You speak about weexchange.
I speak of Mt.Gox! Karpeles is still there, with everyone, working on it. What planet are you living on? I'm serious, but you are living in a universe where Karpeles has disappeared, the Gox document showing their desire to rebrand and rebuild doesn't exist, and, well, I don't know where to start. I can understand you don't believe they got their hands on 200,000 BTC that they "lost", but that doesn't even have to be true for my statement to be true. Wow... so even bankruptcy isn't a hint for you to know that you lost? Im astonished. Lets see if it works better than the numerous other lost business where the owner claimed he will pay everything back somehow. |
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Monopoly Geld ist es ja nicht wirklich. Wer seine Gewinne nicht ordentlich angibt macht sich strafbar. Wobei das größte Problem ist dass niemand darauf geachtet haben wird Nachweise für Verluste und Ausgaben zu erstellen. Jetzt sind viele Exchanges bereits unwiederbringlich kaputt. Dann überzeuge das Finanzamt mal dass du dort und dort Verluste durch Betrug und "unregistrierte" Aktiengesellschaften gemacht hast. Wenn du Pech hast war das dein Privatvergnügen. Wenn noch mehr Pech müsstest du mehr Steuern zahlen als du überhaupt Bitcoins hast da deine Verluste ohne Beweis nicht anerkannt werden. Verrückt das Ganze. Ich denke die Probleme mit Bitcoins werden jetzt langsam anfangen... steuerrechtlich.
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I sometimes had the impression that just-dice might be the first step in hackers washing stolen coins from MtGox or elsewhere. I mean its easy to clean there and when i see how people came in with thousands of bitcoins that they played away in an instant i asked myself who has this money and where is it from. Now it slowed down.
Is there a competitor that could take the bets? I dont know of another site with similar max profits.
Maybe a player survey would be a good thing in case player miss something.
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*lol* So i missed the notification link for this thread and after a month i checked the notification section of the forum to see your post. I guess youre right now after MtGox solved his technical problems...  They're all there working on it. Filed for protection, and working to rebuild their business, and get back people's money. What's your problem? You speak about weexchange. I spoke about mtgox where you were so sure that one only needs to wait so everything will be solved. Whatever... "i will give you back your money later" is a pattern that was used by many scammers in the past and it never yielded the result that the debtors wished. I want to know what happened otherwise i cant judge what the chances are to recover my funds. And i cant imagine a thing were the chance of receiving the funds are lower when the debtors dont know it. I mean everyone knows that something is wrong. So if its a hacker or something he knows already too. It simply makes no sense that the only one that dont know what happened has to be the debtors. |
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Why are people so calm?
I have over 10 BTC stuck, and I am calm simply because I spoke to someone with knowledge of the matter and (s)he believes that everyone will eventually get their BTC back. I was told it could take long, there are government agency(ies) involved. If what you says is right then the correct step would be to involve a lawyer. Simply because when the government really seized the weexchange funds they seem to not understand that these arent weexchange funds but funds of actual people weexchange had in escrow. I dont see a reason that could make it correct to keep normal peoples from their own funds. Or in worst case pay out a single sueing individuals losses from other peoples money. Regardless of if this individual was scammed by an IPO. Ill do the fourth try to contact the forum lawyer now... No, I'm not hiring a lawyer when Cryptocyprus has far more coins stuck than I do and has pledged to be the last one to get paid back. No way. Patience has always made me money or helped me not to lose it. Just look at the people selling BTC on Mt.Gox at ridiculously low prices because they fear that the place is insolvent. Instead of waiting for the technical problems to be resolved and get their whole amount back, they panic, and sell to get fiat. Even Andreas A. said he has no reason to believe they are having trouble other than technical. *lol* So i missed the notification link for this thread and after a month i checked the notification section of the forum to see your post. I guess youre right now after MtGox solved his technical problems... |
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Who cares? The MtGox money is gone. You're just trying to catch him in a lie. Waste of time.
Ken. Do you have the Bitfunder Tender List? Because if you don't, fess up and admit it so we can all set fire to a pile of ActiveMining shares in our minds. And if you do have it, post it, so we can see that you have it and so someone else has a copy besides just you.
