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61  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Riots after Death of Man in Minneapolis Police Custody on: June 19, 2020, 09:39:10 PM
Typical leftist ideology and theory..... if you dont like the truth, blame it on racism.

The supply of real racism has dwindled so badly in the recent years, yet the liberals have such a high demand for racism....this is what you get.

Interesting how you never heard of Systemic or Institutional racism a dozen years ago. Apparently we needed to come up with a new theory, which in itself, I believe is racist.
  For the liberals to see racism in everything, they are implying that they believe the black race is not able succeed on their own, so they need little white liberals help.

The system here in the US is SOOOOOO racist, that it prevented a black man from being President of the US over a decade ago..... oh wait.


You say .... BS PopoJeff, you're full of it.  Ok then, why do these issues only show up at election time?
Nothing more than liberal propaganda. And you youngsters are drinking the koolaid.

Growing up in the '70s and '80s, we didnt have this BS. We could actually find humor in the old racist ways. We got along without just assuming someone was racist based on their skin color. Watch Blazing Saddles, or the 1975 SNL interview skit with Chevy Chase and Richard Pryor.
62  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone... What are your thoughts on it? on: June 19, 2020, 04:18:13 AM
Why is everyone worried about a chart and identity politics.

No one cares.  

Doesn't matter where you fall on that chart. If you and you group of whatever's forcefully take over part of a city, you're nothing more than a criminal, with no regard for others.

Area businesses will suffer.  A nearby Trader Joe's has already closed. Taxpayers will foot the bill for fixing what they've ruined.  Insurance companies will refuse to insure businesses who want to re build in the area.

Good job Seattle, you've negotiated with terrorists.
63  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Riots after Death of Man in Minneapolis Police Custody on: June 18, 2020, 05:46:38 PM
I received messages that 3 of my comments on this thread were deleted.  Upon review, they are all factual information. So the bias is apparent, facts don't matter. 2 decades of actual experience in this subject don't matter.

No reason to post truths here anymore.  Y'all have fun.

But to keep this one 'on topic'......  I believe Minneapolis can burn. Riot and wreck your community you fools

And to address the above post, of course more black males age 18-35 are killed by police, in disparity from population make up,  they are responsible for +/- HALF of all violent crime although comprising only 1.4% of the US population.
   If HALF of ALL VIOLENT crime Police respond to is being committed by black males age 18-35, then they are making up 50% of all police contacts, but yet more white boys get killed.  Seems the whiteys should be rioting.
64  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Riots after Death of Man in Minneapolis Police Custody on: June 16, 2020, 11:19:39 AM
So if the taser is so dangerous then the police officer had no business taking it out in the first place.  That means Rayshard Brooks had reason to fear for his life, defend himself and also flee.   Secondly, don't chase a man that closely if you are afraid he's about to take your life.  Thats just dumb.    Police have no concept of defensive positioning when they are allegedly so scared for their lives.  We've seen officers drive up 2 feet away from a boy they thought was threatening their lives with a toy gun.  

If you think theres danger, you'd keep a distance.   They are creating the very threat to their lives they are killing people over.  These cowards have no business being police officers.

   Unfortunately, your opinion does not matter.  Established law does.  Feelings do not overrule facts.
You're arguing yourself in a never-ending circle of stupidity.

   Tasers can incapacitate. There is always one known firearm in any encounter, the cops gun. A cop cannot be allowed to become incapacitated, otherwise he can lose control of his firearm. This particular criminal already demonstrated he's got no hesitation in feloniously taking an officer's weapon. He demonstrated nothing but criminal activity. There's no reason to believe he would not also take an officer's firearm if he was able to incapacitate the officer.

  Your problem is you keep blaming cops for the criminal's actions. And you just cant see it, or even consider being objectively reasonable, because you have been conditioned to follow the herd.

  Maybe this guy can explain a little better. I think I've mentioned all of his points, but here they are written by a professional.
  https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/the-police-shooting-of-rayshard-brooks-in-atlanta-was-tragic-but-justifiable
I'm not arguing about what the law is.  I know the law and disagree with it. That is why we are protesting to begin with.  I don't think police should have firearms at all unless they are responding to a firearm.  Maybe keep it in the trunk.  Weak cops who cannot keep their weapons away from a drunk man two on 1, should not be carrying weapons at all.  

