[2018-09-08] Journalducoin.com / Interview with Roger Ver: Back to the roots

[reactorjuno]

Hi folks,

Original article in French > https://journalducoin.com/bitcoin/entretien-roger-ver-retour-aux-sources-1-3/

Translation (sorry in advance for the possible mistakes here and there):

As part of my vacation, I went to Japan, it's a long journey. Given the geographical exclusivity of the place and the difficulty to get there, the specter of work was right of my thought. I told myself that I could not go without trying to meet cryptosphere personalities based there. I always kept in mind a famous report by France 2 TV channel about "Bitcoin millionaires", it was the only meeting of the French media with Roger Ver. I could not be satisfied with the few minutes of generalities delivered by the national chain: curious for this character, whose controversy is well known, I decided to meet him to learn more.

Roger was kind enough to accept my request for a discussion and welcome me to his headquarters in the very center of Tokyo on August 8, 2018. So I went to the temple of bitcoin.com, under a heavy rain, coincidence or not, the heavens were agitated.

I found myself with Mr Ver with an hour in front of me to discuss with him. I did not receive any payment from bitcoin.com to produce this content and here is only the direct transcription, and without censorship of the words exchanged during the session.

Who is Roger Ver?

Roger Ver is an entrepreneur known for his involvement and efforts in promoting Bitcoin since his early days. He was born in San Jose, California in 1979. He went to university, but left after a year to pursue his entrepreneurial ambitions. He left the United States for Japan in 2005 after serving a 10-month prison sentence for "illegal sale of explosives". He renounced his US citizenship in 2014 and became a citizen of Saint Kitts and Nevis. Ver will return to his country of origin only two years later, obtaining a visa is not easy for him with his antecedents. He is known for his libertarian positions and claims to be anarcho-capitalist. Today, he is dedicated to expanding a fork of Bitcoin, Bitcoin Cash, which causes the anger of many people in the crypto environment.

The discovery of Bitcoin

When was your first involvement in Bitcoin?

Quite frankly, I think there are many ways to answer that question. I prefer to tell you that my interest in Bitcoin began in the late '90s, with sci-fi books describing a world where the Internet was operational, and on which it was possible to use some kind of " virtual cash "accessible to all, the same cash of course could not be seized or monitored by any authority, thus providing new opportunities for users. I remember being really excited about such a solution, nevertheless the context and the time did not allow the establishment of something similar, it was only science fiction, but I kept up the idea that it would happen sooner or later. And then a decade later (roughly speaking), Bitcoin made its appearance. I do not hide the enthusiasm of my reaction when I heard about the release of Bitcoin. We are finally there, the famous cash described in my old books has finally arrived! So to conclude this answer, I think it can be said that my interest in cryptocurrency dates back to the 90s.

The 90's is a very surprising answer!

You are known as one of the first investors in Bitcoin. You've owned Bitcoin.com since 2014. What made you buy and keep Bitcoin in 2011?

In addition to all these science fiction books I read, I was pretty erudite in computer science and general economics. By having basic notions in economics, we know that the value of things is governed universally by the law of supply and demand. I knew that the amount of Bitcoin is limited to 21 million and that the demand for Bitcoin could only increase in the coming years, given the under-considered potential of Bitcoin at the time. Bitcoin worked perfectly as a motto and was gradually beginning to feed a growing economy, that of Darknet.

I knew that as more and more people started using Bitcoin as a currency, the price would go up. My strategy was to buy a maximum amount of bitcoins, and use my own funds to invest in projects and solutions, to promote the adoption of Bitcoin by people.

Here we are today, Bitcoin has become an international currency of gigantic size. With solid hope, I hope that soon we will come to the stage where BCH will experience a use directly comparable to that of BTC. I am very happy to make this reference, I was very confident about the ability of Bitcoin to grow in 2011 and am just as much about the fact that BCH will see its adoption grow at a rate faster than BTC in the future, possibly overtake it. I suddenly sold the majority of my BTC, to buy more BCH, when you arrived in our offices today, I was just going to sell a large amount of BTC to buy BCH.

