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1  Economy / Economics / Re: How can we make this world economically better? on: September 08, 2018, 01:39:54 PM
We can make this world better, by sending me money, which I will totally use to make the world better and not  just spend on myself (yea right)
2  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Tokens (Altcoins) / Re: ANN{Upcoming TGE) CRUD^16 aka CRUD on: September 08, 2018, 01:27:27 PM
TGE goes live today
3  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Tokens (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN]KR8 TOKEN ICO on: September 02, 2018, 01:23:42 PM
What happened to this project?
4  Other / Serious discussion / Re: Comparison beween Cowry shells and Bitcoin on: September 02, 2018, 01:13:56 PM
For ten.
5  Economy / Securities / Re: High Growth SaaS on track for 100Mil/year in 3 years looking for investment on: August 28, 2018, 06:13:34 AM
And it's gone.😕
6  Economy / Securities / Re: High Growth SaaS on track for 100Mil/year in 3 years looking for investment on: August 28, 2018, 05:52:00 AM
Can look at doing this as convertible notes/shares if preferred and can fit in legal wise.

Will probably be easiest for EU investors.
7  Economy / Securities / Re: New Startup idea on: August 28, 2018, 05:49:40 AM
Heck I know of someone with a profitable startup growing 30% a month who can't get funding...let alone a pipe dream.
8  Economy / Securities / High Growth SaaS on track for 100Mil/year in 3 years looking for investment on: August 27, 2018, 03:32:14 PM
A software as a service for B2B clients in the marketing space.



  • Recurring revenues
    Growth rate of thirty per cent
    Over 300,000 International and 15,000 USA based leads in database
    Highly scale-able web app

Trademark and strong brand recognition leads to approx 8 inbound leads monthly.

Numbers correct as of 14.55 UTC Revenue BTC13.79 Cost of Goods BTC8.04 profit BTC5.79

Improvement plan

  • Reduce Churn
       Better customer service
    More cross-selling
    Cold calling customers on list
    Add direct crypto payments
    ?Potential Marketing token ICO?
Investment could be via tokenote or counterparty

Option one ILP. Investment in BTC,ETH or other crypto is used to issue FLAT(providing a tradable and voting rights) with a
contract recorded on the blockchain. With up to 40% of profits to be issued to the holders of loan (could be BTC,XRP,ETH,LTC) would depend on the legal side. This has the advantage that investors share in the success of the company in proportion to their investment.

Escrow would be the company itself via tokenote/counterparty if all investors are approved and willing to go this route.

Option 2, would be a 20% return (calculated on fiat, but payable in crypto) This would be on revenue rather than profit, so less share in any upside but less risk as paid regardless of profit.

Option 3, either of a or b, with an investment in fiat, and returns in crypto.

Looking for total investment of circa 40BTC (This could be a pool of up to 98 people) +myself and one other.

What will you spend the money on?

Adwords
Social Marketing
Lead Follow up
The big one- buying the business


To avoid time-wasters and tire kickers, I'd really appreciate interested parties, signing a message here and state the amounts they are considering.

Likely Objections


Isn't there risk? Of course don't use money you can't afford to lose.

What about collateral
The collateral would be the underlying company itself and its assets.

Should this not be in the loans sections?


No, because it wouldn't meet the requirements for fungible collateral

Why don't you just get a loan from a bank?

Their are no banks here which will lend base don the business income(I understand this is different in the USA) and I do not have the salary to fund this purchase on my own.

What about Escrow?


I'm open to it , if a realistic approach can be suggested. Perhaps a trustworthy forum member can collect and hold in a multisig wallet, returning crypto funds if anything goes wrong with the deal.
9  Economy / Securities / Re: What legal options do US citizens have for investing in lending ICO's? on: August 27, 2018, 10:36:19 AM
Following some recent court rulings in Europe, looks like those with over $2322 can invest in EU as part of a syndicate. EU's accredited investor rules are lot more lax it would seem. Check with your local legal counsel.
10  Economy / Securities / Re: Cryptobonds on: August 12, 2018, 08:09:30 PM
Companies can issue bonds too. McDonald's bonds are backed by the profits of McDonald's. They issue them in $, and even remnibi.

There are also junk bonds issued by companies that are not considered very good with thier profit and revenue.

Fisco Ltd issued a 200 Bitcoin bond in 2017 (that will hurt them a lot if Bitcoin has gone up a lot when it matures.

You can potentially get bonds that entitle you to a portion of the process, but they are only as.good.as their issues. This is why investing is well risky.

Their not backed by cryptos.there just crypto denominated bonds, their just a crypto version of eurobonds.