I'm not blaming cops for anyone's actions but their own.  People do bad shit in these interactions but rarely does it justify execution and its cops escalating the whole while and eventually pulling the trigger.  I hold the cops responsible for the results and ensuring the safety of everyone involved because that is their job. If the job is unreasonable then we should change the job and that is exactly the solution I'm suggesting.  I'm not following the herd either.  I've been suggesting police reform and taking away guns from beat cops   for over ten years.  

Unfortunately these people have reached a point in their mental degradation where they put emotion in equivalence with or above logic. You can't use logic to prove a point to some one who thinks emotions equal facts. Emotions are the doorway through which they are conditioned to believe their feelings equal logic, opening them to be easily manipulated. On some level they know how absolutely full of shit they are, but their cognitive dissonance won't allow them to admit it. Even if they can admit it to themselves quietly, they believe the ends justify the means, and because they "feel" it is right, by virtue of their good will, their actions become logical and right. These people aren't going to stop until they end up in a bloody pile. This is the inevitable result any time logic exits the equation.
A person who uses logic with no emotions is a psychopath.  Emotions are the only way to incorporate empathy and compassion into decision making. A psychopath might think killing off all of the disabled would benefit society, but anyone with emotions and compassion would easily see the moral downside of an extreme decision like that and make the moral (not logical) argument against it.  


There it is. The single most ill-conceived notion Ive seen on the internet today.

Guess how many people will sign up to be a cop when you take away their right of self defense?

Congratulations, you just allowed criminals to win.


And this, from the same party that wants to ban private gun ownership by saying, "only the cops should have guns."
65  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Riots after Death of Man in Minneapolis Police Custody on: June 16, 2020, 12:50:55 AM
This has absolutely nothing to do with the current President. The person in that seat has very little influence on how any cop does his job.

It has nothing to do with one cop. Or 10 cops. People just had it enough. When you become president you become president of whole country. Trump simply failed there. And was just adding more shit month over month. It all get packed with covid-19 lockouts and then, ....    This riots would happen sooner or latter. And if by some miracle Trump stays president for longer and continue what he is doing there will be more and in way bigger scale.

Where did Trump fail?   I'm listening.

Each State's Governor was responsible for their state's lockdown.
Each Officer is following Use of Force Rulings that have been in effect since 1985.

But, Trump's fault?   Please.... do tell....
66  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Riots after Death of Man in Minneapolis Police Custody on: June 15, 2020, 11:36:10 PM
To me it seems that all this violence happened just because of incompetence of the country president. 4 years of bullshit has to show somehow.

The funny thing that I am noticing is that suddenly black in USA are realising they are actually "racist" feeling they are better then black people that live in Africa. All this revealings will open many yes.  

    This has absolutely nothing to do with the current President. The person in that seat has very little influence on how any cop does his job. If any President influenced police relations for the worse, it was Obama who started the war on cops and added fuel to the fire, making it OK to judge all cops by the actions of a few. The same thing no racial group wants to happen to them.
    If you watch anything other than the leftist controlled media, you'll find out this President has actually accomplished more for more people, regardless of race, gender or sexual orientation. Probably the only President in my lifetime to do what he said he would, and not just blow smoke. Reagan is the last one I remember being this effective at getting things accomplished.
   If only our current President didnt tweet so much and get suckered into engaging trolls.

   But if you've ever watched The Wizard of Oz.... you should be looking for the man behind the curtain. Everything you see happening now leads back to a huge political financial giant.
67  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Riots after Death of Man in Minneapolis Police Custody on: June 15, 2020, 10:38:41 PM
One more aspect to consider.  

If police did not stop this dangerous felon immediately..... and he used that taser to carjack someone in the parking lot, and drove off in their car, while drunk, crashed and killed someone else.  

Who's fault would that be. The officer would be charged complicit to murder and fired, for the death of the innocent person killed by the fleeing felon.
  Who's live is more important? The violent criminal? Or an innocent bystander?