Clearly, you are totally committed and you have taken the side of BCH, which I recall is a fork of BTC, is that it?

Exactly, in the same way that I embraced Bitcoin Core in 2011, when most people laughed at this motto and considered it futile. Today I receive the same remarks and spades with more vehemence as for BCH, but I accept it very well. Time will give reason to the wisest, insulting people, and their negative opinions, were most likely among those mistaken for BTC in 2011; it is very likely that they will again be wrong for BCH.

All right, I respect that position. So you made transition from BTC to BCH, this motto being in your opinion the most promising of the two, it's the thing to remember, isn't it?

Roughly that's it, but I do not think we can talk about transition here. Let me add a few words on this. I do not think I've gone from one thing to another. For me Bitcoin today, is not the one I knew in 2011, 2012 etc. Bitcoin Cash is now getting closer to the Bitcoin experience that appealed to me in 2011. The subtlety being that I have not made any transition to anything, but Bitcoin has moved to another condition. ...

Now that we know more about you, I'd like to talk about MemoryDealers, your old company with which you distributed computer equipment. Did you allow your customers to pay for their purchases in Bitcoin?

It was the first proven and legally established store in the world to accept Bitcoin. That goes back to February 2011, I remember it as if it were yesterday, I rented a large billboard in Silicon Valley stating that we accept Bitcoin. The media reaction was consistent, it made the front page of the world because it was a first for the currency. People were surprised, but I did not really received BTC payments at the beginning.

Nevertheless, some time later, I used my MemoryDealers box and a few other companies I owned to run bitcoinstore.com. I do not know if you have heard about it, but many owners of Bitcoin have used this site to buy electronic equipment, it has worked better than the previous story, I guarantee that. That was in 2012 when a Bitcoin was trading at $ 4, and influential people and media were saying it was impossible to buy anything in Bitcoin. bitcoinstore.com has logged more than 500,000 users, and high-tech products on the platform were mostly cheaper than on Amazon. The argument that Bitcoin did not allow any purchase was invalidated.

Thanks to the platform, it was possible to buy a wide range of products at extremely competitive prices in bitcoin, it made it possible to silence a lot of mouths. Very briefly afterwards, major computer hardware distribution sites, such as Newegg, Dell, Overstock, or Microsoft, followed and began to accept BTC, supported by the positive results of bitcoinstore.com. Overall, the site has contributed to the adoption of Bitcoin on a large scale (mainstream), and therefore to make it the currency that it is today. I think a lot of people who discovered Bitcoin after this period are not aware of the pivotal role bitcoinstore.com played in 2012 in the democratization of Bitcoin.

This is undeniable, I hardly see how it could not have contributed to the progress of the use of Bitcoin. Roger, you're also known as "Bitcoin Jesus", you've given a lot of Bitcoins to a lot of people, I'm not going to ask you about the quantity. These Bitcoin distributions will be part of your move to make Bitcoin better known and adopted. Today, are you for the rise of other cryptocurrency outside BCH?

Quite simply, I'm in favor of everything that's functional, that's all. Whether Dash, Monero or other, as it works, it's decentralized, accessible to all and resistant to censorship: I'm a fan! No matter the name! Alas, I'm sad to have to say that, but BTC is not as good as BCH today. This is also why salaries at bitcoin.com, since last year, are now paid in BCH, the fee being lower on the second platform.



1/3 (to be continued)

[reactorjuno]

Part 2 out of 3 (again apologies for the possible mistakes of the automatic translation)

Interview with Roger Ver: philosophy

Great, we come to the more philosophical part of the interview, now that we have covered the origins of your involvement in cryptocurrency in general, and your appreciation for them. I allow myself to return to the sentence where you indicate that you are a fan of a bitcoin that is not the same as today, to return to the genesis of your commitment.

When and how did you realize that the free market was the optimum for the distribution of wealth?

