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581  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: Something at stake - proof of stake alternative on: November 26, 2014, 09:15:37 AM
This is not addressing the fundamental limitation which is that 'bet' is entirely internal to the system, which means that nothing preventsthe people with the keys from going back and replaying the history, even years after long after they've sold their coins and exited the system... and the resulting forged and legitimate chains are indistinguishable to a new participant.

I feel like you read the snazzy "nothing at stake" words and then stopped thinking before finding out in detail what they actually meant.

If you're going to invoke POW with POS you can try, but it's very difficult to end up with a result where the security doesn't simply reduce to one or the other (or worse, since POS signers can prevent new entrants from joining into mining in most designs; the admissions freeness of POW is potentially lost).

Yes, I want to understand whether it's possible to create a system which "eats its own dogfood", without any external factors.
Theoretically it does not seem to be the case, due to FLP result, but I think this is more of a limitation not a strict ban, as Bitcoin shows.

You can't mine in the proposed setup without coins, so your argument of replaying history does not quite apply here.
582  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Something at stake - proof of stake alternative on: November 25, 2014, 10:49:14 AM
I've been thinking about ways to secure POS against "Nothing at stake" type of attacks. I don't think that Nothing at stake problem kills all POS coins off. Reality shows they are relatively fine, albeit with various tricks, which in a way do not make them completely decentralized.

As far as I understand the science behind distributed consensus POS coins cannot guarantee asynchronous consensus, that is there's a possibility of  successful fork. It manifests itself in so-called "Nothing at stake" argument, which states that since it costs nothing to generate a block for a POS miner to hedge his bets he would mine on all the competing chains that he can find. He just does not loose anything by mining on all the chains, but if he prefers to stay on the main chain he could loose mining fees if the competing chain wins, so it makes sense for him to mine on both.

Bitcoin and POW coins solve this by bringing an external factor into the game, namely computational power the miners possess.
Miner can't afford to mine on the wrong chain since he looses money he paid for his ASIC and electricity. So there's something at stake for him, which makes POW coins inherently more stable.

This is a serious theoretical argument and it has to be probably dealt with.

So, what could be at stake for a POS miner? In real world systems such as NXT a rogue miner would be penalized if he chooses to mine on a fork, the main chain wouldn't allow him to mine on it. Could we dig deeper and make the miner actually pay for his mining with the coin he mines? That would be in a way analogous to investing in ASIC's and electricity when dealing with Bitcoin, with the difference of paying for everything with the coin to be mined.

If we somehow manage to do that we will obtain a self-contained cryptocurrency with a very low energy consumption and no need for fancy asic's, which prevents miners from mining on all forks they can find by its construction.

One way to do it would be the following:
  • The miner pays a mining "initiation" fee ("Bet")  by sending a payment to a special "initiation" address.
  • Miner address is selected from the miners' pool, that is from the addresses who made initiation payments
    The probability for the miner to generate a block is equal to SHA256(prevhash + address + timestamp) <=   Bet / diff,
    where prevhash is the hash of the previous block, address is the miner address, Bet is the fee the miner paid to participate, diff is current adjustable difficulty
  • Let's suppose that mining is for transaction fees only, that is the miner gets to collect the transaction fees. So his mining profit depends on the bet he made and the fees collected in the block. If the miner chooses not to mine due to his bet being less than he profit he collects from the fees, he is penalized by the network, and is unable to mine. The bet is considered to be spent.
  • If the miner decides to do make another bet he has to make a new initiation payment.

Network is able to understand when a given miner has to produce a new block, the system is deterministic (check NXT cryptocurrency forging algo for example). So if in due time there's no block generated by the miner his bet is considered to be spent. So he'd better mine a block even if the bonus he collects is less than the bet he made.

So the average bet miners make turns out to be dependent on average block size, average transaction value and average time between blocks, which is adjustable the usual way through varying difficulty. We obtain a network of gambling miners, where bets they make prevent them from mining on forks, since if a fork doesn't beat the main chain his fee (which has been made on the main chain) is lost.