Quick, you have about 3 seconds to answer that, evaluate the risk and possibility, all while fighting for your life.

They are damned if they do, damned if they don't.


What if the cops, while shooting at the running/fleeing dude missed and the bullet shot/killed a bystander (imagine a pregnant white woman).
Whose fault is that?  How does the situation get dealt with ?

Maybe cops are trained at shooting moving target, maybe they are good at shooting, but an error is always possible, and the consequences can be dramatic.
Lethal force, should always be put in the balance and chosen only in last resort (regardless of the guy was a multi recidivist felon, child beater and drunk).


Couldn't agree more. One of the cardinal rules of firearms is to know your target, it's surroundings, and what's beyond it.
   In this case, I don't know what the officer saw
68  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Do you feel safe going outside? on: June 15, 2020, 08:56:08 PM
I feel plenty safe from Covid.  But more worried about getting beaten by Democrats because of my skin color.
69  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Riots after Death of Man in Minneapolis Police Custody on: June 15, 2020, 08:05:09 PM
Yes, I forgot Mr Decker has his own law. So for your purposes I can extrapolate a wee bit further....

APD policy is in tune with established case law. And... well, that's about all it takes.  Department policies must adhere to current US and state law, not BADecker's version of law.

70  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Do Black lives matter or Do all lives matter? on: June 15, 2020, 07:05:40 PM
This BLM movement has become a bastardized abomination and has literally transformed into Criminals vs Cops.

Anyone find it interesting that this only flares up during election years?
71  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Riots after Death of Man in Minneapolis Police Custody on: June 15, 2020, 05:56:17 PM
So if the taser is so dangerous then the police officer had no business taking it out in the first place.  That means Rayshard Brooks had reason to fear for his life, defend himself and also flee.   Secondly, don't chase a man that closely if you are afraid he's about to take your life.  Thats just dumb.    Police have no concept of defensive positioning when they are allegedly so scared for their lives.  We've seen officers drive up 2 feet away from a boy they thought was threatening their lives with a toy gun. 

If you think theres danger, you'd keep a distance.   They are creating the very threat to their lives they are killing people over.  These cowards have no business being police officers.

   Unfortunately, your opinion does not matter.  Established law does.  Feelings do not overrule facts.
You're arguing yourself in a never-ending circle of stupidity.

   Tasers can incapacitate. There is always one known firearm in any encounter, the cops gun. A cop cannot be allowed to become incapacitated, otherwise he can lose control of his firearm. This particular criminal already demonstrated he's got no hesitation in feloniously taking an officer's weapon. He demonstrated nothing but criminal activity. There's no reason to believe he would not also take an officer's firearm if he was able to incapacitate the officer.

  Your problem is you keep blaming cops for the criminal's actions. And you just cant see it, or even consider being objectively reasonable, because you have been conditioned to follow the herd.

  Maybe this guy can explain a little better. I think I've mentioned all of his points, but here they are written by a professional.
  https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/the-police-shooting-of-rayshard-brooks-in-atlanta-was-tragic-but-justifiable
72  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Riots after Death of Man in Minneapolis Police Custody on: June 15, 2020, 02:07:12 PM
None of this is grounds for a death sentence. You can make the argument that he was potentially a "deadly threat" to others - the courts may see it otherwise. Regardless, running away with a discharged taser is not a justifiable reason to be executed.

If he was a deadly threat to others, why under Tennessee vs. Garner wouldn't the officers have the legal authority to shoot Brooks? I'd argue he was a potentially deadly threat to officers primarily, then bystanders.

How was he potentially a "deadly threat"? His taser had been discharged. He was running away from the cops. Not a deadly threat to anyone. Besides, its not about what the cops have the right to do under the law, its about what they should do. Being able to legally finesse your way into murder should be discouraged among our nation's police force.