Through the study of the economy again. In deepening, I realized the major role of government intervention in the economy and growth. I was also inspired by Ray Kurzweil and his writing about the technological singularity, when machines would exceed human intelligence. I think it's great and I think I would still be alive to attend this era, but for that it must still be reached quickly. In order to do that, I have to contribute to the growth of human intelligence, and my only and best way to do that is to nurture economic growth. That's why I'm so excited about the liberalization of markets around the world and the explosion of payment solutions.

The report is simple to assess, look at the example of South Korea and North Korea, that of the West Germany and East Germany or any country with a freer economy than another. Countries with greater economic freedom enjoy greater economic growth and, therefore, innovate more at their scale. Let's continue to contribute to the growth of processor performance, and perhaps we will succeed in this famous technological singularity, where machines can solve the vast majority of problems afflicting us.

Roger's opinion on progress

This is an original point, I guess you're also in favor of robotics and AI development. Do not you think that with the trend of changing inequalities, the growing asymmetry in the distribution of wealth, as well as the establishment of a global political oligopoly, it is unlikely that we are moving towards an ideal society, where machines will be at our service and everyone's standards of life increased?

Well, I think our iPhones make life easier for us ...

But ... I can get an iPhone. Nevertheless, I do not think this phone is very accessible.

Yes, but if you throw an eye to the least developed countries, you will notice they get to own Android smartphone to $ 20, the existence of which on the market a decade earlier was not even imaginable by their relative progress. For example, I decided to invest in a new company wishing to deploy a solution giving iPhones the ability to perform ultrasounds. Their project plans to use technologies such as machine learning to push the diagnostic capability of their machine to new heights. Thanks to this, their device will be able to guess, or make assumptions about the present problem by reading the imagery and based on the results of other measurements. The first version of their product will cost in the $ 5000 or so, while a device for making ultrasound Doppler / medical grade easily cost tens of thousands of dollars. It is extremely expensive.

This startup will offer its device for less, and thus make the purchase of an ultrasound machine more accessible. The resulting democratization will contribute to the increase of the product's supply, and thus to its general price decline. This will allow us to access better technology at home, for a reduced price. Of course, in the beginning, people living in the least developed countries will not be able to take ownership of this technology. Nevertheless, one or two decades later, the price will be decreased so that the device will become a common accessory for everyone on this planet. As a result, I am not really concerned about the gap between rich and poor, as long as we are generally moving in the right direction.

Today, and it is difficult to contest, it is a thousand times less painful to be a poor person than it was a hundred years ago or more. The pace of global economic growth is the main parameter catalyzing universal progress, and thus improving the living conditions of each. Bill Gates has more money than you and me, however, it does not really affect us. Just as we probably have more resources than some people on Earth, without necessarily harming them. In this window of time, where we are also debating this, it is possible for an engineer to discover a technology allowing the design of smartphones at even lower cost, thus contributing to the universalization of the latter. . We come back from this and for the last time to this notion of economic growth in the service of man.

I want to accelerate this process by any means, and I think with fervor that the decentralized currencies are the best tools at our disposal to contribute to this phenomenon. This is what motivates my commitment in cryptocurrency, and my crusade to make Bitcoin Cash more and more adopted!

The United States, "an empire drunk with domination" according to Roger Ver

Very good, thanks for this perspective! We will come to BCH in a few moments. But above all, Roger, as a former American citizen, what do you think of your previous homeland? Is it difficult to live there as an anti-capitalist, defending libertarian values?

To be honest, there are probably more anarco-capitalists per capita in the United States than anywhere else in the world. But the United States is also an empire drunk with domination, imposing its values ​​through violence, economic sanctions and terror. I was just reading last night that they wanted to apply even harsher economic sanctions on Iran, and the European Union remains totally indifferent to this cruel decision, which concerns it just as much. , since many European companies have recently established themselves in Iran. Why does the EU not dispute that? Simply because of fear, because it is inconceivable to borrow a political direction opposite to that of the United States, today in the Western world.

A machine of terror, indeed. I will not share my opinion of the United States in this exchange, but it is true that certain events push the questioning.

People are concerned about China and Russia? ... Nonsense! The United States is a much bigger threat than these countries.