Now a bond backed by crypto sounds like it is just crypto in escrow.
11  Economy / Securities / Re: Finding Investors. Any Ideas? on: August 12, 2018, 11:22:33 AM
There are imho realistic ideas on here which have ico or saft/pre ICO potential, yet haven't recived funding.

I think it's more a question of marketing ability/ marketing funds than anything else.

12  Economy / Securities / Re: Cryptobonds on: August 09, 2018, 09:58:23 AM
I agree the terms haven't settled but those examples are all pretty solid though in terms of investment lexicon if not legal one.

A denominated bond issued in Ireland is a eurobond but not a bulldog bond. The euro name is a bit unfortunate now as euro denominated bonds may or may not be eurobonds and that could confuse people.

In fact a crypto denominated bond would just be another kind of eurobond, so we could call it a cryptoeurobond as would gold or silver denominated ones.

In fact I think some SAFTS are basically an ETH eurobond.
13  Economy / Securities / Re: Cryptobonds on: August 09, 2018, 05:56:19 AM
Issuing cryptobonds is a new way of raising funds for your project.

You may want to review what happened to the last person who tried this: https://www.sec.gov/litigation/complaints/2018/comp-pr2018-23.pdf


unregistered bitcoin-denominated securities exchange, though a cryptobond denominated in your own coin sounds just like a SAFT, so not really new.

If registered, whats your FCS number? What is the name of the officer in charge of your MiFid compliance? How are you preventing US citizens from joining?

Please have a look at the relevant legal framework in the links stated above, so that we talk on the same terms / jurisdiction and discuss relevant questions.

I'm talking about UK framework too. Yes the earlier poster, was cosnidering from a USA standpoint, so there is a diffrence there. That was a typo, it is  a FCA number (as UK competent MIfid Authority) or MifId exemption I'm looking to find.


And considering legal issues with regional law, as the other posters so kindly brought to our attention, how could this be realistically determined to be a bond?

IANL, but believe it is to do with a specific legal meaning of the word bond in the UK context. The issuing jurisdiction might require usage of that term over say promissory note. Of course equally it could be if the word just mean spromise, you can say I'm just making a promise(although that might be a bond like an IOU)

How are disputes settled? Who is the arbiter that determines where the money goes in case of missing payments as well?



If it is issued in accordance with UK law, then the British version of the SEC. The SEC is unlikely to get involved in British offerings to non US citizens/residents.
How are disputes settled? Who is the arbiter that determines where the money goes in case of missing payments as well?


How are disputes settled? Who is the arbiter that determines where the money goes in case of missing payments as well?

And considering legal issues with regional law, as the other posters so kindly brought to our attention, how could this be realistically determined to be a bond? Is it registered out in the Indian Ocean territories or something? Or could it also be that "bond" is just a nice term that makes people feel more secure, and there is no legal backing behind the security?

It's hard to know with these things with all of the legal issues and stuff.

There is an excellent resource to give you a definition of a bond and its lifetime process, stated in a previous post. It is easy to look up online as well. Just please make sure you are researching English bonds/notes, so that we speak on the same terms.

As it is an obligation to return borrowed funds, it is enforceable under English law in any court that recognises it, on the other hand, cryptocurrencies are unregulated in the UK so cryptobonds issuance is not a regulated activity. It does involve a significant amount of legal matters though and there is legal risk involved in the sense that cryptobonds may be banned at any time (meaning an abrupt end) or declared regulated activities, which would simply mean they would fall within the FCA regulatory perimeter. Therefore we do not expect such a proliferation of fraudulent issues as with ICOs.

Untrue

Cryptocurrency derivatives are, however, capable of being financial instruments
under the Markets in Financial Instruments Directive II (MIFID II), although we do not consider cryptocurrencies to be currencies or commodities for regulatory purposes under MiFID II.
  So, bonds can be derivatives as can ICOs plus there is securities law too, if issued in accordance with UK law;

Whom is in charge of the MIFID?
What FCA number or what MIFID exemption?
Who is the KYC/AML officer?
What is your FACTA compliance procedure?
How about your GDPR comptroller?




There are numerous bond types but I am not in the position to offer couching on basic terminology, so I would again refer to these excellent resources:
http://wildy.com/isbn/9781912363100/clp-legal-practice-guides-banking-and-capital-markets-2018-paperback-a4-college-of-law-publishing
http://wildy.com/isbn/9780414031364/the-law-and-regulation-of-finance-2nd-ed-hardback-sweet-maxwell-ltd
http://wildy.com/isbn/9780414027640/the-law-of-finance-2nd-ed-paperback-sweet-maxwell-ltd

The FCA names which financial derivatives ARE regulated and which are CAPABLE OF BEING regulated activities. At the end of the day it is the courts that have the final say on that. We contend that cryptobonds are not regulated activities and are prepared to argue that position before court.

