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Pure dice games under web3, its design background interface is beautiful, you can choose a network under bsc smart contract,
ERC20, and Polygon.
That's why I can't see any other games besides dice games, do you have any plans to add other games besides dice betting? I hope there is so that the players on this platform also have a shopping experience.
Thank for the feedback! We plan to create Baccarat and Roulette for now, also explore ways to create multi-step web3 games like Blackjack or Crash. |
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I am unable to understand this concept i mean just because creation of something took a certain amount it's not necessary that this value will be it's fair market value always. For example if construction of a building takes a certain amount it's obviously hard to say that this value will be it's fair market value because cost of an exact new construction might have increased due to inflation or gone down due to some pricing revisions of material. This is how intrinsic value of commodities is being measured based on production costs. Construction is a bad example. Gold is a good one. |
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Franky why are you still trying to use mining cost as some sort of way to calculate a value for bitcoin??
I already pointed out the obvious reasons why that doesn't work and why it is meaningless to even talk about a fair value.
As soon as miners sell their bitcoin those bitcoin no longer have any tie to what they cost to produce. They are now in the open market and trade simply by market forces, completely disconnected from miner cost of production. Cost of production has a negligible effect on market price, as the number of bitcoin sold by miners is tiny compared to what trades in the market at all time.
I know its enticing to try to give some base value to bitcoin, and if you were to do that it would make sense to do it based off mining costs, but as I pointed out earlier it simply makes no sense to do that and you're just making pointless calculations. There is no base value of bitcoin. The only value is the market value. To try to come up with a base value is to misunderstand basic principles of a currency and the idea of value in general.
If only value would be market value, whole idea of Investing in any asset wouldn't have existed. How would you invest in something if you don't know what value this asset has? |
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ok lets do some math
320exahash network today
190thash $3639 and 5.2kw per asic
=1684210 asics
=$6112000000 hardware / 105000 blocks* / 6.25btc
=$9313.52 per btc hardware cost
..
1684210 asics x 5.2kwh
=8757895 kw/h x $0.04
=$350315.7894736842 per hour / 6blocks** / 6.25
=$9341.75 per btc electric
total = $18,655.27 hardware+electric per btc for todays hashrate of 320exa
*2 years of blocks
** blocks per hour (even if you multiplied to the fortnight then divided by 2016 = same $ amount)
It doesn't take into account difficulty change, which may be very volatile. difficulty does not change daily but you can do some better math to show a different number at the next change. where you are measuring it out per day/fortnight but at this periods difficulty and resultant of hashes. thats the math for TODAY Your calculation is for today, but it would be very wrong to calculate earnings for the next 2 years and expect that hashrate/difficulty won't change. So, difficulty/hashrate change should be taken into calculations. Current calculation of the difficulty change may be not perfect, but I'm open for the ideas |
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ok lets do some math
320exahash network today
190thash $3639 and 5.2kw per asic
=1684210 asics
=$6112000000 hardware / 105000 blocks* / 6.25btc
=$9313.52 per btc hardware cost
..
1684210 asics x 5.2kwh
=8757895 kw/h x $0.04
=$350315.7894736842 per hour / 6blocks** / 6.25
=$9341.75 per btc electric
total = $18,655.27 hardware+electric per btc for todays hashrate of 320exa
*2 years of blocks
** blocks per hour (even if you multiplied to the fortnight then divided by 2016 = same $ amount)
It doesn't take into account difficulty change, which may be very volatile. |
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the XP is a $6k unit with a 46 price per thash rating
i just showed one that is half the price per thash.. .. why are you using inefficient metrics/measures if you are trying to claim "value".. i still dont get your methodology
You're right, updated to Pro+ Hyd. UPD: Fair value got pretty close to market price. |
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nope its not
190thash for 5.2kw
which in comparison would be like 2.6kw at 95thash(~20% more electric efficiency)
its a more recent 2022 generation of the s19 range
Thanks, added AntMiner S19 XP since 12/01/2022, now Fair Value is $4K less. |
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Thanks for the feedback.
