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1  Economy / Computer hardware / [WTS] 3xMonarch 600C Preorder w/ intl shipping on: December 31, 2013, 01:29:05 PM
I have 3x BFL Monarch 600Gh preorders from the bullet run up for grabs with intl shipping paid!

1x 600Gh 10th of October + 13Gh "Mining by the GH"
2x 600Gh 29th of November
A total of 1800Gh. These are the watercooling upgraded models from the initial bullet run batch.

Selling them as bunch. Payment preferred BTC.

Bidding starts at 17BTC for all 3. Minimum increment 0.2BTC
Bidding ends 7th of January.

After transaction i will move the preorders to you, as instructed by BFL.
Optionally a reputable escrow can be used at the buyer's expense.

If BFL ships any of these prior to auction end, the final price will be adjusted as per remaining preorders or cancelled.
I also reserve the right to cancel auction at my consideration.
2  Bitcoin / Hardware / Summary of current ASIC providers? on: November 20, 2013, 06:11:05 AM
Been out of the forums for a few months, busy with other business.

I see several new comers to the ASIC field, and could some people please summarize how they look, how legit they look etc.?

AntMiner -> This thread i have gone fully through, slightly skeptic but looks more legitimate than some, at least some pics of chips, boards etc. but there was HUGE heatsinks (or what looked like) at the backside of the boards no one explained etc. and the similarities to one of the pre-existing chips is curios one, while they claim to achieve so much more.

BlackArrow -> Very good sounding offers etc. but highly skeptic of their lowest $/Gh and J/Gh claims - and apparently they have absolutely no history of products and nothing tangible in hand to show? Do they have a workshop, has someone visited them etc.?

HashFast -> Don't really know much about this one.

Cointerra -> Went bust, right?

KnC -> They are shipping but big QA issues right, but still in the end delivering more than promised? They come and go out of stock constantly? They are in sweden - anyone know if they allow payment during pickup? For me it's quite quick to get to Sweden since i live in Finland Smiley Did their original announced timeline hold?

So many entrants on this very expensive field to get started up - somehow i think many of these are outright scams. I'm looking to offset risk by putting in orders for multiple places.

No one seems to have anything in hand - except a few very expensive options @ eBay?
3  Economy / Auctions / AUCTION BFL Little Single 30GH/s Preorder #3218 13th of July on: June 23, 2013, 01:42:30 PM
For auction: BFL Little Single 30Ghash/s preorder
Order date 13th of July, order #3218

If i'm unable to change the shipping address, i will reship it to you at my own expense.

Minimum bid: 30BTC, 1BTC increments
Auction End: 1st July, 15:00 GMT+3
Reserve: 150BTC
Escrow: Prefer none, but will accept JohnK or Graet, buyer pays the fees / gives a donation to the escrow
Shipping: within 3 business days of receiving it and clearing from customs here in Finland, will utilize DHL Express. Buyer assumes all risks for customs delays, manufacturer defects and such.

OPTION: We may host it for you in our DC, includes a atom host machine with 100mbps uplink and remote reboot capabilities. Price 35 a month + 0.20/kWh, includes cooling

If reserve is not met, i will decide if i will accept the highest bid or not. If reserve is met the auction ends and will try to change the shipping details immediately after payment and send you the invoice as PDF.

4  Economy / Digital goods / WTB Eve Online Plex on: February 10, 2013, 02:20:22 AM
Want to buy eve online plex
Prefer escrow

Make me an offer via PM! Smiley
5  Other / Off-topic / Upgrading jalapeno to little sc preorder? on: October 28, 2012, 12:05:44 PM
I asked them via e-mail on how to do this but yet to receive a reply - so how to proceed?
6  Economy / Computer hardware / [WTS] 2x *NEW UNOPENED* Gigabyte 7970 Reference Design. 110BTC Shipped on: June 05, 2012, 02:50:26 PM
2x Gigabyte HD7970 3Gb DDR5 Reference Design

Both are new, never installed, only another box has been opened, and even then GPU hasn't been taken out of it's packaging.
Warranty valid, and will handle if needed (Buyer will pay postage for warranty)

Never had the time to install, and they've been sitting around unused.

Price: 110BTC including shipping or delivery near Helsinki, Finland
Price excl. VAT, VAT will be applied for EU residents.
Price not negotiable.