Indeed. These are also rare nations, which on the political scene, tend to rise against American hegemony. By the way, I suppose that in the United States, if one tries to become independent of social and financial structures, one is easily exposed to big trouble, right? We can disappear from one day to the next or be sidelined, right? The example of Julian Assange for example!

Ah Julian Assange! Let's talk about it ! The guy is stuck in an embassy in London for 6 years, for only posting articles on the Internet. It's not bad, is it ?
The Snowden case is in the same category, it's amazing!

Indeed, it is undeniable. They have great solutions to remove people who are harmful to them.

And again, these two are relatively lucky. They are among those who have not finished in prison or in a camp, god knows where!

California politics

It's fun and sad to state! To come back to you, you were engaged in politics in the United States, in your state. You were a candidate to enter the California State Assembly, right?

Yes, some people in the Bitcoin Core and Cash community like to call me a politician: I'm absolutely not. My project at the time, in the case I was elected, was not to accept a single cent of salary, because this money would come from people who would not all be in favor of my remuneration. My campaign emphasized the limitation of losses, the removal of draconian laws, and the proper spending of taxpayers' funds in projects that serve them directly. Basically, nothing very important to gain for me, on the contrary, it only meant the sacrifice of my time. It is because of the main points of my campaign that I can not accept this qualification of politician, because I was everything, except that. We can even talk about anti-politician here. So yes, I went to the California state assembly in 2000, I did not ask for any salary and was in favor of a tax-free society, emphasizing the freedom of the individual and involving him in decisions concerning him.

It is in the context of this story that I subsequently called the ATF (Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives) and the FBI (Federal Bureau of Investigation) , who are sacred murderers and servants of tyranny, to hold them accountable for children for whom they are responsible for the self-immolation at a church in Waco, Texas, in 1993. They did not like it at all. I think you are well informed about me and you have certainly heard about this famous case that led me to prison. I was the first guy in the whole country to be incarcerated for "selling street firecrackers". Coincidence? I do not believe. Selling firecrackers is tolerated unless you open it against the almighty government. I learned it at my expense. The company making these firecrackers had no license, the wholesaler who sold them to me had no authorization, and the two got away without a hitch, a simple and courteous request asking them to stop distributing them. They had to sell millions, I sold 2000 on eBay to break everything. An exceptional country, I guarantee you.

Thank you for sharing this exclusive experience. I just wanted to come back to this firecracker sale story, and your separation from your American nationality. However, I do not want to broaden the debate on this topic and return to the topics we are interested in. Can you define voluntarism, what is it for you?

The idea behind voluntarism is that all human action should be the will of the individual. For example, I asked you before the interview if you wanted tea, and you told me "of course" and I gave you a cup. I did not tell you "you'll drink this tea and if you do not drink it, I'll lock you in a cage", you would have taken me for a horrible person if I had done so. Today, any business offers its product to the consumer and it is the latter on the basis of his will, who will appropriate it or not. The only violators of this consent rule today are rapists, murderers, thieves and government agencies. Let's take another example made in USA. There, you "MUST" pay for social security, and if you do not do it, they will directly incarcerate you.

If Metlife, or another major insurance company asks their customers to buy their coverage packages under penalty of imprisonment, they would be called monstrous. On the other hand, in the case of the government, the violation of consent is fully accepted. People do not ask any questions. It is to ask why? Where do people get their education? In schools, government schools, from day one. Of course, in these famous schools, people are taught indirectly that if the government uses violence, or gives orders, it does not count as violence, it is very legitimate. If you think about it for a few minutes, just because a man is dressed in an elegant suit, with a little flag of the country signaling his political function, he can commit a lot of nonsense in the name of the national good.

Another ineptitude taught in government schools is that the state exercises its authority by the consent of the governors, the famous representatives of the citizens. But what kind of representatives are we talking about? If I begin by threatening your freedom if you do not obey me, and I drown you under the prescriptions, I appear more to your slave, to your master. However, they are never perceived in this way. There are all these strategies of rhetoric, manipulation and that Orwellian double-language that hide the darkness and scope of their control over us, softening the reality. Beautiful ... These charlatans do not represent anyone, but crush people.

