I had to look this up, never heard of the word before: coulrophobia - extreme or irrational fear of clowns

Absolutely yes I agree with you. That is partly why I said Sportsbet have lost the PR battle in this forum. They have not handled things in the best way.

I agree with you, that is what can be done by Sportsbet and all other casinos because that is what their Terms and Conditions clearly state.

I have no idea how many times this would have been implemented either by Sportsbet or any other casino but what I do know is that even though you might be right when you state that the whole becomes deceptive when the funds are frozen at the point of withdrawal otherwise the casino is happy to allow the suspected wrongdoer to lose - there is a fundamental flaw in your argument. You signed up to their website and accepted their ToS.

In a nutshell, if I sign up to a casino and deposit 1 BTC then gamble via various games and find myself 1 or 2 BTC up, then try to withdraw but have my account frozen after having my initial 1 BTC deposit returned to me - then I have to accept it because as per the ToS that I willingly signed up to, that is what the casino can do. They are under no obligation to offer me any explanation about what suspected fraud or breach of ToS I was involved in.


 - My first advice is for those of you that conclude Sportsbet might be a bit tough on those suspected of fraud and breaching their ToS but believe Sportsbet are not scammers - you should consider carry on playing or signing up as a new player.

 - My second advice for those of you that conclude Sportsbet is a scam or might be a scam - stop playing there and advise your nearest and dearest to avoid playing there too.

 - My third advice for those of you that claim Sportsbet scammed them - you read the ToS (or at least should have) and you accepted them but still gambled there so you really do not have a case. Please find a casino to gamble at that you will be sure will not scam you.


What is definitely clear is that Sportsbet have (unfortunately for themselves) failed to engage with the community here in a manner that seemed both somewhat sympathetic to those that were making the allegations and also by addressing the points and concerns that highly respected forum members raised. Sportsbet might have lost the recent PR battle by engaging with the community in a below par manner but I am sure if they modify their approach most of the users in the forum will be satisfied with their response after they add a little human touch to their posts.

As for those making allegations against Sportsbet, if you were making an allegation against a casino with no track record or a new one or one that has been around a short time then the case might be that they were set up with the intention of selective scamming users until their exit scam and that would change the dimension of the case against the alleged scammers but Sportsbet have been around a few years and other than a recent flurry of claims made against them specifically in the crypto betting website they have an almost excellent track record.

All in all it is extremely hard to accept Sportsbet are selective scamming users, I refuse to accept that they are scammers based on the evidence I have seen in the scam accusations threads. They are turning over millions of USD$ every year and the idea them stealing from users is almost impossible to believe or accept it. The amounts involved in the cases are tiny so it probably means Sportsbet are heavily clamping down against those their algorithm flagged up as breaching their ToS regardless of the amounts involved but they always return the deposit - better than receiving nothing.

I sympathise with the handful of users making allegations of wrongdoing against Sportsbet that started several days ago but their ToS that alleged victims willingly accepted clearly trumps any allegation against them. If it is any consolation to the alleged victims, Sportsbet have not exactly covered themselves in glory in the recent days when allegations started surfacing and have a lot of work to do before some senior members start trusting them fully again.

I got you now... enjoy the remaining part of the tequila.

If you had a choice of day-dreaming about those thunderous drumsticks or a fake orange badly tanned POTUS, it is clear which you will be going for regardless of what this thread is supposed to be about

I am speechless reading those words from you nutildah  

That is where they must be making the bulk of their funds from the pumping and dumping ICO trash coins. I wonder how much trade they are doing on a 24 hour basis on the actual exchange part of their business.

Going back to September 2017 Just look how times have changed and how the mighty have fallen.

So sad.....

I have seen several attacks on users during my time here in the forum but the manner in which there seems to be some accounts created specifically to attack, jump on the bandwagon and fling that mud at those they dislike or have a hidden agenda against - it is somewhat strange.


That is the main danger of misinformation by newbies and those with hidden agendas against Sportsbet.

I am not a Sportsbet supporter, game player or representative. The only parts of their conduct I disagree with was with them having that experimental arbitration with forum members to discuss the allegation against them and also the manner in which sometimes they fail to articulate their views when addressing those making allegations against them.

