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Actually if you go on MtGox, choose funding options, "Redeem Bitcoin private key" and input a string, it'll be sha256 and tested as a private key. MtGox will provide feedback if there was any coins there and any coin found will be credited to your account now and in the future.
This shows how dangerous it is to use a simple passphrase to generate a wallet as any bitcoin there can be snatched using existing tools...
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We have some good news for everyone soon, just waiting for some ACH transfers to clear...
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And we'll get the other 25kBTC back. It's very probable a police investigation will tie him to the first hacks as well, so we will get MORE money back. It's a win win.
Previous losses were covered by Bitcoinica owners, which means that if somehow those funds are recovered, they will be returned to whoever paid for everyone. |
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If you have a police report you can request us to forward the details to the police. We'll need a case number and details on the law enforcement in charge (person in charge, etc) to forward the appropriate details.
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Not been on IRC in years but wouldn't this;
[00:49] * ChanServ sets mode: +o phantomcircuit
[01:01] * phantomcircuit sets mode: -o phantomcircuit
[01:01] * phantomcircuit is now known as steve_bobs
indicate that someone logged in with the spoofed ident of phantiom and was de-oped because their mac id did not truely match? Just seems odd he would de-op himself otherwise..
Or maybe he was tired of being contacted by dozens of people and decided to go under a different nick temporarily? |
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When it was made known to me that some suspected Zhou, my recommendation was to confront him privately for his explanation. Would have been nice to keep me in the loop at that point, then. Zhou's explanation sounds convincing, but as previously said it is not up to us to judge, and legal action is most likely unavoidable at this point. Either way, I believe many here would appreciate to know who they can turn themselves to to get things moving forward. |
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No one has asked me about this matter either.
We actually counted on you being questioned by whoever in Bitcoinica would start legal action. It didn't happen, and for us to open the question directly with you while bypassing Tihan or the Bitcoinica Consultancy directors was awkward. The most straightforward way was to do a public announce, which was required anyway considering the fact that funds were blocked with AurumXchange was already posted on the forum a few times. |
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That's an interesting turn of events, but at this point I'd strongly advise reporting this to the police, will it be in China or where you reside currently, as it would protect you against problems that may arise later. The condition of 「Bitcoinica will no longer pursue the case」 is not viable as Bitcoinica will be required to cause legal action if people attack it. USD: about $140,000 + $5000 frozen at AurumXchange (under SJ account)
BTC: about 20,000 BTC I do notice that the amount is significantly low compared to the initially stolen amount, especially in terms of BTC, and I don't see money laundering causing such a large loss. Finally, by posting this publicly you also cut yourself from the possibility of not "pursuing the case" as doing so would likely result in you being considered accomplice should any involved party (including bitcoinica customer) decide to pursue the case anyway. |
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(I see you have quite a lot of ignores already.)
I didn't see the forum had this feature, quite nice actually. Thank you very much, sturle. |
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the company is over... so why would they care anymore about lost business. except to clear name and find the hacker ?
basically if the owners dont file police report say are saying to everyone who is owed money - 'piss off, we dont care' and stopping any further investigations from happening... which means no $$ for anyone.
Actually it could mean that they are legally in fault to any of Bitcoinica's customers, should any of them actually file something too. |
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MtGox breaches customer privacy agreement with its customer due to the advice of a competing exchange's attorney?
Are you sure they weren't just trying to ruin your business?
Actually - it may be difficult to remember as we are already on the 11th page - the announce was made by AurumXchange, not by us. |
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The fact is that at this time no party has contacted us in any way to notify us of any action (we are in contact with all the parties involved in Bitcoinica). In absence of any legal context to relate to, there is only so much we can do.
Absence of proof is not proof of absence, therefore : assumption. Either way my point is that you shouldn't have released anything until contacted by an official law enforcement body. Because doing so would probably qualify as a big fat breach of privacy, decency, and your own very terms. None of the parties able to start a legal action on this have done so, or have declined to let us know. Either way that puts us in a delicate situation. It should also be noted that I speak for MtGox, not for AurumXchange. I do not know the situation on that aspect, as the funds are not held with MtGox (we are merely helping with the investigation and trying to ensure the information flows correctly to the community).