Roger Ver, socialist?

I will not deny this fatal reality. Quick question, Roger. Do you like socialism?

If I like socialism? If people want to work hand in hand and be "socialist" on a "pro-active" basis, let them do it! But that is not possible. If you look at the actual socialism on earth, it's rather lame. From the moment you impose socialism, and forces people to submit to it, I am against! Socialism on the basis of volunteering, I am not interested in the end, because it never worked properly. Another amusing anecdote: at the time of my arrest for "distributing firecrackers", I met a guy, very intelligent, but who had trouble concentrating on the good things in life, and who was not far from finishing homeless. So I let him move into my apartment and stay there for free. I helped him get his life back. Then after the authorities came and arrested me, and they expelled him from my home, while I was totally there for him to stay there. He ended up on the street, end of the story. For the moment, it's an example, of "me" volunteering to help someone, and the government that interferes and plugs all in the air. Anyway, it's so frustrating, what do you want me to tell you ...

Indeed, it is a subject that can easily feed overtime of debate. Strong of my short existence, I did not directly experience such intense experiences. However, as part of my scholarship, I got wind of revolting facts and I was able to witness remote incredible social aberrations.

If you allow, I think this is also why governments are so rigid and opposed to drugs. When people try many narcotics, they often gain empathy and perspective on the society around them. It is incredible to see how the brain of the average citizen is conformed by governments. How is this or that substance declared harmful by the ultimate arbiters of biased governments and health institutions? We could ask ourselves so many more questions.

True, we will avoid the mention of pharmaceutical lobbies and consorts. The government defines what is good or bad for you, and going against the established standard is to be discriminated against, to take frightening legal risks. Nevertheless, do not go astray again and move on to a new question.

The vision of Satoshi: Bitcoin Cash?

Does the phrase "Satoshi's Vision" make sense to you?

I think his vision was clearly stated in the front pages of the Bitcoin Whitepaper. An electronic money system working in P2P.
That's what seduced me in the early days and still attracts me today.

Let's talk about Bitcoin Cash. Do you think that Bitcoin Cash is the best tool for achieving the concrete utopia of a free society based on consent between individuals?

I do not think it's the perfect tool, but it's one of the best certainly. I'm really excited to see his Meshnets protocols (alternative, non-censurable Internet) grow. I do not know if you've heard of it? An example, to my great habit. Many people have trouble for Chinese citizens forced to use an Internet restricted by the parameters of the Great Firewall. But it is also for themselves that they should have, because of this firewall and the informative asymmetry that it causes, both sides are slowed, and thus the world economic growth. The time wasted by both parties to achieve the desired information could be used in the service of innovation.

Build better computers, more efficient cars, and so on. The whole world is delayed by this stupid Great Firewall of China. So yes, I am really looking forward to seeing technologies to circumvent such limitations come into existence, to provide gateways for access to communications independent of any structure. I think that the obsolescence of the Great Firewall will be a matter of even bigger stakes than the fall of the Berlin Wall.

I hear it perfectly, I think the stakes are high, given the demographic and economic weight of China today. However, I do not think that the People's Republic of China will remain powerless and let the Meshnets get the better of its firewall, which still remains a gigantic structure. It is a society that has little choice but to concentrate its efforts on the close control of its population, to maintain itself, no matter how absurd it may be. We have seen what they are capable of on Tiananmen Square, for example.

Yes, but do not underestimate the power of cryptocurrency and the Internet again. These can have a gigantic impact on a specific state or individuals. I will not even talk about the power of predictive markets that are also on the fringes of becoming a huge machine.

Very good. We were talking initially about the ability of cryptos to move us towards an ideal society, where freedom is needed and where the individual preserves his choices. Do not you think that - Bitcoin Cash or not - this fight is already lost, with the implementation of all KYC procedures and multiple regulations that happen day after day, reducing freedom, confidentiality, fungibility and I on the way ? I think we are failing at this rate.

