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81  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Libertarians... if you could change 1 thing in the US constitution.... on: January 21, 2014, 10:00:42 PM
I would get rid of the electoral college. Just have a popular vote for president.

The electoral college is a thing of beauty. Otherwise cali and ny would pick the president every election. Think of the electoral college as the World Series. You have 50 contests instead of 7. Each contest though is still weighted by the number of people in each state.
82  Bitcoin / Mining / Re: questions on: January 21, 2014, 03:45:47 PM
What is mostly sold out is the 500 share units. Each share was only $24 so even if scammy, unless people buy a lot of those shares individually, the amount to be ripped off individually isn't much. I don't think a lot of people would be devastated if they lost <$100 so probably a lot of willing participants. The availability of shares still left doesn't create a sense of urgency that a scammer typically counts on to get people to make decisions too hastily. Also, it appears that they take cc and paypal so if you go that route, you can protect yourself.

Their business model appears to be to sell the miners' hashing power for $12,000. With a purchase price of under 10k, possibly less if they got a volume price and a 10% fee as well, this looks like a profitable business model. I think they're selling quite a few because it is a cheap way to get in on some of the latest mining power without too high a risk of loss and because it is first batch. If I missed early batch buys and were buying a late batch, it might be better to buy all the shares here with a cc instead to get the early start.

They have a referral program that I might jump on but I still need answers to my questions first. Also, I would like to see some proof of purchase from knc.
83  Economy / Trading Discussion / Re: $12,000+ to invest in bitcoin. Need some advice on: January 21, 2014, 05:56:52 AM
I would invest about 25% of that in bitcoins at the current price. Then, look for any drops in price to purchase additional coins. Keep doing this until you are as vested in bitcoins as you want to be. This should give you a lower entry point into bitcoins. Then just sit on those coins.

I've been looking into mining bitcoins but after researching each option, I can't find any way to do it and feel sure of some degree of profit. Here's my take on bitcoin mining:

You have a box that you can put your cash into it and wait a year or two and in all probability, you will have a lot more cash when you open the box. On the other hand, instead of putting the money into the box, you spend all your money on a guy who promises to give you a box a few months from now only all the indications are that this box will have less money in it than the first box.
84  Other / Off-topic / Re: Tell us a joke.... on: January 21, 2014, 05:32:41 AM
A lady is shopping at the pet store when she sees a parrot for sale for $20. She inquires about why the bird is so cheap. The cashier tells her that the bird used to live in a brothel and they were concerned it might say some off-color things. Well, the lady figures she can just re-train the bird out of any bad habits and so buys the bird and takes it home. There, she takes the cover off the cage. The bird looks around...

"New house, new madam", the bird says. The lady is little embarrassed but she is still pleased with the good deal she got. Soon after, the lady's daughters came home from high school. On seeing them, the bird comments...

"New house, new madam, new girls", the bird says. Again the woman is embarrassed but knows she can retrain the bird. In a few hours, the lady's husband comes home from work. The bird says...

"Hi, Dave!"
85  Other / Off-topic / Re: Tell us a joke.... on: January 20, 2014, 11:42:48 PM
Two guys are in a bar, arguing about who has the more superior ASIC setup. Just then the bartender comes up to them and tells them they'll have to leave. The first guy says "awe, c'mon, we weren't being that loud." The bartender says "I know, it's just that we can't serve miners in here."
86  Other / Off-topic / Re: I HAVE BEEN COMING UP WITH TSHIRT IDEAS. on: January 20, 2014, 11:16:59 PM
How about one with a big bitcoin on the back and the phrase "IGNORE THE FED" wrapped around the ouside of the coin.
87  Bitcoin / Mining / Re: helpppp I bought ASIC online but it has no power unit! on: January 20, 2014, 11:07:10 PM

Looks like 360 watt power supply.
88  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Getting Merchants to KEEP Their Bitcoin on: January 20, 2014, 12:19:48 AM
Since this thread is about merchants... I have a semi-related question.

Say, that I buy a product and pay 1BTC for it on Monday and on Monday, 1 BTC = $800 exchange rate.

Two weeks go by and my product is finally delivered and it is just not what I thought it was. So, I get a Return Authorization from the retailer and ship the product back w/registration so they sign for it when they get it. On the day they sign for it, the value of 1 BTC is now up to $1000.

What SHOULD the retailer return to me?  Do I get my 1 BTC back or do I get the equiv of $800 in BTC (so, .8 BTC ) back?

