1781
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Economy / Economics / Re: Trust/backing...
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on: July 20, 2012, 02:04:04 AM
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It's in China's better interests that their currency doesn't become more valuable than the US's. If it did, then US-based manufacturing taking place in China would move out.
That would be great for the Chinese. They could consume more and manufacture less of it themselves. That is, they would be richer. (That what is means for the currency they hold to be more valuable.) Such a pervasive and silly idea. It's like Tom Sawyer getting his friends to paint fences, but for decades.
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1783
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Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold is Bitcoin is Gold
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on: July 19, 2012, 09:03:15 PM
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Hey misc, interested in action on the BTC/gold ratio at the end of the year? We could make a straight bet on it (50BTC?) or we could do a future swap deal at the current rate (175BTC of yours for 1oz of mine?). Easiest to just settle in BTC, but I do have the ounce in case you disagree with kitco price by that time or whatever.
50 btc/oz would be my guess for a endgame price for gold. Whatever that would be in fiat would be irrelevant at this point. But that gonna take a long time. you might be underestimating BTC itself (value increase not caused by fiat inflation but bitcoin economy/investment growth)... or are you talking 2012-based BTC when you say 50 btc/oz? @miscreanity: thanks for above charts and elaboration. It is my opinion that most people in this forum underestimate gold. Not just because of the intrinsic and historical value but also because of unique physical properties. It can be used for tangible nanomoney both in virtual and physical form and it is the only element which has the property along with a single stable isotope. I own gold and think it's great. But it is already valued really really highly. There is hardly room for value growth at this point. Any major price increase will be because of a depreciating dollar. Bitcoin is so small and new that a few guys learning about it could double demand. Earth would need to spawn a new densely populated moon for that kind of demand increase in gold.
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1785
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Economy / Speculation / Re: #bitcoin IRC log: A pirate leads a flock of sheep over a cliff.
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on: July 19, 2012, 08:01:54 AM
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If what Pirate said in that log that he can bring the price down to 1$ is true, then that means he has about 300,000 BTC at his disposal.
At 6% interest this would mean he needs to buy 18,000 BTC per week, or about 2500 BTC per day.
That's a signficant portion of the newly created coins per day.
If it carries on like this that alone will drive the price up.
Not if you buy it not on an exchange. I think most trades does actually not happen on any exchange, and thus have no influence on the price. Where can you buy 18k BTC per week outside of the major exchanges? It doesn't matter, you still drive up the price because you keep those coins from going to market. Even if you find some coins that would never sell at market but will sell to you the person they'd be selling to otherwise now has to go to market. Even if that person refuses to go to market they now either gobble up some coins that would have gone to market or they push some other person who cares less into the market. It isn't clear, but it's all connected. Demand is demand.
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1786
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Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Bitcoin potential value
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on: July 19, 2012, 07:37:46 AM
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And yet the current value of bitcoin certainly isn't $53.92 USD per BTC.
Actually it is even more than that, but people are stupidly throwing them away for under ten bucks. There's just no accounting for people I guess. -MarkM- Close enough? :-)
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1787
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Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Bitcoin potential value
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on: July 19, 2012, 07:15:04 AM
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If bitcoin was used for every single trade made by every single person on the planet, the system would collapse in about 0.5 seconds... The internet would probably also collapse... We would probably need much more capacity, hard drives would be too small, processing power too slow, and we would need like a few hundred different crypto currencies... Click HereAlso, what about those that have no access to a computer or internet (or easy access) ? We'll just have to wait for them to come out I guess.
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1789
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Economy / Gambling / Re: SealsWithClubs.eu - 60BTC guarantee tournament Sunday
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on: July 19, 2012, 03:21:11 AM
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DonkDown.com is hosting a 5BTC freeroll tonight at 10:30pm ET. Get the password by listening to DonkDown.com/radio at 10pm ET.
Where is the live stream button? do I have to be registered? I tried to register with them but haven't gotten my confirmation email to click. Kinda sucks. I'd really like to pay You didn't even need to sign up, just listen. I think there were some streaming problems today, but most people did get it working. Sorry you missed it. radio.donkdown.com:8000/radio.m3u can get the stream in a player instead of browser.
