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1  Bitcoin / Mining / Re: Merged mining now live on: October 13, 2011, 06:03:03 AM

Pools can't have their cake and eat it too.  They can't use language which indicates a "fair split" and then perform an unfair split.

I completely agree and have never said otherwise.  If a pool says that it is giving you a "fair split" and then gives you an "unfair split" then they are cheating or incompetent (my problem with some of the proportional pools).  If they simply imply that the deal is fair but, when read carefully, it is not specifically state to be fair then it is dishonest or incompetent in my opinion (just like most advertising put out by large companies these days).  I'm much more interested in hearing what people think about a pool which explicitly states "We pay x BTC per share you submit" and nothing more.  Do you believe that they are guilty of fraud if and only if they use those shares to generate namecoins?  Is it really any business of the miner what the pool does with the hashes they have accumulated if there has been no agreement about what can and cannot be done with the hashes?


Principally, I believe omitting details in an advertisement that are directly related to your inputs (hidden fees, contracts etc, merged-mining etc) is not appropriate.
If it directly concerns you or your inputs, you should be informed.

I don't believe a hash has to be intellectual property for you to claim responsibility of that hash generation.
You cannot own a hash, a hash is an array of alphanumeric characters. You can however claim responsibility for submitting a generated hash to a pool.
If you claim responsibility of the hash you submitted that becomes your input.

Therefore, if you agree the above statements, we can logically conclude that you should be fully informed about how your inputs (claim of hash generation == work), are being used by the pool.

Remember, Bitcoin implements a Proof-Of-Work system for coin generation.
Only once you are fully aware of how your work is being utilized, can you then determine for yourself, what a 'fair split' is.

2  Bitcoin / Mining / Re: Did the MysteryMiner (MM) keep his coins? on: October 13, 2011, 05:25:51 AM
Quote from: MysteryMiner
Quote from: Confucius
Quote from: MysteryMiner
DDoS, packers/crypters, proxy servers and other stuff for bitcoins. PM me!
Send some of your bitcoins to me now before I do it myself! 1Aiq9FYv12GQjM9LeBHoNq9c3FfFaA4GTA

Nice Signature.
Thanks! Don't know why there was no single user on this forum interested in this stuff. Maybe some think it's scam or trap. I don't care.

Err not exactly meant as a compliment.

I get that DDoS is like 'protesting' on the internet, however I generally classify people that offer such services as shady, regardless of their intentions.
And no matter how I re-read your second statement, it sounds like a crude joke about a double spend attack.

What exactly does it mean? Has your DDoS services ever been used for what we would both consider immoral intent (e.g Bot-net taking down competitions website, compared to protesting taking down a child porn site)?
3  Bitcoin / Mining / Re: Did the MysteryMiner (MM) keep his coins? on: October 12, 2011, 08:10:09 AM
DDoS, packers/crypters, proxy servers and other stuff for bitcoins. PM me!
Send some of your bitcoins to me now before I do it myself! 1Aiq9FYv12GQjM9LeBHoNq9c3FfFaA4GTA

Nice Signature.
4  Bitcoin / Mining / Re: Merged mining now live on: October 12, 2011, 08:01:22 AM
If Pool X displays they are a BTC pool, then I can submit shares to that pool for BTC. However if that pool *doesn't* display that they are merged mining, that means Pool X Op is taking the shares I paid for (with electricity) and secretly profiting.

You're right. I would consider that unfair, under some circumstances. However both circumstances a still unethical (advertising)

If I saw no purpose to owning an alternative coin, yet they could get those coins as a side-effect of me looking for BTC, and the pool did not advertise this, they can have the shit that I produce, so to speak.   - This is a fair scenario. Unethical advertisement practices however

If however, for any reason I thought it might be worth just keeping the alternative coins (e.g. for some crazy reason other people want alternative coins, you have them. use/sell them. ), yet the pool I was mining at didn't advertise they were keeping the coins I found as a side-effect of looking for BTC, I WOULD BE MAD - unfair, unethical

If you would discard all but certain outputs from your inputs, why be so greedy to not let others take which you do not want?

Meaning, from your input of hashing power, you only want BTC and would discard any other coins. Why be so greedy to not let others have the alternative coins you would discard?