It would be better for them to freeze the accounts immediately of those suspected of breaching their ToS rather than freeze them when they try to withdraw wins but allow them to bet and lose. Apart from that I have no issue at all with Sportsbet because their ToS clearly state what they can and will do if they discover fraud and all users know that before they sign up.

Yes I see. Just staying neutral in all this drama one can see something is not quite right.

Sportsbet should be adjusting their threshold to what constitutes a scam whatever it might be but at the same time they are receiving lots of negative posts from alleged victims. What is in it for those mentioned ion the OP to attack Sportsbet?

Did you read their Terms and conditions? According to their ToS they are under no obligation to disclose anything to you or anybody else.

At least you got your deposit back.

My advice is to forget playing Sportsbet. Do not open another account at Sportsbet and instead find a competitor website to play.

Here we go again with another newbie who seems to know everything about everything... 

It is clear Sportsbet have not been articulating themselves in a clear manner on several occasions when posting in the forum addressing those that claim to be victims but that cannot negate what those sniffing around anti-Sportsbet threads are doing:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5266626.0
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5266016.0
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5265723.0
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5263445.0


Several users have jumped on the anti-Sportsbet bandwagon but what is their agenda? None of them have claimed to be Sportsbet users or victims of alleged wrongdoing so why are they floating around trying to inflame the situation without bringing anything positive to the table?

What is in it for them if they try to discredit Sportsbet?

Well if gosha@e-coin is game-protect then all he wants is money from the alleged victims with ridiculous promises of legal action so he is nothing more than a leech trying to suck blood from an alleged victim by lining his own pocket but what are the real motives of the others?


adam0991: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=2828445

cabirr: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=2820596

Get-Paid.com: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=505849

gosha@e-coin: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=409314

Excellent piece of information, thank you. Regardless of the number of the masternodes operating and the power that masternode operators wield Dash is going places 

Does anybody have a graph showing statistics about at which point these masternodes were created? I mean in month/year or at which price each Dash was when the 1000 were purchased?

To my knowledge there are also official/registered and not registered masternodes operating so will those statistics be current?

As posted by members, it seems there is an an acceptance they are not the same person but it has been stated Get-Paid.com has been connected with game-protect in the past

I made a post about this earlier which captures why their ToS trumps everything a user might allege against Sportsbet: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5263445.msg54893685#msg54893685

1- Sportsbet state in their ToS:

12. BONUS RULES
12.1 General
12.1.1 Bonuses are available at our discretion and we reserve the right to restrict the availability of any bonus to any player at any time.
12.1.2 Fraudulent or multiple entries will not be accepted, neither will entries made in breach of these Standard Promotional Terms or the specific promotional terms.
12.1.3 Some of our Bonuses may be offered to you on a complimentary basis or when taking part and completing promotions through the website.
12.1.4 All promotions are not available to players using an e-wallet when depositing funds.
12.1.5 Players who are Self-Excluded are not eligible to receive any bonus. Players that Self-Exclude during the course of bonus qualification or after a Bonus Token has been placed but before any winnings (Cash or Bonus) were accumulated, will not be eligible to receive any winnings (whether as Cash or as a Bonus Token)
12.1.6 Only one Bonus offer per player, per household, per shared computer and shared IP address unless otherwise stated. We do not allow “Multiple Accounts”. Player account details will be determined by any or all combination of name, mailing address, email address, computer (serial), IP address, payment (deposit/withdrawal) method used and any other form of identification.
12.1.7 By accepting any of our bonuses, you agree to adhere to these Bonus Rules and any applicable rules made available to you before or when accepting a Bonus with us. You must also comply with our full Terms and Conditions at all times.
12.1.8 We reserve the right to withhold any Bonus, associated winnings whether from cash or bonus wagers if believed that the offer has been abused and/or where the terms of the offer are not fulfilled, or any irregular betting patterns are found including collusion, and this decision is final.

