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2361  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: BFL Product Failures / Underperformance. on: February 03, 2014, 12:16:00 PM
Whew! Hope all is well.
2362  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: BFL Product Failures / Underperformance. on: February 03, 2014, 11:15:33 AM
http://www.thewiring.com/?p=1257

TLDR;

Quote
I have been working in technology since 20 years and I’m passionate about it. I have all kinds of electronic
devices popping up from any drawer in my apartment and I can tell you with absolute certainty that
ButterflyLabs is the worst company I’ve ever dealt with. They are lacking all the components to make a
company a good company:

- the quality of their products is an absolute disaster;

- their shipping department has big problems. They even don’t check what is in their boxes and I have
   my doubts that USPS misunderstood Switzerland for China;

- after sales support does not exist except for their robot-like rma procedure.


Code:
Butterfly Labs experience. Lets your dollars fly away…
by Wire Master • February 1, 2014

I always had something telling me that the financial system we live in has something wrong.
Growing perpetually in a physically limited world is simply not possible. Capitalism surely matches
the nature of human kind which strives to have more and more, but we cannot go over the limits
given to us by mother nature. Unfortunately in history, the extreme growth periods were followed
by mass destruction wars, giving the grown “graph” a pulse trend.

Besides that, the financial system is driven by banks that together with the states governments
have gotten into a sick mechanism of debts and money generation, going into a very dangerous
direction.

So a few months ago I got fascinated by the Bitcoin idea. It’s a virtual currency that is not
regulated by central banks and governments instead it goes into a different direction than the
 current world we live in. A limited number of Bitcoins will be issued in the next decades and they
 are released at a slow pace from the “miners”. Similar to the gold mining era, mining Bitcoins is
 not an easy task and this has to be performed by more and more powerful computers the more
the mining fever raises.

Once it was possible to mine with a normal PC CPU or GPU, but as more power was required,
dedicated hardware has been produced by a few companies around the world. This hardware is
very expensive and most people who buy them are aware of the fact that they will not be able to
mine the cost of the miner itself, so it’s not about becoming rich, it’s more about being part of a
revolution.

I am one of those, believing that the instinct to grow is part of the human kind. It’s not all bad,
it’s also the fuel to our progress. But probably I’m wrong and growth of ideas and progress can
be unlinked by money growth or probably the other alternative Cryptocurrencies (virtual currencies)
can give this opportunity. Not growing forever otherwise we are again in the same situation like now,
but I am curious to see what happens. Or probably growth paths can be driven instead of being left
to it’s own exponential destiny. Driven by the money eager parts of this system like banks, and as a
consequence governments have to cope with that growth pace. Isn’t it so that nowadays the power
is not anymore within the governments hands but in the moneys hands and that all the world has
to run after that? Think about what you read in the first pages of all the newspapers around the
world.

So I checked the web and the most popular Bitcoin mining hardware
(ASIC Application Specific Integrated Circuit) producer is ButterflyLabs in the USA. The price of their
products vary from few hundreds to several thousands of dollars.

In December 2013 I bought a Jalapeno 5GH/s from Butterfly Labs which I connected to my PC and
after 5 days I had a power outage at home. It happened during a weekend I was away from home
so I had a bad surprise in my fridge upon returning… After that, the device turned on again but could n
ot be detected by my PC anymore. I wrote some emails to Butterfly Labs, wrote in their forum but never
received a feedback. If you are extremely lucky you get a standard email with their usual procedure:
“apply for RMA (return merchandise authorisation)”. Not a word saying that they are sorry or that
they will improve their products… nothing. So I had to ship this box to the USA with additional costs.
Who knows how long the repairing procedure takes…

Before it broke down I decided to buy a more powerful one, a Single SC 50GH/s from Butterfly Labs.
It’s a product worth around $1000 and when shipping to Europe that price becomes roughly $1150.
Initially they send the parcel to China instead of Switzerland… but they blamed USPS for it. After several
mails, forum posts, etc I got a mail from a human in Butterfly Labs telling me that they would send one
 of these devices they had in stock with FedEx so I didn’t have to wait for the one in China to go around
the world. That was appreciated. I got the parcel on 28 January, unpacked the box, plugged in the device
and after 20 minutes of mining the PSU (power supply unit) started to turn on and off by itself. Basically
it was looking dead. According to the forum community they delivered a PSU that was supposed to be
used with a smaller model. That’s why after 20 minutes the PSU could not cope with the power
required by the device I bought. I filed another RMA.

