorypool" call, which is capable to get the btc amount of transaction fees, if the current network block would be solved at that moment. So the distribution of transaction fees will be included into DGM on yourbtc.net as soon as it's technically possible. |
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In order to support Merged Mining and get a fair reward of namecoin blocks we did major updates on the pool:
- Loyality Payout has been done and the feature is now removed
- Therefore all upcomming NMC earnings are distributed on Double Geometric Method just like BTC
- NMC earnings are automatically converted into BTC on current exchange rates and put into the payout queue
- All stats are independent for each chain (BTC & NMC) in the frontend
- According charts will be updated soon
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Does anyone know what happened at the pool recently? The pool's hashrate and estimated payout graphs both flatlined for a few hours.
It seems like bitcoind got stuck in middle about 9 hours ago. Fixed it with server restart. If it happens again, i will take a more detailed look into it. Currently finishing DGM on NMC blockchain, if all goes fine, it will go live today. |
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I am now running on this pool with under 2% stales. See sig.
I'm glad you've managed this. It would have been a shame if your monsterous hashing power was taking a 4-5% hit. I've been working pretty hard on my stales and my average for this round is 1.67% (only 8000 shares though) so until there's a change to the server software I doubt either of us will be able to do much better. Thanks for your results.
I'am currently in contact with shadders (poolserverj dev) and gathering log files atm.
Keep you informed if got an update.
Excellent. I hope this is not interfering too much with the plan to start using DGM for the Namecoin block rewards at the start of November. The problem with higher stale rates and cgminer is hotfixed for now. We are now accepting stale shares from NMC chain as a valid share until we have a more advanced solution. You find a more detailed and technical discussion here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=28402.msg597031#msg597031A slightly higher amount of stale shares is still a side effect of MM and frequent long polls. Stale rate will stilll decreasing a little bit in future with namecoin difficulty increasing. |
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