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4441  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: CoinTerra announces its first ASIC - Hash-Rate greater than 500 GH/s on: September 12, 2013, 03:25:32 PM
It not so much that,as the offerings are 400GH +,give us a 100GH miner or even,dare I say it a 50GH miner.So us little folk can get in for a reasonable price range  Roll Eyes

Bitfury sells naked boards.  You can use your own pi and connect as many boards as you want to it.  In the long run using the backplane likely makes sense but you can buy a single 25 GH/s hashing board and nothing else. 
4442  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: CoinTerra announces its first ASIC - Hash-Rate greater than 500 GH/s on: September 12, 2013, 03:23:05 PM
check out the site, new cointerra products and prices released. what do yall think?
"Where's the beef?" Disappointing to see that there is *still* nothing substantive on that website; nothing to alleviate legitimate concerns that this may be just another, albeit glossier-than-most, scam. I'll pass. There will be plenty of cheap ASIC hardware to buy in the coming months.

The sad thing is I don't think it is a scam but the lack of any technical information at all means you would just be buying on faith.  At least competitors provide some technical details.  There is absolutely no details provided. 
4443  Other / CPU/GPU Bitcoin mining hardware / Re: AMD sales going good guns down to mining? on: September 12, 2013, 03:20:16 PM
Which hardly matters.  If a farmer sells tomatoes and beans and tomatoes only make up 10% of his gross revenue, then finding a way to boost tomato production 2% so that his gross revenue will increase 0.2% doesn't make a material difference.   Still if you have a breakdown for GPU sales then feel free to use that.  $8M (optimisticly unrealistic) is still a rounding error.
4444  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: Crypto Compression Concept Worth Big Money - I Did It! on: September 12, 2013, 03:03:59 PM
However you approach it, it is simply impossible to design a lossless compression algorithm that reduces the size of all possible input files given to it.

This.  The concept is called perfect compression* and I pointed that out to the OP.


* Note perfect means all inputs are reduces in size it doesn't necessarily imply a high level of compression.  If you found an algorithm which can reduce all inputs by 0.0000000001% then you have found an impossibility.
4445  Economy / Scam Accusations / Re: Rogue Customer - " Scott Deleon " on: September 12, 2013, 07:38:12 AM
Wow.  ITT found a company I will never do business with.  The customer was wrong but as a merchant I would expect you to have higher standards than some trolling customer.   Obviously you don't.
4446  Economy / Securities / Re: [HAVELOCK] Crypto Currency (CFIG) Official Thread on: September 12, 2013, 12:23:02 AM
I just saw this stock on havelock. Did people put really 29,800 BTC (~$3819764.00) on a 1 page amateur prospectus ? Wow.

No.  Less than 900 BTC was sold in the IPO.  The rest was off exchange in a "private tx".  Now way to confirm if anything was ever sold to anyone.  However it does make the company look like a massive enterprise.
4447  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: Moving coins between blockchains. on: September 11, 2013, 08:14:08 PM
I don't believe it is possible in a trustless way because there is no concept as "locked coins" in Bitcoin.

To see why it isn't possible lets look at where it would be possible.  If you imagine two brand new coins ACoin & BCoin.  Both A & B allow destroying coins in their chain via a type of transaction and creating coins via another tx.  The create coins tx requires as its input the tx id of the destroy tx on the other chain.  This would be pretty trivial to implement.   You destroy x coins on chain A and then create a enerate tx on chain B referencing the txid of the destroy on A like magic you created y new coins on chain B.

The problem is that while xCoin might support creating coins from nothing Bitcoin doesn't (excluding mining) so we can't make generation of xCoins based on destroying Bitcoins if you want it reversible.  The only workaround would be to somehow "lock down" the coins until the alt-coins are destroyed.  All unspent outputs can be spent by some entity (unless private keys are permanently lost) so at all times someone will be able to cheat the system.   You could use a system involving multiple custodians in a P2SH multi-sig address to reduce the risk but it wouldn't be trust free.  One way to ensure those breaking the trust can't benefit would be to require them to escrow a certain amount of xCoins which they forfeit (destroyed, given to miners, etc) if they release Bitcoins before xCoins are destroyed.  That would allow you to reduce the trust but not eliminate it.  If someone escrows 1000 xCoins but can steal 1 BTC and say the value of 1 BTC rises such that 1 BTC is worth more than 100,000 xCoins then theft will likely happen. There may be other ways to do this in a limited trust manner but it would never be trust free.

