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921  Economy / Service Announcements / Re: [ANN] Tangible Cryptography suspends Bitcoin related transactions on: June 03, 2013, 05:23:07 PM
The company has been given thirty days to provide written explanation on why our activity is exempt from licensing under current law. The commission has formally stated that unless exempt from licensing we must stop further activity until such time as we apply for and obtain a Money Transmitter license.

I see that Tangible Cryptography's MSB registration (#31000023734880), dated March 23, 2013, lists MSB Activities as "Money transmitter".  

The types of activities to choose from include:

Money Services Business - The term "money services business" includes any person doing business, whether or not on a regular basis or as an organized business concern, in one or more of the following capacities:

(1) Currency dealer or exchanger.
(2) Check casher.
(3) Issuer of traveler's checks, money orders or stored value.
(4) Seller or redeemer of traveler's checks, money orders or stored value.
(5) Money transmitter.
(6) U.S. Postal Service.

If Tangible Cryptography were to have wanted to choose something other than Money transmitter, there's nothing else that really applies.   And money transmitter isn't really correct either.

Bitcoins simply is a round peg that doesn't fit in any of the regulator's square holes.
922  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Technical Support / Re: Unconfirmed ghost transaction on: June 01, 2013, 09:02:06 PM
How can this transaction be confirmed?

Unless the sender or some other node is re-broadcasting the transaction then today consider it as if that transaction had never been sent.

Your client could have seen the transaction back when it was last relayed to you but after a restart your client should not still have an unconfirmed transaction retained.
923  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Parrallel block chains on: May 30, 2013, 10:11:43 PM
I'd wondered about something like this for fast payment processing. Something like an alt chain but using bitcoins split off from the main chain and re-merged hourly/daily, no idea how it could be implemented though :/

That kind of sounds like cross-chain trading.  That's not currently something supported but here's the thoughts on it:

There's also Ripple, Open Transactions, etc, which all are solutions that let you use Bitcoin as the backing for the value transferred but using a different layer on top.
924  Bitcoin / Press / Re: 2013-05-30 - Bitcoin will continue to function beyond the reach o on: May 30, 2013, 07:55:32 PM
Duplicate... not that it doesn't merit a second read, mind you.  Cheesy

Ya, I see that now.  The timestamps are just a couple minutes apart.

As far as the article, the comments show how there's still so much about the basics of bitcoin that people aren't grasping.   But compare that to the comments from a year ago, or two years ago and the typical reader is much further along.   (I suppose since even infrequent readers have now seen a dozen articles about it they are starting to realize it isn't some ponzi / scam and will probably be with us for a while).
925  Bitcoin / Press / Re: NEW articles in Press Forum on: May 30, 2013, 07:45:58 PM
2013-05-30 - Bitcoin will continue to function beyond the reach o
926  Bitcoin / Press / 2013-05-30 - Bitcoin will continue to function beyond the reach o on: May 30, 2013, 07:37:20 PM
Bitcoin will continue to function beyond the reach of government and law
by James Ball

The real transformative power of Bitcoin, or something like it, lies not in a speculative bubble, but in its potential to put currency outside of the control of governments, or law enforcement agencies.
"Bitcoin makes Liberty Reserve look quaint as unlike the alleged money launderer, Bitcoin is decentralised. There's no single company or entity controlling the currency, and so it's nearly impossible to shut down.
"Where real money is exchanged into Bitcoins is still a potential weak spot for authorities and some Bitcoin exchanges are looking to sign up with regulators.
"If Bitcoin, or a currency working in a similar way to it, got a stable value and a large user base, it could take cash flows forever out of the hands of government. Whether that's a great thing or a terrible thing depends on what you're trying to do, what you think of government and what country you're talking about.
The prosecutors of the southern district of New York are very publicly celebrating their shutting down of the Liberty Reserve operation. They should enjoy it it may be one of their last such victories.