I've updated electricity cost to $0.04/kW h and RIO to 730 days. It made value $20K less, but still above the price.
Daily fluctuation happens because for the difficulty change, formula uses last 6 months, which is not fixed amount of periods to take into account (It may be 12,13,14).
I may need to adjust formula to take fixed amount of periods to prevent those fluctuations.
Value&Premium in your terms is something different from Graham/Warren's Value Investing.
Also my idea not to calculate some figure to tell miners it's attractive or not to invest in mining, but to tell what's the current difference in production costs to current market price (as for commodity), which may be used a signal to buy/sell.
you are also not using the most efficient asic for your hardware cost measure if the value you now measure is still higher then current price if you are wanting a average of the world cost. then take the bottom efficient as value.. and then use 48 cents for the most expensive measure.. then do the middle of them however if you are looking for VALUE then thats the bottom there is nothing wrong with having more then one metric. as long as you explain the methodology that matches the terminology AntMiner S19 3230 95000000000000 3/1/2020 Isn't this most efficient miner on the market? |
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It's great if the contracts have a completed and approved audit, this will allow you to go further to attract more potential users. In the case of the introduction of a service token, will a part of the profits of the online casino, and if so, what will be distributed among the token holders in case they are sent to staking.?
At present, we view our token as a governance token, which will grant future decision-making power to token holders. If token holders propose and vote, some fees on bets may be introduced. How much time did your team spent on developing this website? This is nice, I really like everything about the User Interface, cool.
Can you give us some insights about your plans? Features, promotions, games that you are planning to add soon?
The concept of the Web3 Dice & Gambling platform was conceived in August 2022, and the development took place between September 2022 and February 2023. Regarding future plans, as previously mentioned, we have developed Version 2 of Moon.win, enabling stakers to act as a casino and earn from player bets. We also have plans to develop two more games: Baccarat and Roulette. Once a significant number of players are engaged with Moon.win, we will airdrop MWIN/MOONW governance tokens, allowing users to determine the platform's future direction. Welcome to the forum, SylasDarkmoon! First of all, I have to say that the moon.win website design is impressive, with its sleek use of dark colors and attractive layout. The way you have organized the information on the site is clear and concise, which is a great feature for users who are new to the platform.
Overall, I think this platform has a lot of potential, and I'm looking forward to seeing it grow and thrive. If the team continues to listen to user feedback and implement improvements, it could become one of the best Web3 gambling platforms out there. I'll leave a detailed review after trying the site, and I'm eager to see what new and cool updates are in store. Thank you for being part of this community!
Thank you! The Bitcointalk community is indeed exceptional, and I'm glad to be a part of it as well. welcome to the forum
it seems all you tx happened on the blockchain, it's nice. but the transaction fee is an extra cost to me with playing your games.
Thanks. Exactly, as the bet size increases, the transaction fee becomes a smaller percentage of the total bet amount, making it more cost-effective for larger bets. Welcome guys , Moon.win such a good choice of site name , and pushing Dice Gaming is one good strategy because there are fewer site now that has Web3 Dice game design .
I have checked your platform and notice about the good front design so i come to pay attention to this .
Thanks. The design definitely looks pleasing to the eye. It is one of its kind of gambling platform having decentralization as the main point for users to play without the hassle of making deposits or worrying about delayed withdrawals and other stuff related to that. I believe they won't even force users to do KYC since it is totally decentralized which is one of the plus points of it.
The platform is relatively new, but with improvements and constant and good support towards the gamblers, they can take a good place. I checked the platform and I see there aren't a lot of players yet, but there will be soon if they focus more on marketing.
Thanks for the feedback.
Of course, Moon.win online casino is not the only one that offers a decentralized system of sports betting or gambling, recently this direction has been actively developing and attracts primarily by the lack of KYC, since these platforms do not have a license, the presence of which requires user verification.
That's correct. Licensing is essential for Web2 casinos because all calculations occur in the backend, which helps prevent cheating and ensures fair play for players. In contrast, Web3 casinos, like Moon.win, operate transparently. We use technologies like Chainlink VRF (Verifiable Random Function) to provide instant and provable randomness, ensuring fairness and trustworthiness for all users. Welcome to the forum and the Web3 technology continues to grow.