In the meantime the forum community was saying that the PSUs delivered by Butterfly Labs are very bad
quality so they suggested to use a ATX (one of these PC desktop square power supplies). I went the day
after to buy one of these ATXs, with additional costs. I didn’t want to wait another month for the new
PSU to be delivered from the US. Besides that, according to the community, the ATX is of much better
quality so you can avoid sleepless nights, thinking if your house will burn down. So I connected the device.
It worked for 3 hours and then went dead. And could not be detected by my PC anymore.

Tired of this waste of time and money, I wrote them a mail asking for a refund and at the same time I asked
them to keep the PSU and the first device delivered (Jalapeno) and again got silence from their side. While
waiting for their reply, they sent me the tracking number for the new PSU. I immediately replied asking to
check my refund mail… Silence. After half a day I get the confirmation that the PSU was delivered. Incredible…

I have been working in technology since 20 years and I’m passionate about it. I have all kinds of electronic
devices popping up from any drawer in my apartment and I can tell you with absolute certainty that
ButterflyLabs is the worst company I’ve ever dealt with. They are lacking all the components to make a
company a good company:

- the quality of their products is an absolute disaster;

- their shipping department has big problems. They even don’t check what is in their boxes and I have
   my doubts that USPS misunderstood Switzerland for China;

- after sales support does not exist except for their robot-like rma procedure.

But the worst is, that they seem to fix products that have been returned by customers and send them on to
other customers selling them as new and therefore at the full price but without properly testing them. Only this
can explain, why a new product stops working within the same day you put it in operation. Besides of course,
that they provide a thousand dollars product with the wrong power supply.

So be aware! I don’t know how the other producers are (Coincraft, Cointerra, Hashfast, KnCMiner, etc) as I
didn’t experience them, but for sure my Butterfly Labs experience is the worst I’ve ever had in my life.

Support Bitcoin, don’t support Butterfly Labs!
2363  Other / CPU/GPU Bitcoin mining hardware / Re: {BFL} Bitcoin miners sue Butterfly Labs on: February 03, 2014, 09:43:20 AM
Dropt... I appreciate you didn't ask about the Wasp Hive considering the topic was Bitcoin Miners Sue BUTTERFLY Labs.

---

He won't be getting anything in February or March that is a certainty given his spot in line. If he does obviously his steadfast support in these forums is his payment for a beta version of a slapped together and untested Monarch or maybe he will get a lab version that never leaves the bench ala Luke Jr. Good luck I am pretty confident I will be reaping rewards from our design well before he mines a single Satoshi. There is a significant difference between his getting it when you get it and my insight into when we are going to have a development board up and hashing. Let us just say we started later and we will ride a much better design wave vs. a one off loser like the Monarch that was and still is over priced and will unlikely return anything other than heartache to anyone that ordered one expecting October delivery.

My guess Late Q3 before the majority are "shipped". Get ready BFL more lawsuits to come. For someone so adamant this is a great product he only "bought" a single 300 Gh/s Black Friday special does that sound like a real supportive fanboy BFL customer there? Guess he knows they won't make a dime unless he flips it on Ebay like Josh told some irate customers to do when they didn't get the super discount when sales started lagging bad.
2364  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: The Wasp Project Collective Information thread. on: February 03, 2014, 09:07:31 AM
Wasp

Minion is out at least until May so the Asicminer 40nm 13 gh/s chip is in if we can get them. Gridseed possibly in but we would require the proper chips specs be available and sample chips in February for an early March production run possible for anyone with any substantial Gridseed chips volume if they are still interested.

Hive

Hive is a sandwiched dual board with power on one plane and signals on the other that is married together via connectors and stanchion stabilizers to increase rigidity but not impede airflow. A redesign is currently happening as well as a careful check to make sure our Wasps mate perfect to the Hive. This is necessary since the Hive is being designed in the UK and the Wasp is being designed in the US and both EE teams are cross checking each others designs for errors or potential problems in fabrication. Further shaving of the Hive boards has allowed more airflow in the redesign but we are reaching the limits where flexing of the board could be an issue on this beta version Hive.

