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681  Economy / Economics / Re: Deflation and Bitcoin, the last word on this forum on: October 06, 2012, 11:20:04 PM
Value of things are relative to each other.

Wow I have never considered this before, even though I said exactly as much in my post. But you have blown my mind, nonethless.

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And free lunch is good thing. It is better than keeping food in supermarket shelves and throwing it out when the time expires.

Someone posting on a bitcoin forum having no concept of social cost and associates "free lunch" with food? Color me surprised.
682  Economy / Economics / Re: Deflation and Bitcoin, the last word on this forum on: October 06, 2012, 10:02:17 PM
Would You like something that gains value as time goes by or loses value with time? Take away bullshit of capitalistic thinking and it is obvious that money (not only bitcoins) must be deflationary.

Take away the bullshit of capitalistic thinking and it is obvious that money should be neutral. Anything that gains value can only gain value relative to other things, meaning those other things have lost value compared to it. There's No Such Thing As A Free Lunch.
683  Economy / Economics / Re: Grand Unified Monetary Theory on: October 06, 2012, 09:21:33 PM
Having "intrinsic" value (which basically just implies that money is a commodity rather than fiat) was another one of the "prices" we had to pay to eliminate counter-party risk, but Bitcoin manages to eliminate it without paying that price.

The intrinsic value of gold doesn't "cost" you anything to use it as currency, it's included in the value in trade. If you want to talk about the cost of mining it, you can hardly disassociate that from bitcoin. And if you imply government is a counter-party to every transaction with fiat, surely the "early adopters" are as well.
684  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Why are people scared of taxes? on: October 06, 2012, 03:08:09 PM
Taxes are no more a great thing than a band of thieves robbing a whole village and then using some of the loot to pay for a homeless family's dinner and shelter. It's still theft and it's still wrong.

Hey bro I'm sure there are a couple countries in Africa with no taxation. Have fun, you won't be missed.
685  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Does the Bitcoin Foundation seek the taxability of bitcoins? on: October 06, 2012, 02:01:55 PM
what, they going to search every piece of mail to make sure it is not part of a transaction?  What kind of world are we building?

Are you under the impression that most commerce is done by mail? What does this have to do with sales tax?
686  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Does the Bitcoin Foundation seek the taxability of bitcoins? on: October 06, 2012, 01:11:58 PM
There isn't anything that the bitcoin foundation can do about it. If bitcoin became a powerful force, or cryptocurrencies in general, it would probably encourage governments to bring in taxes via sales tax rather than income tax.
687  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Potential obstacles for mass adoption of BTC on: October 06, 2012, 12:57:07 PM
Blockchain is the core of Bitcoin. Everything that doesn't rely on the blockchain is perversion of Satoshi's idea.

except that he mentions the simplified payment verification idea in the whitepaper
688  Economy / Economics / Re: Dollar slowly collapsing on: October 05, 2012, 05:59:41 PM
Credit money, when paid back, disappears until a bank decides to create a new loan. There is nothing to loan until the bank decides to loan. If banks, as a whole, decide to reduce the amount of credit money in circulation, yes there will be bankruptcies and such, but there should also be deflation and things will eventually work itself out if the central bank does not intervene. Interest has very little to do with the situation. Loaning money into circulation puts money in circulation. It doesn't matter how it got there as long as it's circulating. And interest can go on indefinitely without printing money as long as the employees/shareholders of the bank spend money at some point, but this is true for anyone who comes into possession of money.
689  Economy / Economics / Re: Dollar slowly collapsing on: October 05, 2012, 04:07:37 PM
Right, and when they do that, there is not enough money to pay the interest that is due

Again, not strictly true. The same dollar can pay off multiple debts as long as it is spent back into circulation.
690  Economy / Economics / Re: Dollar slowly collapsing on: October 05, 2012, 03:49:21 PM
Except savings and CDs have been neutered to the point that they only way for repaid debt to reenter circulation is for it to be lent out again.

This is not strictly true in any sense. Banks have employees and shareholders that get paid via the interest returns on loans. Although some people believe if all debts were paid there would be no money, this is not true. There are two types of money, base money and credit money. Base money is what the fed "prints" into its computer, credit money is what banks create. Base money can't disappear.

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Unless something changes, you do need more printing to pay down the total debt.

Paying down the (national) debt means private citizens hold more money and less securities. To pay for the securities you need money to start with. You do not need to print more money. The Fed does "print" money to buy securities and holds a significant portion of them, but this is not a necessary thing with a balanced budget.

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Banks hold tight to their money these days.

This is the problem of credit money. Banks have all the power, and they can shrink the effective supply of money very easily.
691  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: TEDx: Bitcoin, seasteading, and 3D printing: How technology moves society on: October 05, 2012, 02:57:50 PM
But "it" is singular. So it should be: "...but it wasn't new laws that stopped its acceleration".

Great talk!