The taser has a second shot to it. I also believe most tasers allow you to dry stun after the taser's shot has been deployed without the cartridge in place at the end of the taser (meaning you can hold the taser to the skin directly). Over 1,000 people have died after tasers were used on them since 2000, 150 of these autopsies show the taser having a significant impact on the cause of death. Also, tasers can be dangerous if you have any sort of heart condition. Also, if the taser is deployed near your face, the prongs can blind you.
https://www.reuters.com/investigates/special-report/usa-taser-911/

You have two elements -

1.) The taser itself causes extreme bodily harm or potential death.
2.) The taser incapacitates the officer which might result the suspect inflicting further bodily harm of potential death.

That's why the officer shot and it isn't unreasonable to say from a moral perspective that for the officer's safety, he had a right to defend himself. You put yourself in his shoes, you have someone that fought you and resisted arrest, stole a taser, then fired it at you. Would you not worry about your safety at that point given the circumstances? On a side note, I'm not even sure if the DA's office in Atlanta is going to let this go. I read an article stating that prosecutors are floating the idea of charging the officer who fired rounds probably to cave into the mob who's demanding the officer be charged. You then have an acquittal and people start the rioting cycle over again because they feel justice was not served.


You are exactly correct. Depending on the type of Taser (there are several). Some have a second shot in the primary cartridge. Some have single shot cartridges. If the single shot cartridge type is used, officers usually have either; 2 spare cartridges on their belt, or, 1 spare cartridge attached to the Taser battery, which inserts into the grip of the Taser.

Another notable fact. You do not need to WAIT to be assaulted/shot/tasered before defending yourself or others.
73  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Riots after Death of Man in Minneapolis Police Custody on: June 15, 2020, 12:32:18 PM

It really shouldn't matter what the law says cops can and can't get away with -- they should know better at this point in time that just because you can do something, it doesn't mean you should do it.


Did you REALLY just write that?   Go back and read it again.    

"It really shouldn't matter what the law says" Huh    

Thats literally the most important thing in the world.  Cops dont make the laws, they don't write the laws. They ENFORCE the established laws. The laws that are made by your elected politicians. In a court of law, where they (and you) are judged for their actions, literally the only thing that matters is WHAT THE LAW SAYS.
   Not the kids opinions, not the opinions of any race that want special treatment.  The cops have to follow the law, and none of this shit would be happening if everyone else did to.


"They should know better" Huh  

 Better than what? The laws that govern their operation and procedure?  The laws of the state the operate in?
I think what you're really trying to say is you don't want cops to arrest black people for their crimes anymore. You want special treatment for blacks. There's the racist side of all this mess. The race pandering.  


There's a thing called unpleasant truths vs and comforting lies.  I'll give you an example:  
   BLM is fighting for the rights of the oppressed is your comforting lie.  But the unpleasant truth is they're destroying property and lives of the innocent, at a higher rate than anyone else, while most 'woke' folks are asleep to the fact they are nothing more than a political operative, funding and being directed by the Democratic Party.  
   Here's another one.  You think justice is served in the Floyd case, by rushing the charges on Chauvin. Makes you feel good, right? That knee hold looked awful.  Unpleasant truth is, Chauvin will be found not-guilty of murder. Because most of the public is ignorant of US law.

Nope. You're making this way more complicated than it needs to be, going full conspiratard in the process. Whatever argument you are making is not aided by projecting upon me and referencing conspiracies backed by zero actual evidence whatsoever.

The point is just because the police have the right to do something under the law, it does not mean that it is just. Laws are a continually evolving work in progress. Nothing is set in stone - not even the constitution - that's why we have amendments.

Just because police can do something awful legally, it doesn't mean they should do it. Is that really so hard to understand?

What conspiracy?  Oh, the BLM thing?   Take a look and you can find the truth, it can be found everywhere, you just refuse to look.

The cops ARE the law.  They change as the law changes.  Their entire job is literally enforcement of established law, regardless of personal feelings or beliefs. Humans doing a robots job. And things are set in stone, until they change the stone. Up until 1985, ANY felon fleeing from the law in Tennessee could be shot in the back, and they were.  That was the law.  Then in 1985, the Tennessee vs Garner case was heard by the US Supreme Court, and the law changed, now the fleeing felon must pose a risk of harm to others in order for deadly force to be used. That law changed, the cops changed with the law.