Firmware & Software

Progress The Bitfury emulator based on the XMEGA is ready. The controller for the Bitfury (the MCU) is also in a good state. We have just settled on a workload for it, which will be in line with current approaches taken by others (ie, local work generation on the PC). I am currently working on hooking into existing codes, so that we don't have to write our own PC program for feeding the MCU. Once we're talking we will then implement the MCU logic to drive the Bitfury emulator from the data. But, of course, things can always jump up and bite you so we hope no major issues arise.

Website

Currently waiting on a member to update the website with the content we have currently but will be augmented with videos and pictures our work so far on the Wasp & Hive as well as the Pool Information. Waiting on another members to finish the Mining Pool and start on the internal share exchange for our members. We have a bips.me as a payment gateway working now and it will be integrated into the website.

Mining Pool

Two members are finishing the BackEnd+FrontEnd Coding for the pool and it is now going through security and full testing. A few members have offered 20 Gh/s+ to the pool for testing and our soft opening. We have potential customers in the order of 50 Th/s lined up for our hard opening

PR & Marketing

We will have a meeting for PR and Marketing this Friday.

License Fee

There were extensive discussions of the licensing fee at the meeting and it looks like we will be modeling two payment possibilities for fabricators and end users based on a percentage of the $ Gh/s pricing of chips. People will have the option to mine off the licensing fee or pay a flat fee. Flat fee will be slightly lower and available in USD or BTC.
  
Provisioning Server

Work continues on testing of the provisioning and licensing server and it is likely we will be on schedule for use on the Development Boards coming very soon.


---------

Other News

Many are interested in joining the WPC and we are keen to grow our ranks but before we can even start taking on new members the current membership has decided we need to set up our LLC and finalize our franchise / membership bylaws so that all members are required to sign on to agree to those terms before being a full member. This will take a number of weeks to finish so until then no new members will be added.
2365  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: The Wasp Project Collective Information thread. on: February 03, 2014, 04:23:34 AM
Meeting Update:

Wasp

'The main take away from the last meeting is that the first boards dev-boards, will have a left column of 8 BitFury, middle column of 2 A1, and right column of 8 BitMain.' - Lead EE for the Wasp & Hive Project.

This will cut down on some of our development time to get to our prototype boards that will drop soon afterwards. Again video and pictures will be released when this board is actively working and testing. Note that all the components, including the ASIC chips are already in the EE's hands. This now is a matter of testing the dev-board design after it is populated and then moving on to separate prototype boards for A1 Wasp, BitFury Wasp and the BitMain Wasp.

More updates to come later on...

Hive
Firmware & Software
Website
Mining Pool
PR & Marketing
License Fee
Provisioning Server
2366  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: DIY Bitcoin miners with ASIC chips? on: February 03, 2014, 02:35:04 AM
theoreticaly yes, practicaly no

Theoretically yes, practically yes.

Just wait for our designs to come out and you could buy chips and build a number of units or you could look at NanoFury and use VS3's design and build right away.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=321287.140
2367  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: New Avalon Batch on: February 03, 2014, 02:25:49 AM
Pass.
2368  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: ntek 1.2th/s miner? on: February 02, 2014, 10:06:45 AM
I don't know why these guys don't provide solid proof about the product they want to sell if they are serious, or why they refuse to be transparent. if I were them and I was serious, I'd allow in person payment and pickup, and show a video of who I am and our place of business along with the equipment I intend to sell...

What would constitute SOLID PROOF?

Where are they being less than TRANSPARENT?

Have you purchased one of these units?

If not wait for Ben T. to do a full evaluation of the unit and then you can buy one if it is legit you will see that soon enough.

You have been reading the replies from Ntek reps in this thread right?