You may have to be brutally honest about your perception of alternative coins values. Are they really worthless? Worth discarding? If they exist and other people want them, perhaps I want them just to sell/use them?

But yes I have not challenged the idea that its unethical advertisement/operations however you put it.
Unfair, to me, in this circumstance is different.

Thinking really critically, if I wanted the alternative coins just for the purpose of discarding/deleting them, and the pool I mined at did not advertise I was also hashing for these alternative coins, it would be unfair. But is it? The only reason I want them is to discard them?

5  Bitcoin / Wallet software / Re: Bitcoin-Qt, the future Bitcoin client GUI [user input needed] on: September 14, 2011, 09:30:28 AM
Things like setting the color of palette or transparency of the background are not very important in a financial app, and making them options is overkill and only complicates the application logic.

It should either be implemented correctly, and readable for everyone on every kind of PC by default (including those with crappy old gfx cards), or not in there at all.

Upon second thought, your absolutely right. Then again it is a GUI wrapper so...

Maybe, one day when I get of my lazy ass, I could branch my own with the pretty features I like =)
6  Bitcoin / Wallet software / Re: Bitcoin-Qt, the future Bitcoin client GUI [user input needed] on: September 13, 2011, 04:34:53 AM
Having the transparency effect as an option would be the best solution.

Agreed, though I should add I think the option should be to turn it off, i.e. defaulting to on.

Furthermore, a color pallet for choosing the color of transparency would be really cool! Of course it would be extremely low on the priority list.
7  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Help translating Bitcoin Wallet for Android on: August 14, 2011, 03:18:38 AM
I will gladly translate this to Australian =D
8  Other / Meta / Re: Well this sucks so far! on: August 01, 2011, 05:38:34 AM
I was going to post a similar topic in the Meta board. However my skin returned to normal upon previewing my post. Perhaps you should delete this now seeing as its in the wrong section and pretty pointless?
9  Economy / Economics / Re: The world of fractions on: July 15, 2011, 04:14:43 AM
The standard client is open source software. Just add a setting to display amounts in Bitcoins, Millies, Mikes or Satoshis.

If you're not a programmer, start up a bounty for a programmer to do this.

There's no possibility to change the definition of what "one Bitcoin" means. You can't have one name meaning different measurements. But using sub-units instead of the largest unit is unproblematic. Go for it!

I am a programmer and I could change it.  However this is not a coding issue in the slightest.  It is a community issue.  We need a consensus.  We all need to switch at once.  MtGox and TradeHill need to switch.  Bitcoin.org will need to switch.  The vendors would need to switch.  In order for that to happen we all need to agree.  That is what I am trying to do.  I am trying to convince you.

It is entirely possible to change the definition of "one Bitcoin".  Mexico did it with the peso.  The chopped three decimal points off in a country of millions of people, many of whom live in remote areas and/or are poorly educated.  The bitcoin community is small and well-connected.  If we all agree to do it there would be no problem.

Perhaps the best that I can hope for is to get everything listed in bitcents and drop the notion of bitcoins.

It's as simple as changing the front-end GUI. This could of course confuse people if they use different versions of the client and see different amounts of BTCS. But if it bothers you that much make the change and distribute it either in the GUI or by changing the protocol (if your mad).

For example -
                    Previous balance:         5.24813 BTC
                    New balance:               524 Satoshi's 813 MSA
10  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: How the banks will own BitcoinŽ on: July 11, 2011, 11:12:00 AM
This "Bank" is using Bitcoins.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_Standard_Bank

Quote
Global Standard Bank, is an internet business that uses Bitcoin the new cryptocurrency as its base currency.


Does anyone use this?

According to this it is a scam. Do not use.
11  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Bitcoin is backwards and that makes if beautiful on: July 11, 2011, 10:56:01 AM
Although I'm not entirely educated in the workings of Bitcoin yet, I'd like to throw out there the possibility of each new version of the official Bitcoin client containing most of the block history, up to the point of release. Or would that be rather large?

Either way, I think we can all agree that something should happen to remove the inconvenience that comes with a currency like this.

