Seriously.  I tried doing the old ~DefaultTrust thing a couple years ago and didn't make a custom list and thus couldn't tell who was who anymore.  You really need some sort of list if you're going to do any business with people or feel like you're going to have to trust what they say (unless you feel like manually checking every single time).

I have a relatively short trust list that Lauda suggested a while back with a couple of modifications, and I'm going to just keep it as is for the time being.  I wouldn't mind eventually adding Jet Cash to it, since I do trust him and he's done quite a bit for newbies and the forum at no cost to himself.  Anybody opposed to that?

I know that, believe me, but I don't want to start any potential drama before acting since this is all brand new and soliciting opinions isn't a bad thing.  I'd been thinking about it for a while, though my status on DT2 wouldn't have mattered much up until today when I got bumped.  There are some others I'm thinking about as well, but the vast majority of my functioning neurons are screaming at me to just sit still for now and not do anything. 

I wasn't really giving you any harsh criticism, because you've earned a lot of merits from other posts with the same level of English.  For the linked thread, though?  As suchmoon kinda said, the topic is threadbare at this point, which is basically what I said in my other post.

Believe me, I try.  You know probably as well as I do that lower-ranked members posting in Bitcoin Discussion tend to make very low-quality posts and that thread was full of them, and I explained to you why:  talking about bounties is all most shitposters can relate to, and thus most of the responses are going to be straight from the combinatoric asswipe reassembly factory, whereby the same members (or new ones) say the same things in different forms, and it's all vapid crap.  It's almost as bad as reading comments on Youtube.

For what it's worth, I agree with you on that one.  The self-bidding thing was wrong, but as Lauda pointed out it was a long time ago, and even though Anduck is still justifying it I don't think he'll do it again.

But not this one:
Flaccid, it could be mistaken for a bellybutton.

I don't think I have to do much adjusting to the trust I've left, since I was already on DT2 anyway and I don't make it a common practice to leave feedback without either a reference link or an explanation, and I don't think I've left retaliatory feedback.  I'll take a look at the trust I've given out, but man...it's quite a lot.  

OK, just understand that I don't trust account sellers (and buyers) because of how the for-sale accounts might be used, and I've explained that a million times.

You say you don't trust me because I gave you a neg.  If that hadn't happened, I'm 99.999% sure you'd be completely indifferent about anything I do.  I never scammed anyone here and it's true that you probably do more deals than me here, but so what?  You do bring up a good point about escrow, which is the only way to trade with red-trusted members.  On the other hand, I'm pretty sure that if someone saw my neg for account selling, they would just ignore it and do business as usual.

Funny how I found out about the new changes not by reading threads but by two PMs by members complaining about you and Timelord2067.  Put on a helmet and git ready for a rumble around here.

Well, apparently Theymos thinks more of Lauda than the old DT1 members did.  Somehow I knew Lauda would get back onto DT, and I'm anticipating all hell breaking loose some time within the next 12 hours as people around the globe start waking up to a familiar bright red world on bitcointalk.  

I still don't understand exactly how these new changes are going to work, but there's a lot of chaos that's going to ensue.  But hey, you're an account dealer who's already been tagged multiple times, so what are you complaining about?

Edit:  Whoops, I wrote this post way too early without understanding the algorithm on which the new system is based.  That'll teach me to not effing read before posting.  On the other hand, Theymos obviously doesn't have any objections to Lauda's inclusion since he could have not included him/her manually.  Boss man is still the boss.

Eh, yeah.  I just got a PM asking me to counter a neg, which I refused to do for now.  I'm not a big fan of that tactic anyway.

Edit:
OK, since you're here:  I removed my neg on you because as I told you in my PM:


So for anyone wondering why I de-negged Rambotnic, that's the reason.

Yeah, that's a good thing.  This is quite surprising to me, and I'm expecting a lot of chaos.  I already got a PM from someone about Timelord2067 being on DT2.

So what happens next month?  My tiny little pea brain isn't comprehending how this works, the rotating default trust thing.

If I had a horse farm, I'd bet 'em all that you're right.