Burnside published the full assetlist for all Bitfunders stocks at Bitfunders closures before, here's the Activeminer part from that list. ActiveMining 300 158wnLCrsrkpgrLA7SnQ4BsKiekqL2d3aC
ActiveMining 200 18kX8W8ANcEDtkQ1f8frLR5ukssRcY3r3c
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ActiveMining 200
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ActiveMining 250 16Q6GhFgPSerwECA2XV4y6VZQEiui52BbU
ActiveMining 3 17LczfYPbxGW7Cw7osAmqwWFVDELe19o6m
ActiveMining 136 1Kouu6vz8ysUuaTkB22CYUWNdP4rJL8SFs
ActiveMining 160 13dvZVdMfX7mGTn1fyKm2iFqCqNfaeTB26
ActiveMining 44 14thDEBcVAaLPoqbtm6Pq59WfufPa8LAf3
ActiveMining 250 12sH1fiNNT7vz6YHBgSMYV6iDnPoxcEbm1
ActiveMining 100 1H7StWxWe4L7ELfZ2aVukaohAX7WP2F4JW
ActiveMining 335 1QAos9RjChPYjxGdhXgjUngnq3aCWk7zXj
ActiveMining 1,608 1FpvKh7rP5MpCqGPbc9oGmu6KaXod1vpT
ActiveMining 29 1A6Bc7qrXr8WFjKJBqZhywVXvx11coLqgp
ActiveMining 260 1MdPwq8tdu4a3kYjtoBvTGdCUpP1qjpXGo
ActiveMining 4,725 1BRyszipKLfwj44r85wEVRW7BUCrgofbgd
ActiveMining 517 14mGVbj4CEXjCULgcpexGXhPmbgSmVNVrg
ActiveMining 1 1CrEWyYDTYgubRb5ux71Bwyvu2KvuFiQYR
ActiveMining 125 1DVjPEotsKTZa91eSopzTNgWpokhvAvi4Y
ActiveMining 6 19qbowSZbRdDK44fcFMcwxPPSTjYQ1H69A
ActiveMining 3 1611xfHEi2TjT5ih8b4J5zuNnXDAtKT6En
ActiveMining 209 1NqouLd1nPH3CFQ2Tzw3XibyxWGxmFGXGL
ActiveMining 96 1B34iEvHosCDVDYfpdowHCoYDtsQXvrWqs
ActiveMining 655 15hm8XXgP1B8TaU1LG7KAKdYRfnDXJhJAp
ActiveMining 10,596 1SYxZQrhGwFCAY6hFNWMJtiZiHthF32rw
ActiveMining 4 1QFmHvwkcxeFXNRsWUwhAeLMGLmRawsHhk
ActiveMining 52 19Ei3TRu6xQRyKfvXC9b4ibGy3fUTPwj5Y
ActiveMining 4 14VKJe4zMZMFih5bHfRDrVJAk94VxcBpCz
ActiveMining 1,000 1PSP8V8Z1AUU8xgHPAjvLPzdS1rP31o6ko
ActiveMining 545 12LnGdSP53vJFRdE9gYp3PHYRG11CKrLmh
ActiveMining 3,417 1PhmF3i2Kh6Q7gDF3tVsPPycBP9myPQp3P
ActiveMining 2,795 1HCRxMps4ew7i4qGy6s1famCNtFUKYY9Hr
ActiveMining 8,621,699 16yTynjmSe5bsRGykDaaCL5bm2pxiEfcqC
ActiveMining 38 17W6rsQVgPjBGrvZJz35gH6CaN8Gqi27Ed
ActiveMining 7 1DEfKUvx9cnSmkfPNB1AW7RPUhRA3eS1pJ
ActiveMining 4 1EjmRBCTUs7esrKE3pxnJGyiQiTfxTJbFp
ActiveMining 1,965 1GYYxseH1TSuQmoa1TU6qin19uuhb1mYiZ
ActiveMining 5,506 17vU8gTEnVmSLsLRwMKMvW47VLAgy8jadN
ActiveMining 100 1BuPXECyPoaJLzYmPkoYPqaNWki5QUKiUX
ActiveMining 6 1h4rpshPMgYba6ZNaRdHF9nEKtPWiAxzf
ActiveMining 847 1FHzGXKvFoKuS6PhxJrVgPWM5nDBQjctRy
ActiveMining 30 18BfHRvBnpTTDNY1dNTazonEyLfG3aTXfj
ActiveMining 1 1EmrbLDymA6WKHBZfXeA2sXFvp2FrHDmwe
ActiveMining 2,477 1QC5fDdHv92jqwbLJpZi1HVi527tQrRdHZ
ActiveMining 620 1HpVUGyw4kdktDMrrPzMLaX1nLm7ZRdff8
ActiveMining 1 14LBheoQAmtYkfbS2BwxmEcnbN2va3mNAM