Will you accept Bitcoin in the future or this will exclusive to altcoins or your own token instead? Anyway, still looking for a good Web3 gambling site since this is an interesting technology and so far this site is looking good. Will have to review some reviews as well from a good site and I hope to read the pros and cons of this site honestly.
Due to the nature of Web3, accepting Bitcoin directly isn't possible. However, we can include Wrapped Bitcoin (WBTC), an ERC-20 token, as an alternative. WBTC maintains a 1:1 peg with Bitcoin and allows for seamless integration into the Ethereum-based Web3 ecosystem. you know, I was reading this thread and I realized I have not heard or encounter a good webpage fully dedicated to write reviews and promote the best Web 3.0 casinos and gambling services on internet.
Most of the webpages I have seen are only about centralized casinos.
Do not you think it would be useful for us to have a web like that, considering the relative popularity these decentralized casinos could have in the future?
So many Web 3 casinos being opened and I don't know anything about them or what the best ones are in terms or volume or number of users.
We would definitely want to be listed on such website. |
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Thanks for the feedback. I've updated electricity cost to $0.04/kW h and RIO to 730 days. It made value $20K less, but still above the price. Daily fluctuation happens because for the difficulty change, formula uses last 6 months, which is not fixed amount of periods to take into account (It may be 12,13,14). I may need to adjust formula to take fixed amount of periods to prevent those fluctuations. Value&Premium in your terms is something different from Graham/Warren's Value Investing. Also my idea not to calculate some figure to tell miners it's attractive or not to invest in mining, but to tell what's the current difference in production costs to current market price (as for commodity), which may be used a signal to buy/sell. value is below market. premium is above market
it appears your numbers for 2022-23 are average not value
your formulae numbers are subjective
8 cent electric of a 12 month ROI
hmm
my numbers are
from efficient asic farming mining in low electric of $18k for this fortnights mining rate
to an inefficient asic hobby mining in high electric of $118k for this fortnights mining rate
which is an average of ~$68k
value: 18k
average: 68k
premium: 118k
as for your numbers for 2018.. that is way above premium for that period even for high electric regions
my math is based on a 2 year ROI
because industrial mining farms buy hardware that lasts 2 years and electric contracts that are bought for upto 2 years so the number of coins earned over a 2 year period become the math.
and industrial electric is cheaper then $0.08 at $0.04
and the hobbiest is electric is more then $0.08 at upto $0.48
..
that said you have a good bases of looking beyond the markets for underling value. but your math is a lil out, compared to rational expectations of what real mining farms do
and another hint. the math you show saying how you are using 1 year measures of coins earned. and then 6 months and then fortnightly difficulty changes.. yet your charts changes daily so your not exactly sticking to the difficulty steps of one change a fortnight. using average hashrate of that fortnight
most miners dont account for costs on the daily. they take the monthly costs or the 2 yearly costs and compare it to coins earned over those averages
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Good points folks, security audit is on the way.
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Nice job on the ANN. Good to see another new Web3 application after long time. It seems you have plans to get good exposure on the forum. It's the oldest and biggest crypto space although it will be a bit difficult if you do not have BTC as a payment option which I guess you don't. But in any case, a professional touch and advertising strategy may increase your chance.
Feel free to reach me if you are looking for such person. You can see from my service page that I provide Bitcointalk campaign management.
Welcome to the forum by the way.
