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7461  Economy / Economics / Re: Can a decentralized "stock exchange" work (well) without government support? on: January 30, 2014, 12:36:13 AM
Stock exchanges have existed without government intervention, so it definitely works, though now it is mostly illegal.
7462  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: Paper wallet - spending a little - what is the risk? on: January 29, 2014, 11:07:55 PM
Hi all - I have a paper wallet with a bunch of bitcoin, and I just want to send a little to my online blockchain wallet.
If I do this, and correct me if I am wrong, blockchain just sends the "change" back to my original paper wallet. Everyone says you shouldn't do this, but I don't really understand the risk. Everyone can see the public key of my paper wallet the second I load it, so why is there a risk in sending the change back to the same paper wallet and having my public key made public twice?

You cannot send bitcoins using a paper wallet because it simply doesn't have the ability. In order to spend the bitcoins in a paper wallet, you must import the private key into a wallet that can send bitcoins.

Once you import the private key, you should destroy the paper wallet or at least store it very securely because anyone that sees it can still spend your bitcoins. Also, you shouldn't reuse the paper wallet because the key is now in another wallet and that might cause confusion.

Blockchain.info has a feature where you can "sweep" the private key. All that does is sends the bitcoins from the paper wallet's address to a new address in the blockchain.info wallet. In this case the paper wallet is no longer useful because it no longer contains any bitcoins, but there is no reason why you can't reuse it.
7463  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: Cameron And Tyler Winklevoss Release Statement On Arrest Of BitInstant CEO on: January 29, 2014, 09:29:59 PM
The title is not misleading or trying to attract people to look at the post.  The events really happened the CEO of Instantbit.com was indicted on charges of money laundering, which is a company the Winklevoss twins have heavy supported and backed financially...

Lethn is complaining that you didn't actually provide the statement. Here is the missing statement:

Quote
When we invested in BitInstant in the fall of 2012, its management made a commitment to us that they would abide by all applicable laws - including money laundering laws - and we expected nothing less.  Although BitInstant is not named in today’s indictment of Charlie Shrem, we are obviously deeply concerned about his arrest.  We were passive investors in BitInstant and will do everything we can to help law enforcement officials. We fully support any and all governmental efforts to ensure that money laundering requirements are enforced, and look forward to clearer regulation being implemented on the purchase and sale of bitcoins.
7464  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: Has anyone bought any gold from the site Coinabul? on: January 29, 2014, 07:57:32 PM
Quote
yeah once we get confirmation of payment, hopefully in like a day or two, the clock will start on your order.  Then it will be 17 business days until you receive it.

That is absurd. You paid with Bitcoin, right? Confirmation of a bitcoin payment doesn't take a week, it takes an hour at most. He is stalling.

 I believe that Coinabul works like this:

1. You place an order and pay him in Bitcoin.
2. He converts the bitcoins to dollars and orders your item from APMEX.
3. After his check has cleared, APMEX ships him your item.
3. He receives the item from APMEX and then ships it to you.

My guess is that you can get the gold more quickly and more cheaply from APMEX, though you wouldn't be using bitcoins.
7465  Economy / Economics / Re: Bitcoin Mining Consumption of World’s Resources on: January 29, 2014, 07:36:14 PM
Quote
The "sustainable" level of the Bitcoin network is when the cost of electricity burnt is equal to the price of the newly mined bitcoins. It has happened in the CPU/GPU era. It will happen in the ASIC era.
That is only true from the standpoint of a current miner.   What will happen if the network keeps growing at the insane rate it is, there will be increased power costs and/or regulation to stop it.   It isn't reasonable to think that is would be allowed to grow to 10% or more of the world's electrical power.   Do you think people will be willing to live with vastly higher power bills and rolling blacks outs to support bitcoin mining?    In the CPU/GPU era you weren't using nearly as much power as in being used today.  

As pointed out before, the growth in energy usage by miners is limited by the value of the bitcoins received by miners. At a value of $40,000, the energy consumed is around 650 TWh, which by your calculation is only 0.003% of the total. 10% implies a value of around $1,500,000 per bitcoin, which is unlikely because at $1,000,000 bitcoin will have replaced all other currencies.