This is's policy (basically other than cancelled orders, no refund except store credit):

Cancelled Orders: Cancelled orders may qualify for a refund in Bitcoin. The refund will be issued for the full USD value of the order and processed at the Bitcoin exchange rate at the time the refund is completed. If you choose to have a refund sent to an email address that is not set up on a Coinbase account, Coinbase will create an account under that email address once the refund is sent. An email confirmation will be sent by Coinbase to set up your account and retrieve the funds. If you fail to retrieve your funds within 90 days, the funds will be returned to When the refund is sent to an email address set up on an existing Coinbase account, the funds will be available to you and there is no risk of retrieval. Refunds sent directly to a Bitcoin address are also not at risk of retrieval.

Returns: Returns on orders paid by Bitcoin will be accepted for a refund as In-Store Credit to your account. Damaged or defective merchandise may also be returned for a replacement of the exact item. Replacement orders will ship once the return of the original item is received and processed at the warehouse.

I personally, this the store credit only thing is a total BS move. And, they don't say how they will value the store credit. Will it be a 1 BTC value or will it be a USD value and at what conversion rate? There is no reason that the Return Authorization process can't collect an address to be used to return the BTC.

Overstock doesn't take possession of the bitcoins at the time of sale, they are immediately converted to usd. You have to accept that overstock transacts in usd currency so that usd or the equivalent amount of usd in in-store credit will be issued.
89  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Getting Merchants to KEEP Their Bitcoin on: January 19, 2014, 09:38:29 PM
I proposed a solution to this problem whereby a company offers a guaranteed redemption price for any bitcoin held by the merchant in exchange for a policy premium upfront that protected a specified number of bitcoins. It was promptly shot down by people who think bitpay is all that is needed for the retail market.

This proposal would allow merchants to hold bitcoin without risk of loss.
90  Bitcoin / Mining / Re: questions on: January 19, 2014, 09:26:51 PM
How long is the contract. Is it 1 yr, duration of profitability,  etc.?

What happens when these neptunes are no longer earning their keep? Will they be sold off and if so will the proceeds of the sale be divided according to share? If they won't be sold, will you reactivate them if bitcoin rise in price makes them viable again?
91  Bitcoin / Mining / questions on: January 19, 2014, 04:30:07 PM
A search on here didn't get much information. Price of$4/gh seems better than most cloud hashing prices I've seen. Their website estimates a $300 USD income per share but different machines on their site have different size shares. I assume they refer to the $24 share being worth $300 in expected ROI.

Anyone have any firsthand information to share? Also, if you feel this to be an unprofitable venture, feel free to chime in as well.
92  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Why do people think income tax is ok? on: January 19, 2014, 01:28:59 AM
Just because I don't have an acceptable answer doesn't mean one doesn't exist.

You ever hear of the phrase "devil's advocate"?

It's where you argue in favor of a position you are against. To do this well, you have to find supporting research, etc. My debate teacher in school made us pick a side of an argument and then he would switch it.

Let's see you try. I'm switching your argument from pro-tax to anti-tax. Can you do it?
93  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: The Problem of Bitcoin Anonymity on: January 19, 2014, 01:22:11 AM
You can prove you sent it to an address via the blockchain.  If someone sends you the wrong address it's their fault.
True but I can't prove that the person who I am sending bitcoin to owns the address. What is there to keep me from sending the bitcoins to myself and then claiming that I sent it to the address he told me to send it to.

Why would anyone give you an address that isn't theirs? Your second case makes even less sence, if you sent coin to an address other than the one i've asked you to, im going to keep asking you to send until i see receipt of the coin to my address. That the whole point of confirmations, you wait for the blockchain to show the transaction completed. 

Now if there is a problem with anonymity, its that the receiving party can easily defraud you and say they've sent the goods after seeing the transaction complete, but dont send anything.  or in other words, you have the issue back to front.  Chargebacks favor the buyer, removing them favors the seller.

I think your misunderstanding me. Consider this example: I give someone an address that is mine. They then pay me. I then claim that the address is not mine. They have no way of proving that the address was mine. Even though they can show that they sent Bitcoins to the address I gave them (via the blockchain), they can't show that I own that address when I later claim I wasn't paid. They could have a case against me if there was some form of proof that I gave them my address and told them it was mine. However, if I had showed it to them in person (say from my phone) they probably would not have any proof that I gave them the address they sent money to.

Does this make any sense?

Sworn personal statement. You as a buyer can require the seller to make a sworn personal statement that the address he is giving you is the address where he is capable of receiving the funds. If you are arranging the meeting in advance, have him write out the public key and a statement that it is his public key and have him sign it. If he won't do that, you need to consider what to do at that point.
94  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Why do people think income tax is ok? on: January 18, 2014, 11:17:53 PM
I think you have to gradually wean off the system of taxation. America has existed longer without the 16th Amendment than with it.