Here, you missed his one because the guy wasn't black, but same circumstances http://foxsanantonio.com/news/local/suspect-shot-dead-by-cop-after-taking-officers-stun-gun-tasing-him
   Your point is moot.
74  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Riots after Death of Man in Minneapolis Police Custody on: June 15, 2020, 11:58:04 AM

It really shouldn't matter what the law says cops can and can't get away with -- they should know better at this point in time that just because you can do something, it doesn't mean you should do it.


Did you REALLY just write that?   Go back and read it again.    

"It really shouldn't matter what the law says" Huh    

Thats literally the most important thing in the world.  Cops dont make the laws, they don't write the laws. They ENFORCE the established laws. The laws that are made by your elected politicians. In a court of law, where they (and you) are judged for their actions, literally the only thing that matters is WHAT THE LAW SAYS.
   Not the kids opinions, not the opinions of any race that want special treatment.  The cops have to follow the law, and none of this shit would be happening if everyone else did to.


"They should know better" Huh  

 Better than what? The laws that govern their operation and procedure?  The laws of the state the operate in?
I think what you're really trying to say is you don't want cops to arrest black people for their crimes anymore. You want special treatment for blacks. There's the racist side of all this mess. The race pandering.  


There's a thing called unpleasant truths vs and comforting lies.  I'll give you an example:  
   BLM is fighting for the rights of the oppressed is your comforting lie.  But the unpleasant truth is they're destroying property and lives of the innocent, at a higher rate than anyone else, while most 'woke' folks are asleep to the fact they are nothing more than a political operative, funding and being directed by the Democratic Party.  
   Here's another one.  You think justice is served in the Floyd case, by rushing the charges on Chauvin. Makes you feel good, right? That knee hold looked awful.  Unpleasant truth is, Chauvin will be found not-guilty of murder. Because most of the public is ignorant of US law.

75  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Riots after Death of Man in Minneapolis Police Custody on: June 14, 2020, 05:58:48 PM
Yeah a statistic that is skewed by racism and then used as an argument against the existence of racism is definitely a "racist statistic".

Its funny how the analogy to your privileged POV is reference to another privileged POV.  Instead of stopping mcdonalds from marketing and selling harmful, addictive foods, you blame the victim.   Try looking at the fabric of the systems that cause problems instead of the symptoms of those poorly designed systems.  

Your head is so far up your ass there is really no point engaging in any kind of logical discussion with you. Any facts you don't like you just imagineer some Postmodernist excuse to dismiss and substitute your own reality. You would cut out your own eye if it dared rest upon the truth.

 Hey PopoJeff, you know this guy claims to be a professor? How scary is that? You aren't qualified to be a professor at clown college.
Is Cornell West qualified?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbOP-GmkyzY
The thing about education is that you can't recognize it if you haven't had it so the educated perspective comes off as "an alternate reality"

Here's an interesting perspective, if your are open-minded enough to look at something from somewhere other than a pre-conceived opinion.


Does America have a “racist cop” problem?

It’s easy to believe so when watching the disturbing videos of the deaths of George Floyd, Eric Garner and Tamir Rice at the hands of the police. But do horrific, high-profile cases like these accurately reflect the treatment of black Americans by the police?

Many observers say no.

Since 2015, The Washington Post has maintained a comprehensive database of fatal police shootings. The Post database shows that fatal shootings by police have run steadily at around 1,000 per year since 2015: 995 (2015); 963 (2016); 987 (2017); 998 (2018); and 1,004 (2019).

About twice as many white people as black people are killed by police. “In fact, in about 75 percent of police shootings, the decedent is not black,” says Andrew McCarthy, a columnist with the National Review.

“This pandemic of civil violence is more widespread than anything seen during the Black Lives Matter movement of the Obama years, and it will likely have an even deadlier toll on law enforcement officers than the targeted assassinations we saw from 2014 onward,” McCarthy wrote. “It’s worse this time because the country has absorbed another five years of academically inspired racial victimology.”