Not sure if it helps but rather than destroying and creating coins it is relatively easy to make trust free trades between chains.  Joe has Bitcoins and wants xCoins, Jane has xCoins and wants Bitcoins.  Neither party trusts the other one.  It is possible to construct a system in which neither party can cheat the other one.  
4448  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: Novec 7000 Project [immersive evaporating cooling] on: September 11, 2013, 07:31:22 PM
Cool let us know how it goes..........with pictures. Grin

Will do.  I had a dream last night the UPS guy dropped the bottles and all that expensive Novec ended up on the ground.  Sad  I probably will start a new thread but aTG first experiment gave me the inspiration.  I am just wondering if he has made any more progress.  From where he stopped I see two solutions, the first being a larger radiator and the second using Novec 7100.  Still I would prefer to see Novec 6000 working as it will result in lower board temps.
4449  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: Novec 7000 Project [immersive evaporating cooling] on: September 11, 2013, 07:23:57 PM
I've been thinking of making something similar. I wish Novec 700 was much cheaper, but its out of the budget for most. I would go with mineral oil. the only downfall is that it takes a while to clean it off, i think the green revolution uses it. Also what about a cooling system where the oil goes through a heatsink cooled by water from an outside maybe portable pool?

Mineral oil is an option however I will be working with either Novec 7000 or Novec 7100.  One advantage that ASICs potentially have is extreme energy densities.  Compared to a run of the mill server or GPU rig you have a higher energy usage relative to the size of the system. 3M has provided me with some data on experiment where they cooled 4KW (that would be >8 TH/s using 28nm chip @ 0.5 J/GH) using just 1 Liter of Novec 7000.  That level of energy density is probably not possible (at least not without custom designed boards) but it shows the fluid is capable of incredibly energy transfers.  The challenge is finding a solution to minimize the amount of working fluid required relative to the power consumption and hashrate.

Still mineral oil is an interesting idea however while the working fluid is cheaper everything else has higher cost and complexity.  I already watercooled a server rack of GPU rigs so I need to bump up the extremeness to have any fun.
4450  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: Novec 7000 Project [immersive evaporating cooling] on: September 11, 2013, 06:58:04 PM
Any updates?  My immersion fluid should be arriving soonish.  Interested to compare notes.  I don't have any FPGA and am waiting on ASICs so while I could use a GPU as a test load instead I am going to use a bank of these ...



At 12V they will pull 8.3A and dissipate 100W.  By varying the number that are powered it will allow me to run some tests on a non-hashing prototype.
4451  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: SHA-256 is designed by the NSA - do they have a backdoor? on: September 11, 2013, 02:00:54 PM
Ok. I stand corrected. The word "never" was used as hyperbole. 2030 to 2060 is just about right, and maybe even sooner. Obligatory cartoon here:

No problem I personally use 4096 bit keys for PGP and don't worry.  I does what its name says it does "pretty good privacy".  I also agree even if 4096 bit can be broken someday it is more likely someone is going to beat me with a wrench instead.  Smiley  Someone uninformed however might reach the wrong conclusion.  I guess it all depends on how secret your secrets are or maybe more importantly how long they need to remain a secret.

Quote
However, those same studies find 256 bit symmetric keys and hashes going far beyond the year 2080. We can already start using 512 bit hash functions.

Symmetric cryptography and hashing functions (assuming the algorithm itself is secure) don't have the same attack vectors that public key cryptography does.  They also aren't vulnerable to Shor's algorithm. It is very like we will never need larger than 256 bit symmetric encryption or 512 bit hashes due to thermodynamics*.   Public key is always going to be trickier to keep secure as they all rely on assumptions, and that will lead to a never ending "arms race".  BTW I like that cartoon I have a signed print on my wall.  Good reminder to see the forest from the trees when dealing with security.


* Brute forcing a 256 bit key is a "never" scenario (more energy than available in our star system).  
https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2009/09/the_doghouse_cr.html
4452  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Mining (Altcoins) / Re: Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com on: September 11, 2013, 01:19:15 PM
IS a rig that didn't get delivered on time because it doesn't yet exist "intangible"?

No the product being sold is tangible.  If it isn't delivered due to fraud that doesn't make it intangible.  Intangible product would be things like steam game code, virtual currency, webhosting, development work, etc.
4453  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Mining (Altcoins) / Re: Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com on: September 11, 2013, 01:06:19 PM
either board would be fine, but I would prefer the "Beaglebone Black" just for convenience and would be cool to have monitor attached (even a 7 inch mini monitor) 24/7

The "non-black" version of BB is double the cost and they don't need any of the capabilities it brings.  I doubt they would use a $100 host when the $45 one fits their needs better.  Also notice in the KNC host photo there is no PMIC expansion connector (black rectangle) between the ethernet & power connectors.  That connector is present on the BB "standard" and not on the BB black.

KNC Host:


BeagleBone


BeagleBone Black


4454  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: SHA-256 is designed by the NSA - do they have a backdoor? on: September 11, 2013, 01:00:03 PM
I use gmail. But I also use GPG with 4096 bit RSA keys. They can store my encrypted message and keep it for all eternity, but they'll never read it.