I am all for pile on the scam artists that pop up but there seems to be more than enough evidence that the people at ntek exist have a storefront of sorts and real people operating this project. At some point you just have to wait and let them fall flat or prove it. This is where we are now. I don't see anything here that Ntek is trying cover up or make less than transparent. They have chips in hand. They have a fabricator. They are moving forward. Is it legit? No not until a miner is mining and people get their units. Is it likely a scam. No nothing in what they have said, posted or shown is remotely congruent with scam. In fact quite the opposite.
2369  Other / CPU/GPU Bitcoin mining hardware / Re: {BFL} Bitcoin miners sue Butterfly Labs on: February 02, 2014, 09:46:43 AM
Taunts?

That is how he replies?

Lawsuit thoughts?

Monarch 4 months late thoughts?


Crickets yet again.

I'll be sure to be back in the BFL Monarch Order thread on 18 February when my deadline is for checking in on how much he and others have mined so far on their Monarchs.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=352448.msg3772046#msg3772046
 
My guess come February 18th he will have mined exactly 0 BTC. He will be waiting until March, April possibly May or later for a unit. At this point I am pretty happy he has no clue how to buy miners with at least a hope in hell of making it to market at a reasonable price and that are NOT chicken wired together and require you put it in a snowbank to get it working again or shipped with bottom of the barrel cheap and dangerous Chinese knock off PSU's that have almost burned down a house or nearly electrocuted a few people.

This guy like others is a paid shill for BFL and that is why he is on ignore with the rest of the liars that still support BFL. It is obvious to most the game they play is simply to deny deny deny when the proof is everywhere that they everyone of them lacks the basic ethics that are standard to most human beings. What takes REAL balls and REAL courage is to tell the truth and not be BOUGHT by BFL. Being a liar is pretty easy and the way of a coward or a sociopath I wonder which one he is?
2370  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: ntek 1.2th/s miner? on: February 02, 2014, 09:34:00 AM
Why do all 7 pages of this thread sound like a reverse new product announcement scam?

LOL....

HAHAHAHA.

Maybe because it is. Not a scam and they will ship a product. Remember Ry and Ntek didn't start the thread.

So someone has a product that is for sale?  is there a thread on btctalk about the product or is this page it?

Nope. This is it.

I'd recommend after a working product is ready and shipped and reported / evaluated then start a Ntek thread that is self-moderator by Ntek.
2371  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: BFL Product Failures / Underperformance. on: February 02, 2014, 05:24:15 AM
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=444218.msg4880802#msg4880802


Quote
Hi everyone
This is my first mining rig and it wasn´t a good start. its a 50ghs BFL single that runs at 25.
2372  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: 50GHS BFL Single working at 25GH on: February 02, 2014, 05:23:36 AM
Make this your last BFL purchase cause if you have to stick your miner in the fridge to get it working that kinda means you haven't got a real winner of unit right?
2373  Other / CPU/GPU Bitcoin mining hardware / Re: {BFL} Bitcoin miners sue Butterfly Labs on: February 02, 2014, 05:17:17 AM
October, November, December, January and now February do you know where your Monarch is? 4 months behind initial estimates. I am sensing a pattern. Overpriced, 600 / 300 gh/s arriving in Huh you get a goose egg on this product no matter what you say it is a dog of product that doesn't even have working chips yet. LOL.

Lawsuits.

FCC breathing down BFL's neck. Oh boy this year is going to be AWESOME.
2374  Other / CPU/GPU Bitcoin mining hardware / Re: Butterfly Labs 25GH/s Chips stopped working on: February 02, 2014, 05:16:25 AM
Quality engineering. Stick it in a fridge.
2375  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: BFL Product Failures / Underperformance. on: February 02, 2014, 05:14:32 AM
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=443759.msg4873580#msg4873580

Quote
Yesterday my 25GH/s Miner from Butterfly that mined at about 26,5 GH/s went down to about 21 GH/s, now i saw with bfgminer that 2 chips aren't working anymore. Any Hints on that?