From Satoshi -
Quote
We have the hashes for genesis block through block 74000 hardcoded (compiled) into bitcoin, so there's no reason why we shouldn't be able to automatically download a compressed zipfile of the block database from anywhere, unpack it, verify it, and start running.
The 74000 checkpoint is not enough to protect you, and does nothing if the download is already past 74000.  -checkblocks does more, but is still easily defeated.  You still must trust the supplier of the zipfile.

If there was a "verify it" step, that would take as long as the current normal initial download, in which it is the indexing, not the data download, that is the bottleneck.

Presumably at some point there will be a lightweight client that only downloads block headers, but there will still be hundreds of thousands of those...
80 bytes per header and no indexing work.  Might take 1 minute.

Quote
uncompressed data using a protocol (bitcoin P2P) that wasn't designed for bulk data transfer.
The data is mostly hashes and keys and signatures that are uncompressible.

The speed of initial download is not a reflection of the bulk data transfer rate of the protocol.  The gating factor is the indexing while it downloads.

As you can see, that idea has been considered, but discarded for above reasons.
12  Economy / Economics / Re: Do you hate the State? on: July 11, 2011, 08:52:40 AM

Dang, she got 1.09 BTC donations to the BTC address she advertised on YouTube just for being hot!

Bitcoins == Easiest way ever invented for babes to take monetary compliments from across the world
13  Economy / Economics / Re: If the bitcoin limit is reached. on: July 11, 2011, 04:31:29 AM
Until every single transaction becomes virtual, not every single currency will be virtual.
14  Economy / Trading Discussion / Re: Bitcoin traders, why don't you just trade forex? on: July 11, 2011, 04:27:12 AM
Finally, you can't have expectations of entrepreneurs in a new market to have bureaucratic certifications and be following non-existent regulations.

How do you propose an exchange should be set up for the Bitcoin market?
I aboslutely can, because every other legitimate start up business does it.  If the new pizza place down the road from me can begin business in full complance with the law, so can a Bitcoin exchange.  They can collect the proper information from traders, just like a real exchange.  They can submit to regulatory bodies and follow all national laws (using an off-shore bsaed currency trading account is NOT legal for US citizens, for starters).  You know, all that good stuff that every other legit brokerage and exchange goes through.  Real businesses that people plan on sustaining and growing dot all their i's and cross all their t's FIRST.  No one just wings and hopes for the best, unless it's because they plan to be a fly by night scam shop.

MtGox is processing millions of dollars per day, but the website looks like it was made by a five year old, they have no real contact information, they aren't a registered business, they are not in compliance with local or international laws (have fun when your funds are seized and never returned), and there's absolutely zero transparency.

Valid Points.
However, Mt Gox is not the only exchange in existence - point being that people who outweigh benefits over risk of using said exchange, will make do with the time being, and adopt when appropriate.
A pizza place is well established market segment, but Bitcoins are a grey area with Zero, 0, Null, bureaucratic regulations and certifications, in relation to Bitcoin oriented businesses.
Which (current) regulatory body will acknowledge a business that exchanges fiat monies for BTC as a legit exchange?
It is true that they can still be in compliance with all laws, on the other hand, they may have their own agenda for not doing so.

Laws are there to protect you, can you not protect yourself?
You may think this is a bold statement, but it is entirely possible for sensitive activity to occur between trusted parties, without regards to law. I can buy dope from my friend safely and easily even though it illegal.
How does this apply? People who take the time to evaluate the risk, examine their own trust towards who they are trading.
Some, like yourself, who wish for all the walls and thorns to be up already will have to wait for slow bureaucracy to catch up. Others enjoy a web of trust.

Some do wing it and hope for the best. Either way, Mt Gox is not the only exchange, the majority have chosen to use that one, even if its sheep mentality, ignorance to risks, or whatever. It is the reality and to comprehend it you will not succeed by putting forward proposals why it shouldn't be that way.

If you expect for there to be a safety net, you have the up most right. However, you will have to wait for an exchange that wants to be in full compliance with the law, and slow bureaucracy to catch up.
Look for another exchange such as Tradehill, and find out if they are violating some law. If you find they are, why? Surely they have their own reasons, same with Mt Gox. You may conclude scamming but maybe its protection from conflicting laws etc. If there are no good reasons why an exchange might be avoiding certain laws, I'm sure their will be entrepreneurs to start new exchanges that do.

