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321  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. on: January 29, 2015, 09:37:24 AM
There was once discussion about an exodus plan if a superior technology existed that was not fork-able.  It would maintain a centralized legacy support for cold storage. Bitcoins would be converted proportionally as a one-way transaction. While I commend altcoin developers, some of them have been abusing the community with proof of burn IPOs. Not many people can afford to just dump bitcoins for something that has no value. Yeah free market bla bla, but most of them are scams. Is anyone working on a method to clone one of these altcoins and convert bitcoin outputs to the new system? This would go a long way toward comforting folks that don't have confidence that Bitcoin can live up to its promise. Now I know this sounds like Side Chains. It is because I believe this is the natural consequence of such an experiment. There can be only one.
322  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. on: January 29, 2015, 07:31:37 AM
weaker currencies --> perceived stronger currencies (U.S. Dollar) --> bitcoin

I don't see metals as useful a currency as bitcoin but they will, of course, appreciate against a collapsing dollar - just not as much as bitcoin in my opinion. Bitcoin could be the safety valve that preserves some semblance of a global economy and a somewhat civilized society since it will allow the continued trade across distance (metals not so much).

You're complicating what should be a simple issue.  Resources are exchanged to benefit both transacting parties.  You're assuming people find Bitcoin valuable as opposed to food, shelter, visa cards, beanie babies, whatever.  Metals are more useful than Bitcoins in some circumstances.  Not so in others.  Same applies to credit cards, and so on.

Under what realistic circumstances would Bitcoin "preserve some semblance of a global economy"?

Bitcoin will likely be the final (or only) medium of exchange left that will enable people to trade for the food, shelter, etc. It will enable the global trade across distance to continue because it will be the only trusted currency that is not subject to the risk of being "backed" by the "full faith and credit" of bankrupt governments. It will allow the market economy to continue while preventing the total collapse into a barter economy. In short, it will save many from a lot of pain and suffering.



And what exactly is bitcoin 'backed' by? Coins and fiat are backed by physical governments and militia.    People can protest and throw rocks at politicians when shtf. You can't throw rocks online at miners maintaining the blockchains, or rogue exchange owners known only by internet screennames.

Are you assuming the masses will just put all their 'faith' into a non-reversible, non transparent system backed by anonymous neckbeards should the world crumble?

Sounds legit.

You make the same mistake I did before I learned economics. Bitcoin is not backed by anything - just like gold isn't. They are each valued for their individual characteristics and utility. Humans impute value - there is no such thing as "intrinsic" or "inherent" value.



Perhaps bad wording on my part, as 'intrinsic value' has such a broad range of interpretation.  

I'll say 'utilitarian value.'  Even if gold's market value crashes to 0, it still won't be completely useless, as it can still be utilized in industrial/economic/decorative situations.

Now what usefulness would bitcoin present if its market value goes to nil?

But that is not the argument you brought forth. Your original proposition is that money must be backed by something when in fact money valued for its characteristics and properties as store-of-value, currency and unit of account.

Gold's "industrial" value is irrelevant to this discussion.


We shall have to agree to disagree.  If you think people will put their blind faith into a system that presents just as much chaos and corruption/if not more than the current fiat system (and thus a sesspool for hackers and scammers galore)...then I hope it pans out for you.  It is pretty much the furthest thing from a safe haven in my eyes.  Matter of fact it's pretty much antonymous.

You are looking for a safe haven? Try Jesus.
323  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. on: January 28, 2015, 04:27:42 AM
Has this been posted here before?

'Bitcoin and the dangerous fantasy of Ďapoliticalí money' (2013). By Yanis Varoufakis, Greece's new Finance Minister.

http://yanisvaroufakis.eu/2013/04/22/bitcoin-and-the-dangerous-fantasy-of-apolitical-money/

Yeah, what a piece of shit, I hope he chokes on a Gyro and I hope Greece goes down in flames.
Greece doesn't have the balls that Iceland or Switzerland have. They will sell out their people and lands.
324  Economy / Speculation / Re: I AM HODLING on: January 28, 2015, 02:55:56 AM
After major delisting announcement: hodling one single Feathercoin.
Which is not worth the electricity to run the client, let alone a miner.
325  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Fork off on: January 27, 2015, 05:31:08 PM
Until miners stop merge mining IXC and other shitcoins, I reserve suspicion of ulterior motives.
326  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Fork off on: January 27, 2015, 05:27:37 PM
No

So shut the fuck up.
Thank you very much :-)
The lemming approach working out for ya?
327  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Fork off on: January 27, 2015, 05:17:28 PM
By the same logic we should reduce the block limit down to 125KB right?

Nope. By this logic we don't fix what isn't broken.

Your right so we should restore the original unbroken 33,554,432 byte limit on messages (to include blocks) from the original client.