No, because I think it's a laborious process that's going on. If you take a global and optimistic look at the situation today, you will realize that you have more solutions to make transactions with anyone on Earth, instantly and cheaply, than before the arrival of cryptocurrency. . Some sellers on the Darknet are caught and end up in jail, and it continues today. But before the arrival of cryptocurrency, you did not have this option, today you have the opportunity to receive payments with, they still exist and are even more important. It's still better today in terms of numbers. This is not a fight that we risk winning all at once, but in several stages. Each new option that will be deployed will bring us closer to this ideal, and innovations, there are quite a few in perspective, so I preserve my optimism.

Yes, but today, if an ordinary citizen wants to buy bitcoins, he will have to go through so many identity checking formalities, even more if he is misinformed. He will not go to LocalBitcoins, which has changed, or buy cryptos from someone physical. With so many intermediaries and verifications, the transactions of the buyer can be traced, it will be taxed on his earnings. Paying in bitcoin does not have much attractive for mister everyone, the decision of head is real, it will have done better to make its market in euro. What do you think ?

I think that's a problem, indeed. Nevertheless, I think that for every problem there is a winning opportunity. A chance to find a solution and sell it. You and I are not the only ones complaining about these problems; but I bet we will have no problem paying the person who will propose a solution to these problems. Wherever you see a problem on Earth, it's a business opportunity. Let's be patient. If you buy a coffee at Starbucks, it's because you value coffee more than the money you give them to get it, and vice versa for Starbucks. You are both satisfied and benefit from this exchange. It is also a call to all your readers, which is formulated here, indirectly! Find me a damn solution and you'll be covered in gold! I remain positive and determined, even if I want to make a slight abstraction. See what OpenBazaar is trying to do, it's already a good start. Of course, we will not believe that the police are not trying to monitor the activity of OpenBazaar users, but it is by continuing to develop more and more sophisticated solutions that we will get out and have access to more solutions to protect our privacy and our financial life.

I accept this postulate, but we can not deny that there is an asymmetry between the people seeking to find a solution to this problem, and people are comforting themselves in the already existing model, concealing even new emerging solutions. Government agencies even try to cast a shadow over cryptos and disinterested people curious to know more about this technology.

Totally, it is also a critical problem. These famous institutions seeking to control everyone taking money from people who would like to be free. To reuse this money in order to acquire instruments to better control them. Is not it great?

I will not comment on it. Better not to get in the way of these organizations.

Besides, there's a great Youtube video that I recommend to everyone, the title being "Why libertarianism is so dangerous?"

The arrival of Roger Ver in Japan

Thanks for the recommendation Roger! I will now close this philosophical chapter and try to renew this interview on its original path.
When did you come to Japan, already?

13 years old, my friend! As soon as I had the damn permission to leave the United States, I left.

Ah, it's not new. How are your political views perceived here?

I think in fact, in Japan, there is really no questioning of authority, but prescriptions are not appreciated here, though. Personally I do not encounter any problem, nobody comes to bother me or ask me to change my words. One thing I really like that I saw here is the wording of the smoking ban. In the United States, we have big primitive signs, on which it says "No Smoking or $ 1,000 fine". Here in Japan, it is not the same, there are long texts painted in Japanese, which do not order not to smoke, but which suggest anything else. The most accurate translation I can give you being "with good manners come the big rules, so follow the rules to have good manners: do not smoke." Besides the fine is insignificant here. I love this much more sophisticated approach to formulating prescriptions, which reflects a more respectful consideration of citizens by their government.


(to be continued)

[reactorjuno]

Third (and last) part of the interview (original article here)

Interview with Roger Ver: Bitcoin Cash and Outlook (3 out of 3)
BY SAMI - SEPTEMBER 12, 2018



Will BCH become even more unique compared to Bitcoin, both technically and in the communication approach in the years to come? So what would make BCH the best option, when there are new currencies based on new and more powerful consensus algorithms that are emerging? For example, we can think of EOS and its proof of delegated stakes, or other currencies based on the proof of stakes. These currencies require fewer resources to operate and sometimes announce impressive scalability. What is BCH's plan to stand up to this emerging competition?