It's not the community's role to investage, nor is it yours. I'm simply arguing that the information flow you're mentioning might not be the most appropriate, it might somehow be in your interest, but I fail to see how it's in the victims best interests. Actually it is our role to investigate any transaction that comes or goes through our systems. However once the investigation reaches a specific point we need to forward the details to the law enforcement in charge. It was legal advice on AurumXchange's side to publish a subset of the details. |
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It's been stated elsewhere on the board that MtGox has now frozen the Bitcoinica MtGox account. Can you confirm whether that's the case (it would be a reasonable action to take, but users generally tend to disbelieve such claims as I'm sure you're aware from having to explain such situations in relation to your own financial institutions)?
Yes indeed, as discussed with Bitcoinica, we have blocked Bitcoinica's account to prevent further loss, and pending legal action to determine what should be done with those funds. |
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AurumXchange is blocking funds allegedly belonging to Zhou Tong without any disclosed (until now) reason. Legal advice on AurumXchange's side was to issue a statement as soon as possible to clarify the situation as it was being made public on this very forum.
Releasing a statement to ZT about his money being frozen : sounds ok to me. Publishing a statement to an angry mob looking for a scapegoat : probably not the smartest thing. I highly doubt that AE's legal counsel advised them to publish anything on a public internet forum. I guess you're up for a surprise on this one. In absence of any legal action from the victims of this hack,
This is an assumption, not a fact. The fact is that at this time no party has contacted us in any way to notify us of any action (we are in contact with all the parties involved in Bitcoinica). In absence of any legal context to relate to, there is only so much we can do. we have no course of action to contact the police, but will be held responsible if funds are released then legal processing is started at a later point.
A financial institution has to freeze funds if they suspect illegal activity/ML and report it to the authorities. I'm not saying it would have been smart to release the funds, but maybe it isn't very smart either to release this kind of information on a public forum and not report anything to the police (AFAIK you haven't done that, have you?). I do not know the situation on that aspect, as the funds are not held with MtGox (we are merely helping with the investigation and trying to ensure the information flows correctly to the community). |
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No legal action = you have no right to disclose it publicly.
I'll let you discuss this with AurumXchange's attorneys if you really insist on this. |
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No. What they did is unprofessional, completely irresponsible (they didn't even contact the person they are claiming did something wrong--- so what is the point of the thread?), and possibly illegal.
Unlike many of the people on this forum, we act based on legal advice from seasoned lawyers. The information disclosed here has been disclosed for some time to the people involved with Bitcoinica, but it seems that none of them has talked to Zhou about this yet, nor started any legal action (at least none that reached any of us). |
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Mark, please post MtGox's customer privacy agreement here in this thread.
AurumXChange and BitInstant should as well.
This. If information has to be released, release it to the police. I'm quite unclear as to why the involved parties are disclosing this kind of information on a public internet forum. At worst it might even harm an official investigation. I'm curious about AurumExchange's and MT's actual motivations for posting all this. AurumXchange is blocking funds allegedly belonging to Zhou Tong without any disclosed (until now) reason. Legal advice on AurumXchange's side was to issue a statement as soon as possible to clarify the situation as it was being made public on this very forum. In absence of any legal action from the victims of this hack, we have no course of action to contact the police, but will be held responsible if funds are released then legal processing is started at a later point. |
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Mark, please post MtGox's customer privacy agreement here in this thread.
AurumXChange and BitInstant should as well.
Funny how one can go from talks of disclosure to non disclosure on occasions. The points you are highlighting are hardly private (most if not all of is already publicly known), and I fail to see how this qualifies as "libel". |
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It is not up to any of us to judge if funds should be unlocked, we should have an actual court with an actual judge do an actual investigation first.
Instead, it's your job to libel against customers for things you have no proof of? I do believe that I have not done any libel here. I only have presented facts and answered to questions. I suggest you review the definition of libel. |
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It is not up to any of us to judge if funds should be unlocked, we should have an actual court with an actual judge do an actual investigation first.
Seriously, you 3 together have done a much better investigation than any "actual investigation" most official judges or police bureaus in the world would. The only think you lack is "authority". We'd need details that can't be pulled out without authority to get definitive evidence. |
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