927  Bitcoin / Project Development / Re: Bringing Bitcoin to the world-competing with Western Union on: May 30, 2013, 05:15:10 PM

Bitcoin essentially displaces hawala.  With hawala there is this set of transactions in two locations which is only possible due to a linkage of trust between the two parties facilitating the "transfer".  With bitcoin, a transfer of fiat is simplified into two domestic Bitcoin exchange transactions, each independent from the other.  One is the buying of bitcoins at one location and the other transaction is cashing out the bitcoins at another.

Every hawalador can essentially go independent and offer to do Bitcoin exchange services, ... up to a point.

At most it would mean finding trustworthy people who already have the capital to invest.      

The problem is the street-level hawalador agent handling the cash-out needs to quickly turn over the bitcoins received right back into fiat.   So the street-level hawalador needs a nearby low-cost exchanger who will buy the hawalador's bitcoins and pay out cash.  

So there is a capital requirement for providing this exchange service where held by the mid-level exchanger is an inventory of cash to be able to buy every bitcoin that the street-level hawalador wishes to sell.

When I see how there are 70,000 M-Pesa agents in Kenya who earn commission that supplements their income, (including many who earn so much from M-Pesa that they do it full-time now), it is a natural that individuals looking to earn a little money by providing bitcoin exchange will emerge in that role.  But what they need help with to get started is a way to turn the bitcoins they buy back into cash.

Down the road this will probably build some form of a hierarchy.  You'll have the street-level exchangers buying bitcoins and paying maybe 5% below spot.  That level may seem a little high but it is necessary due to the time involved to provide this service (arranging and meeting face-to-face is time consuming) and to protect against the risks -- exchange rate risk where the value fluctuates after the exchanger buys the coins after completing a buy from a customer but has not yet sold them.   Other risks include receiving counterfeit bills (though with proper training that risk can be lowered) and physical security (i.e., handling cash can be dangerous).

But then if that street exchanger can visit (or get a visit) from a broker-dealer/mid-level exchanger who will convert those bitcoins back to cash at about a 2% to 3% fee then the amount of money earned makes it worth it for the street exchanger to provide the service.   The broker-dealer itself might have a trusted party that the coins are flipped to immediately (wholesale, close to spot rate) so that there is no exchange rate risk exposure and exists is a fairly quick method of replenishing the dealer's inventory of cash.  

The reason the street-level exchanger doesn't just send the coins to an exchange is because that would involve the banking system, and either the costs or the settlement delays associated with the banking system are prohibitive.  And exchange is probably a regulated activity so the street-level exchanger wouldn't use a bank regardless.  Even the broker-dealer probably won't use the banking system either.  

So essentially, this eventually has just tiers like any supply chain.  The street-level exchanger buys coins from the public and sells them to a broker-dealer (the next level up in the hierarchy).  Then the broker-dealer trades those coins up to a wholesaler (who has the banking relationships and / or relationships with large buyers.)

But this hierarchy isn't necessary to get things started.  All that is needed are for the two parties (prospective buyer and prospective seller) to learn that each other exists.  These relationships can be learned from attending a local meetup, or from a classified ad on craigslist even.

LocalBitcoins is essentially the closest thing to a hawala network that exists with Bitcoin today as I can (and have) used that to do a three-party transaction.  Here's how that three-party transaction worked.   I as the seller contacted the buyer in a far away location.  The buyer met with my person who was to receive the cash.    My person sent me a text saying the buyer was there with the cash, I released the bitcoin funds, and the buyer then handed over the cash.     My recipient of the funds didn't know anything about Bitcoin, except that Bitcoin had made it possible for some person to show up at a certain time and hand over some cash -- no names, no phone numbers, no ID, no nothing.  The only technology that was needed at the hand over of the cash was a couple text messages between me and the person receiving the funds.
928  Economy / Trading Discussion / Re: Mt.Gox AML/KYC Process Explained on: May 30, 2013, 03:08:03 PM
All Mt. Gox user accounts are required to be verified in order to perform any currency deposits and withdrawals

TOKYO - JAPAN - May 30, 2013

Statement Regarding Account Verifications

The Bitcoin market continues to evolve, as do regulations and conditions of compliance for Mt. Gox to continue bringing secure services to our customers. It our responsibility to provide a trusted and legal exchange, and that includes making sure that we are operating within strict anti-money laundering rules and preventing other malicious activity.

