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Here is Bitcoin discussion and not any altcoin. Hope this thread gets moved to the right section.
Really why this thread with that headline got opened here???
MaidSAFE isn't an altcoin really. It does contain an altcoin. But it is mostly a new internet and a new Cloud platform that will change everything. Currently Storing private keys is one of the biggest issues with Bitcoin. MaidSAFE will provide a nearly HackProof solution to that. MaidSAFE will also provide a very efficient method to store the blockchain. MaidSAFE, if it comes to fruition will change everything -- Including Bitcoin -- And for the better. |
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safecoin lost my interest at the bit where it said no bloat because safecoin confess its own storage...
in short.. they are just a upload website with a gimmicky way of having users access data to pretend to be decentralized..
its like saying to users its decentralized because all the users download a torrent program.. but all the seeds are on safecoins servers...
much like etherium and nxt are centralized coin holders pretending to be proper decentralized blockchains..
when will the world of the 1990's centralized mysql database lovers, ever learn..
i dont even understand why this is being blatently advertised on bitcoin/blockchain based forums.. when it has nothing to do with it
Okay so what exactly is not centralized? The transaction managers? The vault managers? You could be a bit more specific if you really know what you are talking about. What exactly do these MaidSAFE servers do? Who runs them? where are they? MaidSAFE has servers now that serve their web pages and marketing material, but they have nothing to do with the code.. The code is on GitHub, and all of the services the network provides will be on the network by the consensus of clusters of peer to peer nodes. There are no central servers. I have downloaded, reviewed and run much of the code, and I think you have no clue what you are talking about? The code works in test. it is not ready for release yet. There are lots of things left to improve and enhanced, and peer to peer software is very difficult to upgrade once it is in the wild -- You need consensus to make any protocol changes, and that is hard to get. They say 1-3 weeks before a developer pack is ready.. Knowing the process, I translate that to within 90 days. But you can download and see the progress every day. Anyone who claims this is Vaporware is ignorant of the truth and is just making stuff up because it is plausible. |
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Has anyone approached any authorities at all?
I'm wondering about this as well. I just lost 125$ so it's not worth any effort, but how can you treat it as a shut case if you lost 1k or more? I don't get that.. It's very likely that some of the people that lost much did approach the authorities. But those things move slowly and even if you get some results announcing them publicly s not the most responsible thing to do. But it's likely that most cases were similar to you, small losses etc. It is unlikely that any authorities take this too seriously. Nobody even knows who these guys where or where they where operating from. Most authorities will not do too much work unless they know that the crime and criminal where within their jurisdiction. There where tons of much bigger scams to chase. I know there where several Private investigators assigned to the case, but if they haven't yielded useful clues by now they probably never will. Most of the lost money is probably in the hands of the early investors. I am sure the perpetrators ran of with a good chunk too.. |
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I still don't know where BT pulled their daily profit numbers
Out of their ass. Well, their ass was pretty well tuned to some market movements, so the question is not answered so easily... Not that it matters, or can be proved either way, but do you think they actually ever traded in anything? There seem to be two basic ponzi models 1) Ones which are, from the get go, pure scams pretending to trade but solely designed to gain credibility and deposits until such a time as the admin take the money and run 2) Ones which start off as legit investments and 'go bad'. They have a core business which is real but unexceptional, which is then developed on by the owner for reasons of greed and hubris and becomes a ponzi. If you believe anything that Madoff says, for the first thirty years he was straight. Hindsight is a great thing, but I followed BT quite carefully and came close to a dabble, luckily deciding not to. The decider for me was I didn't believe that John Carley existed, there were too many inconsistencies in the story. If he didn't/doesn't exist then I think BT must go in category 1. Usually if you are trying to set up a legit investment you don't go and buy software that is marketed "Professional HYIP Manager" I don't think there is any reason to believe the traded at all. When the placed closed, there was several days where if there where traders, they damn sure would have known why they weren't trading.. The fact that everyone was in a confused daze and had zero answers tell us that the whole thing stopped working tells us pretty much that everything is made up and the points don't matter.. |
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I think what Bitcoin Trader had going for it was a 'Degree of plausibility' When you looked at it at first glance, you would think "I can see how that could work" Particularly back in the days when MT Gox was trading 100 dollars above everyone else..
If you built a spreadsheet and tried to work out how the arbitrage would work - it didn't add up -- but who does that?Once you are in, you want to believe what you want to believe, and many people would lie to themselves and everybody else at least long enough to get their money out..
Esoteric came in and pretended to be a legit BT -- I don't think many believed them -- thus the short lifespan.. Hopefully everyone has learned their lesson. I think several of the "Cloud Hashing" services are also HYIP.. So there will be at least one more round of "Where's all our money" Hopefully by then most will have learned their lesson and will be ready to pass along their advice to most anyone who asks..
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Anyone get any money back yet? Says update on 11/10 but nothing seems to be posted on the website..
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u know u posted in wrong topic ? Yes, but there where 10 pages or so of these guys ambulance chasing Bitcoin-trader.biz customers after the collapse in this thread and several of us telling them to get lost, that nobody needed another ponzi. I figured it deserved a "told you so" here. |
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what about funds ? did they refund to the investors ? Well, the paper there says that they intend to sell everything, gain or loss and pay the investors back soon. They made it very clear that there will probably be losses. If they where ponzi (sure smells like it) they will probably be pretty substantial. Time may tell.. |
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this is crazy I was looking up information on how to make money with bitcoin a few weeks ago,
came across Bitcoin Trader in some youtube videos, I was so close to putting some funds there.