People think you need taxes for roads. Not income taxes as there is a tax on fuel already. However, I would go so far as to say that businesses have a vested interest in making sure there is good access to their locations so those businesses who build and maintain access will thrive. Just look at any major mall and you will often see roads that are maintained by the mall. Home builders create the roads in their subdivisions, voluntary HOAs can maintain those roads and some do.

Police. Many people don't need them if they were to take it upon themselves to procure the means of defending their lives and property from criminals. Investigations into crimes can be conducted by insurance companies, private investigators, etc.

Prisons. Wouldn't need 90% of them if we weren't locking people up for plants. Anyone convicted of heinous crimes like murder, rape, etc., could be executed in rapid fashion instead of being warehoused for years.

Fire. In many areas, people pay to be protected by a fire department. They get a bill for it. I suspect that if there were no government-operated fire departments, private fire departments would fill the void. People can either pay them directly or take out an insurance policy on their home. Since many lenders require insurance, the vast majority of mortgaged properties would be covered against loss. Those insurance companies may opt to pay for fire protection.

and so on, and so on....

You have to take small parts of supposed government responsibilities and return it to the private market for a solution. Then you drop the tax by the associated amount of savings. Eventually, you eliminate tax altogether on citizens. Import taxes can continue to exist because companies in other nations voluntarily ship goods for imports.
95  Other / Off-topic / Re: What would you have done? on: January 18, 2014, 07:29:53 PM
Can you buy a lock at a store without any special requirements? If so, then yes. Anything can be a weapon if you know how to use it. You could kill a person with a shoestring if you know how to use it.

Keep in mind that some things could be considered illegal improvised weapons. Pvc pipe is legal, spud guns and potato cannons are not. Personally, I wouldn't carry a lock in my pocket in a place like New York. Police have to consider the totality of the circumstances when investigating. A lock in the pocket without reason might be one of the contributing factors in making an arrest if you are searched.
96  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Why do people think income tax is ok? on: January 18, 2014, 07:20:42 PM
To assume that taxation is the only solution to the problem is akin to shutting your mind off to looking for other possible solutions.

Too many people spouting that taxes are a necessary evil and not enough saying "isn't there a better way?" I challenge everyone to think outside the box.
97  Other / Off-topic / Re: I have to survive.. on: January 18, 2014, 06:33:47 PM
Break up the keys and give them to multiple people. More money means more people to distribute the code. This means that any conspiracy to steal your wealth would require enough people such that the distribution of the ill-gotten gains are not individually worth it. Also, the more people that have a portion of the keys, the higher the probability that one or more of them would be unwilling to participate.
98  Other / Off-topic / Re: What would you have done? on: January 18, 2014, 06:21:45 PM
Bare fear is not enough to claim self defense.

Each state is different so check your local laws. In new york, you probably have to be hiding in your window-less closet of the furthest room of your house, cowering in fear and pleading for your life at least 10x before you can use self defense against an attacker.

Bare fear is usually circumstantial. Seeing 10 gangbangers across the street staring at you would be bare fear in many people's eyes.

Reasonable fear would be if those 10 gangbangers started following you for a considerable distance, while making threats or gestures of harm.

Reasonable fear is usually enough to justify aggression but there is a matter of imminence. If those 10 gangbangers follow you into a dead end alley and keep coming towards you, making threats and you have no means of escape, now a reasonable person can be expected to defend themselves aggressively.

The threat isn't imminent if it is avoidable. You see a police officer while walking away from those 10 gangbangers but ignore him and keep on going. You could have avoided the imminent danger by letting the officer know of their actions.

Basically, you have to have a reasonable fear of harm and it has to be imminent. Yes, you might feel personally justified in giving your brass knuckles a workout on that guy's face but can your wet-behind-the-ears public defender convince 12 jurors that you were justified in your actions? You haven't convinced a public forum if that is any hint of your odds.

Google your state laws. If your going to carry a weapon, carry something legal. You can wear a belt that you don't really need and learn how to use it as a weapon. Not a crime to wear a belt but it will function to harm a person's face, wrap up a hand that has a knife, choke a person to death, etc. If you have access to a punching bag, practice tearing off your belt and delivering a strike to the bag. No one gets arrested for having a belt on them.
99  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: BTC business ideas on: January 18, 2014, 05:26:26 PM has buyers and sellers of bitcoins in India. Just find a regular buyer through there.
100  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: BTC business ideas on: January 18, 2014, 05:05:58 PM
One of the way - open digital shop with bitcoin support)

I'm planning one for Indian handicrafts which have huge demand in International market. There are few things that have kept me at hold:

1. Website designing( I know nothing about it)
2. Integrating Payment system. (How can Bitpay be useful with INR?)

1. Find someone who can make website and do partnership with them.
2. Use bitpay to convert to USD and then you will have to do traditional currency exchange from USD to INR.
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