Hear, hear.  It's always occurred to me that rioters (and even terrorists) always pick the wrong targets.  *Disclaimer: I don't support terrorism.*  But that guy who flew his plane into an IRS building?  He knew what he was doing.  The 9/11 terrorists?  They at least hit the Pentagon.  What I'm saying is that the gripes are almost completely with government institutions and the judicial system (like the Rodney King riots, etc.), but the rioters don't end up storming a courthouse; they break into shops and loot stuff.  It makes total sense if you're a cynic like me who thinks that greed drives most people's behavior, but rioting doesn't accomplish much for whatever the cause is except for media attention.  Terrorism accomplishes a lot, but not in a good way for anyone.

It's astounding how much unrest there is in the world today.  2019 is nothing like how I remember the early days of my life or even when I got out of college.  I'm just hoping something good comes from all of this and doesn't lead to armageddon.

Now that's what I'm talking about as far as targeting the right institutions.

I merited a couple of posts, but most of them are shitposts--and it doesn't surprise me.  When you create a thread about bounties and earning bitcoin/altcoins, that's prime real estate for shitposters.  That's really all they know, and the section they visit most:  Bitcoin Discussion.

So that thread has already gone downhill, though there were some fairly decent posts.  But most of them were just regurgitating posts I've seen so many times before, and I have to tell you that the topic isn't exactly original.  It's obvious the OP took time to create his post, but 1) English was very broken, but more importantly 2) The thread is a shitpost magnet and the OP wasn't original (not plagiarized, just not anything new).

Edit:  But hey, LoyceV merited the OP.  This is the great thing about having so many merit sources and diverse opinions.  It's also a win for this thread.

I disagree with you there, because if you've ever read any of the ban appeal threads in Meta, you'll hear all sorts of begging in the form of "plz unban me, my family depend on my earning" and so forth.  Could those statements be lies?  Absolutely, and I remain skeptical and cold in the face of them--but I do think that there are a lot of folks in 3rd world countries who think bitcointalk is a place to work.  And I also believe that if you're earning bitcoin through bounties (and especially if you're employing alt accounts as well), someone in a poor country could earn far more with that than in real life.

That's true, and there are many other reasons why someone should have a job in real life instead of relying on shitty, shady bounties that might not be around for much longer.  You can already see bitcoin-paying signature campaigns are getting rarer, but those altcoin bounties are eventually going to die off.  The market is going to get saturated with this crap and people are going to stop falling for ICOs and their scams, and the devs are going to stop paying people for advertising/translating/social media posts.  You'll see.

Whoa there with the exclamation points.  Those should be saved for special occasions.

I do remember some threads here about people selling their kids' toys, houses, and all of that.  Who knows if they actually lost money, though?  They could have sold in time to make a profit, and I don't think many of those threads were followed up on by the OPs.  It was pure lunacy when bitcoin was approaching $20k, and what's amazing is that people want more of that type of bull market--the kind that's not sustainable.

Man, not even I'm that cynical.  Then again, if and when a Venezuela-type of hyperinflation hits the US I'll come back here and admit that you told me so.  Let's hope that doesn't happen.

I hate to keep feeding this discussion about your neg from Vod, but what suchmoon said is completely accurate--it's just not complete, leaving out your private conversation with Vod about feedback removal.  That's a separate matter, but the self-bidding description is on point.  I've already said my piece about both things, so I'm not going to continue flogging that poor dead horse. 

Consensus pretty much is that self-bidding on an auction here is not cool.  That's what reserve prices are for.

Thanks all of you for helping me on this one, I do appreciate it. 

Going to lock the thread now.

That's what I'm thinking--and I also posted something about having a 24/7 stock exchange based on using a blockchain last year or so, but I can't find my post.  It would definitely be awesome not to have to be limited to trading stocks between 9:30am-4pm.  But yeah, the SEC would either nix this idea or find some way to regulate or exploit it to their advantage.

A lot of people think that because of all this decentralization that things can't be shut down, and that's just not the case.  If a government makes something illegal, e.g., using a blockchain as a way of side-stepping a traditional stock exchange, do you actually think legitimate companies are going to thumb their noses at the law?  Absolutely not.  The only thing you'd see are scam companies offering shares on any blockchain exchange that existed.

