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81  Economy / Economics / Re: The Problem With Altcoins on: November 09, 2013, 01:52:18 AM
The timing attacks research has been done by numerous different researchers from numerous prestigious universities and numerous confirmations. It is all peer reviewed. Go read the research papers so you are not ignorant on this.

AnonyMint, I am not going to write a whitepaper whenever I need to make an argument for you. This has already taken up way too much time. First you imply that there is some ulterior motive behind disliking your anonymizing design with your loaded question, then jump to the conclusion that I am uneducated about timing attacks based on a jab at your resort to appealing to authority.

A P2P transaction network interfacing with tor is *not* the same as your typical (lol what?) tor user scenario. No, I'm not going to hold your hand until you understand the implications of this.

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Even if you don't believe there is much risk, why not protect yourself and be sure?

Because *I* have a much more idealistic outlook on life-after-cryptocurrency (NB: It is insanely unfortunate that the first had to be designed like Bitcoin). You can think the way you do, but the problem with that is that it doesn't matter what gidget you come up with to anonymize the network, shit is going to hit the mother f***ing fan. There is no winning here.

If you sacrifice liberty for security... (do I need to finish this sentence or is the ellipsis enough?) Liberty being very loosely defined as the utility and accessibility of the network. Cheap, fast, scalable are properties that are of paramount importance to anonymity. And IF you can find a way to increase anonymity via increasing difficulty/cost with little affect on those who do not want it or need it, then you allow a happy medium between both needs and, imo, have the best chance of achieving what I think is roughly the same goal between us.
82  Economy / Economics / Re: The Problem With Altcoins on: November 09, 2013, 12:39:01 AM
That is not acceptable in technical debate. Refute with technical argument.

You mean like "well bruce schneier sez!!!"?

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Did you fail to read what I wrote upthread? That I don't want to have to prove that some criminal who used my coin before or after I held it, was not me or not involved with me somehow

Sorry, but this fails the smell test. It is a manufactured argument for pushing an agenda. Crypto accounts can't be frozen, and they are difficult and sometimes impossible to confiscate (lol let's raid EVERYBODY!!), let alone prove that you are in possession of them.
83  Economy / Economics / Re: The Problem With Altcoins on: November 09, 2013, 12:07:03 AM
Incorrect. For a timing attack, they only need to see the traffic passing between each node in the Tor network.

You do not have a grasp on the situation here. I'll leave it at that.

Hmmm. Etlase2 why are you are arguing against improvement of the anonymity?

Hmmm. AnonyMint, why are you so scared? May I imply that you are a criminal in various ways?

PS - For crying out loud, stop editing your posts.
84  Economy / Economics / Re: The Problem With Altcoins on: November 08, 2013, 11:43:11 PM
The data goes on a public ledger. It is decrypted.

And the gigantic point that you miss is that the originator of the transaction is lost in the noise. With basic protocol encryption, the NSA would have to not only be watching your connection, but they would have to BE every peer you are connected to on the "clear net" so that they can isolate the incoming tx that you see and retransmit, then they would have to control a vast majority of every bridge or relay in the tor network to ensure that they control each hop you use (which is astronomically unlikely if the client acts as a tor bridge--unless the NSA is the only one using it, you're fairly safe).

What in the ever loving fuck are they going to do? Control every bit of data, crunch all the numbers and put it in a tidy box for the IRS to examine and send a tax bill? What happens if people start opening up their wireless connections for transactions? What happens if KimDotCom (or insert random person with wealth and anti-establishment values) creates a tor hidden service and says "send me your tx, I will forward them on"? They will now need to control every piece of tor infrastructure and his service.

The NSA does not have the ability to suppress this or do whatever it is you've gotten into your mind that they can do. Not without destroying the internet, the tool they have fallen so deeply in love with.
85  Economy / Economics / Re: The Problem With Altcoins on: November 08, 2013, 11:17:48 PM
Also some people has thought the Tor relays are honeypots. How can you prove they are not! You can't. Who is paying to give away all those free servers and bandwidth?

SO WHAT? The relays do not know what the data is!
86  Economy / Economics / Re: The Problem With Altcoins on: November 08, 2013, 11:17:12 PM
You don't understand that all low-latency networks are vulnerable to timing attacks if the attacker can see the traffic between each peer on the network. They don't need to decrypt the traffic, they just need to see the timing. This is well proven in research papers that have analyzed Tor. Tor even admits this.