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1790
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Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold is Bitcoin is Gold
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on: July 19, 2012, 02:02:11 AM
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Hey misc, interested in action on the BTC/gold ratio at the end of the year? We could make a straight bet on it (50BTC?) or we could do a future swap deal at the current rate (175BTC of yours for 1oz of mine?). Easiest to just settle in BTC, but I do have the ounce in case you disagree with kitco price by that time or whatever.
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1792
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Economy / Economics / Re: Bitcoin London Conference 2012
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on: July 18, 2012, 09:04:04 PM
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Destroy the myth of a deflationary price spiral.
Yes please do. I just ran in to an 'economist' on a bus while wearing a bitcoin shirt and had to listen to him explain that Bitcoin would fail because bitcoins would be too valuable (which would make them worthless, doh).
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1793
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Other / Beginners & Help / Re: Transaction fees higher than yesterday?
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on: July 18, 2012, 09:02:03 PM
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yesterday i wanted to make a small transaction of 0.15 BTC. the official client wanted to have 0.0025 BTC fee. i declined this.
today i just wanted to make the same transaction but now the client wants 0.003 BTC fee. how is this possible?
there have been no other transactions tomy wallet since yesterday.
Ah ha, there must have been transactions -from- your wallet since last attempt correct? You must have a wallet with a ton of small tx. When you made another tx it used up some of the (probably slightly) larger inputs and so now you need even more of those tiniest inputs to make up .15. You are using up a relatively large amount of system resources for tiny amounts so you either need to pay for it or wait a while.
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1794
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Other / Beginners & Help / Re: Transaction fees higher than yesterday?
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on: July 18, 2012, 08:58:33 PM
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yesterday i wanted to make a small transaction of 0.15 BTC. the official client wanted to have 0.0025 BTC fee. i declined this.
today i just wanted to make the same transaction but now the client wants 0.003 BTC fee. how is this possible?
there have been no other transactions to my wallet since yesterday.
Are you sure? I can't recall mine ever asking for less than .005 BTC. Don't you mean .0005?
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1795
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Other / Off-topic / Re: Bitcoin 500 richest addresses, updated often.
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on: July 18, 2012, 08:42:40 AM
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I see the address in my lost wallet Damn bitcoin needs to grow if my lost wallet is in the top 500... That's not how it works. As Bitcoin grows the nominal amount in each address will tend to flatten out and yours and other early lost addresses will become the highest. Rather depressing
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1796
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Economy / Economics / Re: The expected price of bitcoin
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on: July 18, 2012, 06:09:19 AM
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The cost to buy 51% of hashing power, halt the block chain and render all BTCs completely useless is between $1M and $10M. Thus true value of bitcoin is less than 0.51 * $10M / 9M = $0.57
The value of a thing is what it costs to destroy it? Can I have your house for a match a gallon of gasoline?
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1799
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Economy / Speculation / Re: Rally!!!!!
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on: July 18, 2012, 03:38:37 AM
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Nobody wants to sell.
the unprecedented number of withdrawal requests i got last night says different. it can't just be a coincidence that they're all withdrawing after the price goes up. i'm sure it's taken a lot of people by surprise; people that are still in the process of getting their coins into gox. Is it a difficult process? I'd read the large number of withdraws to mean that the coins are already there.
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1800
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Economy / Web Wallets / Re: Blockchain.info - Bitcoin Block explorer & Currency Statistics
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on: July 17, 2012, 09:20:59 PM
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I did this again and this time I got the bonus, but it went back to the address I sent from! That needs a warning for sure.
To be clear, only the bonus went back, the principle is landing in the destination address now.
Obviously it goes to sender because the sender is providing the bitcoins. It's only function isn't sending btc to yourself but also to others anonymously. I wouldn't say it is obvious at all considering that the first time I used it the bonus was paid to the destination address. It really doesn't make sense for the coin to go back where it came from. At the very least there needs to be a warning to not send from a web wallet. Now I see what you mean though. If I want to send 20BTC to Joe I'll accidently overpay if the bonus is included. But this isn't a good way to pay someone looking for a specific amount anyway because it gets broken up. Plus even now that the bonus is not included it doesn't equal exactly the full amount so you'll be short on any specific amount. This service (as currently set up) is for sending to yourself or to a site that doesn't care about the exact amount, deposit to poker site etc.
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