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4901  Economy / Service Discussion / Interest Bearing Instruments on: September 16, 2012, 02:41:30 PM
For awareness, a guide to true interest-bearing instruments has been posted here.
4902  Economy / Lending / The only remaining interest bearing instruments in BTC world. on: September 16, 2012, 02:36:58 PM
I. MPOE Bonds.

These are used to finance the capital needs for the options trading better half of MPEx. Their functioning is described in detail here (look for the section on bonds), but in short: investors put up capital in chunks no less than 50 BTC, for which they ask whatever arbitrary interest rate they want. All BTC must be deposited before the start of an option month (they start/end on the last Friday of each month) and is locked down for the duration of that month. At the end of this interval, the total capital requirements for the month is calculated retrospectively and bonds are accepted up to that level. All accepted bonds are paid the highest interest rate asked for an accepted bond (which becomes the new MPBOR - for the past few months around 5%). Unaccepted bonds are paid nothing (but yes, they were locked down for the interval). Should the options bot have made a net loss during that month, that loss will be allocated to the accepted bonds, on a proportional basis.

You can review past exercises either on Mircea Popescu's blog (look for "MPOE, rezultate" month-year) or else in this btctalk thread. At this point the system has been working officially for about 7 months and informally for about one year. The worst hit investors took to date was ~48% last month, confirming earlier projections as to what a "worst case scenario" would look like. Other than that lossy exercises are actually rare.

A perk for the average forum user is probably the fact you don't actually need an MPEx account to participate.

II. The MPCD series.

This is a typical tranched CDO; you can review the full details including composition and payment schedules here. Tranche A  pays 2% a month, tranche B 3% and tranche C over 9%. Due to the capital structure (350 + 400 + 350 BTC) A's are safe even if the series loses about 750 BTC, so this should count as a very safe investment.

You do need an MPEx account to directly buy/hold these, but if you don't have one you can probably work out a reasonable deal with one of the MPEx brokers.

I am aware that there are other concoctions which purport to be interest bearing, but they are either mystery cake or else more or less managed funds of GLoBal Scam Exchange "investments". Neither of these have been ever, in the entire history of BTC, anything else than pain for the actual investor (ie, he who expects a positive return on his capital along with his capital), and as such if you aren't terribly new around here, the correctness of the title should be obvious to you.
4903  Economy / Securities / Re: Brokerage service for MPEx on: September 16, 2012, 02:20:01 PM
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European style then. Hmmm.

No, they're American.
4904  Economy / Securities / Re: [GLBSE] Nyancat Financial: Your Friend for Life on: September 16, 2012, 02:19:12 PM
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Why are you paying out to NYAN.B, let alone NYAN.C at all, until the NAV is repaired to 1?

By paying out dividends instead of retaining and rebuilding the NAV you are incentivizing investors to get the return of NYAN.C without bearing the appropriate amount of risk by redistributing the return that should be accuring to A & B in the form of retained earnings contained implicitly in the NYAN.C NAV. Not only does this introduce moral hazard but is also unfair and may constitute a breach of the implied terms of the NYAN group's purpose.

Only NYAN.A should be guaranteed dividends because it is guaranteed by CPA. NYAN.B should not be paying out dividends if its NAV is less than 1.

Well said.
4905  Economy / Securities / Re: [GLBSE] Shorting CPA / Contract for Difference on: September 16, 2012, 02:35:31 AM
And deprived has it again. Give the man a pin or something.
4906  Economy / Scam Accusations / Re: Scammer - HashKing on: September 16, 2012, 02:25:40 AM
Maybe everyone just misunderstood what sort of hash he was talking about.
4907  Economy / Securities / Re: [GLBSE] POLY - Persistent BTC/USD margin trading emulation on: September 16, 2012, 02:18:54 AM
RIP
4908  Economy / Securities / Re: [GLBSE] CPA - No Dividends for the month of August, 2012 on: September 16, 2012, 02:16:22 AM
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Wow, from oblivion to financial adviser in just three weeks!

Look at the big brain on young Atlas! Now offering insider trading advice for an asset that even the HBIC admits looks "scammy or shady". Is willing to offer forward looking statements (without the required disclaimer) about future events (without the legal format) promising returns (illegal) on unexplained events (sound just a bit like pirate yet?), and does this thinking the use of a couple of cute acronyms will lend credence to his "advice".

NVA = Net Asset Value. That's the core physical value of a share, based on actual current analysis. Not based on vague future plans.

Equilibrium = balance. The share price is nowhere near balanced, and the price has been dropped significantly due to the erratic and quite possibly fraudulent actions of the assets founder, Usagi.

Payout = actually making good on contracts. It does not mean making up rules after a default to change how the record looks. Has every creditor who bought this insurance been paid in full for all losses as required by the conditions of sale? No.

My call on this asset and it's trusted financial adviser is stay as far away as possible. This is just another ploy by a pirate-loser looking to re-coup some coins for themselves. Which may explain why Goat is hanging around here sucking up too.

QFT
4909  Economy / Securities / Re: [GLBSE] Diablo Mining Company (DMC) [140.1 gh] [6.700 mh/share] on: September 16, 2012, 02:10:20 AM
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Buying shares in s.dice will take 10 years to payoff.

Last dividend was ~7k for the whole thing, it only is selling for ~350k, so your math fails on that score.
Further, after 10 years you'd have both the shares in their original, pristine, mint condition and the dividends paid during the 120 months. What "pay off" are you talking about?
4910  Economy / Securities / Re: S.DICE - SatoshiDICE 100% Dividend-Paying Asset on MPEx on: September 16, 2012, 01:59:41 AM
It's not that hard really: you go to satoshidice.com and click where you see the word IPO in blue and underlined. Those are usually links on the interwebs.
At that link you will find a few nuggets of information, like the contract, a prospectus, the total dividend paid (786.15699996).

