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"Post fakes & find out the truth a bit later" is a typical maidan-troll behavior template. Almost all of their "online projects" like censor.net.ua, stopfake.org and many others are constantly doing these crappy things. I even sure that keymone2 & chopstick are two sides of the same person.
"Almost all of their "online projects" like censor.net.ua, stopfake.org and many others are constantly doing these crappy things." is this your mindshield to protect yourself from going to those sites and seeng things you think are truth are actually propaganda? you must be desperate to save your parallel reality where putin is saint and everyone tries to kill him  |
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Actually that youtube video have been uploaded by some random bloke. That guy could be Russian, Ukrainian, even Chinese, American or Zulu. I have no means to find out. Only Google and maybe God knows that (but I'm not sure about the second). Practically I can't even rule out that you made it for supporting you standpoint here about Russian lies  . So this is not a good example. did i also make that reporting in russian media as shown in second video? truly russian way of thinking - instead of admitting a mistake continue blaming everything on "evil outsiders who want to destroy slavic world!" @Balthazar "I even sure that keymone2 & chopstick are two sides of the same person." oh i can't wait to see what chopstick has to say about that |
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You seems to indirectly prove my point. I everything from Russia are lies and false propaganda then logically the other side must say the truth . false dichotomy. me saying all from russia is lies does not mean me saying all from ukraine is truth. by the way here's a fresh example of russian lies - remember that video with "suspected ukrainian ballistic rocket" and shattering glass? a message from @chopstick here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=518645.msg8444051#msg8444051it was reported by russian media to be a ballistic strike by ukrainian army and it was actually russian rocket blowing up near Baikonur cosmodrom in 2013 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mV6ct4GW7pw |
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I think he does, or is well paid to do so, which, if true, is worse. Not saying that Russian channels don't show (counter-)propaganda, but I saw an interesting tidbit on the Solovjov's talkshow on Sunday. He invites various politicians and they have rather long discussions about various political affairs, Ukraine being one of them. If the issue is international, he often invites someone from the country of interest. Last Sunday, a member of Ukrainian parliament (they are not all gangsters, but those who aren't often get physically beaten during the parliament sessions for speaking their mind) was among the guest debaters. She had the following interesting observation: it's like two parallel realities in Ukraine now. What she sees happening in the country in her capacity, and what is shown on TV, which turns to be a kind of parallel virtual reality.
Read a newsitem yesterday, where a Ukrainian officer voiced an opinion that some third party operates on the territory of Ukraine, shooting both at freedom fighters' positions and at the same time at National Guard positions, trying to stoke the flames even more. Though I am not convinced by such statement, there are plenty of 3rd parties interested in instability on the Russian border or economic gain or both, from Kolomojskij with his private army and outlook to more property acquisitions, to the US.
Humanitarian convoy is forbidden to make stop on the territory of Ukraine until it reaches its destination: http://lenta.ru/news/2014/08/21/stop/They are still at the border, though. Last I read yesterday, the Ukrainian officials didn't show up to inspect the cargo. oh wow, so far it was me suspecting many pro russians of being paid by kremlin. believe me or not - for what i'm saying i'm not taking a dime because it's an honest world view that you too can have if you just spend bit more time investigating the facts. "Not saying that Russian channels don't show (counter-)propaganda" counter-propaganda to what? russia started it's propaganda war in late 2013 when euromaidan happened. i remember one particular moment when propaganda just became too obvious - it was Kiselev's reporting of Ukraine committing suicide. man if there are any checklists of what propaganda message should include - that report would fulfill all of them. it had everything from outright blatant lies to skewed information to using specially crafted rhetoric and wording that forms one's worldview. after that point things just went downhill. if you really truly care about truth - why don't you go through entries on stopfake.org from oldest to newest and cross-check how many things you consider a fact were actually proven to be russia's propaganda? and the virtual reality created by TV is exactly what you experience by watching russian media, ukraine just doesn't have enough experience to compete with that. |
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Do you really think that those gangsters in the Ukrainian parliament and their personally owned news channels are are the ultimate source of the pure truth? You can't be that naive...