Is Bitcoin currently broken?
No, but the 'check engine light' is on, or are you the type that ignores it until it's too late?
328  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Fork off on: January 27, 2015, 05:08:14 PM
There are only people: people I trust, and people that I don't trust. And I don't trust Gavin.
Open source. We don't need your trust. Thanks anyway.
329  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Fork off on: January 27, 2015, 04:56:37 PM
By the same logic we should reduce the block limit down to 125KB right?

Nope. By this logic we don't fix what isn't broken.
But... full blocks!
330  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Fork off on: January 27, 2015, 04:16:04 PM
Look at these answers and notice they are all about costs, and yet he thinks people are going to teleport bricks of gold. Gold transactions are rare. Only one Satoshi is needed to send gold since it requires counterparty risk. There's no sense in having any fee at all. Only metadata is needed. Since he thinks the block reward is so large, perhaps we should do away with bitcoins and only use one metadata transaction per block.

You seem to only have been given a meta-brain.

That's actually a compliment in meta. What do you care? YOU HAVE GOOOOOOOOLLLLLD!!!!!!!!!!!!!
331  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: January 27, 2015, 03:31:59 PM
eleventyleventyone!!!11111!!!!oneone
332  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. on: January 27, 2015, 03:10:55 PM
Centralized Bitcoin exchanges need to divorce themselves from the libertarian paradigm.
Solve this:

1) We dont have centralized, "serious" exchanges like the Gemini or Coinbase one, which leads to old big money not comming in.

2) We have centralized exchanges which means we get to deal with wall street bastards and risk the price being rigged, also risk on the exchanges being a failure again killing bitcoin due lack of trust.

How to solve this?? afaik, decentralized exchanges dont allow for proper trading.
I posted on Reddit:
Quote
I want to see a bitcoin exchange that doesn't give a fuck. Keep bankers hours. Ring a bell at opening and closing. Develop a good OTC trading board. Buy and/or hire Trezor. Offer Trezor support for security, multisig deposits and withdrawals, and after hours OTC trading only.
The libertarian paradigm must be divorced from centralized exchanges. They can only work on decentralized exchanges. DEXs will flourish when they find their niche as arbitrage markets between regulated traditional markets.
Take a good look at Tether and develop your own Winkelvoss dollar backed colored coin. Maybe you can leverage it against your ETF profits.

Tether is a colored coin (Mastercoin-style) that pegs USD or any other fiat to bitcoin metadata. These can be used for crypto pairings on DEXs.
333  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. on: January 27, 2015, 02:39:04 PM
Centralized Bitcoin exchanges need to divorce themselves from the libertarian paradigm.
334  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Fork off on: January 27, 2015, 02:36:18 PM
Evidence of what exactly? The fees today hardly equal a tiny fraction of the block reward, yet you're advocating increasing available space?


Since it's obviously costlier to mine a bigger block, in lots of ways, the expected profit can only be lower if the revenue is the same, and hence the chain is *less* secure.


Ask anyone with a bit of money in the bank, that's fucking cheap to teleport gold.

Look at these answers and notice they are all about costs, and yet he thinks people are going to teleport bricks of gold. Gold transactions are rare. Only one Satoshi is needed to send gold since it requires counterparty risk. There's no sense in having any fee at all. Only metadata is needed. Since he thinks the block reward is so large, perhaps we should do away with bitcoins and only use one metadata transaction per block.
335  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: January 27, 2015, 02:16:06 PM
Tea cup handle pattern on the 6H chart?

http://www.investopedia.com/terms/c/cupandhandle.asp

Bullish  Cool
Looks more like a B-cup, but bullish either way.  Wink
336  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Winklevii will become one of great capitalist barons of this century! on: January 27, 2015, 11:24:01 AM
Barons would be an ironic title in a decentralized ecosystem. They don't seem to have much interest in promoting Bitcoin unless I missed something.

You missed something.
Robber Barons were allowed to create monopolies. I guess OP meant something else here because Bitcoin is highly resistant to monopolization.
337  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Winklevii will become one of great capitalist barons of this century! on: January 27, 2015, 08:57:53 AM
Barons would be an ironic title in a decentralized ecosystem. They don't seem to have much interest in promoting Bitcoin unless I missed something.
338  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: January 27, 2015, 05:44:28 AM
it's over guys



yes it's just a matter of time before we go there, still money to be made on the way down, thanks to the clueless bulls who'll keep buyin because they saw a moon in they cereal bowl
Yeah, I'm waiting for it to go to negative numbers so you pay me to buy them. Either way, Bitcoin can't die.
339  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: January 27, 2015, 02:22:32 AM
There is no evidence of superstitious trading. Trade only bitcoins you can't afford to buy back at 350.
340  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Fork off on: January 27, 2015, 01:18:18 AM
Small blocks do not make Bitcoin scarce, small blocks make Bitcoin impotent. Size matters. Low transaction count means Bitcoin can't spread itself around. You know what I mean, ladies.
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