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Wenn der Bäcker klug ist, verkauft er dir also die Semmel eher um 0.001 BTC konstant - damit werden die semmeln in Euro (derzeit) immer teurer, bleiben jedoch konstant im BTC Preis. Hast du also genügend BTC um nicht auf Umtausch angewiesen zu sein, kann es euch beiden egal sein.
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Was meinst du mit "ein Projekt"?
Bitcoinnutzer? Miner? Händler? Leute die EUR gegen BTC und umgekehrt tauschen?
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That's why he only wants to do it in his own "pond" within the real Bitcoin network. Transactions would still be done via the vanilla client, only the money generation would be different. There just needs to be a trusted authority (as in every pool) that watches over money distribution. Additionally he needs to have some incentives for people to mine - especially GPU mining must be more profitable than real bitcoin while returning far less coins. If there are 0 GPU miners in the pool, the few CPU miners won't find blocks themselves and the pond dries out because no money is generated at all.
If I get it correctly, he'd need:
- A pool that somehow detects CPU miners (Hashrate could be cheated by GPU miners launching multiple instances, so there must be another way - probably a quick additional calculation or something that is easy/inexpensive on CPUs but hard on GPUs but should not cause too much loss of hashrate...?!) and hands out getworks of different difficulty but rewards the submitted shares the same. Probably using a PPS system.
- A few Bitcoins to start the system until the first block(s) have been found
- A way to track Bitcoins entering the system and a modified client that gives people the chance to see if a coin or fractions of it is a special "Towncoin" or a regular "Bitcoin" (this might be the hardest part - not the detection, but the distinction so everyone gets the menaning of it!)
- An exchange where you can trade your Dollars for Towncoins and vice versa, with guaranteed exchange rates (that would be quite high, something around a few hundred USD for a full Towncoin probably)
In "Fiat money" this would mean, he'd collect 500 1$ notes, write down the serial numbers and guarantee that he will trade each of these notes for 5 $/piece. Whoever believes him, can now treat these as well like 5$ notes.
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Die hat wohl einfach jemand mehr oder weniger nach Gutdünken angebracht...
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The ~0.2% less income (from transaction fees) currently are not really worth the immense variance you'd get even with a 20 GH/s setup imho.
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There are people mining at ~40GH/s for http://www.compute4cash.com/ even though their fees are effectively over 50%! All this just for payouts in USD, which is a trivial thing to do... |
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So we have two scenarios:
A. I stop mining and keep 100 of mined bitcoins so far for the cost of one month.... and have them worth 200*X$ in a month
B. I continue mining and get to 160 bitcoins in 1 month for the cost of electricity and stuff for the cost of two months... and have them worth 320*X$ after that month
Hard to choose, I think I will go with B?
Question is: Will you mine more Bitcoins until your hardware fails than you'd get if you sell your hardware and buy bitcoins instead? If yes, mine along. If no, sell hardware. Currently nobody can give you an answer, as it depends on difficulty developments, that are difficult to predict. Here in europe for example I could buy 58xx cards in the dozens... and Bitcoin is barely known and unpopular, as they are heavily traded only in USD. Once MtGox also trades in EUR, I expect a HUGE increase of demand and miners! It might however also be that now the ceiling has already been reached and we'll settle at ~1 million difficulty, only increasing when new GPU generations are released. Just do a difficulty vs. exchange rate chart yourself and you'll see we're currently heavy in a mining zone, only held up by demand of people who heard "Bitcoin is the new sh!t" in the news. This can change any moment, a more realistical/sane exchange rate would be ~10 USD/BTC for the current difficulty. The longer we stay in this zone, the more people will order GPUs and bring them online, driving difficulty up. |
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How can you mine 25(!) BTC with equipment worth ~500 USD within 1 month?! This is BAD advice!
What do you mean? I can just go out and buy parts from stores around my home. Worst case, I need to wait 2 days for shipment. Wtf 1 month?! You cut the quote... maybe it's easier understandable this way. About the recent babble of "Difficulty follows price!!!!!111" (+add some skewed excel-charts where 99% of data points are crammed in one corner to the mix): Unfortunately this chart seems to be discontinued - I'll still link it as a warning though: http://bitcoin.atspace.com/income.htmlPlease note the logarithmic scale! If price increases as you say, you're better off cutting difficulty (+ noise + electricity costs + work hours + heat...) from the equation and just keeping BTC, as they will increase each difficulty increase anyways in value as well!  Mining would only pay off if you end up with more BTC by mining after some time. With current increases, it doesn't look like you will mine 25 BTC within the lifetime of a card that costs 25 BTC right now. Also you have to add constant costs like electricity + work to that equation! |
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What people keep tripping over is the fact that towncoins are bitcoins period. They are just produced in smaller quantities at a faster block rate to match the network value.