And this is completely irrelevant in the case of a distributed shared file. No one is trying to hide anything except for a tiny little portion that they do not want attributed to them. They DO need to be able to decrypt the traffic if they want to know what transaction originated from where.

Tor is perfectly acceptable for anonymizing transactions. Why you don't see this is beyond me. And the trade-off for high latency is an unusable network for commerce, at least of the face to face variety. In that case, only criminals are likely to use such a system making the target much juicier.
87  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Messaging layer built into the protocol on: November 08, 2013, 10:52:34 PM
There are of course other issues to consider with regards to messaging, such as how to prevent spam (tx fees seem like the most obvious answer, but will people be willing to pay even trivial fees just to sign a transaction?).

This is the rub. You are either forcing lots of people who don't care about the data to receive it, or you are forcing lots of people who don't care about the data to receive it and those who do pay a tx fee. These are things better tackled outside of the primary network, imo.
88  Economy / Economics / Re: The Problem With Altcoins on: November 08, 2013, 10:35:45 PM
I highly doubt the NSA hasn't been able to crack Tor given it is well documented that a global adversary can in theory crack every low-latency mix-net using timing analysis. And Tor only uses 3 hops.

I still don't get your view on this. Even if they somehow manage to have such a massive amount of control over Tor that they can determine where a packet of data originated on the tor network, it does not prove or even imply that the transaction belongs to the originating connection. That is a preposterous presumption to make of a distributed shared file. Hell, I could imagine that even if the NSA was watching every local connection for everyone, this would be easily defeated by pseudo/fake Tor peers that occasionally feed each other nonsense data. How are they going to prove it? "We control every single node and we know that that isn't one of them?" That could be foiled by occasionally sending real data among the nonsense data.
89  Bitcoin / Project Development / Re: Momentum Proof-of-Work Bounty - 30 BTC on: November 08, 2013, 12:46:01 AM
I wonder what would happen if we used NESTED momentum proof of work? 

Change the nonce-space of the outer proof of work to a pair of 16 bit numbers that result in a X-bit collision?

Now you have a more memory intensive inner hash that is still quick to validate, but would significantly complicate GPU miners.

AnonyMint suggested this very thing but with scrypt at one point. However, I think it would have made verifying even more difficult. He would know better. He would probably also be a reasonable judge of this corollary to that idea.
90  Other / Alternate cryptocurrencies / Re: Invictus Innovations ProtoShares Cheat Sheet | CPU Mining | Unofficial on: November 07, 2013, 08:33:43 AM
Meaning there won't be sufficient return for serious miners after the initial launch period. Only the masses will bother once the masses are the majority of miners.  Wink

You are banking on the irrationality of the masses. Not necessarily a bad bet, but it is a square peg treatment again that involves wasting energy.

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That was my most clever insight.

It is less clever than giving that value away without requiring the token of wasted energy.
91  Other / Alternate cryptocurrencies / Re: Invictus Innovations ProtoShares Cheat Sheet | CPU Mining | Unofficial on: November 07, 2013, 08:21:19 AM
The point of CPU-only is the millions mass your coin can gain in the market since anyone can download and get some coin. Mass leads to network effects, which leads to competing against Bitcoin effectively, given Bitcoin only has 350,000 users.

This is not a well-thought argument. A CPU coin is likely to be dominated by expensive CPUs and/or CPU farms that are available for time purchase. Those with low-end CPUs will be forced to upgrade to remain relevant, but the simpler and perhaps more financially sound option is to purchase the currency in lieu of mining it. This is the *exact same* scenario with GPUs. And it also makes sense economically because if everyone is a miner, no one is demanding to trade fiat for it, and all value must enter the coin via burning electricity.
92  Other / Alternate cryptocurrencies / Re: Invictus Innovations ProtoShares Cheat Sheet | CPU Mining | Unofficial on: November 07, 2013, 08:01:32 AM
Any thing that is computationally intensive can be mined faster on the GPU employing 1000s of hardware threads

A GPU is a relatively general purpose device, and with GPGPU on the horizon, is it really a problem? What is the fascination with CPU only? As long as ASICs remain specific and an algorithm is easy to change, ASICs can't have an advantage over GPU/GPGPUs because they can easily become obsolete. With this algo, it is trivial to change the hashing algorithm while keeping the verification simple and general purpose devices relevant.
93  Other / Alternate cryptocurrencies / Re: Invictus Innovations ProtoShares Cheat Sheet | CPU Mining | Unofficial on: November 07, 2013, 07:45:14 AM
Note the 768MB is within L3 cache, which has much lower memory latency, so the specific case might not be as bad as a larger memory case.