2- The rules are clearly stated in the footer of the Sportsbet website

3- By signing up to the Sportbet website, all users are confirming they agree to and will abide by the ToS that are clearly stated beforehand therefore all users are aware of which type of contract they are getting in to before they are signing up

4- The most important of these rules is 12.1.8 because it clearly states Sportbet have the right to effectively withhold any winnings or bonuses if they believe they have reason: "We reserve the right to withhold any Bonus, associated winnings whether from cash or bonus wagers if believed that the offer has been abused and/or where the terms of the offer are not fulfilled, or any irregular betting patterns are found including collusion, and this decision is final."

5- Sportsbet ToS do not state that in the event of them implementing clause 12.1.8 they are under any obligation to justify their findings to the suspected fraudster or to a third party such as various members of this forum. Sportsbet are also bound by European data protection laws as stated in their ToS (5.1 and 5.3):



5. CONFIDENTIALITY

5.1 We will take reasonable and appropriate measures to ensure that Your personal information as disclosed to Us shall remain confidential. We will not disclose Your personal data or betting information unless required to do so by any applicable laws and regulations, court order, the relevant gaming and law enforcement authorities or other than as set forth in these Terms and Conditions. It is also Your responsibility to keep Your personal information confidential.

5.3 We will process Your personal data in accordance with Data Protection Act 2018, General Data Protection Regulation (GDPR) 2018, other relevant legislation and regulation and Our Privacy Policy.


6- The OP has claimed he is innocent. From what is seems on the surface the OP is saying that he is ready to comply with KYC and sent it to Sportsbet but they rejected it as 'failed'.

In my opinion the bottom line in this situation is this:

Sportsbet concluded beyond reasonable doubt the OP conducted in activity that breached their ToS and they are under no obligation to explain to anybody why they came to that conclusion. They also stated it was not as simple as it being based on multiple accounts from the same IP address. Furthermore they went on to state they will not state what their security protocols are as they will give an obvious advantage to those that try to defraud them.

All existing Sportsbet users and all future new sign ups have to accept their accounts could be frozen at any point without a fully explained justification and they could lose all their winnings but will probably get back their initial deposited funds providing they have not been spent. The OP has protested his innocence but that has not stopped Sportsbet from coming to the same conclusion that their ToS were breached.

==================

Having said all this, there are two main points of concern for me that Sportsbet and other betting websites implement on a wide scale:

1- I do not know why Sportsbet asked for KYC when they knew it would definitely not be enough. Even if the KYC is valid and even if they have a video call to ascertain identity of the user but he is linked with multiple accounts and breach of ToS then why would they ask for KYC?

2- Why do all these issues of multiple accounts come up after a user wins an amount or tries to withdraw - Sportsbet and other websites should have algorithms that start freezing accounts as soon as multiple accounts and breaches are detected because it means as long as users in breach of the ToS are depositing crypto and spending it losing on bets it remains a non-issue but as soon as a win or withdrawal takes place it triggers a breach of ToS

In March 2016 Dash was trading at under $5 each so it is all about timing and maximising the opportunities at the right time.

I agree with this simply because the ToS clearly state what Sportsbet can do if they even suspect anything untoward going on. Does that allow them to misuse the ToS to steal funds? Well it allows the facility for them to do it but that does not mean they will do it.

If Sportsbet or any other casino mass-scam or selective-scam their users then surely people will walk away and allow the casino to slide in to obscurity. I just fail to see this as a scam by Sportsbet. What I see is them taking a strong stance against users they feel are trying to cheat them. Where they have made a real mess of things is by not freezing accounts of users as soon as they suspect them of cheating. By allowing those users to play and effectively lose funds is tantamount to morally indefensible conduct by Sportsbet if they then stop those users they suspect of cheating from withdrawing funds.

A user is effectively signing up of their own accord to ToS they were never forced to accept. If those users did not like the ToS offered or enforced by Sportsbet they should sign up to other casinos - simple.  They should review the ToS other casinos offer beefore signing up but will notice virtually all of them have identical clauses.

How would that be fair when considering all existing masternode operators did have to pay that rate of the day?

It is all up in the air right now. Nobody knows for sure what is going on and what will happen with tx fees or anything else. Running actual scenarios on the testnet will give an indication of what to expect but in reality the only way to know will be when using the live net. All predictions and estimates mean nothing at this stage.