What is more likely is that the cost of entry will get so high that it will block most from mining at least bitcoin.   If the cost of power is truly what limits bitcoin, then bitcoin actually won't have much of a future.   Most businesses run with as high as profit margins as they can.   The micro-economics don't work the same on the marco scale and the bitcoin network is way past the micro side.  

Right now you can get an ASIC miner for $100. I'm not convinced that cost of entry will be too high for most people, though profitability might be difficult for small miners because of economies of scale. Also, the cost of power limits only the miners, not the users.
7466  Economy / Economics / Re: What happens to mining if the price of Bitcoin tanks? on: January 29, 2014, 07:08:47 AM
The amount of electricity used by an ASIC is very low. The price of bitcoin would have to drop below $100 before power costs exceed the mining revenue. If the price does drop that low, then many miners will quit mining because it will no longer be profitable and the difficulty will drop. If the price drops but mining is still profitable, then the difficulty will continue rising, but not as quickly.
7467  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: Cameron And Tyler Winklevoss Release Statement On Arrest Of BitInstant CEO on: January 29, 2014, 06:55:52 AM
They should have invested in HSBC instead.
7468  Economy / Economics / Re: Bitcoin Mining Consumption of World’s Resources on: January 29, 2014, 01:03:01 AM
As I pointed out before, the cost of mining will approach the value of the mined bitcoins.

At $800 per bitcoin, that is currently about $1 billion per year and about 13 TWh per year (at $0.08/kWh). As the block reward drops, the amount of energy used would also decrease (unless energy gets much cheaper), except that the price of bitcoin will probably rise much more quickly.

If the price reaches $40,000 this year then the energy usage could be as high as 650 TWh, assuming there are no other limits.
7469  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: What to do with .25BTC on: January 28, 2014, 11:08:18 PM
Don't listen to these newbies. Spend it. If you want to save it, buy some more.
7470  Bitcoin / Press / Re: 2014-01-28 Alcatel-Lucent files Bitcoin Patent Application: Vault to Wallet on: January 28, 2014, 11:03:53 PM
X = offline computer
A = online computer
B = payee's address
S = secure storage on online computer
1. X creates the transaction X -> A and stores it in S.
2. A creates the transaction A -> B.
3. A sends X -> A and A -> B to the Bitcoin network.
Compare this to Armory:
1. A creates the transaction X -> B and sends it to X (via USB stick)
2. X signs X -> B and sends it back to A (via USB stick)
3. A sends X -> B to the Bitcoin network.
IANAL, but in my opinion, the only "novel" part of the patent might be S, but that is pushing it.
You dont seem to understand how Armory works.....

There is no such thing "sent" from A. A does not send anything, itt just generates an unsigned transaction that need private key holder (offline Armory) to sign it and then broadcast it.
Now there will be a hw device that work like an offline Amory that ppl can just sign tx (holding private key)
None of these is related to the topic on hand.
The Vault can be a private key holding service....thus it requires trust and insurance.

I do understand, but I was trying to write like a patent lawyer Smiley. In Armory's case, "sends" in #1 and #2 means "copies the transaction to a USB stick and tells the user to plug it into the other computer".
7471  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: Bitcoin is a Bubble: But so what? on: January 28, 2014, 10:53:36 PM
A lot of people are hurt by bubbles. Just look at the dot-com and housing bubbles. In fact, everyone is hurt by bubbles to some extent because bubbles create economic inefficiencies and wasted effort.

There is no strict definition of a bubble, but one defining characteristic is that a primary factor behind the increasing price is a widespread expectation of an increasing price. Bubbles burst when that expectation goes away.

So, a person (such as Shiller) that considers Bitcoin to be in a bubble believes that expectation of rising prices is the primary factor behind the rise in price. Now, who can argue that most people have not bought bitcoins primarily because they expect the price to rise? He has a very strong argument.

On the other hand, adoption will also drive up prices, and expectation of adoption does not make a bubble, unless perhaps the expectation is unrealistic. So, ultimately the test is whether or not adoption of bitcoin will soon be high enough to support the current price.

I believe that adoption will continue to increase dramatically, so I believe the current price is valid (if not low), and Bitcoin is not in a bubble.
7472  Economy / Economics / Re: Bitcoin Mining Consumption of World’s Resources on: January 28, 2014, 10:31:40 PM
I don't follow your logic.   The amount of power consumption used to produce a bitcoin isn't the same as the value of the bitcoin.  