When did L3 caches become 768MB?
94  Other / Alternate cryptocurrencies / Re: Invictus Innovations ProtoShares Cheat Sheet | CPU Mining | Unofficial on: November 07, 2013, 07:04:58 AM
The bounty isn't for whether or not GPUs can mine it, the bounty is for whether or not there is a non-linear speed increase available without the memory tradeoff. If GPUs end up being faster, big deal, it isn't going to be an order of magnitude faster unless you have an order of magnitude increase in the memory bandwidth or in the memory available. At least, that is the presumption by my understanding.
95  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Bitcoin distribution vs Bitcoin adoption on: November 06, 2013, 05:20:03 AM
The reason I introduced some numbers was to show that (2) is hyperbole.

I don't know if we're from different planets or if you have the blinders on for the sake bitcoin argument, but you stated under your own presumptions that 500 people now control value equal to a quarter of the world's gold supply--and you call "a small group of people having vast amounts of control" a hyperbole under this scenario? Is based on the caveat you added that they "refuse to ever sell"? Because that is pretty meaningless. Wall Street doesn't "sell" their dollars, they use them to make more dollars.

Does the dramatic draw to bitcoin essentially boil down to "you save visa/mc/forex fees"? It's fine if that is enough for you, but it most definitely does not address the topic--I would almost say it is a red herring.
96  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Bitcoin distribution vs Bitcoin adoption on: November 06, 2013, 01:12:51 AM
But lets assume wild success - Bitcoin grows to a total value of $10T (roughly gold's, or M2 in the US).  Say a quarter of the bitcoins ($2.5T worth) remain held by 500 die-hards, roughly evenly distributed, who refuse to ever sell.  As of March 2013 there were 1426 billionaires holding onto a total of $5.4T.  So Bitcoin will have grown the billionaire population by ~35%, and increased their overall net worth by just less than 50%.

Meh.  With a world GDP of ~$70T, a 2% annual savings (rough guess) on transaction fees, cash handling fees, bypassing of forex fees, lack of need for options to hedge FX risk, etc. due to Bitcoin adoption would pay this same $2.5T out to "society" in the form of savings every two years.

Argument appears to be thus:

1) Create a new monetary/banking system
2) Give a small group of people vast amounts of control
3) Huh
4) World is saved by innovative idea completely unlike FRB/fiat.

(I know you did not make the point 4 implication, but it is certainly a common theme.)
97  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Bitcoin distribution vs Bitcoin adoption on: November 05, 2013, 10:58:30 PM
And even though I do know a few private keys with unspent outputs, I'm not sure I'd like to live in world led by early adopters, even less if you're one of them. Wink

Well, you didn't get that my post was dripping with sarcasm, and in addition to that, I am designing something completely different that might just tickle the fancy of the 99%. See sig.

PS - Out of principle, I do not own any bitcoins.
98  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Is Bitcoin really broken? on: November 05, 2013, 09:52:56 PM
The forked chain will be orphaned when published.

Perhaps you should understand the attack before lambasting someone else's misunderstanding of it.
99  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Bitcoin distribution vs Bitcoin adoption on: November 05, 2013, 08:55:52 PM
Should we reset the blockchain when BTC becomes the official world currency, all join a single, worldwide, non-proportional pool?

Stop speaking nonsense, the world will gladly want to become slaves to new masters, it's the only way of life they know.
100  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: It took 10 seconds for the brainwallet "password1" to be taken on: November 03, 2013, 05:10:26 PM
You're specially unlikely to open it on page 1. The book's binding will make it more probable to open it on specific pages. All that reduces entropy.

Yes, I could have made the corollary referencing this nonsense, but alas.
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