Payment: BTC, Paypal, IBAN Wiretransfer, Cash
7  Other / CPU/GPU Bitcoin mining hardware / ATI Open sourced Linux Drivers for 7900 series! on: March 21, 2012, 09:05:35 AM
Also reported on Slashdot
8  Bitcoin / Mining software (miners) / Why not utilize RAM in video cards? on: March 18, 2012, 09:11:25 PM
I know you guys are far more skilled and knowledgeable in terms of doing this kind of chance, but in the odd chance i had just a different view perspective.

Video cards usually sport a lot of VERY fast RAM as well, so couldn't this be used for portions of the algorithm in a 'rainbow table' fashion.
So for some particularly heavy operation in the SHA256 algorithm, trying to fetch the answer from video card ram, or maybe even system RAM as a fail over.

This has to be a very small portion key=value based store which is pre-generated upon launch, but a costly one, with a very high ratio of processing cost vs. memory needed.

As there is a latency cost, it will likely mean that the code needs to be split into 2 portions from the "look at tables" position, so that results are being cached for the 2nd stage (after lookup) to keep all SPs fully utilized all the time despite increased latency.

This would help utilize more of the (already paid for) hardware for a performance increase.
9  Economy / Computer hardware / [WTS] 5850 HSF on: March 17, 2012, 03:53:34 AM
PowerColor HD5850 Heatsink + Fan. Looks reference design to me.

Fan in good working condition. Heatsink quite clean despite running for a year (no i didn't clean it).
One of the heatsink screws got cut through while i was screwing it back after replacing thermal paste, so i decided to replace it with a AC TwinTurbo. All screws with springs are included however.

Pictures upon request, i already took pictures but it's a PITA to transfer pics out of my Nokia E7.
Shipping from Finland.

Price: Best Offer + Shipping.
Buy out: 25$

Payment PP or Bitcoin equivalent.
10  Bitcoin / Mining / wierd pause on newly mined blocks - no blocks for 56mins? on: March 15, 2012, 12:52:18 AM

During the turn from 14th to 15th there was 56minute gap in new blocks.
Only reason i noticed was because i was waiting for some transactions to go through.

Does this happen often, i thought it shouldn't? What are the odds of that just happening by chance ... Probably just chance but i would think odds of 1hr with only 1 block mined has quite low odds.
11  Bitcoin / Mining / Mining resources hosting/leasing service, worth it? on: March 13, 2012, 04:43:13 PM
I've been thinking about this since last summer, but it brought up again lately and realized this might make a lot of sense for some people.

My idea is to offer mining hardware for hosted lease, with some customization options, and a range of products to choose, from GPUs to FPGAs.
Pricing would be set according to real world pricing and cost to operate and acquire the hardware - not by the potential BTC mining results.

You would directly pay for the mining hardware, not the infrastructure etc. you wouldn't need to care yourself about the physical setup etc.
Price would include hardware replacements, service level agreement, and all the overheads needed to operate something like this.
You wouldn't not need to worry about anything else than "What pools do i want to use?".

You would get access to RRD graphs of YOUR cluster, with each device listed and total graphs.
At later point we will also enable you to change pool configurations on the fly for yourself, and for the whole cluster - maybe also some other configuration options to a limit.
The performance would be managed by us, meaning we first optimize it for best MH/W combination.

The biggest drawback is that electricity is rather expensive for us - 0.18$/kWh in primary location for GPUs and 0.16$/kWh where a small cluster of FPGAs will be set up (office). The upside is that we don't need AC being located near to the arctic circle Wink

Office has AC so FPGAs will run cool, with low rejects and high speeds.

The SLA would cover:
 * Network uptime
 * Hardware uptime
 * Hardware replacements

Support is 24/7 for basic questions, hardware technical (replacements) is ~12/7, commercial is available ~12/5 (business days)

Capacity to grow offsite location is up to around 100kW (cooling limited), office 7kW.
Offsite location has 24/7 recording camera surveillance as well.

GPUs already available or en-route:
  • 5830
  • 5850
  • 5870
  • 6950
  • 6770
  • 7970

All current FPGA options will be made available, with longer delivery times:
  • BFL Single
  • Icarus
  • X6500
  • Z-Tex

Some GPUs will be upgraded with better after market coolers if the temperatures raise too high. Target is to keep them below 70C.