ActiveMining 5,462 188ZGGV3texLSZ8ZJ9ZLL6bmvoNEVWJBkq
ActiveMining 15 1PYjdgo5G7L6TVYeEZ5itYT8tm6R1sLpM9
ActiveMining 130 1JnAcjXvTgB9oF8ZQvchtydmgeLXrZtoRf
ActiveMining 300 18Gq3mWyPhRs7hb9YSfDdpwUmoS5DNXWnM
ActiveMining 60 1KEzFTTSPkWwgF79fQsUGWpDW651gfpvNi
ActiveMining 4,906 133yWZHeRdS2hnqpZyv525kHoipAnnX6zb
ActiveMining 200 1CCr1hsozDNPUjBMr67wW2xA2mc61Bqfpw
ActiveMining 1 1AbyfrvNyoEkyT993aPz3x4zajeXp188Wj
ActiveMining 250 1Mo9aZLMmjVQc21fZfkeRX5Zc1FvwdSa85
ActiveMining 13 1558RcigPVdKCBbYR5euqbeQtUtyf8fC9k
ActiveMining 4,000 1DLHHuzuB3nwqthDujsHseiZ4iRDhoStPp
ActiveMining 9,161 16PqDWLt3jkBaoiTPRa5KKr2bMFoWS9HMD
ActiveMining 312 13yugH9QA5pX3dqnjGLufQdWVCX3xDAdpC
ActiveMining 30 1iWhqYZw8JuctpiaoQoA94ynEdY3sNWtd
ActiveMining 4 148pAhd5rcHNDLthFxRayzRj6QiEoc1tJ6
ActiveMining 4 1JMDsor5LLSxtoNTvysAkta4k22yWM1ZpN
ActiveMining 55 133mjXxpe2tssKSkh75KzCVutTUCfLPmho
ActiveMining 28 1KAwqg4SFNF1XRTdzkLc5y5yqUJi8ibne5
ActiveMining 65 1FtaBHyfkCaPKtiJ6RdQV42Xyuzb8UW9Gv
ActiveMining 650 16jssZJWoG9qboAiHtXXEmH7JyYGN49WHU
ActiveMining 1,200 1CoRevjkbgCRRadoN3faBiDY87vFe1T4Rd
ActiveMining 1,330 1MrcLUmA4D4pkgdoNDD2LufUzsxHLgNCck
ActiveMining 350 1HvEaM62s7hzx6NSahiR8fAZ1yZWXpQwZ6
ActiveMining 30 1CpgnGGHcVLV58N62xdhwdYUzQXzugdBuK
ActiveMining 8 1Bq4fhjBcXcGuXvRHVBv7MB12zb5MWzAfs
ActiveMining 35 1D7itdS1zHHvH8e5X3DaNWAApvmYjGbM3W
ActiveMining 5 1ErwFMcsXRNJLzKKEGX41LZYiPerBnhdYA
ActiveMining 3 1CiPSLjkJwcgHJbXifzb5GXCC1ZeYw8ncB
ActiveMining 117 18dfp8MKT3jBu63cwBHNSiQKcARHHawNXh
ActiveMining 928 16KfgXYXkBauSwgmsgPXqFd8WeGmHJtxhs
ActiveMining 2 1GsbqGqMhhvPd2hf4fs4KoeZmCzDkk8kQ3
ActiveMining 230 1FL8muz4bvaP2988b1GfUJerAtJS4VoTzY
ActiveMining 640 15mhfrP55utA1xJ9dBywEN1WfQJ7GvZt4r
ActiveMining 77 1PRvh9TnPJsFzuWGcXXbH3gbnJjSdAfRic
ActiveMining 2,200 Balance 1Dxg9ZazutpaNkS3Yu5NwMsBHuHTRPdkn
ActiveMining 6 1NzkwARErLvmAvUCFkMLGkC3EMFBv6Vy51
ActiveMining 55 1AFzExNQEFDwwnwznGkhMq7adAandQUnri
ActiveMining 23 1FeZ3BSKpQFXBAndiSSR2PA8EPzoX36on2
ActiveMining 35 18ZYpPUSa6eMWhVNJGq5Pz1pgktGeRvAA2
ActiveMining 103 12CnTse3rB3e7YRBqen11LaQzNzkDHyxmn
ActiveMining 1 1KQGkUnvvqyYUpfA3bBZjJKwr8apnM14mZ
ActiveMining 7 1PBN7yhi6JLEa6VV31npGLV2ehrepoYdyR
ActiveMining 250 1NdgoSqkbQcxsFtToPS1cQqj4EiBjLm8cj
ActiveMining 122 16gx8QmZvqbVitakDGcSTgaLEx4M2ozMeM
ActiveMining 400 13kXLHtomcThqskYhuy1UuzQZB1Mcy1iUE
ActiveMining 1,005 1DDhPhsydLh6dDgAg7GVT3xZuYd93tjqtp
ActiveMining 75 14Ykoq9kJZyhJVCPs8DPdQwBpdfx5q2o7H
ActiveMining 10 1BAPS2p4vac5TLFE9KD6GB7o5wFRpsasfy
ActiveMining 200 1JaPU6kficLkc3DpVqEP1S18SbWyGzkHPk