This is the point that I don't get - how will this work together with the mainline chain?! No mainline client will accept any "fast block". All in all what you want to do is set up a "pay per share" pool and artificially give GPU miners harder shares to solve while still paying them the same as CPU miners to make sure CPU mining is more profitable - correct? What I then don't get - why would GPU miners even want to mine in this pool? How do you distinguish between "real" Bitcoin and "Towncoins" and what is the added benefit of owning "Towncoins"? I guess a subsidized, stable exchange rate, until the bitcoin rate has caught up? Anything else? Also it might be quite hard to distinguish between someone who mines at 10 MH/s on his 30 PCs and someone who mines at 10 MH/s on 30 instances on the same GPU. |
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Oh, and btw: Get out of BTCMine, and get out quick! They charge now a 2% fee!
I still would suggest starting 2 miners per GPU - 1 at Eligius and the other one at BTCguild. This would equally distribute the hashrate and allow for automatic failover. If you need help for this, just tell us/me.
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Not profitable any more.
It certainly was before, and it's how knighttmb got 371k BTC
It never really was, if you look at historical data... |
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Heads up! BTCMine has had trouble with VERY LARGE MINERS on the pool paying 0% [greedy bastards without respect].
Who, the operator(s) of BTCMine? Sorry, but donation means exactly this: Everyone is free to give, but doesn't have to! If any 0% pool starts to up their fees, I'm off to another one and if all pools start to charge fees, I'll either look into hosting my own or going solo. It's BTCMine's problem, if their operators can't put up a solid business plan and calculate income! What's up with my suggestion of automated payouts - still on the radar or did you skip over it? |
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Exactly - if you need a new computer, get one that can mine while you don't use it.
If you don't need a new computer, don't buy one!
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I would sell enough bitcoins to build a decent mining rig, say you sell 25 btc you can make that back in a month and then continue profiting. It is an investment, either you think it's worth it or you don't.
How can you mine 25(!) BTC with equipment worth ~500 USD that still needs to be shipped within 1 month?! This is BAD advice! Also, if you say: "But he can get 500 USD back, as the conversion rate increases if the difficulty goes up!" then I say: "If he does not 100% need this computer right now, he will make more then 500 USD by keeping the 25 BTC and selling them in 1 month!" Paying Bitcoin to mine is a bad deal in very many cases. This is one of them! |
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I bet you just have access to a (weak) CPU, not a high-end ATI gaming GPU, so all you risk is being thrown out due to misuse of resources.
Also it's not even clear to me if you can upload your own programs/executables on this "ispaces" thingie...
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If he takes that money from Bitcoins though, he will loose more in the end than he gains. Also I doubt that you took difficulty increases into consideration - and right now mining is EXTREMELY profitable, expect this to change! |
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Europe hasn't really caught on to Bitcoin yet and who knows when asian "gaming rooms" start to see there's a cheap way to finance their equipment!
A lot can happen in 1 month...
Also: Holidays! Kids start to have even more time to mess around on the internet.
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I'm not sure it's even possible to poolhop on your pool currently. For poolhopping you need to know when a new block starts, and the only stat you provide is the hash rate, e.g. not enough  I bet he has implemented long polling... from then on it's trivial!  |
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I would say, sell 25btc and buy yourself a decent gpu, join in on the fun That GPU would need to create more than these 25 BTC during it's lifetime, which is... questionable at least! |
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If I understand the underlying idea (between tornadoes, watermelons and whatnot?!) correctly, you want to set up a pool within a town, get some initial bitcoins (to not be dependent on waiting until the first block is solved) and distribute these amongst townsters for mining duties. The mining itself is rather to have "proof of work" than to actually mine bitcoins, as you will distribute only your own initial coins anyways.
How is this different from just starting a new blockchain with all earnings in the genesis block?!
Please get a bit more technical!
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