But "it" is an ambiguous pronoun (in this case) that is introducing a new clause. It is a very unusual construction for english, and the proper word would be "there". You wouldn't say "they weren't new laws" in the sentence, yet the pluralization is correct. "It wasn't new laws" would be idiomatic at best, but most likely just as wrong, imo.

[/grammar nazi]
692  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: TEDx: Bitcoin, seasteading, and 3D printing: How technology moves society on: October 05, 2012, 02:25:07 PM
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Scientists argued for 150 years that politicians needed to stop population growth, but it weren't new laws that stopped its acceleration.

I don't know whether you can edit the description, but "weren't" is plural.

So is "laws". Wink
693  Economy / Economics / Re: Dollar slowly collapsing on: October 05, 2012, 02:21:39 PM
deflation kills the economy ONLY with debt currencies (which all "mainstream" currencies are) - because you always need more money to pay off the debt, and that has to be "printed" - so the system can ONLY be kept going with a certain rate of inflation

You don't always need more money to pay off the debt, you need to ensure that the currency circulates. The worry is that even a small amount of deflation can lead to a cycle of reduced spending, more deflation, job losses, etc. This isn't magically solved by a non-debt based currency. The debt has very little correlation to the inflation rate. This can be easily seen by historical inflation rates and historical debt rates. Either government raises taxes to spend or government sells securities to spend (debt), either way the government is spending and the effects are similar.

Inflation is caused on purpose by the Fed and what it charges for credit. It does this to avoid deflation, no more, no less. Unfortunately the way it does this is by gifting banks at the theft of the people.
694  Economy / Economics / Re: Grand Unified Monetary Theory on: October 05, 2012, 11:10:38 AM
No offense benjamin, but your post does reek of shoehorning bitcoin sound bytes into the "grand unified theory". Like, for example, the concept of intrinsic value is dubious enough as it is, then you somehow manage to attribute this value arising from a viable attack on the network.
695  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: Qubic - Quorum-Based Coin on: October 04, 2012, 09:41:07 PM
should probably repost your conspiracy theory thread on your forum since it got deleted here.

I'm kinda surprised whoever did that did it, it only fuels the fire imo
696  Other / Off-topic / Re: The beginning of the end? on: October 04, 2012, 09:17:22 PM
I guess I am. Haven't bothered reading anything about it. This isn't the debit card thing from bitinstant? whatevs
697  Other / Off-topic / Re: The beginning of the end? on: October 04, 2012, 09:09:22 PM
I'm talking about Bitcoincard. With unaccessible proprietary software inside the chip.

It's a debit card bro...

Besides pointing out that voorhees lies about bitcoin's features constantly, you have uncovered nothing that I can see.
698  Other / Off-topic / Re: Membergroups; or: Why do some users get colored coins under their names? on: October 04, 2012, 08:00:55 AM
Je comprends, mais il y a des personnes qui préfèrent l'option plus juste.

"il" can mean "he" (masc), "it" (masc), or "there" (neutral), and it most definitely means "there" in this case and has nothing to do with masculine/feminine pronouns. Ils sont would be sexist in a group of mixed company, if something like that actually bothers people.
699  Other / Off-topic / Re: Basic encryption questions on: October 04, 2012, 07:45:20 AM
If I encode a message with an RSA public key and then transmit it over a completely insecure network, is it possible for an attacker to see that the receiver (known by the public key) received a message?

Is the answer different for ECDSA? Is it different for other public key algorithms?

ECDSA cannot be used to encrypt a message, unlike RSA it is only a digital signature algorithm. Assuming the messaging protocol provides the information of who the message recipient is, then yes they could tell that someone received a message. However, if it is a protocol that makes you check every message to see if it's meant for you, then no, they could not (at least, I don't believe so, but I suppose it is possible that some of the public key encryption schemes could allow you to tell whether or not a message is intended for a certain public key, I am not totally sure on this one).

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I remember reading something about ECC having a property where one could extract the public key from some other piece of information efficiently and that Satoshi wasn't aware of this property. Could someone remind me of this property?

The public key can be extracted from a signature.

It is a problem because it would reveal the public key of the recipient to the public which would reveal that the receiver received a message.

Public key cryptography is not intended to address this.
700  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: "All cryptography is breakable" criticism on: October 03, 2012, 05:33:04 AM
I apologize if this has been asked here already and I missed it (it seems obvious) - are there recent examples of cryptographic algorithms being broken in a sudden, catastrophic fashion? I see it much more likely that a "weakness" is published first, thus giving everyone some time to migrate to a new signature algo and send their coins to the new system. How hard would it be technically to enable spending of "old" ECDSA coins into the network based on a different signing algorithm?

Catastrophic failures are not at all common (if ever) for well-tested algorithms. Speculative ones get busted with some regularity. Old ECDSA coins would need to be spent to a new address that is either a new public key or a new hash from a new public key. According to what I've read, this can be done without a hard fork, but unless all miners are upgraded the network will fork, at least temporarily.
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