ActiveMining 60 1N1iaQmuZrUHtA35S4JAscLMPNoEDVtFgT
ActiveMining 75,000 1G9CD1bVJ1E1MrUhC87sxZJ2QZ17uJqzVD
ActiveMining 404 1CoWSdKtvRAzfa3U1J2s1qNq5zXGJmLgPA
ActiveMining 1 14pcMVbxx1Ecg1CKMS6FqhhTJQFZcyAPwq
ActiveMining 72 17oN3VWW5LmkCmBMQnwc6FZM4ezj7ZZWRp
ActiveMining 96 1936Z1V6asgZLEPbUqk6fBaPUYqdU96XjG
ActiveMining 994 18JfE5ez9n7gU5tXNg1zZ9V5yX1ugbqduM
ActiveMining 10 1NnWWb6UmNdtuL1Z7Zt8KAqfCW85eYQDc2
ActiveMining 66 1ehofT1nakyCu4F9mb1j2CU6NwXgUBmGp
ActiveMining 100 1FALKEDavPSA8phx9rZNYd3N32YdjWgn8A
ActiveMining 68 1z2VB8Aicgc2xUDQBvGdx6ra8XHgX9qrs
ActiveMining 25 1KXuL99qRhsQDsLL8QweXkxAWkuSpxczut
ActiveMining 511 12fLpF3oB5rNJP6B61fTPk2CRasVi3daDm
This list is mostly useless. The majority of the shares have been tendered to Ken at this point. Previous lists should show all tenders. I dont see my shares in there and i know another user whose shares arent there too. So i think those are the remaining shares that werent moved to amctender yet and the big one in the list is amctender. |
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Just for a update, I have talked to a lawyer who specialize dealing with debt collection.
He said ,that if UKYO has really taken user's fund and not intend to return, he will going to jail because this is a criminal behavior.
and he can't hide any fund, because all BTC transaction is traceable ,right now, the only things concern me is the cost legal fee.
If going to sue him alone, it going to cost me 20-30K dollars, so I still looking for more people to join me ,become a group people against UKYO.
If anyone interest on this you can PM me ,with how much he owes you.
all cost relate to this lawsuit we be shared proportionally by joint people.
Thanks
20-30k for sueing him? Sounds like american lawyer prices after they heard what he owes you. If you pay that amount you take a high risk. I mean you not even know yet what happened. If he claims its stolen and he only can seize his personal belongings you can have a hard time getting your lawyer costs back only. I think the lawyer sounds a bit strange. It sounds like he let you think that ukyo still owns the money but only dont want to give it back. I think the problem isnt that easy. Of course he cant hide funds. Nobody knows whats the owner of a particular address. So when ukyo sent the coins to a address he silently owns and claims it was a hacker then you cant proof that he is wrong. |
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How are things coming along with the pre-ordered products?