That's kind of my impression about this as well, but we'll see.

Not a bad idea at all.  I don't have any data, nor a prejudice against Russians--but don't a lot of scammers originate from there?  Seems like I've come across a lot of threads about Russian scammers, but as I have no interest in ICOs and don't understand Russian, they fly under my radar.

Whatever the case is, there are a lot of Russian bitcoiners and I think that board ought to have a Scam Accusation subsection of its own.  What would be the downside of that, having to get a moderator?

Please explain to my pea brain how this would be so.  Also, how would this affect the ability of DT members to warn others?  Also also, I thought you wanted to get rid of the DT system altogether.

Yes, I know you've said this ad nauseam across multiple threads.  Sorry I brought it up.

I did see that thread, and I'm not sure how forcing newbies to create a trust list would work, and they're the ones most likely to fall for scams around here, IMO.  As to adding more DT1 members--did I miss how those would be chosen?  Theymos would have to pick them, since he doesn't like the voting strategy, so it just seems like the DT system would end up being more of a clusterfuck than it already is, unless the DT1 members had to keep very strict trust lists.  Diluting the DT2 pool seems like it would end up with more people with more power, more headaches, more internecine squabbles, more bitching about wrongly-left feedback, and more chaos.

Or have I got my math wrong again?

See?  This is why I asked for help.  I reported his last post with a link to that thread.  If he had a permabanned account, any account he controls now should also be banned as far as I know.  We'll see what happens.

Edit:
Actually I didn't notice that, but the reference link only leads to the BitcoinHeroes profile page anyway.  Good eye, though.  That probably would have saved us a lot of time had I noticed it before making this thread.  In any case, let us hope that the saulzaents account gets banned as well.  It wouldn't hurt for someone else to report this to the mods, though my guess is that this thread will be read by at least one of them with a ban-hammering mindset.

I sort of understand that statement, maybe 70% of it.  The other 30% makes my head spin.

Contrary to what a lot of other members think, I don't get off on being on DT2 and in fact it's a pain in the ass half the time.  But since bitcointalk doesn't even moderate scammers, there needs to be some mechanism through which unwitting members can avoid being scammed and bad behavior can be punished, so to speak. 

I completely agree that the trust system is screwed up, and I think I've said that for as long as I've been here.  If Theymos were to ditch the default trust system here tomorrow, and my feedback no longer carried as much weight, I'd be fine with that--as long as there was something in place to warn people about scammers, account dealers, identity thieves, trust abuse, extortion, etc.  If you asked me how many DT2 members exist I couldn't tell you, but I know it's a lot.  But there are only a handful of them active in handing out negs when they think someone deserves it.  The rest are just members that some DT1 peeps trust.  I'm assuming your gripe is because of Vod's feedback, and he's one of the active ones.

So, if we eliminate the whole DT system right now without having a function that the active DT1/DT2 members serve, what would happen?  All the cockroaches would have a field day, that's what.  I hear lots of gripes but no suggestions about alternatives, and I'll admit I can't think of a different system that would be better either.  I used to like the Scammer Tag thing that was in place when I was a lurker, but I do believe Theymos won't be going back to that. 

OMG, yeah I remember that!  He claimed he was a doctor in this post:


....and I remember your criticism of him and the operating theater.  I'll have to go back and read that thread again, as I just took a quick glance at the link you provided.  Hmm.  What do you guys think should be done here?  That feeling that the account was hacked or sold is getting stronger.

For those who like to peep:

This has got to be borderline plagiarism at least, and it's certainly spam.  A lot of the above post is lifted from here, though he didn't exactly say what he was writing was from that site.  A lot of this guy's other posts from last year are pure spamming for cryptov8 or EverLifeAV:


If I was a mod, I'd kick your ass right off the forum and back into the real world of Indonesia without a mouse.

It's this part of the post I'm interested in the translation of:


I know this is off-topic, but I'm not going to open a new thread about something that might be nothing.

Edit:  OK, thank you for the translation.  Doesn't look like he was looking to buy or sell an account.