I wouldn't be so sure that RSA with 4096 bits will really never be cracked.  Especially asymmetric algorithms seem quite vulnerable, given enough time for new methods and hardware to develop.  (Nevertheless I also consider my GPG mails with this setting to be reasonable secure.)

This.  There is a high probability that 4096 bit asymmetric encryption will eventually be broken (by classical computing).  Various agencies estimate a high probability that 4096 bit will no longer be secure after 2030-2060.   That being said 4096 bit RSA provides reasonable security for the intermediate future however "never" is a long time.  If it must be longer than your lifespan you should be looking at something like 15,360 bit RSA or 512 bit ECC.

4455  Bitcoin / Mining speculation / Re: Estimate of ASIC pre-orders (6,000 to 8,000 TH/s by end of 2013) on: September 11, 2013, 06:43:07 AM
The 25xx includes unpaid orders.   There were ~800 orders shipped out on day 1 and day 2 based on the cutoff (purchase) date for day 2 shipping.
4456  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Mining (Altcoins) / Re: Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com on: September 11, 2013, 04:58:58 AM
The connection to the ASICs is serial.  I didn't say there is no USB port just that it isn't used.  The rPi on Bitfury has 2 USB ports but they aren't used.   Not sure what you mean by you must use an FPGA or embedding ethernet in the ASIC.  Neither Bitfury nor ASICMiner do and I am sure KNC doesn't either.  You have a microprocessor based host (beagle board, Single board computer, rPi, etc doesn't really matter) and it sends instructions to ASICs over serial link.   No FPGA, no need for USB, no embedding anything in the ASIC cores.

Simple version
host controller ---- serial link ---- ASIC board ---- serial link ----- ASIC board ----- serial link----- ASIC board ---- serial link ---- ASIC board.

The serial data connectors are visibile on the ASIC board https://www.kncminer.com/userfiles/image/ASIC_PCB.jpg
The ribbon connector from host controller to ASIC board is partially visible in this photo: https://www.kncminer.com/pictures/product/big/5421_big.jpg



4457  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Mining (Altcoins) / Re: Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com on: September 11, 2013, 04:07:01 AM
For this particular purpose rPi could be considered a serious step back even in comparison with the hobbyist-level hardware like the BeagleBoard/BeagleBone.

I hadn't realized how cheap Beagle had gotten.  The entry level board BeagleBone Black (which is what appears to be used in KNC rigs) is only $45 and probably less in volume.  Since Pi has gone up in price ($35) and you need to add a SD Card they are roughly the same cost.  I must be getting old, IIRC at one time the cheapest BeagleBoard was almost $200 and that was considered a deal.
4458  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: Litecoin is Silver to Bitcoin's Gold? No So Fast Mister on: September 11, 2013, 02:11:20 AM
However, I honestly think that will happen and not a single person has been able to point out to me why it can't and why it won't.

People have told you, you just ignore it so you can do you youtube scam-o-mercials. 

NETWORK EFFECT.

Bitcoin has it and GoldCoin doesn't.  This is isn't to say something can displace Bitcoin but the network effect sets the bar high and it will need to be something vastly superior.  GoldCoin is a weak copy of a copy with absolutely no innovation.   If Bitcoin is displaced it won't be by that garbage.
4459  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Mining (Altcoins) / Re: Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com on: September 11, 2013, 01:27:40 AM
Perhaps your eidetic memory can recall this link
https://www.kncminer.com/news/news-25

Specifically the statement "Embedded Linux SO_DIMM module"
As far as I know that still stands.

I'm prepared to be proven wrong, even though I never claimed it was a fact.
You no doubt remember me stating "If they use the SO-DIMM pictured"

Yes however that doesn't mean things don't change.   KNC has reported in separate occasions that the package would be 2797 ball and 2046 ball and looking at the PCB today it is clearly neither.  The photos of the board (identified upthread not by me BTW) appear to be .  Still even if the SO-DIMM board is used, the reasons aren't the ones you listed.   USB isn't used, only single Ethernet port used, no need for FPGA to run cgminer, etc.
4460  Other / CPU/GPU Bitcoin mining hardware / Re: what will replace asic? on: September 11, 2013, 01:09:17 AM
Nothing.  You will eventually see more efficient ASICs either better designed (higher MH/s per mm^2 of silicon) or smaller process node (20nm or better).    Neither are likely in the near term (6-12 months).  In the near term just expect the price per GH/s to keep dropping.  $2 per GH/s is pretty likely.  $1 per GH/s is probably pretty close to the build cost (whole miner not just chip).

Quantum Computing against hashing functions?  Nope.
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