Offsite location will likely also feature UPS backup at a later date.
Office will likely NOT have UPS for the FPGAs
12  Other / CPU/GPU Bitcoin mining hardware / Making PCI-E x1 to x16 with power on: March 12, 2012, 04:43:20 AM
I got a bunch PCI-E x1 extenders but need to add power to them most likely. I recall some people having connectors "frying" without the added power.

I can't remember the pin numbers to which put the +12V and ground leads.

Anyone got a link where the specs were or a how-to?
Don't want to get this incorrect and fry a few 7970s Cheesy
13  Other / CPU/GPU Bitcoin mining hardware / Building a DIY UPS on: March 12, 2012, 12:25:25 AM
The easy part is getting batteries stacked, wired, charged.
Still easy is to power up 12V devices from that: I was thinking a zener diode, regulator, capacitor between battery back and 12V DC sources, so trickle charges can continue normal operation like no load was attached while beyond the regulator etc. is a 12V PSU with 12V devices. and when network electricity goes the trickle charger, 12V PSUs shutdown and 12V devices get powered from the battery pack with regulator +capacitor "cleaned" source.
Some kind surge protector + fuses might be still good idea tho.

The problem arises on how to switch between inverters and network electricity on 230V equipment?
How to "join" together multiple cheap inverters for single source of 230V instead of calculating how much to put behind each single inverter?
I've heard of switches sold for this usage for rack mounting, but i simply cannot find those "STS switches" for sale. Or would SPDT relays switch fast enough when outage occurs? Doesn't that cause spikes, and need something to smooth out the transition?

One problem tho remains at this location is how to clean the network electricity, as it's a bit flaky there, short sub second outages are known to happen there during storms and fuses to blow with no apparent reason occasionally. Network -> converter -> battery back -> inverter -> miners is just not a feasible option due to losses.
14  Bitcoin / Mining support / BAMT won't OC anymore on: March 11, 2012, 02:10:26 AM
After a crash on one of my 58xx cards due to a bit too high clock, now BAMT refuses to set clocks for the high usage profile. Infact, the high usage profile memclock got applied to idle :/

Had to disable the GPU because @ stock voltages it's running hot and slower than an undervolted card :/

Any ideas what's going on?
15  Bitcoin / Hardware / FPGA life expectancy? on: March 10, 2012, 03:16:15 PM
I'm trying to figure out what should be the next mining related purchases i do, but one question remains: What is the life expectancy of FPGA based miners?
Has people have them fail?
How long were they running before they failed?
and how many do you got which are still running, and how long has each been running?

That data would help me calculate the annual failure rate, from which one can derive the expected average lifetime Smiley

Versus GPUs it seems people expect GPUs to have an average lifetime of 3years, correct me if i'm wrong.
16  Bitcoin / Mining support / Mining results far worse than expected on: March 08, 2012, 09:45:06 PM
I use Slush's pool almost solely, but the rewards has been far worse than expected always.
Before i didn't really care, just few Ghash/s worth for fun running.

Currently i have on Slush 1.77Ghash worth of capacity and the yield is 0.95BTC/day while expected is ~1.2BTC/day.
This has always been true of Slush's pool, and deepbit seems to be even far more worse.

All my systems are properly cooled, have good PSUs, only mild OC if any and efficiency (stales etc.) travels at around 97.8 to 99.2%.

I use Linuxcoin, and even after updating to latest Phoenix which increased hash rate ~7.5% i saw actually a decrease on reported hash rate @ Slush's pool, and it made absolutely no effect on yield.

Generally my GPUs are running under 100% utilization, somewhat below the average expected by the hardware comparison charts, except for some cards, ie. 6770s i'm running at 242Mhash/s average! (890Mhz, stock 850, temps ~65c, stock air cooler)

About to change to BAMT (Linuxcoin has always sucked, but it was most convenient to use last summer) and see if that changes things.

But anyone know why my returns are roughly 20-21% below the expected?
Direct Ghash/s comparison to pool total should yield 1.214BTC/day.
According to: should make 1.19BTC/day and after taking into account pool luck should still be 1.1186BTC/day.