There is definitely room for improvement for a lot of aspects of the exchanges, however that will come with time.

I'm not going to argue if they can do it better, that will be solved by competition.
I was simply stating they can't follow non-existent regulations and certifications in regards to a Bitcoin oriented business.

Also, if its so illegal, why hasn't it been shutdown?
15  Economy / Economics / Re: can bitcoin solve all social and political issues? on: July 11, 2011, 03:37:14 AM
Hello everyone, this is my first post out of the newbies section!
Welcome Smiley

So, which is the particular characteristic of Bitcoin, so different from the current physical moneys the society uses will make it fail in the long term?
  • Selfish people in power (NOT all powerful people), create resistance. Bitcoin is most susceptible to social attacks.
  • The arms race of security between cracking Bitcoin and securing it. I've heard this mentioned little on the forums. It can be enhanced with stronger algorithms, but every single digital device has the potential to be cracked/hacked, contrary to what you may think. There are known vulnerabilities to Bitcoin.
  • Unknown social reason
  • Disruptive technologies that may may pose a threat/opportunity to Bitcoin.

etc.
Basic two categories are social and technical, with many scenarios in each one.
I am very eager to see Bitcoin succeed, however, for that, all issues should get attention.

I do believe that Bitcoin is very secure, robust and sound, but I'm simply stating there are those that seek to dismantle it. It may be an easy race, but its a race non-the-less.

The last point of disruptive technologies could be a big one, however, we can't see the future.
 
Failing to solve all social and political problems and provide enduring world peace?
Out of scope.
16  Economy / Economics / Re: Bitcoin parity: what is a bitcoin worth? on: July 11, 2011, 02:45:39 AM
5g Weed Tongue

17  Economy / Economics / Re: Do you hate the State? on: July 11, 2011, 02:37:46 AM
"The state" is a bit too vague for me. I'll say simply that I hate democracy and all other forms of collectivism.

:O

What do you like?
18  Economy / Economics / Re: If the bitcoin limit is reached. on: July 11, 2011, 02:35:20 AM
Demand is the single factor which constitutes the price per BTC.

It is true that various traits of our cryptocurrency such as transportability, divisibility, homogeneity, scarcity and others, are factors that stimulate demand, but demand is the father of price.
There are also other external factors that play with demand, however those can only be speculated as to how much they impact.

Once the limit is capped, if everyone is using BTC there will be extremely high demand, thus each should be worth a lot.
Perhaps, 1+ Billion people / 21M BTC == a generous amount.

In-case anyone is worried, divisibility along with decimal shifting, solve the problem of: people > BTC

By then, you would be better of valuing your BTC in its native form, rather than 'so if I convert to USD, pay fees, buy-online with CC, extra fees' and so on.
19  Economy / Economics / Re: Wealth is unlimited. on: July 11, 2011, 02:17:02 AM
What about when we reach The Singularity? When technology advances at an exponentially infinite speed that it moves too fast for humans (without genetic modification) to comprehend.
Indeed, this would be a time where there would be more than enough abundance for every being to potentially be as wealthy as the next - No pie, unlimited wealth.

As stated, wealth is subjective.

Humans simply do not understand enough of the universe to conclude what is limited and what is not.
Imagine if you will, parallel universes. Or just about any other theorized possibilities, that work in our favor.  
The more we know, the more we realize how much we don't know

Literally, entire novels could/have(?) been written by philosophers on the subject of wealth.
20  Economy / Trading Discussion / Re: Bitcoin traders, why don't you just trade forex? on: July 10, 2011, 10:31:21 PM
There are methods to build trust between parties.

Because Mt Gox is only made of a few, we can know who they are relatively easily. They are not anonymous.

Yes they could still screw us quite easily, but you can avoid disaster if you follow a few rules -
  • Don't put all you eggs in one basket (Don't trade only BTC, use several exchanges ?)
  • Building trust progressively is your best bet

Which brings me to the point of the OP, people quite possibly are trading both, and there are many reasons why one would trade BTC.
I don't see at all why its so mind-blowing, you don't necessarily have to invest your life savings?

Finally, you can't have expectations of entrepreneurs in a new market to have bureaucratic certifications and be following non-existent regulations.

How do you propose an exchange should be set up for the Bitcoin market?
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