There is a tradeoff.  Obviously it's not "just as good" -- but the fact that people you trust can spend your bitcoins with justcoin if they need it is valuable in and of itself.  I mean, you would want to give something of value to all those people you sent 1BTC to on the other thread right?  Having their ripple credit allow them to use justcoin would do just that.

Ripple is NOT a bitcoin competitor.  It is a complement.

It's only scary because you do not understand it.

Not yet -- that will probably come after OpenCoin's Ripple implementation comes out of private beta.

Ripple is not XRP.  XRP is the currency used *by* Ripple.  If you're looking for an exchange, or somewhere to buy XRP try bitstamp.net.   


Not really, only in part.  What it really depends on are users who trust eachother -- the users will dwarf the number of exchanges, the exchanges are just easier to use.

Because XRP is not intended as something that will just hold value and raise -- it is required to make transactions on the ripple network.  These transactions are valuable --- and not much xrp is needed to make them(however, some XRP is needed to make connections & have an account).

I think XRP are overvalued right now, that being said, but that problem'll solve itself as more of them are distributed.

If you can help it, don't use it soley as a means to get bitcoin.  Ripple is used better when it's used to actually manage things outside of money -- keeping track of who needs to chip in for coffee, and so on.  Don't put too much trust in anyone, including exchanges -- only trust what you would be willing to lose.

That's because TradeFortress is paying people to suggest that.

How long will bitcoin be around?  Does it matter?  You could use the same argument against mtgox or any online service which allows you to deposit BTC into it.  "Sure mtgox lets you keep your BTC on their service...but for how long?"

If you have trust issues, that's your problem.  But if you trust someone for 1BTC, and that person trusts someone else for 1BTC, then that 1BTC of value can be transferred between you.   You do not need a "real" bitcoin in order to make a transaction happen, and that's the whole point.  Let the "real" bitcoins stay in a more secure location and let trust be allocated via 'lighter' ways.

...

The whole point of Ripple is that there will be *many* gateways and that a complete loss of one will only be a trivial problem.  Sure there's only a few right now, but there will be no barriers beyond legal ones(and good luck with that).


Equivocation.  You owned something, and that something can be recreated.  Unlike real bitcoin a balance can be reinstated after a hard disk is lost.  Obviously not all gateways are going to do this but there's nothing preventing a balance of 1BTC from being put right back after a hard drive is taken.  As you've pointed out these are not bitcoins these are *promises* of bitcoins, which is a different thing but, when treated right, can function *just as much of a currency as bitcoins themselves*.


I would encourage people who believe this go check out the source code to villages.cc and other releases of Ripple.  It has been a continuing path of decentralization, ending at the next version which is not yet released but which TradeFortress seems to have some kind of an issue with.


Which is fantastic, if you're living in a cabin in the woods and don't have any friends but can still order stuff at gunpoint off of the internet.

Unfortunately most of us *do* trust people and our trust is limited to fairly local trust networks, and mostly sits unused.

Ripple allows you to use that trust so you, along with your entire community can build wealth that is not available without it.

History repeats itself. Don't blindly follow Satoshi, but as someone who has created Bitcoin, you have to give their word a moment of thought.

Satoshi has NEVER commented on Ripple.  TradeFortress is building an argument based on misunderstandings of what Ripple is.

588 khash/s, cpu mining on bitcoin-qt on debian stable

no pool, just mining alone.

I do understand -- arguing on the internet is a pain, and it's probable that you're arguing against a cad who doesn't know any better than you half the time who thinks he does.  It's exhausting and it's not always fruitful -- but nevertheless, rational people cannot agree to disagree.  Either one of us is irrational, we're talking past eachother(I suspect this is happening) or one of us is wrong and we need to both consider that possibility(really all 3).


Know what's funny?  I actually had encountered him earlier on the ripple network and had allocated him some trust there -- so he was likely trusted in the Ripple community by others too.  He (or any of these 30 people) could have made use of that ~0.002BTC because he seemed, at the time, pretty legit.  Now I am definitely wondering, and he can contact me if he wants to maintain that credit.

In the meanwhile I think I can post in other areas, thanks.

It is not rational to Agree to Disagree.  But let's make sure we're on the same page -- I don't think TF is a scammer per se, but posting in a thread and then removing all discussion that doesn't go along his point of view is very sketchy.

Just so you know, I predate OpenCoin's involvement with Ripple.  While their solution is, in my opinion the legitimate heir to the previous attempts, it's not a matter of believing this is a good idea because they say so.  It's a matter of believing it is a good idea because it works.


This is not a zero sum game.  They are not taking money from everyone's pocket -- at worst they are allocating themselves money which, up until they made it, did not exist, in a future world where it is valuable.  They are creating value, and then allocating some of that created value to themselves for the trouble of it.

For the next few months, I am going to be travelling across Canada, trying to live as much as possible off of bitcoin, starting in Carnduff, Saskatchewan.  Is there anything interesting available for Bitcoin there?  Food/lodging?  I'll post the next city when I get there.

I agree - you didn't, but you did call us sockpuppets.  And I want to make the point that it is reasonable for people who are being called scammers carte blanche to be able to justify their position, and that it isn't just OpenCoin sockpuppets coming out of the woodwork or something that's happening here.

There is no "Hole" that he is exploiting -- he exploiting *people* (if he's exploiting people at all).  Now granted, they will only be exploited to the extent that they trust him, but that is only going to happen because he's a Hero member, and that's the issue.

I will try staying logged in for 4 consecutive hours and do that if that doesn't work, thanks.

First of all, let's get one thing clear here.  XRP is not Ripple.  XRP is an anti-spam mechanism that just happens to be a special purpose currency..  The fact that they call it 'ripples' is confusing, but Ripple is much more than XRP.

The price of XRP is basically a non issue.  People determine the price of XRP -- the currency that, I will remind you, is created *by* OpenCoin.  TF is not dealing in XRP.  TF is dealing in Bitcoin.

This is only true until they actually release their server -- at which point they will be just another network participant abiding by the rules which they are clearly laying out on the wiki ( https://ripple.com/wiki/Main_Page ).

For the time being, you probably shouldn't use the system as it's in development -- use the pre-existing versions such as http://www.villages.cc instead.

I am not a sockpuppet.  I have been a member of these forums for quite some time(though I have not yet figured out how to convince you all that I am not a 'noob' and am hence not able to post in most threads) and I am a fairly public person (albeit a Ripple supporter) on much of the web.  I have been on TV promoting Bitcoin and I do not appreciate the suggestion that Ripple is a scam.

No it isn't.  Don't create a line of trust to anyone you do not trust. It's really that simple.

Until OpenCoin came around, did you think that Ripple was a scam?