please do quote me where i'm saying that |
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Sorry, guy, but... Do you have something except "russian propaganda" in your dictionary? Maybe you need to spend some time for self-development? This could be very useful.
it's not my fault that all coming from russian media is propaganda or did you not see hundreds of proven lies coming from russian national television and other kremlin puppets? |
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"hi, my world view is completely formed by russian propaganda, i found this video with more russian propaganda, it is so true and awesome, must watch!" that's how i see you mate, sorry |
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So they are not going to attack the cities and just let the "terrorists" continue to kill civilians. Did I get you right?  And how this meets your previous statements that the valiant army of Ukraine is already cleaning Lugansk from the "terrorism plague"? It seems that you are going right into the land of wet dreams and wishful thinking...  "Did I get you right?" well almost, you just have to think a little bit harder but i believe in you! "Ukraine is already cleaning Lugansk" well there's a difference between bombing the shit out of city and making accurate targeted strikes and cleanup operations against terrorists. i'm sure you can figure it all out - you've basically solved the puzzle, i know it's hard but i'm cheering for you! |
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So, according to your logic, the Ukrainian army allows the militants to kill civilians, so as not to have civilian casualties? Did you finish school and with what grades? Regarding the Ukrainian army as such, read this article and watch this video. I'm curious whether you actually believe that this army is able to gain victory over anyone? "allows the militants to kill civilians, so as not to have civilian casualties?" i'm wondering where are you getting this from? seems desperate move to put at least some responsibility on ukrainian army - has everything else failed? nobody allows killing civilians, but it is obvious that if army just storms into the city a lot of people are going to die. or is that not obvious to you? as for state of ukrainian army - it was deliberately being destroyed for 20 years and to see it operating with whatever mistakes there are - i am amazed and happy. and looking at map of rebel controlled territory over past 5 months - they do operate and are pretty good at it. i wish them quick victory and minimal losses - that's all i can say. |
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Do you have any reason whatsoever? If "terrorists" are attacking each other why the Ukrainian army can't still overcome them? How long do we have to wait? If "civilians are hurt as a consequence" by pro-Russian "terrorists" (since "they are simply going batshit crazy with weapons putin provided them"), why do they run for cover to Russia? Even Ukrainian soldiers try to find refuge in Russia! Will you deny this?  "If "terrorists" are attacking each other why the Ukrainian army can't still overcome them?" ah, now you start asking right questions, my answer will probably be still "nazi-ukro-lies" for you but believe it or not ukrainian army is trying everything to not have civilian casualties. i concede that they are not perfect at it but this is a very good question: "why did they not blow Donetsk to pieces if they are the evil nazis russian propaganda claims they are?", you're progressing "why do they run for cover to Russia" because people run where they feel safe. some run to russia and some to ukraine and i'm sure both options are fine, russia certainly is not going to hurt refugees - they need them to fuel their propaganda stories. "Even Ukrainian soldiers try to find refuge in Russia" ukrainian soldiers that didn't have other choice but to fall back to russian territory and later went back to ukraine - yeah, that happened. if it proves anything it's russia is not yet going full-retard to shoot ukrainian soldiers getting away from terrorist fire. sorry to disappoint you but this is not evidence that ukrainian army is falling apart |
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Are you from Ukraine? If so, then it explains a lot! It makes no sense for "terrorists" to use Grad against civilians, they would thus be losing ammo in vain, which they probably desperately need to withstand the junta. Your words lack pretty obvious logic... i am indeed from Ukraine though don't live there for a while but know enough to not get bullshitted by russian propaganda "makes no sense for "terrorists" to use Grad against civilians" unless they are having internal conflicts and are attacking each other and since they make a habit of using civilians as live shield - civilians are hurt as a consequence? or they are simply going batshit crazy with weapons putin provided them and have hopes of blaming it onto ukrainian army. gonna be hard with that since video does show firing happens from rebel-held territory, right? "the junta" do you mean current russian government, because it matches definition of "junta" perfectly? i don't think terrorists are fighting them, you're confused. @Nemo1024 you still failed to provide any inconsistencies in my messages - i've asked you for that explicitly. or are you some kind of religious fanatic believing blindly what your russian propaganda book tells you to believe? |