While the current national narrative is that black Americans are, as some Black Lives Matter advocates claim, being “targeted” by police, Rafael Mangual, deputy director of legal policy at the Manhattan Institute, says that view is backward.

“It is certainly fair to say that police have had a target on their backs for some time,” he told InsideSources.

I believe the number is that police officers are eighteen and a half times more likely to be killed by black males than unarmed black males are to be killed by police officers,” he said. “And studies have shown that the odds of a black man being killed in police custody are about one in 1,000.

https://www.houmatoday.com/opinion/20200610/opinion-black-lives-matter-rhetoric-doesnt-match-facts-on-police-violence



So, is it the police that need the ambiguous talking point "more training" ?    Or does society need "more training"?   A simple 20 min PowerPoint presentation in free public school about law? A very simple understanding of.... don't fight police, attack police, or resist arrest, and your odds of being hurt by police are less than being struck by lightning.

You can't just blindly look at statistics without understanding why they are the way they are.  You need to zoom in and have a qualitative understanding to go with statistics.   You are ignoring a lot of the "whys" and only looking at the "whats"

Why are police being killed?

Why is there so much crime in some areas?

You will start to realize that despite massive amounts of policing, the areas with the most policing still have the highest crime.  If you arrest 1000 black people and kill one, the kill rate is low because you are arresting way too many people many of whom did nothing violent.  Now your rate of murdering black people looks better for a bad reason.  

Police, along with the justice and prison systems are manufacturing criminality.  We oppose training the public to respect police because
 this is not a supposed to be a police state.  Police need to serve their community by learning how to interact with them. Not the other way around.   We need to scale back the police big time and put most of  that money into things that will make society better.  

-Counseling
-Rehabilitation
-Jobs training
-Community programs
-Mental health response teams
-Therapists
-education




That's cute.  Really really a cute idea.  Right out of a leftist politician playbook. However, it lack's one important factor...... TRUTH.
It's really an empty opinion to think police and "the system" are "manufacturing criminality."    Spend one friggin hour with any police department and you'll see they don't spend their time picking out who they want to arrest.
    You can pull up any department's UCR data and annual report. You'll find out the largest portion of police interaction and arrests stem from someone CALLING the cops.  It wasn't the cop's choice to go somewhere and dig up some BS charge, the cop's get called to a crime in progress.
  
   And the other contradictory issue is "respecting the police".   No, no ones looking for you to respect a particular person, but a civilized society expects you to respect their established LAWS.  When you don't respect the established LAWS, then you end up having to deal with the police.

  You are also ignoring a WHY.  You say the areas with the most police still have the most crime.  WHY?  Which came first, the crime or the police response?   The areas with the most police didn't start out by someone saying "you know what, we should have a shit ton of police, that'll stop crime."   The actual inverse happens.  Crime statistics increase, they hire more cops. Crime increases more, they hire even more cops.  Policing is REACTIVE in nature.
76  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Donald "Nero" Trump tweeting while Wendys burns. on: June 14, 2020, 02:19:49 PM
I posted this in the other thread:

There's Federal Ruling that applies to deadly force. Not one person's opinion, not another person's opinion. But the opinion of the Supreme Court. And every deadly force incident is judged by this ruling.

Do the circumstances fit the standard?
Does the fleeing felon pose an immediate danger to others?
Is it reasonable to believe if not immediately apprehended, he could use the stolen weapon on others? Or use is to steal a car and kill someone else while DUI?
Did the cops already know this guy had a violent record of child endangerment and kidnapping?

Those are all questions to be answered by prosecutors and judges, under the "reasonableness test."

  

I guess asking someone to not drive while drunk, resist arrest, assault a police officer, steal his taser, fire the taser at the officer, is too much. The district attorney's office is going to find the shooting legally justified but the officer got fired strictly for PR.

He was shot in the back while running away. The cop's life was in no way endangered. If the shooting is found to be legally justified then it will be highlighting one of the main problems with law enforcement.

   Your problem is not with Law Enforcement, it's with the law. Every state had this thing called laws. Somewhere within it, you'll find a section detailing deadly force and when its justified to use.   Then every Police dept has something they call Policy, or SOP's, or General Orders.   That book will also details when deadly force can and can't be used by police.  
   Most of them are quite similar from department to department, state to state.  If if you ever read one of these books, you'll find a phrase called "fleeing forcible felon" or "violent fleeing felon."  