Since the total shares issued is 10 million and the owner blocks for sale add up to 6`938`859, you can work out the total dividend paid to 3rd party investors on MPEx to 240.65374250 BTC. The GLBSE passthrough holders together count for a little over 10% of that, hence the 40ish BTC payment that made its way there.
4911  Economy / Securities / Re: Bitcoin-Insurance.com on: September 16, 2012, 01:46:10 AM
Deprived pretty much has it. Not only is this in no way insurance, but it is in no way useful at this point. Back to the drawing board.
4912  Economy / Securities / Re: [GLBSE] Diablo Mining Company (DMC) [140.1 gh] [6.700 mh/share] on: September 16, 2012, 01:43:15 AM
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Bitcoin seems to be a particularly bad unit of account to be using in fact, because it is itself an investment that is likely to out-perform most markets. It is quite likely that simply buying and holding bitcoins is better than almost any investment other than ones in which someone has been talked, convinced, fooled or suckered into using bitcoins as a unit of account thus ends up owing the investors more [b[bitcoins[/b] than were invested rather than merely more buying power than was invested.

Look into s.mpoe, s.dice etc. There's plenty of real businesses making 100s and k's of bitcoins every month.
4913  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: A Letter to Matthew on: September 16, 2012, 01:23:12 AM
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You are an immoral, illegitimate person, Matthew, and I hope you extricate yourself from what we're trying to build.  I'm embarrassed to have ever defended or supported you.

Ashamed and betrayed,
-Erik

Witnessed.
4914  Economy / Service Announcements / Re: OPEN LETTER to Donald, Patrick & Amir RE: Bitcoinica on: September 16, 2012, 01:20:42 AM
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Everyone at the conference needs to force Amir, Donald, and Patrick to sign this.

You can't force people to sign things.
4915  Economy / Service Announcements / Re: OPEN LETTER to Donald, Patrick & Amir RE: Bitcoinica on: September 15, 2012, 10:56:14 PM
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Even if you disregard Nefario (GLBSE) and Intersango (libbitcoin), there's Tony Gallippi from BitPay, the guy from Butterfly Labs, Stefan Thomas (bitcoin-js), Pieter Wuille (core dev team), Jan Moller (BitcoinSpinner), Jim Burton (MultiBit), Vladimir (Bitcoin Magazine), Juraj Bednar (he's been promoting Bitcoin in Slovakia), the guys from Bitcoin Austria, and tons of people I didn't have time to meet or whose names I forgot.

That'd count as one (jurov). Get something straight: you're not in the WOT, you're not in bitcoin.
4916  Economy / Securities / Re: [GLBSE] BDT - 3% weekly interest bond, backed by Bitdaytrade on: September 15, 2012, 03:00:27 AM
Oh, looky, it's Meni trying to talk his way out of having helped a bunch of people lose a bunch of money on some "investment" of his, all the while pretending like "there isn't a btc/fiat hedging vehicle".

While you circlejerks are doing pretty much nothing at all and making a lot of noise about it, MPEx traded about 100k option contracts last month. That would be significantly more than your aggregated net worth. Think about that for a second... actually, think about that for the hour and a half lunch takes to arrive.
4917  Economy / Service Announcements / Re: OPEN LETTER to Donald, Patrick & Amir RE: Bitcoinica on: September 14, 2012, 11:10:27 PM
Seriously? One name that's something in bitcoin, say it. Who's there?

Give out free soup in London these days, get 3k people lined up all the way to the next intersection.
4918  Economy / Service Announcements / Re: OPEN LETTER to Donald, Patrick & Amir RE: Bitcoinica on: September 14, 2012, 10:47:28 PM
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Seriously why are these guys still even allowed to talk at the conference in London. These guys should not even be related to bitcoins anymore. I still do not understand who still uses intersango after all this BS.
Because they're simultaneously organizing it and the only people participating. So in the sense everyone's allowed to talk in his own living room...

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I don't work for Intersango
Except you do.

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Regarding the conference, it starts tomorrow(proper, started unofficially on Wed.), it's been mostly organised BY the guys from Intersango
Including you.

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we'll go and create the future of bitcoin without you
The only future you will create is the future news in the Cartmell suit / more luzly drama with the Global Scam Exchange.
Way to go with the partial statements however.
4919  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: Personal responsiblity and the Ponzi scam. on: September 12, 2012, 08:39:51 PM
I'm not implying it, I'm saying it. Any one of ten thousand famished Nigerian adolescents could have done the same.
4920  Economy / Long-term offers / Re: List of Lying deposit takers, and the reasons why on: September 10, 2012, 02:25:28 AM
Kluge: You, personally, are an idiot. Thinking oh herp derp, I r bankr nao --that's idiocy. Going around now acting like you're some sort of noteworthy character doing things, wheeling and dealing and so forth is risible. You are simply an idiot that helped a bunch of lambs to the slaughter.

Oh, Mr. Citizen Banker-Dentist thinks being called an idiot in a public forum for having been an idiot is unfair and unwarranted? Bully for you. Oh, your mommy always told you you're great and you fart runny rose water? Bully for her. Nobody else cares. What you are is a guy that helped a bunch of lambs to the slaughter.

So drop the pretense, get on your hands and knees and face the music. Oh, he can't take the "pure negativity". Why did you associate with a ponzi if you knew you couldn't take the negativity? Why did you pretend yourself a banker when you're nothing of the sort? What do you think happens to people that play pretend?

Go ahead, whine about how openness is a bad thing because idiots get to be called out and "it's just unfair". So very impressive. And when you're done with that, we can laugh at you over the kronos fiasco, too. 

Un-fucking-believable, the nerve of you idiots. "Limited amount of patience", the gall.
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