Thank you! We would gladly have BTC as "payment option" but there's no smart contracts in Bitcoin network, so currently ETH, BSC, Polygon (MATIC, USDT) are the options to play. Welcome to the forum. Be aware that people are asking about Bitcoin integration in your casino because, even though, Web3.0 services are welcome around here, moderators reserve their right to remove any services from the gambling section which do not take Bitcoin onto the alt-coin section. If that happens, you may lose some visibility from potential users. It has happened before with other threads. So, if you can come up with a solution to deposit with Bitcoin (at least in a centralized manner, for now) it may save you some troubles with this ANN thread. Good luck.  Thanks! About Bitcoin I first read in 2012 and I'm a big fan of Satoshi's ideas, decentralization and cypherpunks. I'd love to add Bitcoin to Moonwin, but there's no smart contracts per architecture. (Cypherpunks wouldn't be happy with centralized solution  ) Hope this thread stays in this section, as it presents what decentralization and transparency in gambling nowadays should be.  I am aware that ideally, you would be able to accept Bitcoin in a decentralized manner, through smart contracts, but that not possible because of the nature of the Bitcoin Chain, as you said. There are many popular and loved casinos here in this section which are mostly centralized when comes to deposits and withdrawals, and yet that has not translated to a decrease of quality of services to them. I understand the main focus of your casino is decentralization and Web 3.0, but do not rule out to make an exception for Bitcoin if in the future you realize you could get some benefits from adding solutions for those who wish to deposit satoshis somehow. Keep in mind the huge volume of Bitcoin. Wrapped Bitcoin may be a solution and can be easily added to Moonwin, if there's demand for that. I only doubt that pure Bitcoinists have any WBTC  |
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Greatly appreciate your feedback!
We are currently in discussions with several companies regarding the Smart Contract Audit, and we expect it to be completed shortly.
We refer to our platform as a "Gambling Platform" because we have developed Version 2 of the contract, which will enable users to stake coins and serve as a casino or bankroll for both stakers and players, allowing them to play against one another. Furthermore, we have plans to introduce a governance token, empowering the Moon.win community (players/stakers) to have a say in the platform's future direction.
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Nice job on the ANN. Good to see another new Web3 application after long time. It seems you have plans to get good exposure on the forum. It's the oldest and biggest crypto space although it will be a bit difficult if you do not have BTC as a payment option which I guess you don't. But in any case, a professional touch and advertising strategy may increase your chance.
Feel free to reach me if you are looking for such person. You can see from my service page that I provide Bitcointalk campaign management.
Welcome to the forum by the way.
Thank you! We would gladly have BTC as "payment option" but there's no smart contracts in Bitcoin network, so currently ETH, BSC, Polygon (MATIC, USDT) are the options to play. Welcome to the forum. Be aware that people are asking about Bitcoin integration in your casino because, even though, Web3.0 services are welcome around here, moderators reserve their right to remove any services from the gambling section which do not take Bitcoin onto the alt-coin section. If that happens, you may lose some visibility from potential users. It has happened before with other threads. So, if you can come up with a solution to deposit with Bitcoin (at least in a centralized manner, for now) it may save you some troubles with this ANN thread. Good luck. Thanks! About Bitcoin I first read in 2012 and I'm a big fan of Satoshi's ideas, decentralization and cypherpunks. I'd love to add Bitcoin to Moonwin, but there's no smart contracts per architecture. (Cypherpunks wouldn't be happy with centralized solution ) Hope this thread stays in this section, as it presents what decentralization and transparency in gambling nowadays should be. |
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There used to be a website called satoshidice where we were supposed to send our bets and get instant payouts if we win and there were some slabs too that gave higher wins (I'm not talking about the current website as it looks like their domain name got sold some time ago). Your website reminds me of them, nice job SylasDarkmoon by allowing us to anonymously play on your site and get paid out winnings directly on our address.  I wish you good luck and great success with this project. Thanks a lot. Appreciate your words very much. Original Satoshidice was a huge inspiration for me, when I start building Moonwin, but Moonwin is even more anonymous and decentralized, as all the logic is on the smart contracts and for random number generator - Chainlink VRF is being used which is instantly provable. |
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Nice job on the ANN. Good to see another new Web3 application after long time. It seems you have plans to get good exposure on the forum. It's the oldest and biggest crypto space although it will be a bit difficult if you do not have BTC as a payment option which I guess you don't. But in any case, a professional touch and advertising strategy may increase your chance.
Feel free to reach me if you are looking for such person. You can see from my service page that I provide Bitcointalk campaign management.
Welcome to the forum by the way.
Thank you! We would gladly have BTC as "payment option" but there's no smart contracts in Bitcoin network, so currently ETH, BSC, Polygon (MATIC, USDT) are the options to play. Welcome to bitcointalk.org !