TLTR:

POS system is proposed where a miner has to make a bet before being eligible to generate a block; miner's profit is equal to (fees generated in the block - miner's bet);  miners who choose not to mine a block are penalized and their bet is considered to be spent.
583  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Marketplace (Altcoins) / Re: [NXT AE] MMNXT - market making and arbitrage fund for NXT AE. on: November 25, 2014, 07:59:15 AM
These are bold statements, since bot can be tracked in real time through its NXT account. I urge you to check nxtforum thread.
584  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][BURST] Burst | Efficient HDD Mining | New version 1.1.5 on: November 19, 2014, 10:04:37 AM
Since it's based on NXT, are you going to have some NXT functionality such as assets etc. ?
585  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Marketplace (Altcoins) / Re: [NXT AE] MMNXT - market making and arbitrage fund for NXT AE. on: November 19, 2014, 09:00:26 AM
Strange comment. All stats is open, you can watch our bot trading live.
10% profit a month. Right.  Roll Eyes

Nice ponzi.

Where? The link you provided for stats: http://www.mmnxt.com/ can easily be faked. Even if you were able to maintain 10% profit each month.. Is that in NXT, or in BTC? NXT has been dropping like a rock for a couple months now.
Please check our NXTforum thread, there's an expansive discussion of all details there. The profit is in NXT, NXT will come back.
586  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Marketplace (Altcoins) / Re: [NXT AE] MMNXT - market making and arbitrage fund for NXT AE. on: November 17, 2014, 12:50:07 PM
ICO is sold out.
587  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Marketplace (Altcoins) / Re: [NXT AE] MMNXT - market making and arbitrage fund for NXT AE. on: November 13, 2014, 08:57:16 AM
Strange comment. All stats is open, you can watch our bot trading live.
10% profit a month. Right.  Roll Eyes

Nice ponzi.
588  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][GSX] Glowshares: Community Driven Blockchain Development on: November 11, 2014, 09:10:00 AM
IoT seems to be the new buzzword in crypto. No real substance as of now though
589  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Marketplace (Altcoins) / [NXT AE] MMNXT - market making and arbitrage fund for NXT AE. on: November 10, 2014, 08:31:54 AM
NXT AE Asset ID: 979292558519844732
http://nxtreporting.com/?as=979292558519844732

This is an automated trading fund for NXT asset exchange. Its goal is to provide market making for most liquid AE assets. Also we strive to move most of NXT trading to NXT AE Multigateway assets, thus providing additional liquidity for NXT which should assist in keeping its price more stable. Trading will be carried out at NXT Asset Exchange and other exchanges supporting NXT.

Trading is both long and short, that is you buy lower to sell higher and you sell higher to buy back lower. The profit is converted to NXT, also when trading MGW assets profit can also be realized in corresponding crypto, and converted to NXT afterwards.

There's 50 mil MMNXT shares. IPO will be carried out based on current projected monthly 10% profit, that means that initially around 2 mil shares at 1 NXT each will be sold. The fund will payout 60% of the profit, dividend payments will be made weekly on Fridays. The fund statistics will be published daily in this thread and at a special website mmnxt.com (not live yet).

Roadmap for the fund development:

October - November 2014:

NXT AE market making for the most liquid assets. MGW cryptocurrency assets Market Making (we also participate in MGW servers maintenance )

November 2014:

Arbitrage trading for BTER, Poloniex, Cryptsy.

We plan to trade on InstantDEX as soon as it's live.

We also run Bitcoin trading bots privately, they can be included in the fund portfolio in future based on its performance.

Trading stats: http://mmnxt.com

Around of 60% of initial 2 mil batch is sold out at the moment.

nxtforum thread: https://nxtforum.org/assets-board/mmnxt-market-making-and-arbitrage-fund-for-nxt-ae/
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