    Resisting arrest is a felony.   Assaulting cops is a felony.  Disarming an Officer is a felony. Stealing an officer's taser is a felony. Pointing the stolen taser at an officer is a felony. Firing a taser at an Officer is a felony.  
    Assaulting officers is violence.  The fleeing felon has demonstrated he is quite capable of being a deadly threat to others.
  
   This is just another criminal who escalated a simple interaction into multiple felonies, and his own death.  

  Instead of "more training" or "police reform"...... maybe the public needs some training on resisting arrest..



   No one seems to mention, that every time the police have to use force on someone, it's because that someone resists, fights, or attacks the cops.

Quote
Under U.S. law the fleeing felon rule was limited in 1985 to non-lethal force in most cases by Tennessee v. Garner, 471 U.S. 1. The justices held that deadly force "may not be used unless necessary to prevent the escape and the officer has probable cause to believe that the suspect poses a significant threat of death or serious bodily harm to the officer or others."[2]
A police officer may not seize an unarmed, nondangerous suspect by shooting him dead...however...Where the officer has probable cause to believe that the suspect poses a threat of serious physical harm, either to the officer or to others, it is not constitutionally unreasonable to prevent escape by using deadly force.
— Justice Byron White, Tennessee v. Garner[3]
 
77  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Riots after Death of Man in Minneapolis Police Custody on: June 14, 2020, 12:04:43 PM
I guess asking someone to not drive while drunk, resist arrest, assault a police officer, steal his taser, fire the taser at the officer, is too much. The district attorney's office is going to find the shooting legally justified but the officer got fired strictly for PR.

He was shot in the back while running away. The cop's life was in no way endangered. If the shooting is found to be legally justified then it will be highlighting one of the main problems with law enforcement.

   Your problem is not with Law Enforcement, it's with the law. Every state had this thing called laws. Somewhere within it, you'll find a section detailing deadly force and when its justified to use.   Then every Police dept has something they call Policy, or SOP's, or General Orders.   That book will also details when deadly force can and can't be used by police.  
   Most of them are quite similar from department to department, state to state.  If if you ever read one of these books, you'll find a phrase called "fleeing forcible felon" or "violent fleeing felon."  

    Resisting arrest is a felony.   Assaulting cops is a felony.  Disarming an Officer is a felony. Stealing an officer's taser is a felony. Pointing the stolen taser at an officer is a felony. Firing a taser at an Officer is a felony.  
    Assaulting officers is violence.  The fleeing felon has demonstrated he is quite capable of being a deadly threat to others.
  
   This is just another criminal who escalated a simple interaction into multiple felonies, and his own death.  

  Instead of "more training" or "police reform"...... maybe the public needs some training on resisting arrest..



   No one seems to mention, that every time the police have to use force on someone, it's because that someone resists, fights, or attacks the cops.

Quote
Under U.S. law the fleeing felon rule was limited in 1985 to non-lethal force in most cases by Tennessee v. Garner, 471 U.S. 1. The justices held that deadly force "may not be used unless necessary to prevent the escape and the officer has probable cause to believe that the suspect poses a significant threat of death or serious bodily harm to the officer or others."[2]
A police officer may not seize an unarmed, nondangerous suspect by shooting him dead...however...Where the officer has probable cause to believe that the suspect poses a threat of serious physical harm, either to the officer or to others, it is not constitutionally unreasonable to prevent escape by using deadly force.
— Justice Byron White, Tennessee v. Garner[3]
 
78  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Riots after Death of Man in Minneapolis Police Custody on: June 12, 2020, 10:01:49 PM

Are your kids more likely or less likely to be successful because they have a father that was able to send them to college?

Will their children (your grandchildren) be more or less likely to be successful because of you?

See where I'm going here?


Yep.  I see that you are TRYING to claim any success for my hard work is based on my race.  And you will be proven dead wrong.