We are getting ready to start issuing refunds again. We are also using our new 600 GH/s board as we get them in full production to solve our refund problem. Ouch... we have a refund problem that can be solved with the coins we get from the running boards? Sounds like the funds are pretty much gone already. I didnt think its that bad yet. |
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Thanks for the update, any news about the wax that you guys mentioned last time?
The wax/oil prices in the area have significantly dropped. We know people that want to take it off our hands but not at the price point we are looking for. We might have to settle if we cannot move it out at the price we want. It might be the only choice for we to unload the wax. Will let you know as soon as we make a decision. I guess thats to be expected. The market is a boom market and everyone and his friend wants to get in. Hopefully it not gets to the point where only the strong survive. Though im confident in cannabit anyway. |
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After speaking to someone in the know but who wouldn't divulge much, I am now convinced that Ukyo is being investigated along with others by the U.S. SEC and was forced to withhold people's funds and not talk about it until the investigation is complete. I further speculate that it is the same investigation into Satoshi Dice that is coming to light.
I dont see why a gag order would be needed in place then. A gag order normally only is used when a investigation runs and the culprit shouldnt be noticed about his steps being noticed. Thats not the case here since everyone knows something is fundamentally wrong. So i think thats not the problem. |
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Since i was asked to hold the coins in escrow until the buy... the escrow address for this Groupbuy is 1wascLN5FuQmi3XLBTQoRmmBfDEepubfK |
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I myself did a little groupbuy with around 15 people.
I just kept track in a little textfile who ordered what, who payed using which service, etc.
But how are you keeping track if you have hundreds of clients?
Do you use a massive excel sheet, of some other software?
Also, Do you use adress stickers or handwrite everything?
Calc(Free Excel) is a huge help. Most people dont know what it can do really. Adress stickers printing is easier for big amounts. But thats only a very small part of the work. |
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Das dürfte ein Altcoin sein. Diese Coins sind eigentlich zu nicht viel nutze außer zu spekulieren. Und da nicht viel gehandelt wird kann der Verkauf oder Kauf von Coins den Kurs stark beeinflussen. Ist immer ein Risiko in Altcoins zu investieren. Besonders wenn sie hochgejubelt werden. Dann besteht die Chance dass da jemand einfach mal ein Coin erstellt hat um damit Geld zu verdienen.
Next ist nicht einfach NUR ein Altcoin! Next wurde vom Grunde auf neu erstellt! Klar, die Verteilung war nicht wirklich fair, aber mit Vorteilen die NEXT hat, müsste der Kurs eigentlich steigen! Vielleicht macht es NEM ja besser? Irgendwie haben die meisten Altcoins ja irgendwas was sie besser machen wollen. Nur schaffen es die wenigsten Coins bis zu einer stabilen Userbasis. Von normaler Funktion als Währung ist da meistens auch noch nichts. Es ist ein Spekulationsobjekt. Insgesamt meine ich ist es einfach generell ein nicht kleines Risiko in Altcoins zu investieren. Besonders wenn man immer in das "Neueste" investiert was gerade beworben wird. Da muss man sich fragen wie sehr es wirklich eine Chance hat als Währung oder wie weit der Ersteller Geld damit verdienen will. |
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Das dürfte ein Altcoin sein. Diese Coins sind eigentlich zu nicht viel nutze außer zu spekulieren. Und da nicht viel gehandelt wird kann der Verkauf oder Kauf von Coins den Kurs stark beeinflussen. Ist immer ein Risiko in Altcoins zu investieren. Besonders wenn sie hochgejubelt werden. Dann besteht die Chance dass da jemand einfach mal ein Coin erstellt hat um damit Geld zu verdienen.