As a result, beginning May 30th, 2013 all Mt. Gox user accounts are required to be verified in order to perform any currency deposits and withdrawals. Bitcoin deposits do not need verification, and at this time we are not requiring verification for Bitcoin withdrawals.

In the past two months Mt. Gox has invested in more than doubling our verification support staff, and we are currently able to process most verifications within 24~48 hours.

We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause. Please visit the Security Center in your Mt. Gox account if you are not already verified, and keep in mind that being careful to submit the proper documents will result in a much faster processing time.

Mt.Gox Co. Ltd Team.

Mt.Gox Contact

929  Economy / Trading Discussion / Re: Who trades BTC/USD options? on: May 30, 2013, 03:05:20 PM
I would like to trade options (CALLs and PUTs) on BTC/USD... Do you know somebody doing it except

For CALL and PUT options, currently that's it:

There's at least one binary options vendor but about the only thing that shares with what you likely are looking to do is the word "option" in the service.

But there has been talk of this coming from one or more of the upstarts ....,, maybe too. 
930  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Parrallel block chains on: May 30, 2013, 05:28:34 AM
Such a method implies sacrificing security on the individual parallel chains, taken as whole they would be of a similar security level.

The advantage being scaling.

Ok, it appears you are describing multiple standalone blockchains.

But one fourth the hashing does not give one fourth the protection.

Either the defenses are sufficient or they aren't, so the right approach is to want maximum hashing capacity securing the Bitcoin blockchain -- even in excess of the minimum level necessary.

So you don't benefit as a whole when splitting hashing capacity among multiple standalone blockchains.   And there's no difference between three blockchains each with 10 GB of storage required versus one blockchain with 30 GB, so I'm not sure what you see as being the upside with this approach.

931  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: So I just came back from the BitPay Offices... on: May 30, 2013, 05:12:13 AM

"Yes we have a keg in our office. On ice until the morning!"

Heh, ... morning?   I guess ... it's always noon somewhere, right?
932  Economy / Economics / Re: If you are being paid interest on your money, why would you spend it? on: May 30, 2013, 01:59:40 AM
Guys, calm down, Elwar is being sarcastic, he's obviously playing on the whole "Deflationary currencies are doomed because no one spends money that will be worth more in the future" concept by applying it to fiat money and showing how it doesn't hold water.

I'm not sure it is a good comparison.   If you are lending your money the borrower generally isn't putting it under the mattress but instead is spending the funds and economic activity results.   So lending is essentially the same as spending.

Now there are differing beliefs as to which is better ... spending today by the borrower versus later spending that would occur by you (from your bitcoins kept "under the mattress").  Let's say the borrower uses the funds to buy a car for commuting to work, whereas your later spending might be used to import some expensive bottles of wine to add to your collection in your wine cellar, let's say.   For the economy as a whole that money might be more useful going to the car today rather than to the wine for the cellar later.    And thus you lending out the money is better than you buying gold with it and sticking it in the ground, for instance -- at least that's the argument as I understand it.

However, the problem is that the lending isn't just going for the cars for commuters and other productive uses but instead it goes for overpaying for goods and services and for speculation on commodities such as crude oil which raises the street price for all.   So there's good lending (investment) and bad lending (resulting in malinvestment).   Evidence of systemic malinvestment might look like this

Unemployment worsening in much of Europe:

while at the exact same time a designer handbag manufacturer sees sales in Europe double for the quarter:

i.e., lots of money sloshing around, going to consumption spending instead of to uses that increase productivity, or to factories, etc.   If there's more profit from creating designer handbags than, let's say, designing and improving water purification technology, then that's where human talent will focus their efforts.   If markets are left alone they are pretty good about figuring out the where and when investment should occur.