Also someone mentioned that 1Ghash/s stays at around 4$ per day value on average over the long term, How the hell does one achieve that kind of results? :O
17  Bitcoin / Hardware / FPGA HPC :P 32*LX150 on: March 07, 2012, 09:08:50 PM
Noticed this:

32 Spartan6 LX150 FPGAs in single device

Now let's see who first turns that into a mining rig or something similar Grin
18  Economy / Speculation / Interesting view of what BTC value could be in 2022 on: March 04, 2012, 03:03:00 PM
I started this by comparing to Paypal, and by finding some statistics of Paypal.
Please note that all of this is based on the assumption Bitcoin will have very conservative success - but success over the long term nevertheless.

350mil+ Paypal users, from 2009 data we can estimate that that 135million of them are active users.
Active account average balance was 45$ in 2009, we shall use that without correction for expected growth.
This means 6 075million USD in just active account balances on Paypal in 2011.

So by 2022, if Bitcoin achieves just 5% of the current mass of Paypal, which could be very conservative, especially if Bitcoin is made easier for Joe Averages and some kind of Killer application becomes reality, ie. eBay + Craigslist type of events. Technological advances will make a huge influence as well to make this a reality, think about how things were in 2002.

If i calculated right there will be already ~19.03mil BTC in the wild by 2022.
That seems too much, but i based it on the halving of mined return per 210,000 blocks or 4 years.
If it's too much, it only makes this even more conservative.

If we assume 5% get lost forever by this time, that leaves us with 18.08mil BTC.

If even 5% of Paypal's mass today is reached by 2022 this means these will represent 303.75million USD, or 16.80USD/BTC. Seems far too conservative? Because it is.

Due to nature of Bitcoin, people will be inclined to hoard and keep them, in hopes of future gains. Bitcoin is also a value store, unlike with Paypal you are mad to keep any significant balance there for any period of time.

So we can assume safely people will keep atleast 4 times more, ie. 180$ or more in their balance.
This already leaves us with 67.20USD/BTC. That looks a lot more realistic - still conservative tho

But it remains extremely conservative STILL.  It does not account for new people getting connected, the growth of eCommerce, and that many wants to use Bitcoin also as a offline transaction medium, which AFAIK is happening to some degree already? ie. cash based exchanges, actual coins & bills etc. Which is impossible with Paypal.
We will buy more and more stuff online, and for many parts of the world internet is just beginning to see widespread adoption in some parts of the world. There still remains billions to be connected to internet. With the raise of better and better mobile devices, these people will get connected.

Just from eCommerce growth we can assume at least 50% growth by 2022, which is probably off by order of magnitude.
Add to that it's quite likely we will probably see nearly double the internet users by 2022, let's say 80% for a total of 58% of current world population using internet.

eCommerce growth will bring us to 100.80USD/BTC
Internet user growth will bring us to 159.26USD/BTC.

Unlike credit card companies, and almost any method of transactioning out there has fees of at least % for merchants. Only cash, and in most parts of the world bank wire transfers are free, neither of which is easy to automate for some portions.
This will mean a lot of Merchants will choose to support BTC when value slightly stabilizes, easy to automate, no transaction fees, likely to just increase in value - what's there not to like?
Assume this adds an conservative 10% to the % using BTC.

Russia, United Arab Emirates, Asia, are pretty much blocked off Paypal - In real world this would easily triple the amount of user base. We will choose an very conservative 50% for this figure too. This too would of course increase adoption within Merchants but we are not adjusting for that separately.

Merchant adoption increase: 175.19USD/BTC
Russia, UAE, Asia: 262.79USD/BTC

Add that to other potentially disrupting technologies: Think pre-paid Bitcoin "Credit cards" to use @ grocery stores, this "CC" would store the keys required for the grocery store to make the transaction from your wallet. Remember that with real cards merchants are trusted like this too. And this isn't even that hard to do.For short term someone could offer regular prepaid Mastercards which are prepaid using BTC Smiley

To recap the percentages of increase from 16.80$/BTC Are:
Hoarding/Investing into bitcoins: 400%
eCommerce Growth: 50%
Internet userbase Growth: 80%
Merchant Adoption: 10%
Russia, UAE, Asia Access: 50%
IMHO, these should be calculated in exponential fashion as in described above.

The 16.80$/BTC came from:
5% of Paypals mass 2011
135mil active users with 45$ average balance representing 6 075million USD.
18.08Million BTC in circulation
(135mil * 5%) * 45$ = 303.75Million USD
303.75 / 18.08 = 16.80$/BTC

Using 25%:
1 518.75million USD
Growth factors:
Hoarding: 336$/BTC
eCommerce: 504$/BTC
Userbase: 907.2$/BTC
Merchants: 997.92$/BTC
Russia, UAE, Asia: 1496.88$/BTC

My instinct is telling me however that we are going to see somewhere in vicinity 1000$/BTC.