Simply, the network effect. Bitcoin Cash is the fourth largest currency in the market, with an impressive amount of portfolios and merchants supporting it. It is much rarer for the currencies behind. Moreover, more and more merchants are only keeping Bitcoin Cash, for reduced fees on our network. Today, there is more and more new business accepting BCH rather than BTC, and I think this is an essential asset of BCH compared to other cryptos available. We'll see what happens in the years to come, and anyway, you know, I'm in favor of what works. BCH works today very well, the fees are ridiculously low and transactions fast enough, I'm happy. Moreover, tools for more confidentially are coming up, these same tools that disappeared in BTC. The fees being too high, they were no longer interesting.

Many projects are currently being developed in parallel with BCH (sidechains, applications etc). They recently announced something, "Wormhole Cash", which will allow the creation of tokens and the execution of "smart contracts" on BCH for example. I can not wait to see that happen. Finally, we have an entire team of full-time developers at bitcoin.com, who enhance and maintain development tools, making creating applications on Bitcoin Cash really easy. Apparently, our platform is so nice that a lot of fans of BTC and developers have asked us if we plan to release our tools for BTC. Our answer is obviously no, because we want to cultivate exclusivity for our BCH. I do not mind being criticized for this, because there is only one Bitcoin for me, and it is Bitcoin Cash.

It's a pretty radical and expeditious position. I look forward to seeing the evolution of both networks in the years to come.

The world needs a currency that works with consistency, not a technically fragile currency, in the face of increases in usage. BCH has not yet seen a surge in transaction fees so far, and that's what's important to me.

And Lightning Network, even if at this stage, it is not yet that and the user experience is terrible, what do you think?

Can you set up a Lightning Network wallet on my phone, please? I'm afraid not ... If they get it right and the promised performances are honored, I might reconsider all my positions.

Will you come back to Bitcoin?

We will see, but I'm in favor of what works and if Bitcoin regains great efficiency with LN, then I will consider again. The thing is that what they did with Lightning Network is hardly acceptable, for now they have intentionally disrupted a system that worked in the hope of migrating people to a system that does not work yet. And that's terrible. Anyway, if Lightning works, I'll be a fan, but there are computational constraints, which make me doubt the chances for the latter to work well.

Do cryptocurrencies have value, Roger?

Let's talk about cryptocurrency market now. The latter has been fairly stable over the last few weeks. As a reminder, today and while we speak, Bitcoin is around $ 7000 and the ethereum is around $ 400, BCH is now $ 700. Do you think cryptocurrencies have finally reached their intrinsic value? In the case of BCH, don't you think that $ 700, that is 0.1 BTC, is a reasonable value?

To be honest, I'll be surprised if in the future a BCH does not cost more than a Bitcoin. You often hear a lot of people say that BTC is only interesting for large transactions or as a value storage. But look, in France, you use Euro for small transactions but also for large ones. A currency whose ambition is global must be able to be used in all contexts, today it is the case of BCH and not of BTC. It's only a matter of time before people realize the superior utility of a currency like BCH.

Please remind me the transactional capacity of BCH?

20 to 30 times more than BTC.

But how can a currency like BCH handle world-class traffic?

So today, 100 transactions per second is not enough. But one moment please...
* Roger leaves to go get a crate from many hardware shelves. * Look, these are 4 MB memory cards that I was selling at $ 200 / piece at the time. I could throw them today, they're worthless, aren't they? But they have an emotional value for me now, more than 20 years ago, 4 MB, it was huge! I keep them to remind me of the rapid progress of computer hardware in recent decades. I do not see why this logic of progress would no longer be valid today. I now come to Bitcoin Cash. Today a block of the BCH chain weighs 32 Mb, it's already not bad. Nevertheless, today, with a basic $ 1000 computer, you can easily manage blocks of 128Mb. Let's see things differently now. Within two years, even if progress is slightly slowed down from today, home computers will be significantly more powerful. They can easily support blocks twice larger, then later four times larger and so on.