We would preferably recommend a syndicate distribution of the issue in question rather than a retail bond.
The FCA list is non exhaustive, there's still a requirement to list a prospectus or the number of the exemption your using in your offering, even if it is an unregulated exempt offering, that has to be declared too. Your legal counsel will be in a portion to answer my basic questions (in fact quite possibly required and compielled to do so)


Untrue

Cryptocurrency derivatives are, however, capable of being financial instruments
under the Markets in Financial Instruments Directive II (MIFID II), although we do not consider cryptocurrencies to be currencies or commodities for regulatory purposes under MiFID II.
  So, bonds can be derivatives as can ICOs plus there is securities law too, if issued in accordance with UK law;

Whom is in charge of the MIFID?
What FCA number or what MIFID exemption?
Who is the KYC/AML officer?
What is your FACTA compliance procedure?
How about your GDPR comptroller?




This is what I meant. And to what extent is the government actually going to get involved in these issues if Bitcoin is still in the legal grey zone? I personally like the idea of a bond because it's guaranteed, but I'm having a hard time imagining who will enforce these laws if push comes to shove. Are they actually going to give it court time? Do they really want to sit and argue over (what they may claim to be) bits and bytes that are perceived value?

At this stage in Bitcoin's development I am a bit hesitant to believe that a truly guaranteed bond could be created.

Actually the idea of a truly guaranteed Bitcoin bond doesnt seem thag far out of grey. Eu countries routinely issue security bonds in other currinces. If the jurisdiction considers Bitcoin to simply be another currency, then a properly regulated MiFid and prospectus compliant conventional bond denominated in bitcoin seems functionally the same as an EU company issuing a dollar bond. Of course there is no crypto issuing,trading is in terms of the white legal framework of bond issuing. Bond payments would be in btc and the sale price would be in btc though.
14  Other / Serious discussion / Re: Any knowledgable thoughts on how to create a healthy environment for ICOs? on: August 09, 2018, 05:41:39 AM
perhaps it is best to establish a decentralized ICO platform which holds investors crypto's which cannot be withdrawn unless certain criteria are met(inverse KYC/proof of project as an example). not only gives security for investors money project developer can do some free/cheap advertising to the platform. sometimes inverse KYC of the ICO raters is not enough I remember Hashcard whom inverse KYC is positive yet it turns out to be a scam.

That is a good proposition.
There is another way. Why not create a crowdsale smart contract that allows to withdraw funds only when the team reaches certain milestones? The decision is made by voting of 50-70% of contributors?
If the project team dissapears than the proposition could be made by any of the contributors to refund the investment. The same logic: 50-70% of contributors vote and the refund is processed.

Now. There could be more complicative situations when the team will be agains the refund or possible attack by competitors project for instance (guys who will want this current project from our example to go bankrupt).
The possible solution is to allow team achieve small results and withdraw small amounts. But if you ask to withdraw 3 times and 3 times 50-70% of contributors did not vote for it (during a month) than any of the contributors can ask create refund proposal and vote for it.

What do you think about this way of fund management by the contributors community?

This could work well with a stable coin, since a project is likely to have fixed expenses or expenses in fiat a stable coin easily redeemed for face value is needed.
15  Economy / Securities / Re: Cryptobonds on: August 08, 2018, 11:11:28 AM
Issuing cryptobonds is a new way of raising funds for your project.

You may want to review what happened to the last person who tried this: https://www.sec.gov/litigation/complaints/2018/comp-pr2018-23.pdf


unregistered bitcoin-denominated securities exchange, though a cryptobond denominated in your own coin sounds just like a SAFT, so not really new.

If registered, whats your FCS number? What is the name of the officer in charge of your MiFid compliance? How are you preventing US citizens from joining?

Please have a look at the relevant legal framework in the links stated above, so that we talk on the same terms / jurisdiction and discuss relevant questions.

I'm talking about UK framework too. Yes the earlier poster, was cosnidering from a USA standpoint, so there is a diffrence there. That was a typo, it is  a FCA number (as UK competent MIfid Authority) or MifId exemption I'm looking to find.


And considering legal issues with regional law, as the other posters so kindly brought to our attention, how could this be realistically determined to be a bond?

IANL, but believe it is to do with a specific legal meaning of the word bond in the UK context. The issuing jurisdiction might require usage of that term over say promissory note. Of course equally it could be if the word just mean spromise, you can say I'm just making a promise(although that might be a bond like an IOU)

How are disputes settled? Who is the arbiter that determines where the money goes in case of missing payments as well?