If we use the 45$ average balance figure, and 10% of internet users are actively using BTC in 2022:
408million users.
18 362million USD.

This holds better with my instincts Smiley

I did do some heavy assumptions here, but please do point out if i had blatant mistakes. Just remember on this i assumed mainstream success if the value seems too high to you.

If you did like my speculation, please donate something: 1983sUSuHXAWSMnYCX1ZJ2RFZBPPQwNVYD

19  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / grr Mt. Gox bouncing around - cannot give more proof! on: June 24, 2011, 01:15:58 PM
Ok, my claim gets denied constantly.

I've validated my e-mail address, given approximate withdrawal sums, told name, address, bank name, account # for withdraws i've done, told how many & amount of deposits, submitted company VAT code, link to website. I think there's nothing more i can give them proof apart from them coming to visit me!

First time i use them and this shit happens!

So they think my e-mail account is compromised, and my bank account is compromised?

My e-mail address has partial match for my account name, company info shows same as account name, account registered using company email address.

Probably someone compromised my body too then, and i'm a drone typing this by someone using somekind of mind control device?

I understand the need for strict verification, but this is a joke. What are the chances of potential attacker having access to all of this, and knowledge of my full activity @ Mt. Gox? They are in a hurry, and got tons of accounts to validate, but they shouldn't hurry at the expense of being precise.

FYI, i made withdraws multiple days before they closed their site, infact i expected them to arrive before they closed down ...
20  Other / CPU/GPU Bitcoin mining hardware / Mining hosting idea on: June 22, 2011, 12:37:03 PM
An idea - Mining hosting

An idea to offer mining hosting, your feedback appreciated Smiley

First a little bit about us(??)
Pulsed Media is a smallish specialized niche hosting company. There is 2 of us working daily on tasks, and we got quite an nice market share for our niche. We do well by our automation and methods to increase stability, performance and usability above all others Smiley

I've been familiar with bitcoin for over a year, but have not been doing anything related to bitcoin, letting it to mature a little bit more Smiley Recently, i've setup my first ~1.4Ghash of power, and waiting for GPUs to arrive for another 1.7Ghash. This is just for testing before starting to roll out a cluster.

Plans for a cluster?
The plans immediately shifter towards building a cluster, autonomously managed etc. This requires a little bit of sofware development, but nothing we couldn't handle to build quite fast if we put our minds into it and put some time & effort to it. Just something like 50-80hrs of efficient work for internal system built fully Smiley

Hashing contracts ... Cluster ... This gave me an idea
I saw the hashing contracts and their outrageously high pricing, i mean, more than the mining income is! :O Like WTF? (No offense meant, but really ... Charging HW + Electricity + 100% Margin? and you get to keep the HW!)
Ok, you are free to ask for whatever you want, and if you still get business - Good for you! Smiley

They are also quite opaque offers, little background info etc. force for 3 month contracts etc.
Why not offer properly?

We got space - We got contacts - We got (some) budget - and most of all, we are established
We are an already established business so there is plenty of BG info about us, we are stable and always looking to expand. So there is certain safety about what we got to offer, and we got established routines for managing a mass of customers in terms of support, and administrative tasks.

We got plenty of space and power!
We got roughly 150m2 space which is 4.4m free height, and mostly 5m high, also we got plenty of power. Currently we got installed capacity of 14kW, but being in a industrial building means we can install more with a week of notice, and the upper limit is quite high (being a big industrial building), probably 100kW+. Despite being off-net location we can get there atleast 100Mbps connectivity as well, if not faster, if required.

This space is currently used just for building custom computer chassis', warehousing and other kind of DIY projects. It's rented as cold, so during winters we anyways need some heating there! It gets really cold here during winters, peaking out at around -30C, and regularly over -20C. Summers tho might hit 40C (on direct sunlight), but this space is slightly cooler than outside during summers Smiley Heat will be somewhat of an issue during summers, ambient hitting 35C or so, but downclocking HW should handle that without installing any kind of AC Smiley

We already got several outlets for venting air to outside in the wall too, one of them being "damn big". and ceiling being high means there is always room for the heated air to rise and transfer through the ceiling.

