bitcoin mixers- do they save data?

[gvuandrew]

Does anyone know the policy of bitcoin mixers with regards to them saving data and how do customers know for sure that's being done?

Because if they don't keep records, if an entity was chasing after someone, the mixer company couldn't provide them with any info even if they wanted too

[pereira4]

Does anyone know the policy of bitcoin mixers with regards to them saving data and how do customers know for sure that's being done?

Because if they don't keep records, if an entity was chasing after someone, the mixer company couldn't provide them with any info even if they wanted too

It's a gamble. Even if they say they don't, you are just trusting them, something that goes against the ideology around Bitcoin, which is to make the experience as trustless as possible. Mixers are not to be trusted, we need a better solution. That's why integrated Coinjoin in every wallet ever is a necessity.

[Shibashi Dogemoto]

If i'm not mistaking, some mixers (like the one in my sig), are unknown to the authorities... They also claim they don't hold any logs.
But, like being said before, there's no way of being sure.

There's always the option to exchange your coins to a cryptonight coin, send it, and transfer it back to bitcoin in case you don't trust mixers.

[pedrog]

Mixers are just honeypots.

If you send your coins to anonymous people on the Internet, you're gonna have a bad time.

[coinzat]

It is possible for mixers to save their logs of course, but I do not think it is something good for them to cooperate with a government because it will deal with them as a criminals. So if the enemy of my enemy is my friend, then mixers and their users must be friends.

[Furio]

Does anyone know the policy of bitcoin mixers with regards to them saving data and how do customers know for sure that's being done?

Because if they don't keep records, if an entity was chasing after someone, the mixer company couldn't provide them with any info even if they wanted too

If you do it correctly it shouldnt matter, also solely relying on mixers isnt wise if you have something to hide, coinjoin is a must in combination with mixers

[shane]

i think bitmixer is trusted company, and he did not share his log tracking bitcoin
if you have any Question you can PM bitmixer owner, or contact bitmixer support

[twister]

If i'm not mistaking, some mixers (like the one in my sig), are unknown to the authorities... They also claim they don't hold any logs.
But, like being said before, there's no way of being sure.

There's always the option to exchange your coins to a cryptonight coin, send it, and transfer it back to bitcoin in case you don't trust mixers.

They must keep some logs or else how will the bitmixer code work? Which makes sure that a user doesn't gets the coins which he sent to the mixer before.

But having said that I don't think they will share these logs with anyone, they're well reputed and they wouldn't want to do something that might tarnish their reputation.

[aleandromagno]

It is possible for mixers to save their logs of course, but I do not think it is something good for them to cooperate with a government because it will deal with them as a criminals. So if the enemy of my enemy is my friend, then mixers and their users must be friends.

If we take situation that mixer service cooperate with government it will be possible, but difficult to belive.. What if government open a mixing service..?  

[unholycactus]

i think bitmixer is trusted company, and he did not share his log tracking bitcoin
if you have any Question you can PM bitmixer owner, or contact bitmixer support

It's trusted to give you back coins after you mixed them.
Should you trust them for not keeping logs? No way of knowing and to be honest you shouldn't.
Of course, it's better than doing nothing to protect your privacy.

[coinzat]

It is possible for mixers to save their logs of course, but I do not think it is something good for them to cooperate with a government because it will deal with them as a criminals. So if the enemy of my enemy is my friend, then mixers and their users must be friends.

If we take situation that mixer service cooperate with government it will be possible, but difficult to belive.. What if government open a mixing service..?

It is possible to happen , as no one knows who is managing  the mixing sites AFAIK.
So mixing btc using such sites may by not enough to make the transactions untraced completely.

[gentlemand]

There's no way of knowing but they have a major incentive not to. I assume logs are held for long enough to complete an exchange and then it's goodnight.

[OROBTC]

There's no way of knowing but they have a major incentive not to. I assume logs are held for long enough to complete an exchange and then it's goodnight.

That's my guess as well.  It probably took bitmixer a long time to become trusted by its customers, and I have heard very few reputable sounding complaints re their service.  Like others above have pointed out, there is no way to tell for sure.  But, they do indeed have a major incentive to keep their info quiet (or to make it disappear).

If a mixing service is located overseas (their owners or managers), then they are probably fairly safe from US authorities.  In the case of bitmixer, their pretty high volume would seem ti indicate that they are making money, and so have extra incentive to be trustworthy.

I suspect we will all be watching the Apple/FBI case to see what happens re encryption (and by extension to BTC mixing).

[fvwfv9]

Obviously nobody knows.  Any one of the mixers could be operated by a government.  Or a government might have learned their private SSL keys and be reading all of the traffic.

Clearly, using two mixers gives you a better chance of actually escaping logs.  It also increases your chance of getting scammed.

A subverted popular mixer would be a valuable intelligence asset to law enforcement, and they would avoid using the information in a way that could reveal its source.

Any mixer that has a reputation and traffic has a substantial incentive to stay in business and keep collecting fees, rather than pulling an exit scam.  Beware a new mixer with low fees.

All of the mixers are frequently phished.  Check very carefully to find the correct URL.

The mixers always sign a document specifying the input and output addresses.  Be sure to save the document and check the signature.  After the mixing is completed, you want to destroy the document.

After paying the fee to isolate your input and output addresses, don't watch both input and output using a block explorer or a wallet such as Electrum that queries the internet to find out about the addresses.  Supposedly these services don't keep logs, but they could. Either use a node such as the Satoshi client which has a private copy of the whole blockchain, or use Electrum via Tor to watch only one address.  To start watching a second address, delete the first from the wallet, exit Electrum, delete all of its data (or at least ~/.electrum/wallets/default_wallet), tell Tor to open a new identity, and only then restart Electrum and enter the next address.

[Pursuer]

Does anyone know the policy of bitcoin mixers with regards to them saving data and how do customers know for sure that's being done?

Because if they don't keep records, if an entity was chasing after someone, the mixer company couldn't provide them with any info even if they wanted too

you should read terms of services and privacy policy of each mixer that use. but as far as I know they all say that they are not keeping any logs, because that would be against their purpose as a mixer!

for example here is what Bitmixer.io says in its faq section:

What logs are kept?
Absolutely no logs or personally identifying information are kept regarding your use of the Bitmixer service. All logs are permanently removed from both our website database and from our Bitcoin wallet after your coins have been transferred out of our reserve. All forwarding entries are removed after 24 hours.