I was thinking if its been around for a while then it must be ok,
Consider yourself very lucky. A friend and myself lost a fair amount of BTC to this sham for precisely the same reason. We figured if it had been around for over a year perhaps their claims of not being a HYIP had some credence. Boy, do we feel stupid. Bitcoin the technology I still believe in whole heartedly, but it's this kinda crap that's keeping 96+% of the rest of the world from truly embracing this thing of beauty. Leave it to greedy, unscrupulous people to ruin the single most ingenious invention arguably in multiple generations (or at least peoples perception of it). As for fund recovery, I'll be surprised if we see a single satoshi of our investment at this point as it appears the con behind this appears to be a verteran scam-artist. I feel bad for both mine and my friends lost satoshi's as well as anybody else that fell prey to this scam but honestly I'm more concerned what impact this will have on the 'general publics perception of bitcoin overall. I am coming to the conclusion that most "Put you Bitcoin to work" businesses on the internet are scams. If they had a profitable business model, there is no shortage of Venture Capital money to fund operations. If they have to crowdsource 20 dollars per share, chances are the business model is "take the bitcoin and run" or "Collect huge salaries and live high on the hog until we file bankruptcy." |
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Does anyone have any updates on the situation with our money? Has anyone heard from any law enforcement agencies or anything? I only know this forum for finding out what's going on with trying to get everyone's money back from Bitcoin Trader.
I reported to the IC3 but haven't heard from them still and it's been over 2 weeks, wondering if anyone also reported their situation to them or another international investigative agency. It seems the more time we wait the more likely we won't get our money back, is anyone doing anything to find out the facts of all that happened with BT since it shut down? I'm still 20,000$ out and have to pay back my debts, so I really would like to know if anyone has heard anything.
Thanks,
Tim
Best to make peace with the idea that your money is long gone. In the unlikely event that it is recovered, there will still probably only be 40% on the dollar anyway, as in a ponzi scheme most of the later money is handed to the earlier investors. |
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This thread has got so funny. Imagine a legit investment company sending "reps" onto the internet to tell people "It's not up to us to prove we aren't a ponzi - you guys have to prove we ARE a ponzi!"  So has Esoteric Investments posted anything whatsoever to show they are carrying out legit business yet? Any tiny little thing which might just hint that they aren't exactly the same as BT? Because it seems to me that, if a company WAS carrying out any form of legit business, it would be very easy for them to post a little something to prove it. Imagine the PR boost that an investment fund, offering 5% return per month, would get, just from revealing something which hinted that they were above board? After all, there are hundreds of schemes like this, appearing and disappearing every day - and not a single one has EVER managed to show they are carrying out legit business. What reason on Earth would there be for a fund NOT to do this? Even if they weren't already being regarded with heavy skepticism? If it walks like a duck, talks like a duck It must be an ostrich, right? If anyone suggest otherwise, they just quack even louder and more fervently. |
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The simple fact of the matter is that I had a very long argument with a Bitcoin trader representative the day before John Carley's letter came out making the exact same "Just because we look like a ponzi doesn't mean we are, Slanderer!" dialog...
It quite simply doesn't carry an ounce of weight here.. The more you talk the more you look just like them..
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Seems they are already operating a new scheme: https://www.esotericinvestments.comI have contacted their support with a silly question and the reply was almost identical to what BT replied at the time they were still replying. I think its created by those who have been scammed by BT Esoteric Investments is not in any way connected to BitTrader.biz No shit. That's why you need to get lost. The more you post here the more connected you get. Go AWAY post on your own stinking thread. Ambulance chasing is not welcome here. I was just passing through as someone accused us on one of our own threads. And I wanted to clear up theconnections that I had seen here, all I am trying to do is fix a possible source of ppl claiming we are connected. I will not be posting here again unless necessary. You just did. |
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Seems they are already operating a new scheme: https://www.esotericinvestments.comI have contacted their support with a silly question and the reply was almost identical to what BT replied at the time they were still replying. I think its created by those who have been scammed by BT Esoteric Investments is not in any way connected to BitTrader.biz No shit. That's why you need to get lost. The more you post here the more connected you get. Go AWAY post on your own stinking thread. Ambulance chasing is not welcome here. |
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I don't think bitcoin-trader.biz was on the list, last time I checked. The best scams don't reveal themselves as scams until it is too late. |
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Does anyone have any idea how they got their yield numbers? The mining part is easy, just provide difficulty adjusted returns. But what about the trading pool. How did they pick the numbers?
No. I do think Shadowscripts has options to calculate the optimal payouts for you. They probably looked at the market a bit and adjusted it one direction or another a little bit -- But the schedule was pretty set.. The average would be steady for a couple months, the step down a quarter percent and stay steady for a couple months until the end. In Feb and March 1.5% days where pretty normal at the end it was more .7%... |
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The topic of this thread is bitcoin-trader.biz. If you want to talk about something different, the forum software allows you to make new threads..
Ambulance chasers suck. Go away.
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They all claim to have a new "secret sauce' That makes them different.
All of these scams are innocent until proven guilty.. Unfortunately the only way they are proven guilty is that they disappear with all of your money...
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Ooh, You aren't investing in that scam? Come invest in mine instead....
Ambulance chaser.
Shameless..
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