But there are those who think the central bank is smarter than you as far as what you should be doing with your money, and monetary policy is used to persuade you to behave in a certain way.  Like spending it now (to cause economic activity) versus seeing it lose value (as the result of currency inflation).
933  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Parrallel block chains on: May 29, 2013, 07:46:37 PM
I just want to open the floor to thoughts about a parallel block chain system.

"Parallel blockchain" could mean different things to different people.   An alt-crypto currency is a parallel blockchain, but I'm not sure if that's what you are referring to.

As far as changing the Bitcoin protocol for "faster" confirmations, that would require a hard fork.    Unless this method adds value to Bitcoin it likely won't be accepted by the economic majority and thus will not survive as a fork.   "Faster" confirmations comes at a cost (security of confirmed transactions) and thus the Bitcoin protocol won't likely see such a change.  Again, .... other alt coins do this now.

Or were you thinking of some other approach?
934  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Technical Support / Re: Unconfirmed transaction after 24 hours? on: May 29, 2013, 07:36:24 PM
Anyway, could this be some kind of fake/double-spent Tx?

You could tell that right away using as it will show double spend information for the transaction if there appears to be any spending conflicts.

After a period of time, pools will forget about transactions (as they can age out of the memory pool as it fills) so what needs to occur is for the sender to re-broadcasdt the transaction occasionally.  The Bitcoin-Qt/bitcoind client will do this forever.   Other clients may vary in the frequency of re-broadcast.  Some E-Wallets (including sometimes seem to no re-broadcast transactions that are older and haven't confirmed (and thus the funds become available for spending once again).   That doesn't happen often, but it happens enough to be in the range of possibilities explaining why an unconfirmed transaction might not ever get a confirmation.   
935  Economy / Economics / Re: Bit Angels Launches Website and Sub Reddit - Join Us on: May 28, 2013, 05:36:14 PM

2013-05-27 [TechCrunch] 60+ Investors Band Together To Form BitAngels
936  Bitcoin / Press / Re: 2013-05-27 [TechCrunch] 60+ Investors Band Together To Form BitAngels on: May 28, 2013, 05:25:54 PM
Links to Announcement forum thread and Subreddit:

937  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Bitcoind transaction notification on: May 28, 2013, 02:26:18 PM
Actually, there are two command line switches -blocknotify and -walletnotify which will call a command when a block is found and when transactions arrive.

Ah, thanks for that!

Here's more info on it:

How to use Walletnotify?
938  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Bitcoind transaction notification on: May 28, 2013, 02:05:14 PM
What is the best way to get an HTTP callback when bitcoind client receive an input/output transaction?

Thank you all

The Bitcoin-Qt/bitcoind client does not have any callback, so the main method employed currently is to poll the client to discover new transactions (using listsinceblock).

BitcoinJ does support this with a PeerEventListener interface:

Also, BitsOfProof possibly supports a callback for new transactions as well.

[Edit: And most payment processors, e.g., BitPay,  provide this within their API.]

[Edit2: And you can configure to notify you:
 - ]
939  Economy / Economics / Re: Hoarding Vs. Spending on: May 27, 2013, 08:01:24 PM

The power of fiat for them is the ability to endlessly print new money.

You can do that with bitcoin, provided you have the majority of the hashing power...

That's false.   Bitcoin's issuance is fixed, so even with majority of the hashing power the only thing that attacker can do is be the recipient of the entire block reward subsidy.  But even with a majority of hashing capacity does that give the attacker the ability to issue more than the Bitcoin protocol allows (currently 25 BTC every ten minutes).    So "endless" in terms of no upper limit, is not possible with Bitcoin.
940  Bitcoin / Legal / Re: Question: MtGox vs. Retroactivity of law on: May 27, 2013, 05:36:35 PM
What am I missing?

There were no new laws.   What changed was FinCEN's guidance in that for the first time their interpretation of the law is that the exchange between bitcoins to and from cash (or other forms of value) are considered the transmission of money and thus, at a minimum, require registration as an MSB.

have a question to the lawyers of this forum:

So that there's not any confusion, IANAL.
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