The cost of producing a bitcoin tends to approach the value of a bitcoin because if it costs less than a bitcoin then more people will mine, raising the difficulty and thus the cost. If it costs more than a bitcoin then less people will mine, wihich will lower the difficulty and thus the cost.
7473  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: Are there fake Casascius coins yet? on: January 28, 2014, 10:13:13 PM
The "code" is the first 8 characters of the bitcoin address. You can check its validity here: http://casascius.uberbills.com/

According to this site, the bitcoin address is 1Goe6LR2xP4Ss4g3KSLgPQ5vPmYWaZyZAh and the 25 BTC has not been spent.

The coin could be a counterfeit, but I don't see anything that indicates that might be.
7474  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Bitcoins destroyed if unused, to keep bitcoin supply known? on: January 28, 2014, 10:08:17 PM
That's the point. Forcing them to move them would produce proof that the coins are active. And I would argue that to make supply and demand work (correctly) you need to know the supply.

I disagree.

1. Supply and demand works all by itself without intervention. In fact, intervention only creates problems. Just look at the dollar.

2. Knowing the number of spendable coins does not actually tell you enough about the supply. The "supply" is not a single value -- it is a curve, and knowing a single number doesn't tell you much about the curve.

3. We don't have a way to determine demand. Even if we did know the number of spendable coins, there is nothing we could do with that number.
7475  Bitcoin / Press / Re: 2014-01-28 Alcatel-Lucent files Bitcoin Patent Application: Vault to Wallet on: January 28, 2014, 08:11:32 PM
X = offline computer
A = online computer
B = payee's address
S = secure storage on online computer

1. X creates the transaction X -> A and stores it in S.
2. A creates the transaction A -> B.
3. A sends X -> A and A -> B to the Bitcoin network.

Compare this to Armory:

1. A creates the transaction X -> B and sends it to X (via USB stick)
2. X signs X -> B and sends it back to A (via USB stick)
3. A sends X -> B to the Bitcoin network.

IANAL, but in my opinion, the only "novel" part of the patent might be S, but that is pushing it.
7476  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: What to do with .25BTC on: January 28, 2014, 05:30:00 PM
There are several online stores that accept bitcoin. You can spend it at overstock.com and tigerdirect.com, among others.
7477  Economy / Securities / Re: [BTC-TC] Deprived Mining Speculation (DMS) on: January 28, 2014, 04:27:26 PM
I somewhat agree, however to be fair we must take into account also the BTC value, which now has risen quite a lot.

Last login from Deprived is about the time when BTC hit $1K for the first time... coincidence?

I you implying that the exchange rate dropped because Deprived has disappeared?
7478  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: cgminer error "No servers could be used! Exiting" on: January 28, 2014, 04:37:25 AM
Code:
Jan 29 21:39:24 Desktop cgminer[10849]: Testing pool http://api.bitcoin.cz:8332
Jan 29 21:39:24 Desktop cgminer[10849]: HTTP request failed: couldn't connect to host

Something is wrong with the URL. I am unable to access that URL from my browser, so maybe the problem is simply that the site is down. It is also a good idea to have a backup pool to mine. If cgminer has problems with one pool, it can automatically switch to another.
7479  Economy / Economics / Re: (HELP) How do i pay Taxes on Bitcoin or any other Atlcoins on: January 28, 2014, 04:31:02 AM
Al learned the hard way, I simply what to learn from his mistakes Smiley I've been mining for a year what how do I claim my winnings to uncle Sammy?

You came to the right place! There is absolutely no possibility of anyone here giving you bad advice. I can't imagine why you would visit a CPA or a lawyer when you can get better quality advice here for free.
7480  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: What happens to price when block rewards "half"? on: January 28, 2014, 12:52:18 AM
What happens to price when block rewards "half"?  From a trending perspective is there a noticeable change in the coin price when the block reward is cut in half? I'm sure there is a percentage of miners that will stop mining because the profitability drops. I was just curious if there is an impact to the coin price.

The price is unaffected by changes in the block reward or the difficulty. On one hand, some miners might lose interest in Bitcoin completely and sell everything, and that might cause the price to go down by an imperceptible amount. On the the other hand, slightly fewer bitcoins are available to sell and that might cause the price to go up by an imperceptible amount. Of course, those two factors might cancel each other out and nothing happens to the price at all.
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