We got contacts to local refurb. hardware dealers, meaning we can reseller rates(=REAL cheap) on older hardware with 2x or more PCI-E connectors, fans, memory, cpus (ie. Celerons with heatsink just 5 inc. VAT!). So some of the hardware can be built on REAL CHEAP.

We also get access to wholesalers so we get under market pricing. As a registered business VAT will be returned to us in a few months (23%). And this being Finland -> there is quite a lot of competition in computer hardware pricing, and relative to population there is a lot of computer stores :O

Some budget
We got also a steady budget to invest into new hardware, which does not affect the day to day operations. The same budget would just go somewhere else instead (ie. marketing, or 3rd party development). We could easily add several Ghash/s each month without selling any BTC, or without any revenue from hosting.

In practice
First of we need to add to the available space some shelves etc. nothign major, some exhaust fans, cabling and acquire a steady reliable internet connection there (not some 3G shaky one). 3G could work in the interim, maybe with mining pool proxy (haven't looked into it yet).

Then we can immediately shelve around 12kW-13kW worth of hardware (leaving a bit of room for peaks ie. rebooting etc.).

Add some remote management HW (VPN Gateway, remote reboot etc.).

And build up our software and monitoring. Build an nice interface for end users. This being the major work, maybe not in terms of hours, but how much thought needs to be given to it.

How would it work for end users, AKA Customers
When you buy up, you would get an interface where you configure your pools you want to use. It would show the number of cards, and give you ways to distribute among pools, or add weight to pools and it automaticly distributes or uses just as a backup some of them.
You would also see graphs of actual Mhash/s you are getting, and can upgrade/downgrade anytime.

This could potentially work on a Mhash based billing as well, allowing us to choose the most efficient HW possible and billed hourly. Billing hourly would give the user a "upper limit" selection for Mhash/s, and actual Mhash rate would be charged, no need for separate SLA. If monthly rate, then some kind of SLA needs to be provided.

If we cannot flexibly control the rate of Mhash/s (ie. stable multiple instances per GPU and using Aggression to determine rought Mhash/s rate. Something i've not even tested), customers would choose something like Low-end GPU, Mid-Range GPU, High-End GPU and number of them. Definitions being something like under 200Mhash/s, 200 to 350Mhash/s, above 350Mhash/s. However that would complicate matters, and more fine-grained control is best idea to develop.

Due to heavy investment required (GPUs ain't that cheap afterall), pricing would consist of a setup fee and monthly(or hourly) rate.

An example pricing mostly out of my head:
0.25 per Mhash/s setup fee and then 0.5 per Mhash/s per month. So for 200Mhash/s the 1st month price would be 150, 2nd month 100.
1Ghash/s would be 250 setup, 500 monthly. (afterall with 3x6950s consuming over 600W alone).

Option 2 could be higher setup fee lower monthly:
0.50 per Mhash/s and then 0.3 per Mhash/s per month.
1Ghash/s would then be: 500 setup, 300 monthly.

On monthly options: Stop the rental, and you have to pay setup all over again if you want to continue.

On hourly basis we could charge just one time setup fee, which ups your upper limit for Mhash/s.
0.35 Per Mhash/s setup fee. Minimum 50Mhash/s increments.
0.0009 Per Mhash/s per hour. Minimum 50Mhash/s.
1Ghash/s per hour would be: 350 setup fee, 0.9 per hour.

Accounts would have to preload credit, at minimum 50 worth per time.

All payments in BTC or EUR.

Mass discounts
We could give mass discounts for those who get high numbers.
Say, if you pay setup for more than 2Ghash/s, for all above that we could lower the per Mhash setup rate by 0.05 or something like that Smiley

Hourly rate might be easier to handle scaling in business sense, if charging is based on the actual received. (Say averaging per 5mins and so forth).
So if we get tapped, we can allow people to get setup for their chosen amount, and then we go get more HW. Ofc, if we are completely out and cannot roll extra capacity fast enough we would need to halt new setups.

Why would we do this - looks like charity to me?
Setup fees. Simple as that. Allows us to add more HW on the line faster, and we get to keep ownership of the HW for resale if they become useless and for other customers.

Sure, you will earn more than you are paying us, but we also get multiple streams of revenue, and can tap into non-techy markets by making it simple enough! People who have no clue, or cannot setup their own mining rigs.

Sooo, what do you think?
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