If it is issued in accordance with UK law, then the British version of the SEC. The SEC is unlikely to get involved in British offerings to non US citizens/residents.
How are disputes settled? Who is the arbiter that determines where the money goes in case of missing payments as well?


How are disputes settled? Who is the arbiter that determines where the money goes in case of missing payments as well?

And considering legal issues with regional law, as the other posters so kindly brought to our attention, how could this be realistically determined to be a bond? Is it registered out in the Indian Ocean territories or something? Or could it also be that "bond" is just a nice term that makes people feel more secure, and there is no legal backing behind the security?

It's hard to know with these things with all of the legal issues and stuff.

There is an excellent resource to give you a definition of a bond and its lifetime process, stated in a previous post. It is easy to look up online as well. Just please make sure you are researching English bonds/notes, so that we speak on the same terms.

As it is an obligation to return borrowed funds, it is enforceable under English law in any court that recognises it, on the other hand, cryptocurrencies are unregulated in the UK so cryptobonds issuance is not a regulated activity. It does involve a significant amount of legal matters though and there is legal risk involved in the sense that cryptobonds may be banned at any time (meaning an abrupt end) or declared regulated activities, which would simply mean they would fall within the FCA regulatory perimeter. Therefore we do not expect such a proliferation of fraudulent issues as with ICOs.

Untrue

Cryptocurrency derivatives are, however, capable of being financial instruments
under the Markets in Financial Instruments Directive II (MIFID II), although we do not consider cryptocurrencies to be currencies or commodities for regulatory purposes under MiFID II.
  So, bonds can be derivatives as can ICOs plus there is securities law too, if issued in accordance with UK law;

Whom is in charge of the MIFID?
What FCA number or what MIFID exemption?
Who is the KYC/AML officer?
What is your FACTA compliance procedure?
How about your GDPR comptroller?


16  Economy / Securities / Re: Crypto Index Fund on: July 31, 2018, 03:23:30 PM
Although I like the idea, "weighted by market cap" is a bad measure.

I'm not sure though what would be a good way to select them.


Agree, you probably want 100+ coin, ideally including utility tokens and others.

You could have different funds in the crypto space, just like in equity.
Apart from large cap, mid cap and small cap funds, you can have thematic investments. One fund could invest in coins which have an anonymity theme.

A cross-country,cross-theme, diversified(including ideally counter-cyclical) backed-crypto could be an interesting play at a more stable coin (lose less value each dip)
17  Economy / Securities / Re: Cryptobonds on: July 31, 2018, 03:10:04 PM
Issuing cryptobonds is a new way of raising funds for your project.

You may want to review what happened to the last person who tried this: https://www.sec.gov/litigation/complaints/2018/comp-pr2018-23.pdf


unregistered bitcoin-denominated securities exchange, though a cryptobond denominated in your own coin sounds just like a SAFT, so not really new.

If registered, whats your FCS number? What is the name of the officer in charge of your MiFid compliance? How are you preventing US citizens from joining?
18  Economy / Securities / Re: Crypto Investments in companies on: July 31, 2018, 01:13:16 PM
I Would be very interested in links to those gaming companies or similar.
19  Other / Off-topic / Re: Can blockchain improve our environment? on: July 30, 2018, 10:32:10 AM
You could create your own token and pay people with it to get you biodegradable and nondegradable materials like plastic to your small scale factory.
Finished products from the factory can be sold around your County or internationally. You could make buyers buy the products with the token or simply make paying with it an alternative. You could get people use the token more by reducing the prices of products purchased with the token.


Of course , you need to be passionate and skilled in the field with a plan to develop and expand/grow the company in future. You could even have an open sourced cyber platform/Blockchain for the company.

The company should be as transparent as possible with Webcams positioned around important parts of the factory and can be accessed anywhere in the world. You financial records (Blockchain-based) should be transparent as well.

You could pay your workers with the token and get investors to buy some token in order to help you expand company or something.

Similar to a project I posted about, albeit different environmental issues. We are not quite there yet,but there is work is ongoing. It's just a matter of time and money (more money,less time or more time less money)
20  Bitcoin / Project Development / Theory geocolored coins for mass adoption? on: June 27, 2018, 04:03:58 PM
the problem

Companies selling products for crypto, need to know where residents are located for sales tax purposes,.but a lot of crypto people are reluctant to hand that info over. Credit cards encode that info in the transaction itself

solution

Coloured coins are  normally used to represent assets, but this is just data. Instead create a wallet that uploads a rough location (country,state) to coins that are mined or received. This allows the Bitcoin wallet itself to handle the passage of needed info, without needing to reveal ID or detailed data.

This could be handled as an alt, but coloured coins would build on the network and hopefully be useable as just ordinary Bitcoin, when needed or dealing with those not using that tech.
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