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I just state what we have by now. Without Russian gas Ukraine will get deep in trouble by winter (whether they progress in Lugansk and Donetsk or not). Add to this covert struggle inside the Ukrainian authorities, and you will see the reasons behind my statement Actually, I'm a one-quarter Ukrainian... "Without Russian gas Ukraine will get deep in trouble by winter" - with EU reverse we can live through winter and see Russia collapse under sectoral sanctions if it decides to start gas war yet again Ukraine and reverse can fulfill 100% needs of general population, industry will be hit and economic crisis will deepen but i'd say you're pessimistic or you just really-really-really want to see Ukraine fail. well, time will show. meanwhile terrorists use GRADs from within Donetsk city: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7XPLGHKoPLc and it apparently hits living districts as some eyewitnesses say |
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I expect that everything will be over for the junta in Donetsk and Lugansk till the winter (and it is not given that Ukraine as a state will survive it)! Lugansk and Donetsk are shelled, and they would be shelled and bombed even more but for the lack of available means. I have no doubts whatever that the Kievan junta would be just as happy to wipe away these cities from the Earth if they only could. But they just can't... "it is not given that Ukraine as a state will survive it" you must be very happy thinking about this! a real patriot of russia, a real son of stalin and lenin! good for you! |
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Okay, let's assume for a moment that what you say has some relevance to reality... You say that "one district of Lugansk has been taken and cleaned from terrorism plague" and "there is some actual progress made from Ukrainian side" (does it mean that there was no actual progress before?), so when will the "terrorists", as you call them, be done with after all? Could you give us a date by which everything will be over? How long should we wait, a week, a month, a year? no i cannot give you a date, can you give me a date when terrorists will win? i'm just happy to see the progress, that's all so what do you have to say about Lugansk and Donetsk not bombed to shit like Grozny? or is hypocrisy a requirement to be supporting russian side? |
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I remember that the Ukrainian authorities had already declared Lugansk taken about a month ago (or was it Donetsk?). I'm curious if you really don't see that Kiev is losing the war? Time passes by, but they are still where they were over a month ago... interesting definition of "losing the war" you have. Kyiv has reclaimed more than 75% of original rebel-held territories and pushed them back to their main centers of power and main sources of live shields that protects them from being cleaned up in a matter of days because Kyiv was never into bombing the shit out of whole city just because there are terrorists in it. That's russian strategy which we not only have seen in Grozny but we've read about it in field notes from Chechnya war of probably-dead-or-evacuated-by-GRU terrorist leader Girkin. so yeah, i see progress and i see lots of "gruz 200" coming back to russia in those humanitarian trucks. |
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and while russian nazis here are drooling over imaginary victories of russian terrorists there is some actual progress made from Ukrainian side - one district of Lugansk has been taken and cleaned from terrorism plague
lets hope for quick progress from this point and fast death to terrorists, the end is near.
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Iraq, Afghanistan were occupied by the US. Hundreds of thousands of civilians if not more died between the 2 countries. And now after we pull out of Iraq ISIS has taken over large parts, committing genocide and killing tens of thousands more. Mission accomplished right? How is that for a contribution to global security? Libya - An absolute atrocity. NATO bombed the shit out of Libya and deposed Gaddhafi, now they are ruled by islamist extremists. The IMF took all their gold and the country is now in debt.. Syria - There were calls for NATO intervention but thanks to Russia and some serious resistance within the ranks of the US military it never materialized. Lybia bombing by NATO was sanctioned by UN which means it was not vetoed by Russia. how come you are not demonizing Russia to same extent as you demonize USA? much hypocrisy? |
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an unprecedented period of peace has been challenged by Russia's aggression against Ukraine. - NATO
LOL
Yeah, tell that to the people of Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria, Sudan, Somalia, or Libya... or any other country that has seen the horrors of USA/NATO intervention.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NATO_Operations#2001.E2.80.93present - among those countries you've listed NATO only had operation of enforcing no-fly zone over Lybia what is with this demonization of NATO anyways? they are pretty much a police-like entity in the region and they usually don't act without UN aproval |
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The Nazis entered Zhdanovka.
that's enough to make conclusion about retardedness of author, thank you |
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