Bye
Michael

 [2014-02-01 14:48:34] BFL0 51.0C | 5s:21.50 avg:17.49 u:18.56 Gh/s | A:13 R:0+0(none) HW:2/.34%
 [2014-02-01 14:48:34] BFL0a 51.0C | 5s: 3.32 avg: 2.70 u: 2.86 Gh/s | A:1 R:0+0(none) HW:0/none
 [2014-02-01 14:48:34] BFL0b 51.0C | 5s: 3.60 avg: 3.04 u: 3.26 Gh/s | A:1 R:0+0(none) HW:0/none
 [2014-02-01 14:48:34] BFL0c 51.0C | 5s: 3.48 avg: 2.85 u: 3.07 Gh/s | A:5 R:0+0(none) HW:1/1.0%
 [2014-02-01 14:48:34] BFL0d 51.0C | 5s: 3.73 avg: 3.04 u: 3.39 Gh/s | A:2 R:0+0(none) HW:1/.93%
 [2014-02-01 14:48:34] BFL0e 51.0C | 5s:  0.0 avg:  0.0 u:  0.0  h/s | A:0 R:0+0(none) HW:0/none
 [2014-02-01 14:48:34] BFL0f 51.0C | 5s:  0.0 avg:  0.0 u:  0.0  h/s | A:0 R:0+0(none) HW:0/none
 [2014-02-01 14:48:34] BFL0g 51.0C | 5s: 3.68 avg: 3.01 u: 2.79 Gh/s | A:2 R:0+0(none) HW:0/none
 [2014-02-01 14:48:34] BFL0h 51.0C | 5s: 3.70 avg: 2.98 u: 3.32 Gh/s | A:2 R:0+0(none) HW:0/none

Solution? Put in a fridge or outside in the cold... really... quality engineering is that.


Quote
Chips probably need a reflow.
When you go from a hot to cold cycle the lead free solder can crack.
Just like the XBox 360 red ring of death.
2376  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: ntek 1.2th/s miner? on: February 02, 2014, 05:12:25 AM
Why do all 7 pages of this thread sound like a reverse new product announcement scam?

LOL....

HAHAHAHA.

Maybe because it is. Not a scam and they will ship a product. Remember Ry and Ntek didn't start the thread.
2377  Other / CPU/GPU Bitcoin mining hardware / Re: {BFL} Bitcoin miners sue Butterfly Labs on: February 01, 2014, 02:52:40 PM
http://www.btcpedia.com/butterfly-labs-announces-monarch-mining-blade/

Quote
From past experience to anyone new here considering purchasing from this company, if they are promising November/December 2013 delivery, you can expect to receive it in January or February of 2015. No, I am not joking.

It took BFL 14 months from when they started taking pre-orders for their ASIC line to when they finally started shipping them in any kind of volume to real customers.
2378  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: BFL Product Failures / Underperformance. on: February 01, 2014, 02:50:24 PM
Quote
21:41 kovert: I read somewhere that butterfly labs are not delivering the monarchs untill 2015 does this sound right
21:41 captainpugwash: i heard that yeah
21:42 captainpugwash: ppl must b fkin pissd
21:42 kovert: ahh ok not that i have ordered 1
21:42 kovert: I would be -- no refund either
21:42 captainpugwash: i know if the hw i preordered went back a year for delivery i wouldnt be happy
21:42 13oots2: this is BFL we are talking about, I only just got my Jally and it screwed up after 2 days
21:42 captainpugwash: holy sht! thr not offering money back, by the time it arrives the diff would be mental on BTC
21:42 kovert: true 13 -- Did you ever send it back
21:43 captainpugwash: 13oots, i start learning how to create YouTube videos next week Info
21:43 13oots2: Hardly worth it, it'll cost about £40 just to send back and will be worthless by the time they replace it
2379  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: The Wasp Project Collective Information thread. on: February 01, 2014, 12:00:41 PM
Groups:

    All Active Projects

Next Meeting:

    Saturday 8th February 2014



Location:

    Teamspeak

Location Time:

    Seattle, USA 1030 PDT Saturday
    London, UK 1830 GMT Saturday
    Central Europe 1930 CET Saturday
    Jakarta, ID 0130 WIB Sunday

Reporting On

    All Projects Overview
    Wasp
    Hive
    Firmware & Software
    Website
    Mining Pool
    PR & Marketing
    License Fee
    Provisioning Server
2380  Other / CPU/GPU Bitcoin mining hardware / Re: Tiger Direct CENSORING Butterfly Labs reviews on: February 01, 2014, 08:40:40 AM
Post your REVIEW here for us all to see.

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