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I believe MegaBigPower pushes 1000TH of which they claim 500TH is used to pay the shareholders at Picostocks 100TH. (unfortunaly for the shareholders it's month after month "bad luck" so I guess the MegaBigPower-part 500TH got the luck) Wasn't the MegaBigPower mining operation financed by bASIC customers that got screwed by this "Satoshi superstar" Thomas van Riper ? That satoshiscumbag owes me over 50 btc. Sorry, I'm still pissed!  Im not happy with my investment in 100TH too. I hadnt realized that i only fund the business for others. Then they had delays and i got out with a big loss only. I think the only one that earned big is the one that now has an asic and a miner design for free. |
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If I didn't make myself clear:
There is no plausible scenario in which *anyone trying to get money from Jon* would to tell you to sue.
Those planning to file a civil (tort) case against Jon would not tell you to sue him because you would be competing for the same (limited) funds. The more people sue Jon, the less money each one will be able to get back, the messier the case, etc., etc.
Those looking for a solution outside of the legal system obviously don't want you to sue, but assuming that you'll somehow benefit from their efforts is unreasonable. Backroom deals are seldom done to benefit the public.
*lol* Multiple accounts are confusing right... Theoretically i think youre right but ukyo not only owes privately but with a company too. The debtor's with ukyo loan could sue ukyo directly for the money. They have an advantage in sueing. But all weexchange debtor's have the problem that they only can sue when they sued weexchange first. Depending on if the company catches the problem or if ukyo made a legal error that makes him personally liable you have to sue then weexchange or ukyo in a civil case to seize funds. Though i think ukyo wont have riches you can sue him for. The only hope is to find out where the coins went and get them back. |
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Ok, i already sent 0.401BTC back to whirlpool now... only waiting for your pm to speak about how to give the account back to you now.
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I was addressing SebastianJu, who feels that it does matter... ...So when ukyo, neobee and others, that know what happened believe its better to not sue ...
I have further pointed out that Danny, being a friend of Ukyo's, would be unlikely to suggest involving teh law. Which pretty much nulled SebastianJu's argument. Assuming that major debtors' interests are aligned with yours also deserves some dynamite money. If they are trying to get money out of Jon (who does not have enough to pay back everyone), why in the hell would they want *you* butting in with *your* lawyers and *your* hand out? Bananery had it right. Those guys lost many coins themselves, they know what happened and they think its not good to sue now. Ukyo in itself is no reason of course except you add him some credits for his past. But when other big debtors say the same it means ukyo has a right point there most probably. Thats a strong hint that there might be better options. Of course... that doesnt mean that i will accept ukyo telling me nothing since i could not decide if its a clever scammer technique or a real reason then. I did not get any contact till now from someone who knows what happened that told me i should not sue. Only ff96 claimed its best to let a lawyer get in contact which hints that its a legal problem that wont be solve with sueing. @glendall... The technical problem was the first problem and that is known. Its the crashing bitcoin-deamon. Then there was the second problem that ukyo claimed its of legal nature. There was a third little problem with a block that didnt confirm or something. As far as i see it the technical problems are solved, only the remaining problem is in the work now. It sounds to me that ukyo works together with others for that and that he had to wait for them to act. That hints a bit that its really a legal matter. Anyway... i think i gave the last info yesterday to my lawyer and they prepare the letter of demand... (whatever they do...) I hope my spent money brings something back. In case the coins are seized i cant believe that this is legal since the coins arent owned by weexchange but they belong directly to persons. They cant use the coins as if they are funds owned by weexchange. Though thats my personal opinion, nothing a lawyer said. Just speculation. |
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I respectfully suggest that you are not going to get any information outside out of court case though.
It's been many months and he has said about nothing about what happened, and has lied (remember that for the first 2 months or so he said this was a technical problem solely), so I don't think he'll really offer all of bag-holders unless he is in some sort of trouble. Right now he's probably just sipping margaritas in Tahiti laughing with how he got away with this. It's pretty easy to ignore pms and emails. Especially if you did something illegal and don't fear any repercussions from having done so.
The technical problem was only the first problem. Then came the second problem he claims is of legal nature. So when ukyo, neobee and others, that know what happened believe its better to not sue when you want to get your coins back then there is a strong chance that this is right. And its better to know whats wrong before you break maybe the last chance for success. It doesnt matter anyway if he has some more months time. If he failed he cant escape. Trendon Shavers couldnt too. Bitcoin is a global community so where should he hide? So no, i dont see a reason to rush. But if ukyo dont gives any info ill think about that again. I mean if there are legal reasons then for sure my lawyer will get some info. |
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