I didn't grow up wealthy, we didn't have luxuries.
But I did join the military.....which just about anyone can, regardless of race. And as a matter of fact, my time in the military, working side-by-side with blacks, Asians, Hispanics, etc... was a great experience of true equality. So here we are on a ship,.... our own group of humans, every race, from every US region, all working together for a common goal, while learning discipline, respect, and a code of conduct. All equals, with equal opportunity. We all got paid on the same scale...., yeah, even the females,.... and we all had the SAME opportunities. Some rose to the top, and some stagnated. But it was never due to their race, it was due to their effort.
    Then I got into Law Enforcement 2 decades ago, everyone had equal opportunity to test for the job. Everyone, of all races have the exact same opportunity. And everyone I work with (of all races) has he same opportunity to earn extra pay by working overtime. Some do it, and some don't.  Some excel, some dont. And the difference between the two is effort, not race.

  The route I took, is available to EVERYONE !

And rather than paying my kids way to an elective education they wanted, I made them responsible for the majority of the financial aspect, but I do hold the safety net for them.
79  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Riots after Death of Man in Minneapolis Police Custody on: June 12, 2020, 08:38:55 PM

Hey PopoJeff, you know this guy claims to be a professor? How scary is that? You aren't qualified to be a professor at clown college.

It does not surprise me one bit.  There's a reason colleges and universities are referred to as "liberal indoctrination centers."

Fortunately, I skipped the college route and went military instead, entering the USN nuclear engineering program. I was able to travel the world for several years of my life and get a true representation of global society.  The poorest Americans have NO IDEA how good they have it.

The military training and experience offered me the opportunity to get a 6 figure salary afterwards, and I put forth enough effort in OT to send my kids to college. (Not white privilege, but effort that can be achieved by any race)    But my kids were warned about the liberal youth groupthink that is prominent at college. They've all remained level headed and discuss with me, the feelings vs facts problem they see at school. Too many youth are influenced by feelings and have a sheltered view of overall society.
80  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Riots after Death of Man in Minneapolis Police Custody on: June 12, 2020, 08:04:16 PM
Here's an interesting perspective, if your are open-minded enough to look at something from somewhere other than a pre-conceived opinion.


Does America have a “racist cop” problem?

It’s easy to believe so when watching the disturbing videos of the deaths of George Floyd, Eric Garner and Tamir Rice at the hands of the police. But do horrific, high-profile cases like these accurately reflect the treatment of black Americans by the police?

Many observers say no.

Since 2015, The Washington Post has maintained a comprehensive database of fatal police shootings. The Post database shows that fatal shootings by police have run steadily at around 1,000 per year since 2015: 995 (2015); 963 (2016); 987 (2017); 998 (2018); and 1,004 (2019).

About twice as many white people as black people are killed by police. “In fact, in about 75 percent of police shootings, the decedent is not black,” says Andrew McCarthy, a columnist with the National Review.

“This pandemic of civil violence is more widespread than anything seen during the Black Lives Matter movement of the Obama years, and it will likely have an even deadlier toll on law enforcement officers than the targeted assassinations we saw from 2014 onward,” McCarthy wrote. “It’s worse this time because the country has absorbed another five years of academically inspired racial victimology.”

While the current national narrative is that black Americans are, as some Black Lives Matter advocates claim, being “targeted” by police, Rafael Mangual, deputy director of legal policy at the Manhattan Institute, says that view is backward.

“It is certainly fair to say that police have had a target on their backs for some time,” he told InsideSources.

I believe the number is that police officers are eighteen and a half times more likely to be killed by black males than unarmed black males are to be killed by police officers,” he said. “And studies have shown that the odds of a black man being killed in police custody are about one in 1,000.

https://www.houmatoday.com/opinion/20200610/opinion-black-lives-matter-rhetoric-doesnt-match-facts-on-police-violence



So, is it the police that need the ambiguous talking point "more training" ?    Or does society need "more training"?   A simple 20 min PowerPoint presentation in free public school about law? A very simple understanding of.... don't fight police, attack police, or resist arrest, and your odds of being hurt by police are less than being struck by lightning.
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