It seems to be a nice platform, I've seen your site and how it works. I'll try your dice platform in the next hours.
Thanks! Let me know about your experience and how we can make it better. Welcome onboard mate, you have an interesting ANN and I look forward to seeing you grow through the market, I have not really taken the time to check through your casino to know how effective your services are.
-But then let's see how things unfold as you journey ahead, I will make out time to check your platform during the coming weekend.
Thanks and Welcome to Moonwin! Welcome to the forum.
I see your website is very good, has very attractive colors, but unfortunately there seems to be no option to use bitcoin to bet, even though bitcoin is the favorite coin to bet on this gambling.
But it doesn't matter it seems there is still an Ethereum option to bet on and for me that is good.
Suggestion for you OP if you want to run a business and be known in all members of this forum it would be better to do a signature campaign, it will make your business more known in this forum like other gambling that has been successful in this forum.
Hope your business will be successful here, I hope.
Thanks! Unfortunately, there's no smart contracts in Bitcoin Network and the only option for now is to have some backend to accept and play in BTC, there are some centralized options to play Dice on the market. We want to stay fully decentralized with all the logic on smart contracts, currently I consider sharing source code of the front-end, so people may run it locally to play, if some connection issues to the website happen. Welcome to bitcointalk.org !
It seems to be a nice platform, I've seen your site and how it works. I'll try your dice platform in the next hours.
A platform cannot be confirm as a nice platform because of the picture or the design of the website it can only calls a good website when will participate on it and see the reputation of the platform so I believe that this platform should be something we are supposed to consider or look into very well before we try to cooperate with them Reputation is something that hard to earn, but easy to lose. Hope, time will make Moonwin a place with good reputation, as we tried to make it as transparent and decentralized, as it was possible. Firstly, welcome to BTT! I'm certain that many people here would love to try your platform, given its sleek design as a web3 website and its use of web3.js. One of its standout features is that it can operate on multiple networks such as BSC and Ethereum without requiring token swapping or incurring gas fees, which is not common among many platforms. We are excited to see the addition of new games in the future.
However, I strongly suggest that your smart contracts undergo auditing to ensure that there are no malicious codes present. As we are all aware, granting access to wallets can be risky.
Thank you! That's a good point, currently we didn't undergo auditing, but consider making it in the nearest future. All our smart contracts are verified, so people with technical skills can read the code. Addresses: Polygon: 0x153DeC40755788591d30891050d0c39Ed5862C10 ETH: 0x26a1FcCC5e03A0f7988B4A24D09b519DbE7a51C2 BNB: 0xf4ea47dc23D1efd580bEdaF35787C126283fc969 Welcome to bitcointalk.org !
It seems to be a nice platform, I've seen your site and how it works. I'll try your dice platform in the next hours.
A platform cannot be confirm as a nice platform because of the picture or the design of the website it can only calls a good website when will participate on it and see the reputation of the platform so I believe that this platform should be something we are supposed to consider or look into very well before we try to cooperate with them I think that what you said is in line and I believe that any platform can be justified based on the ability of drawing your deposit and ability to deposit and in the process very fast, secondly when you have issue in your platform the customer service at them to you very fast is the criteria where we can classify a platform as a good one Our platform doesn't require deposits and/or customer service, as it is non-custodial, when player makes a bet, smart-contract requests Chainlink VRF to provide random number, if player wins, winning is instantly payed out to the player's wallet Your platform is really amazing and has many good features. But I only notice one wallet connect option, and it's fast, but I will recommend more, like Metamask preferably, and others that will support other coins that are out there and not just Ethereum and its layers of blockchain. And to change between one network to the other you should also make that simple instead of requiring one to disconnect and reconnect using the preferred blockchain why it could have just been made as easy as just 2 clicks since it's might just be same wallet
Metamask is supported for desktop Chrome extension and Mobile Metamask browser, in the coming days we will roll out update for UI to change networks via WalletConnect without requiring to Disconnect and Connect again. Thanks for the feedback! |
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