Many people think that we have reached a certain level of evolution on the hardware side, but it is exactly the same state of mind as 20 years ago. The actual reality has surprised many, in the end. I spent 20 years selling computer equipment and I was a privileged witness to this progress. By cultivating the idea that things are impossible and taking no risk, I think we are condemned to stay down. To be called idiot of the village, or of irrational repetition, is not pleasant. Still, if it's the price to pay for recognition in the end, I accept that weight. "Nothing ventured, nothing gained". Believing that it is impossible at first you will not try anything, while believing that it is possible, even if it is unlikely, you have a chance to succeed. I have enough confidence in the relative evolution of computer hardware and average bandwidth, to be serene about the scalability of BCH by increasing the size of blocks and also offchain transactions. It will take the time it takes, look at the time it took for Bitcoin to fully fill a block of 1 Mb, 7 or 8 years? It is only a matter of patience and conviction, in my opinion.

So according to you, the concomitant evolution of the average storage capacity, the speed of Internet and the processors, should allow to support the increase of the number of users on Bitcoin Cash.

Yes, it is certain that the transactional capacity of BCH will increase. After, we are never safe from a sharp increase in the number of users of BCH, but it is a scenario that I can not dread.

Roger Ver: crook & man of evil?

We heard your opinion on BCH's future prospects for supporting a larger volume. I would now like to rebound, if you allow me, on the public opinion towards you. Many angry people consider you a salesman, a crook, a man of evil. How do you react to that?

I did not give up Bitcoin, it's Bitcoin that stopped being what it is, I always come back to that point. I made a video on Youtube, where I explain why I think Bitcoin Cash is the real Bitcoin, and why Bitcoin Core is not what it used to be. I used many arguments to defend my thesis. In return, I received a lot of insults and accusations, free of arguments. Someone who is decent should use logic and reasoning to attack someone's postulate, and this is rarely the case on the Internet. I am always open to debate, if I am offered interesting arguments, however. I would like to hear more interesting things to enrich myself intellectually, but it's quite difficult to have meaningful discussions with social network users.

To get back to the main question: No, the opinion of some people on the Internet does not matter to me, I remain true to my convictions and I listen to those who want to join me or debate properly. I only ask for evidence, arguments, and it is with great pleasure that I would change my point of view.

I heard that you can be very upset if you talk about "Bcash" instead of "Bitcoin Cash". Why is this ?

Another common misconception about me on the internet. I gave middle finger to a guy on a YouTube Interview, 6 months ago. People on the Internet say that I got angry because this guy called Bitcoin Cash, "Bcash". I think calling it Bcash is a rude social attack, trying to untie Bitcoin Cash's "bitcoinnian" value. But what pissed me off with this guy is that he insisted childishly with that name and especially started to chant anything, going so far as to accuse me of doing things that I did not do it. He said I paid people on the Internet to promote BCH on social networks ... Slander.

Thank you for this ultimate answer, I think we are coming to the end of our session.

The ultimate message from Roger Ver: buy Bitcoin Cash!

Roger, once again, thank you for your time. Do you have an ultimate message to convey?

I will not ask everyone to buy Bitcoin Cash, but I want everyone to really think about the cryptocurrency and question its condition.

See you soon Roger, in Tokyo or somewhere else!

Thus ends this long interview. The discussion was pleasant from my end and Roger had interesting concepts to move forward. Even if I do not share this fervor for Bitcoin Cash, the exchange was without any hitch and Roger turned out to be a character with a profile very different from the one that some people attribute to him on the Internet. Far from the figure of zeal and pretension described on the social networks, it was possible to argue properly with him, and to raise opposing ideas to his own, without making the debate unpleasant. Although I do not have particular beliefs about BCH's success as tomorrow's universal motto, and I find some of Roger's opinions redundant, I think Mr. Ver's ideas and experience remain relevant to study. The future will tell if Roger was right about BCH.

I'll see you again soon for more "crypto-tales"!